Up next in 10
Shelagh Fogarty is joined by 17-year-old Charlie, who shares his experience of modern dating, from sending explicit photos to the influence of the manopshere to dinner dates being seen as 'cringe'. Listen to the full show on the all-new LBC App: https://app.af.lbc.co.uk/btnc/thenewlbcapp #shelaghfogarty #manosphere #LBC #uknews #ukpolitics #socialmedia LBC is the home of live debate around news and current affairs in the UK. Join in the conversation and listen at https://www.lbc.co.uk/ Sign up to LBC’s weekly newsletter here: https://l-bc.co/signup
Show More Show Less View Video Transcript
0:00
Charlie's call from Mosley in Manchester. Hello, Charlie
0:03
Hi there, can you hear me? I can, loud and clear, yeah. It's my first time caller, I'm a bit nervous, sorry
0:09
That's all right, don't be anxious. What did you want to talk about? Well, leading on from all JP summed up as well
0:16
sort of the points that the parent made beforehand about men and women online
0:21
and the influences it has in their sort of circles, especially at the ages of, I'd say, 16 to 17
0:26
and seeping into 15 when you're still at high school is actually, it's awful
0:32
And I think it's interesting that a lot of parents can take a look at it and go
0:37
yeah, that's pretty bad. But like when you live in it, it's just abysmal
0:42
Well, describe living in it to me. Well, so say, so going back to high school
0:48
say you had, for example, I'm going to say Andrew Tate, when he was
0:55
when I remember when I was in year nine, I think. I was 14, I think
1:00
No, just turned 14. How old are you now? I'm 17. 17, okay
1:06
And he sort of like, I succumbed to it really because I remember there was
1:13
there's always like a big boys group in high school. And I was never a fan of it in year 11 my last year
1:19
And sort of when he came around and everyone was agreeing with him
1:23
it was really funny and it was a laugh. and all the things that you just hear people quote what he said around school
1:28
and you'd join in, you'd laugh and you'd do the same. Looking back, and it still happens now at my age
1:37
I don't involve myself in it as much, but it's just you go completely blind for some reason
1:45
especially at such a young age, because you will do, and I know you will because I've been there
1:49
you will do anything to get sort of a validation from someone
1:53
so if you had say i had a very small friend group from some of my friends from primary school maybe
1:58
four or five of us and and these were my primary school friends were in this big boys group and i
2:04
was like oh let's join in so i joined in and then they were having a laugh so so you were 14 and the
2:10
and the big boys would be what age the the wasn't the same age as me i think boys i was in like
2:16
a big group of boys i thought you meant yeah so yeah no no i didn't like a like a lads group
2:22
I see. That sort of thing. Yeah, yeah. So you wanted to join in
2:26
But then about a couple of months after, I was like, what on earth am I doing? Because of what they were saying
2:31
Yeah just horrible things It was so normal in school Can you give me a flavor of it Just all of what Andrew Tate said like women belong in the kitchen make me a sandwich More extreme ones like um
2:43
just rude words in general, just a lot of generalised quotes. Denigrating women all the time
2:49
Yeah, basically just that. Did anyone call it out in the group? Did anyone say, God, this is..
2:54
grow up or anything? No, no, not at all. At that point, I withdrew
2:58
I left because I just didn't... It was horrible at that point. And then fast forward, much more grown, to say the least
3:07
But it's sort of, there was no, you know how people say there's women sort of belittle men a lot more now
3:16
It's because there's a lot more female influences than there are men influences now
3:22
And it's sort of, it's gone through this stage where we've seen Andrew Tate, we've seen H.S. Tiki Toki, the absolute clown
3:28
and we've seen... Well, you know, what's that law? Is it a law of physics to every action
3:36
There is an equal and opposite reaction? Yeah, that's what I mean. I wonder whether that's what's feeding that
3:41
Yeah, and I sort of see it as, what's it called? What's happening now is sort of a
3:46
I see it as a revenge for patriarchy or male-dominated things. But it's equally unhealthy, isn't it? Yeah
3:54
If it's being done in that way. It's not worse. And can I ask you, when you were, say, under 16
4:01
so around the time you were starting to engage in all of this stuff
4:06
did you ever get asked to do things that you wouldn't do
4:10
in a month of Sundays normally, or perhaps you never did them? But were you ever asked, for example, to send nude images
4:16
or semi-nude images of yourself to anybody? I think I was pretty voluntary on that side
4:24
I wouldn't really say it was a forced thing. What does that mean
4:28
Did you send them to people unwarranted? Yeah, well, mutual, really. Not more a mutual, just teenage thing
4:35
I think that's pretty... What's a real shame is that's really common around teenagers now
4:39
It's not sort of, come to my house, we'll listen to music and take you out for dinner. That's just what happens
4:44
You do these things online and you look at it and you're like, why has this become this sort of bonding experience for young children
4:51
It's appalling. So how young were you when you were, and you promised me now this was all mutual, was it
4:58
You didn't just send these things to girls? No, I do promise it was mutual. I would never do that. I would never just do that
5:04
Because I know I received it from men and women and I gone what are you doing And I blocked them instantly because it just wrong It horrible Men and women or boys and girls Well it would have been boys and girls when I was there
5:17
Yeah, so an adult never unwarranted sent something to you? Oh, no
5:22
No, no, no. Never been a... A victim of that. No, well, that's good
5:26
That's good that that didn't happen to you. But when... So how do you think the sort of mutual sending of naked images of each other began in your experience at such a young age
5:37
don't get embarrassed it's okay you're really informing us here it's good good conversation
5:45
it needs it needs to be spoken about it does speaks about it i'm so passionate about it and
5:50
and every time i bring it up it's like oh no one cares but i care it's appalling it's actually
5:54
appalling well you just you get to know someone and and so when you're young you well i wasn't
6:00
exactly wealthy when i grew up neither of my parents but it's sort of instead of asking for
6:06
50 quid, 60 quid to take someone out for food or come to my house
6:10
I wouldn't be lying, but if you said, come to my house
6:14
I'll make you dinner, it'd be seen as cringy. It's like, what on earth do you mean
6:18
It's a lovely thing to do, to get to know someone, to hang out with them. Literally, I'm a big, huge music person
6:24
All I do is listen to music. I would gladly sit in my room for two, three hours lying on my bed in silence
6:28
listening to music with someone. That'd be such a lovely experience. But now it's normalized to just
6:32
either sit on the phone with each other and play Roblox or Minecraft or video games
6:37
and talk down on other people your age or do that, send explicit pictures to each other
6:45
And it's just such a strange thing to be in. It's real and unreal at the same time, isn't it? Yeah
6:54
Rather than going for a walk in a park or going to see a film or..
6:58
I don't know why we can't do that anymore. Well, you can. Breaking news, you can
7:02
I do now, but that's what I mean. if I find people that don't want to do that
7:06
I don't associate myself with them because it's just wrong and I don't see why people justify it
7:11
Did you lose friends by taking this position that you took? Many
7:20
Lost many friends. Lost a couple of far friends, a couple of close friends
7:25
Completely cut off a lot of people. It gets to the point where a lot of teenagers typically
7:31
it's all about pleasing others. because it's always about fitting in. And it's really a shame because it's just
7:35
that you shouldn't care, you should just be you. It does not matter who, what anyone says
7:41
what's the trend, what you should be doing. For example like hating on men or women It this real stigma such as influencers like Andrew Tate Sabrina Carpenter Billie Eilish these big musical people these big influencers all on TikTok And they say things and they got these huge massive people
7:56
that say, yeah, I agree with her. And they go around spreading all this stuff, and it becomes common
8:00
such as, like, all men do, or mansplaining. Do you know the term mansplaining
8:06
I very much do. Right, yeah, that's what I mean. And I'll try, like, for example..
8:10
It's a real thing, Charlie. You're not doing it, but it's a real thing
8:14
I know, I was playing pool with my friends and they were holding it like a rifle, right
8:18
The hand was all over the place and I was literally just trying to help her. I was like, oh, do you want to help you
8:21
And I was like, yes, basically he holds you like this. And then three of the girls rolled their eyes
8:25
and said, oh, you're mansplaining. They said, I'm just trying to teach her to play pool. I was like, where's the danger in that
8:30
But it becomes a real thing where if you're a man or woman... And that's a great way to get physically close to somebody, isn't it
8:35
As long as they welcome it, you know. Yeah, yeah, of course. Teach them pool, teach them cricket, teach them golf, whatever
8:40
Yeah, yeah, exactly. can i you've been so interesting to talk to charlie can i ask you what do you think you had
8:48
in your upbringing that made you see quite quickly that this was not making you thrive
8:55
uh self-awareness complete lack of parenting if you let a child live in my opinion you should let
9:04
your child go when they're in year eight when they're 13 14 you should let them live you should
9:09
let them do as they like you should let them understand what a lack of parenting yeah because
9:14
it once you control them they will try and break free of that control and do bad things if you let
9:20
them do a bad thing they will understand yeah but if you let them do a dangerous thing they might
9:24
not come home that's something to be aware of and that's that's where you set boundaries not control
9:29
there are so many problems of parents that control their children and tell them what to do you should
9:33
advise them how do you feel when you look back at things like sending images of yourself um to me
9:41
it's not the end of the world to me that person will always uh if i see them on the street i'll
9:47
say hi i'll have a conversation with them or get on with our life it's it's not really the end of
9:50
the world and setting boundaries that term you use there how how should they do that on social
9:56
media because there might be a whopping great boundary about to be set which is 16 16 and under
10:02
I can't use it. Yeah, well, I think just blocking it off completely is just terrible
10:09
No way. Because then they will find every way to get around it and cause trouble. I think there should be, again, I've heard it
10:16
It's like it's not the government's problem, but it is because it causes problem in modern-day society
10:22
It does. It's about the backdrop of your lives, isn't it
#news