Up next in 10
James O'Brien is joined by the Crime Agents' Andy Hughes as the five men arrested on terror and explosives charges are released on bail.
Counter Terrorism Policing said earlier today that the five men arrested over the suspected bomb plot are all British nationals from London and aged in their 20s.
In an event in the Oval Office last night, Trump expressed his 'surprise' at the release of the five men.
Listen to the full show on the all-new LBC App: https://app.af.lbc.co.uk/btnc/thenewlbcapp
#jamesobrien #fairford #raf #donaldtrump #trump #crime #uknews #LBC
LBC is the home of live debate around news and current affairs in the UK.
Join in the conversation and listen at https://www.lbc.co.uk/
Sign up to LBC's weekly newsletter here: https://l-bc.co/signup
Show More Show Less View Video Transcript
0:00
Presumably one of the strangest stories that you've ever encountered
0:03
It is an odd one. It began in the early hours of Sunday morning where five men were arrested near RAF Fairford
0:09
on suspicion of terrorism offences. Major incident declared. Dozens of homes evacuated
0:15
after police were alerted to three suspicious vehicles near the airbase in Gloucestershire
0:21
Now, these men, all British men in their 20s from London, they were initially detained on suspicion of committing offences
0:27
under the Explosives Act and on suspicion of preparation of a terrorist act
0:33
And yesterday, the suspects were released on police bail and would be subject to stringent conditions on their movement
0:40
and contact with others and no explosives were found. Now, President Donald Trump and US Secretary of State Marco Rubio
0:48
have questioned that decision to release the suspects. I'm surprised that they released him. I wouldn't have done that
0:54
Look, they've been very good. They work with us very closely. We know everything about them
1:00
We would not have released them. I mean, Trump's saying he knew who they were
1:04
and they've been watching them for ages, and Marco Rubio then coming out and saying that he knows that a foreign agent, a foreign state is involved
1:11
It's foreign state-sponsored. We had them under view for a long time and we got them
1:15
It's one that clearly involves the hands of a foreign actor. Biggest surprise was the bail, probably
1:21
The fact that they were suspected of the most serious potential. crimes and bailed in
1:29
24 hours, pretty much. Well, what this suggests is that counter-terrorism police do not believe that these five
1:34
suspects are an immediate threat to the state. And they didn't have any
1:38
explosives. No. No, they didn't. If they believed they were an immediate threat, they would have simply
1:44
been held in custody. How the process works is, counter-terrorism investigations, suspects
1:50
can be questioned for up to 48 hours. They are then either released with
1:54
no charge, released on police bail, or charged. So where we are today is that the counter-terrorism detectives
2:03
will be trying to establish whether the suspects, knowingly or unknowingly, were up to no good
2:10
on behalf of any foreign state or not. Or doing something completely different, but nefarious
2:18
Exactly. Or doing something completely different and not even nefarious, albeit that they I mean some of the details suggest that they were trying to sort of go undercover as it were Well we do know that and I have spoken to sources in security services they had intelligence that this air base
2:34
was going to be attacked. Yes. So, and also the fact that counter-terrorism police
2:41
are still leading this investigation, that gives you a few clues into the motives
2:47
Potentially, except, of course, that if they had had, and I mean, it's hardly surprising
2:51
given that Fairford is a stopping-off point for planes that are heading out towards Iran
2:56
But the fact that the culprits, suspects, were apprehended as a consequence of a member of the public phoning it
3:06
suggests that they weren't exactly at action stations. No, no, but they were on high alert, I'm told, from Saturday evening
3:13
OK. So there seems to have been some intelligence. I mean, we're not really allowed to speculate, are we
3:20
No. Are you sure? What are the rules? I mean, I... I'll tell you what, there's no doubt that..
3:26
How can you not speculate a bit now? There's no explosives. And they were in..
3:31
I mean, a lot of people think that Diesel might be involved in that. Yeah, well, it's certainly not my job to speculate
3:36
I can tell you for a fact that counter-terrorism police would not have been happy when they heard Donald Trump and Marco Rubio
3:44
coming out questioning their decision and effectively saying that this was linked to a foreign state
3:49
But they're unhitched, aren't they, from the parameters of honest discourse. So just because, I mean, it's an incredible thing to have to remind people of
3:59
but just because the President of the United States has said something doesn't mean that there is necessarily a scintilla of truth in it
4:05
And that's a mad thing. It never stops being mad, that. Even though it sometimes feels like we were the only people saying it for a long time
4:11
everyone's caught up now. Just because Donald Trump says the President of the United States of America
4:16
says something about events at an airfield where his own air force is stationed in the United Kingdom
4:24
He says it, and I don't know what the odds are on it being true
4:28
or complete bunkum, but you absolutely no guarantee whatsoever that it would be true
4:33
Marco Rubio, a long time ago, fell into line behind Donald Trump
4:39
And so what might happen next? Presumably the police have got hold of devices
4:45
Yeah, homes searched of the suspects, all devices seized and that does take time to go through
4:52
The main object is to decipher the motive or the potential motive of the suspects and if indeed this was linked to terrorism
5:02
I think a lot of people have jumped to conclusions immediately because it's an RAF base
5:07
and both the Iranian state and the Russian state have made no secret of their desire to target these bases
5:14
especially given that RAF Fairford is, well, that's where American bombers go from to the Iranian war
5:24
And as we saw with the arson attacks on Keir Starmer's property
5:28
there is a sort of newish trend of signing people up who don't really have any ideological skin in the game
5:37
to do things that are designed to disrupt democracy. And then it goes alongside online agitation
5:42
So in that case, it was people claiming that Kirstenmer hadn't paid some rent boys
5:47
And that was absolutely everywhere on social media. And it was sponsored, it appeared by somebody with pretty close links to high ups in Russia
5:56
And that is a new mode of hybrid warfare, just simply combining actions or plots in the real world with online speculation, provocation and incitement
6:10
Yeah, well, the head of MI6 came out last year and said that attacks or threats from foreign states is up 50% and the use of proxies has also been rising
6:23
And we've seen several cases going through the courts in the last year. So the only thing anybody could say with any certainty about this is that Nigel Farage would absolutely turn it into a conversation about small boats
6:33
even though we now know that the absolute absence of any link whatsoever to anything that has anything whatsoever to do with small boats
6:40
which is why he's now issued a public apology. Don't be ridiculous
6:45
Of course he hasn't issued a... Why on earth would he issue a public apology, even though the revelation or the announcement
6:50
that it was five British nationals came pretty much while he was delivering a nonsense on social media
6:56
about how it proved everything that he'd said about the Iranian Revolutionary Guard and small boats crossing
7:02
So literally announced that it's got nothing to do with small boat crossings, it's British nationals
7:07
which also means it's got nothing to do with the Iranian Revolutionary Guard directly, in the middle of Farage recording himself
7:13
claiming the polar opposite. But anyway, I suppose in a world of confusion and flux and change
7:18
it almost reassuring to know that some things remain relatively certain Thank you Andy I mean I can do it can I Because I mean what you might call healthy speculation
7:31
in the spirit of Occam's razor or Sherlock Holmes, once the impossible has been eliminated
7:36
whatever you are left with, however improbable, must be the truth. You can't even really do that
7:41
Do you know what? I've noticed that the police are even giving up
7:45
on asking people not to speculate now because it is so rife
7:49
All that can be really done is have people like me who know about these issues
7:54
read in between the lines into what something like releasing them on police bail may mean
8:00
Yes, yes, good point. And I suppose just to make that transatlantic connection once again
8:05
if Donald Trump and Marco Rubio were following them and knew exactly who they were
8:10
and were absolutely fully aware of what was going on, why the hell did it take a farmer to bring it in on her way back from a dinner party
8:15
in the middle of the Cotswolds in the early hours of Sunday morning
8:19
I think we may have been let down by five eyes on this one, or certainly by our supposed allies
8:23
That, of course, presupposes that Trump and Rubio are telling the truth, which, as I reminded you a moment ago, is sadly far from guaranteed
8:31
Andy Hughes, great stuff. More on this, no doubt, as the situation develops, or indeed doesn't
8:35
because it might not now. It might not go nowhere for a week or two. Probably
8:40
Extraordinary scenes. What has happened here? And it's funny that the last caller mentioned Boris Johnson
8:46
and that I observed when Andy Hughes was in the studio how mad it is that we live in a world
8:51
where the President of the United States can say something about us
8:55
and the chances are it's not true. The chances are it's simply not true
9:01
And it's mad on a whole heap of levels because, number one, he didn't have to say anything
9:06
Number two, he doesn't really gain much by saying it. The people that were arrested at RAF Fairford at the weekend
9:13
were apparently known to him and he knew exactly what was going on, but presumably didn't know that they were going to be bailed 24 hours later
9:21
because there was absolutely no evidence to link them in the first instance to any of the crimes that he somehow knew were likely to be committed
9:28
So you see what I mean? Is that like, I mean, am I reading too much into it
9:33
Are we just seeing the street level equivalent of delinquency at the highest levels of politics
9:40
Prime Ministers and Presidents behaving with complete contempt for rules, and you're not even consciously going
9:47
well, why should I obey them anyway? You're just not aware that rules matter anymore because the people at the very top of societies
9:52
treat them with utter contempt
#news