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I don't think I want a leadership challenge today | James O’Brien - The Whole Show
May 15, 2026
This is a catch-up version of James O'Brien's live, daily show on LBC Radio from the 14th of May, 2026. Listen to the full show on the all-new LBC App: https://app.af.lbc.co.uk/btnc/thenewlbcapp #jamesobrien #politics #LBC LBC is the home of live debate around news and current affairs in the UK. Join in the conversation and listen at https://www.lbc.co.uk/ Sign up to LBC’s weekly newsletter here: https://l-bc.co/signup
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0:00
Three minutes after ten is the time and you are listening to the most listened to radio program in the history of UK commercial radio
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Boom! There we said it. Thank you very much and good night. Well, not good night. I'm not going anywhere. Not just yet
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Nobody knows what's going on. Who has been listening to this programme closely enough over the years
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to have the intoned mantra of my old geography teacher just triggered in their mind
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Don't know, he would say, when presented with something that veered slightly off the curriculum
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with which he was only passingly familiar. Don't know, don't need to know, nobody knows
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That was his response to questions about anything that was slightly off curriculum
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He was a PE teacher originally, and then he retrained, while a PE teacher
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to also teach geography, which suggests, looking back, that his heart wasn't really in it
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And that was the mantra for which he became famous in, don't know, nobody knows, don't need to know
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And in some ways, whatever the pundits may pretend and whatever the front pages may proclaim
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that is where we are today. Don't know, nobody knows, don't need to know
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um where streeting probably probably isn't 100% sure what he is going to do later today
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there is still and i think this is possibly the most underpriced element of the entire circus
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there's still a strong chance um that he will do nothing it's not i'm not putting money on anything
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i'm metaphorically speaking i i wouldn't put money on anything but wiser heads than mine
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have put a little bit of money on the idea that nothing will change today
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Why would Streeting move now? Why would West Streeting move now? Actually, should we write that
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That's quite a good question to ask, actually. Why would West Streeting do now
2:03
And, of course, the question of what it would achieve, what it would trigger
2:07
there's so many clever people in our building that one of them pointed out that he could well have been a victim
2:13
of Downing Street tricks yesterday. That the idea that West Streeting was responsible for the story breaking
2:22
as the king was still making his way to the Houses of Parliament seems to be, when you stop to think about it, quite fanciful, doesn't it
2:30
Why on earth would he do that? It makes him look awful. It makes him look like an attention-seeking egotist
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The king? We're about to have the king's speech. Can you not at least wait until the king is back in his slippers in the palace
2:43
before you start launching your leadership bids or igniting speculation about when said leadership is likely to be launched
2:51
So it was suggested to me this morning that Downing Street might have sort of put it out there
2:57
that West Streeting was expected to launch a leadership bid today, expected to resign and launch a leadership challenge
3:05
it's a possibility, isn't it? Downing Street certainly giving the impression at the moment
3:14
and this is probably the closest you can get to confidence about what is currently unfolding and what is currently going on
3:20
Downing Street very much giving the impression that Keir Starmer is not going anywhere without a fight
3:27
there is not going to be any civilised passage of power a passing on of the baton
3:34
a sort of recognition that the end of the road has been reached
3:40
And that can be for a whole variety of reasons. Tiny Blair being perhaps the most recent example
3:46
of just sort of recognising that the pressures without are becoming unsustainable, becoming irresistible
3:54
for good or for ill, the game is up. There's a slight tension here, isn't there
4:01
between the idea of the game being up and the idea of the game being afoot. The game is not currently afoot
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And if the game's not up, then it's highly likely that the game will never be afoot. Keir Starmer is warning, his allies are warning
4:14
over the danger that a leadership challenge would do. And yet, of course, the council election results
4:22
not to mention the national results in Scotland and Wales, made grim reading for anybody
4:29
A, hoping to be re-elected as a Labour MP at the next general election
4:33
and B, hoping for a Labour government after the next general election. That is roughly where we are
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Don't know. Don't need to know. Nobody knows. The film crews are camped outside Downing Street
4:46
Angela Rayner's exoneration over her tax affairs being released to the media in a coincidental and timely fashion
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That's no coincidence. I think that information has been available since Tuesday
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It drops on Wednesday, early on a Thursday. Sounds like a Craig David song
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It drops early on a Thursday, just as speculation over potential leadership bids reaches fever pitch
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Do you know something I don't think I've ever said to you before, for the very simple reason that only occurred to me this morning
5:19
It's simultaneously ridiculous and incredibly important, this stuff. Because you know when you're at work and you start gossiping about work stuff
5:30
and you start gossiping about who's going to get promoted or what the manager is like
5:34
And it's really, really interesting to you, right? It's not remotely interesting to anybody else
5:41
You know, oh, crikey, you never guess what Keith has for breakfast. You don't care what Keith has for breakfast
5:47
But within the building, within the office or within the company, gossip is absolutely riveting
5:53
Not for everybody, I grant you, but it is for many. but the problem with politicians is that what is riveting for them is of national significance
6:02
So you can't say, oh, just get over it, will you? Why are we even talking
6:05
You have to talk about the possibility of a prime minister being replaced
6:10
So it's almost as if the word self-important isn't quite right to describe what is now going on
6:15
in these quarters, in these corners of the Labour Party. They'll be negotiating, there'll be a degree of gossip
6:23
Some people will be in loops, some people will not be in loops. There will be several rooms, to paraphrase Hamilton, where it happens
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And nobody is going to be in all of the rooms where it happens. Some people will be able to move from one room to another
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Ed Miliband is on manoeuvres, we read in one newspaper this morning
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Wes Streeting is expected to quit government today. Angela Rayner's timely revelation regarding her house purchase affairs
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sends a shot across somebody's bowels. But whose bowels? Who is she perceived to be the most doughty ally of
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Vandy Burnham has, quotes, let it be known that he doesn't want a Coronation Street-ing
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I still think that's brilliant. Coronation Street, yeah? Like the soapbox? No
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Coronation Street-ing. No? All right. Well, I'll work on it. I'll get back to you with that one
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And they are all there. Al Kahn has let it be known
7:17
that he is interested in having a tilt at the big job
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and yet there is yet, as it stands, absolutely no certainty that there going to be a battle at all what what question would you ask if you were doing my job today I I I mean I I I don know that the the question about who who do you who do
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you want, I don't, is that, I don't even know if that's interesting or not. I think what I'll start with, with, with your, everyone wants to know what Keith has for
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breakfast now. Just, you just, come on, what do you have for breakfast? Every day
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you don't have penguins for breakfast he does different breakfasts on different days
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I should never have introduced that question really, could we do a phone in on that
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if it was an election day we could, couldn't we? we could do a sort of version of Beat the Sweet
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from back in the day when I had about 200,000 listeners as opposed to 1.5 million
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except we could call it Keith's Breakfast, you have to ring in and suggest
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what Keith has had for breakfast to which I can only answer yes or no until we get it right
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but we won't be doing that we'll be doing this instead I want you to answer this
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question. It's a bit of a strange one for a phone-in. And it
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demands a degree of thought, I think, forethought. What would you say to Wes Streeting
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So there are two questions here. Do you want a leadership challenge
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That's the question, isn't it? That's better than asking who you want because we can move on to that
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But do you want a leadership challenge? Today I don't. But give it a month and I could well look back and think, oh my God, I wish someone had moved
8:59
a month ago. I wish they hadn't bottled it. So I'm apologising in advance for the lack of solidity
9:06
of my position on this. I don't want a leadership challenge today. I think I would be like that
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lady. Is it Brenda? Oh no, not another one. I think that's how I would feel. I also would like
9:21
the Labour Party to distinguish itself from the madness of the last few years. I can't remember
9:26
whether or not we always started talking about coups and putches and replacements and leadership
9:31
challenges when things went badly in the short term. I don't think we did. I'm pretty sure that
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Margaret Thatcher, they weren't talking about replacing Margaret Thatcher mid-term when she
9:43
was quite unpopular shortly before the Falklands War, restored her fortunes in a quite spectacular
9:50
fashion. I don't know, maybe we did, but it certainly wasn't this feverish and constant
9:56
What we've done is create a new paradigm. And it's been done
10:00
to us, really, by the breach of the natural order, the breach of the social contract in
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2016, when the media destroyed any hope the country can have for being informed
10:13
for actually having trusted commentators and trusted correspondents, ignorance and bigotry, dominating the national conversation as a consequence of Brexit
10:22
And we're still in that ridiculous aftermath because you get to choose what you believe now
10:29
You can even pretend not to understand that the police are going to treat one march this weekend
10:34
differently from another because one is full of criminals and one isn't. It's pretty straightforward
10:38
Policing question, where do you put your resources? The one that's full of criminals, led by a criminal
10:43
populated by criminals, full of criminals, or the one that isn't? But hey-ho, we're still living in a country
10:49
where people pretend not to understand that. You do, and I do
10:55
But are we living in a country that sees this feverish speculation
11:00
and this call for change becoming actually unrealistic? It doesn't bear a relation to..
11:09
I don't know. I don't know, I don't know, I don't know. So that's your question. Question number one
11:13
Do you want Wes Streeting or anybody else to launch a challenge today
11:20
0345 6060 973. And obviously, I will want you to explain why you do or don't want Wes Streeting or anybody else
11:30
And it looks as if it's going to be anyone. It's going to be him. But that will be the beginning of a process
11:35
It will be the beginning of the beginning, not the beginning of the end. Do you want it
11:39
Do you want it? I'd love to talk to you if you've changed. If, like me, you're a little bit of a pendulum on this one
11:46
I don't think I've ever wanted it. I perhaps thought it was inevitable
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I don't think it's inevitable this morning, but I don't want it. I don't want another leadership battle
11:56
I think you just need to have a little bit longer at the crease before anybody can decide that you need to carry your bat
12:03
You need to go back to the pavilion. Look, the economy's performed unexpectedly well today
12:09
Growth is up 0.6%, which I don't know in the great scheme of things what that proves or what it's a consequence of
12:16
But there is not a sense among normal, sensible people that the country is on a path to oblivion
12:25
It still feels possible that we're on a path of recovery, a path of repair
12:31
and Keir Starmer for his myriad personal faults and failings hasn't done anything truly heinous, truly egregious
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truly deserving of being sent packing. I would say. And that is why I do not want
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sounds like a Dr Seuss story now, I do not want, want, do I not
12:53
a leadership challenge today. Do you? and then I think that the other question I'd quite like you to have a look at
13:02
would involve Wes Streeting and if you could whisper in his ear today what would you actually say to him if you could give Wes Streeting your
13:19
counsel what would you say to him today in some ways it's going to be a similar answer to the
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answer to the first question because I think I'd say to him not now Wes not now why would you do
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this now it makes you look as ridiculous as the the daft divided Tories it not now
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the reason why my voice is uncharacteristically querulous this morning or hesitant is because I am
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conscious, more than I am on most mornings, I am conscious of the possibility of being
13:59
violently wrong about this. I'm violently wrong. The idea that Keir Starmer hasn't already blown
14:07
it completely is certainly not crystal clear, is it? But I just
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I'm always honest with you. In my bones, today, I do not want another
14:19
leadership challenge. But I don't know whether that is me channeling Brenda from Bristol
14:24
a sort of fatigue with the speculation a fever fatigue I'm fatigued with the feverishness
14:33
of the speculation that doesn't mean I should be opposed to a changing of the guard
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and it's hard to tell the difference between I've had enough of all this infighting
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and quarrelling, can we just all shut up please and a genuine desire
14:47
for a genuine change 0345 6060973 I just got a bit scared by my inbox then
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And I realised that you were sending messages for West Streeting not for me So the one that just began get over yourself lad Just go what have I done now You can expect me not to mention record listening
15:06
figures that are the highest in the history of commercial radio in this country. But I
15:11
appreciate, you know, a little bit of ego can go a very, very long way. But I will start
15:15
looking at what you are suggesting. You might like to say, to West Streeting as opposed to
15:22
me. Is it chaos to have another leadership challenge or is it actually a rational response
15:27
to a very real and present set of problems? I don't know, which is great because I've got a
15:33
massive great switchboard in front of me and I can canvas your opinions, pick my favourite and
15:37
pretend it was mine all along. James O'Brien on LBC. It's 21 minutes after 10, Angela Rayner's back
15:45
in the frame, Ed Miliband is on manoeuvres, Al Karnes has declared or let it be known that he's
15:49
interested and West Streeting is still reportedly expected to launch a leadership challenge against
15:56
Keir Starmer today. If, and it's a big if, he can secure the support of enough MPs to trigger the
16:04
contest because we know there are enough MPs interested in a change but that doesn't necessarily
16:09
mean that they are interested in that particular change. So do you want one? Do you want a leadership
16:15
challenge? Do you want to get it all out of the way and put whoever is successful on a three-year
16:21
run to the next general election? Or do you just want to cut to
16:25
the chase and tell Keir Starmer to carry on? And that, of course
16:29
leaves open the possibility of a challenge later. I don't think there'd be another challenge if there was a replacement
16:35
That would be insane. That would be sort of Liz Truss-Rishi-Sunak type territory
16:41
But I do think if Starmer survives to fight another day, he may well have to fight another day
16:47
It is 22 minutes after 10. Phone lines are full, but don't be put off if
16:51
you get a busy tone because we turn over the calls quite quickly
16:55
and some people are sort of ringing in to us what the weather's like or
16:59
they think Nick Ferrari's still on. So there will always be vacancies
17:02
freed up on the switchboard if you use a judicious use of redial
17:07
Helen is in Manchester to kick things off. Helen, what do you reckon? I reckon
17:11
I'm a grumpy old woman. I don't want another leadership election. I am tired
17:15
of the so-called psychodrama and the infighting. Your average person doesn't care about this stuff
17:21
I think your average person just wants them to crack on at this point. I really don't think changing
17:27
the leader is the problem either. What do you think the problem is? The problem is
17:31
that they need to for me personally, I would like them to go
17:35
harder and faster on a lot of things. Yeah. They definitely need to do better with their PR
17:41
because the good things that they're actually doing really aren't getting across very well to the electorate
17:48
I didn't even vote Labour at the last election or at the local elections
17:53
And I actually think Keir Starmer's doing quite a good job. Why didn't you vote for them
17:58
I am pretty sure I'm what Dwella Braven would call part of the woke karate
18:02
OK. So, like I say, I want things to go harder and faster
18:06
So, what do you mean? Did you vote at the last election? I did. Who for? I have voted, I'm middle-aged, I have voted in every single election and referendum I possibly can at this point
18:15
and I've never, ever, ever had kind of my pick get into power
18:19
I voted Labour for years and years and years, and at the last election I switched to the Greens
18:23
Okay, fair enough. I mean, a lot of people did, and a lot more people are minded to do that at the moment
18:28
So, it is just, I mean, it does feel emotional rather than intellectual, this, doesn't it
18:34
Because you can make the intellectual case for the council results having been so awful, the U-turns and the failures and the perceived lack of charisma
18:45
Two words I wish I could ban at the moment, psychodrama and charisma, but they're going to run through this conversation like a skeg nest through a stick of rock, Helen
18:53
But it feels like we don't want one. It doesn't matter whether it makes sense or not, whether or not a computer would say, no, you definitely should
19:00
I've calculated this and calculated that and I've looked at the 100-year history of leadership
19:04
I just don't want one. Everything at the moment just feels very, very reactionary
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There's no plan and that's what I want. I want a plan. If you want to change leader, that's fine, but don't just do it because you're reacting to bad local election results
19:20
It is, it is reactive. The Manchester mayoral elections are due in 2028 and we're due a general election in 2029
19:28
There is lots of time to plan away if you want to get Andy Burnham onto the ticket within that
19:32
without annoying all the people in Manchester, quite frankly. I did vote for, weirdly, I did vote for Andy Burnham to be mayor
19:37
Sure, it's not weird at all. If Wes Streeting was listening, and he might well be, actually
19:41
but what would you say to him? Wind your neck in. Seriously, Wes
19:45
You're not doing anyone any favours. It makes you look bad, quite frankly
19:50
because it just looks like you're putting yourself ahead of everything else that's going on
19:55
Be a team player. That's what I want to see. I want to see the Labour Party come together
19:59
I don't care what's going on behind the scenes and what you're arguing about. Keep it behind the scenes
20:03
In front of the general electorate, in front of the public, let's start coming together
20:09
Let's show a little bit of you. I'm saying like I, not me. I want them to have a plan
20:15
At the moment, I don't know what the plan is. I love this. And I love the way that you've justified my question
20:21
That was a brilliant answer. And I'm going to ask every caller now to tell me exactly what they would say to West Streeting
20:27
if he was listening. And I'm not joking, he might well be, because they have to stick their head out of the window sometimes
20:33
It can't all be smoke-filled rooms, metaphorically speaking, and, you know, cabals and gossip and talking and counting
20:41
And find out what the public are saying. Find out what some, largely
20:46
for the callers on this programme, it will be people that want the government to succeed
20:52
not people that sort of subscribe to either far-right conspiracies about our country
20:59
and indeed our capital city or think that all of the problems can be waved by the waving of a racist magic wand
21:05
You want the country to thrive, to improve. You want the government to succeed
21:09
What would you say to Wes Streeting? Helen kicks things off with wind your neck in
21:14
Fiona's in Hatfield. Fiona, what do you think? Oh, do you know what? I've been listening and I totally agree with what you're saying
21:20
and I totally, totally agree with what the lady spoke about just now
21:25
Yeah. And to West Streeting, I'd say, yeah, I'm going to quote the other lady, back off
21:31
Yeah. Do you know what? We've not been, two years is nothing, you know
21:35
and after the turmoil and the chaos of the last government, there's an awful lot to do, awful lot to pick up
21:43
I think we should just get behind Keir Starmer, get behind the leg party and just, you know, keep your head
21:51
Keep your head and just get on with the job. You know, after Boris, my God, you know
21:56
all I wanted was somebody very staid, somebody honest, somebody grey. I didn't want anybody with this big charisma that people talk about
22:07
Don't need that. We just need somebody in to be honest and get on with that job
22:13
And we live in such a chaotic world. and the last thing we want is chaos within our government
22:19
It would be, it would trigger chaos. I mean, goodness knows how many contenders there would be
22:23
and they'd all have their own factions. But I mean surely this sense that Keir Starmer is you know a safe pair of hands that the adults are back in the room surely that is at the very least under threat after various missteps and reverse ferrets and U and mistakes
22:42
Absolutely. And do you know what? Over the last, I don't know, the last few weeks, months, do you know, I've been up and down and up and down and then thinking, oh, my gosh, should he go
22:51
especially with the election results, and thinking, oh, my gosh, are they right
22:56
Should he go? And I think the more I am, well, I'm talking about it now
23:01
the more I'm thinking, no, two years is nothing, and we've got two years to really, really, you know
23:09
get the message out there, be more communicative, and just get on with it
23:16
But, you know, I have been up and down. Yeah, well, that's honest, isn't it
23:20
Because I don't know, you're 52% Brenda from Bristol and 48% sophologist or number cruncher
23:28
So you're looking at the facts, you're looking at the electoral calculus, you're looking at the results of last week
23:33
And at the same time, you're sort of feeling fatigue. We should play that clip, shouldn't we, of Brenda from Bristol
23:39
Because it is a little bit, I think, how I feel. But, of course, facts and feelings are two very different things
23:47
Fiona, thank you. Oh, crikey, it's half past ten already. 03456060973 is the number that you need
23:55
Rob, had he got Wes Streeting's ear, would whisper into it, you need to sort out the doctors and the NHS
24:02
It's a huge task that I think you've handled well so far, so stick with it
24:06
What would you say to Wes Streeting if you had his ear
24:10
Because it appears, as things stand, that it is going to be him who decides
24:16
whether or not the starting pistol is fired on a leadership challenge that nobody is guaranteed to win
24:22
It could easily be a period of infighting and warfare that ends with Keir Starmer still installed as Prime Minister
24:29
and an awful lot of time and energy and goodwill, perhaps, expended on a largely pointless exercise
24:39
I don't know if that's reason enough not to try or not to do it, but it's certainly something that needs to be considered
24:45
Here's Dominic Ellis with your headlines. James O'Brien on LBC. 33 is the time
24:52
Oh, no, not another one. That is the response that many people have
24:56
to possible leadership challenges, and it puts us in mind of that lovely lady Brenda in Bristol
25:02
who was informed by a television journalist that there was another general election on the way
25:08
Was it a general election? Probably a general election. I think it was a general election. But anyway, she'd had enough
25:13
And I know how she feels, but that isn't enough, is it
25:17
it's not enough to think, oh, I don't really want another one. You have to be clear about why you don't want another
25:23
It can't just be, I've had enough. I've had my fill. If it's going to be for the benefit of the country or the party
25:28
then you want a leadership challenge. If you honestly can't see how it would make things better
25:34
And, you know, Keir Starmer is far from impressive, I'm afraid, is the word that I would use at the moment as prime minister
25:42
And, you know, how long do you hang on waiting for something magic to happen
25:47
before you accept that it ain't ever going to? Answer, I don't know
25:51
I don't know, I don't know, I don't know. The show is full of I don't knows today. It's full of I don't knows
25:57
Quickly, because you're sending me some absolutely lovely messages. I should share the laurels for these listening figures
26:04
with Eleanor, who produces the programme, and Keith, of course. I'm never quite sure what Keith does
26:08
but he's here every day eating penguins and doing things like that
26:13
There you go, that's what Keith does. Mystery Hour will be upon us at 12. hopefully, but of course it's up to West Streeting
26:20
Maybe don't involve that in the words that you would like to say
26:25
So, you know, Oye Streeting, Don't You Mess With Mystery Hour, probably not that helpful when it comes to assembling a tapestry of insights
26:32
and opinions regarding this possible leadership challenge. But I do, oh, and actually I'll answer a couple of questions as well
26:40
So, no, it's one and a half million, Stephen Windham asks, it's one and a half million or is it 300,000 times five
26:45
It's one and a half million weekly listeners. So one and a half million individual people
26:49
listen to at least a chunk of this program every week. So it's not the same 300,000 people tuning in every day
26:57
Some of those one and a half million will listen to 15 hours a week. Some of them may only listen to one or less
27:04
but it's one and a half million individual people. 25 minutes to 11 is the time
27:10
I only worked that out for myself about two years ago. Never really knew what it means
27:14
I didn't really care because you just do whatever. You know, if management start jumping up and down in excitement
27:19
you think that's good. And if they start looking at you as if they're sort of measuring the professional coffin, then you sort of think, oh, that's bad
27:25
So I never really knew what it meant, but that's what it means. I checked
27:30
Back to business. Brian's in Bracknell. There's three Bs there. Brian, Bracknell, business
27:34
What would you like to say, Brian? Right. Thanks for having me on the show
27:38
Most welcome. Yeah. I'd just like to say that I think he should take on Starmer
27:44
to try and replace him. My reasons being, if Starmer continues, goes into the next election
27:50
I don't see how Labour are going to win the election. So it really comes down to that simple principle
27:56
If Labour want to stay in power at the next election, they need a different leader
28:02
I'm not saying it's going to make much difference, but I think because of his popularity
28:07
which is, I'm surprised how low his popularity is. Do you understand why it's so low
28:14
Well, there could be a number of reasons. Maybe lots of the U-turns that the government have made
28:20
Not necessarily... It's odd how visceral it is. It's odd how vituperative it is
28:25
It's not as if he is riding roughshod over standards and decency
28:30
or setting fire to the economy. It could just be a collection of lots and lots of little things
28:35
But the viciousness of a lot of the hatred of the man genuinely baffles me
28:40
You don't have to think he's wonderful, but to think that he's hideous is extraordinary. I totally agree with you
28:46
and I don't think it's necessarily just aimed at him I think it's more about the party
28:51
and the things he can't do that he'd like to be able to do
28:55
and the U-turns he's done so changing him isn't going to change that
29:01
but I do think if Starmer stays in then there's a good chance he'll get replaced
29:08
by the more to the left side of the party Angela Rayner and I think that will make them even more unelectable
29:15
It's funny, isn't it? So you, I'm going to go out on a limb here and say you're not a traditional or certainly not a regular Labour voter
29:21
No, I'm not a Labour voter. The best thing for me as a non-Labour voter
29:26
would be for Starmer to stay in place. There's a massive difference between what a sort of Labour diehard tribalist
29:33
would want to happen and what somebody who is objectively looking at electability would want
29:38
And it may well be that streeting would offer a better chance of electoral success
29:43
but that, of course, isn't going to butter many parsnips in the bowels of the Labour movement
29:49
where he is quite unpopular, where he is not, by any stretch of the imagination
29:53
the favoured candidate. The favoured candidate, with a sort of whiff of compromise to it
29:58
is probably Ed Miliband. Yeah. How would you respond to that? Ed Miliband
30:04
Well, we've been there before with Ed Miliband. I mean, I don't think he's..
30:11
I think they're looking for... I think the voters are looking for something a bit different
30:17
Yeah, but that might be part of the problem, Brian. I mean, you know, the voters have got used to thinking
30:22
they can have something different, whereas I think Stanley Baldwin... Didn't Stanley Baldwin lose two elections as Prime Minister
30:27
and then still come back for a third go? and there's an argument that Churchill would never have been allowed into UK politics after Gallipoli
30:35
if he was living in the sort of goldfish bowl of modern politics
30:41
Burnham and Miliband have had tilts at big jobs and not performed brilliantly or not succeeded
30:48
although I think Miliband increased the Labour vote in 2015 and they've gone away for 10 years and they could have got better
30:53
So I'm never quite sure, I'm glad I asked you that question, I'm never quite sure about the line that, well, Ed Miliband's had his chance
30:59
I don't know again that we should be subscribing to that school of thought
31:03
You could easily say, you know, politicians are human beings. They learn lessons
31:08
They grow. They get better. They get worse. Just because you had a crack at something ten years ago
31:12
doesn't mean you should be forbidden from having another crack at it now. I think that's underpriced, by the way, Ed Miliband
31:18
I really do. I know a lot of people respond a bit like Brian did
31:23
with the sort of idea that because he's had a go, he shouldn't be permitted to have another go
31:30
or it would not be desirable to have another go but I'm not so sure, I think Lewis Goodall
31:34
who is of course Susan in Scotland's favourite LBC presenter I think Lewis Goodall made a similar point yesterday
31:39
and there's something in it, the idea of Miliband being underpriced popular in the party, bruised, knows what's needed
31:45
but hey-ho, of course it may never come to pass if streeting doesn't pull the trigger today
31:50
and the question that we're asking is do you want him to? Brian's our first, yes, Nicky's in Totnes
31:54
Nicky, do you want him to? Good morning. Hello. Thank you very much for having me on your show
32:01
You're most welcome. I am not a traditional Labour voter. I'm actually not a traditional any-party voter
32:08
No. But I did want to see the end of the Conservatives. Yes. And so I followed the South Devon primary route
32:14
which we had here locally in Devon, and we chose a progressive candidate to oust the Conservatives
32:22
Okay. And we succeeded there. It wasn't a Labour candidate. and we settled with Labour
32:32
And now I've woken up this morning and I'm furious. And I'm not normally one to be furious
32:37
That's interesting. I don't want this chaos. I don't want this turbulence at a time when we need stability
32:46
global leadership and a statesman-like direction from a leader that can do it
32:52
And just because he isn't some macho king that is delivering a loud narrative
32:59
doesn't mean that he isn't a really good leader that's going to do some great things to our country
33:05
Gosh! Yeah, I feel really, really angry this morning. And I would say, I would concur with Helen
33:12
lovely Helen in Manchester. Yeah. We're at two ends of the country and just say, streaking, rein your neck in
33:18
and just support your leader. And get on with it. Yeah, exactly
33:23
And yes, if you are having inciting, keep it behind closed doors and sort it out
33:28
What do you think the reason I find your anger fascinating? Well, even more fascinating is your surprise at how angry you are
33:35
because it is an emotional response to a sense that, you know
33:40
the people in charge are too busy bickering with each other to get on with the job that they've been charged with doing
33:47
And Keir Starmer, for you, is not this sort of hobbled prime minister
33:53
who is just limping towards an inevitable early finish line. He's somebody who is still very much in place
34:01
Absolutely. If you do not subscribe to reading headlines and listening to, you know, quick, quick, quick sentences about him
34:11
No, absolutely not. And I'm an avid listener of yours, but yesterday I felt a bit dismayed by you and Sheila
34:20
because I thought, no, don't feed into this silly narrative. It doesn't need it
34:26
We kind of, I mean, Sheila can defend herself. We kind of have to. I mean, when it was reported by The Times
34:32
that West Streeting was point to launch a leadership challenge, we might feel a bit fatigued with the chaos
34:38
or indeed with the narrative, but you can't not talk about it in a job like this
34:43
Don't make me mention my listening figures, Nikki, in defence of my judgement on these matters
34:47
I just heard you clarify them. I just heard you clarify them. No, absolutely
34:51
I mean, I will remind you of Brexit and you did stick to a position on Brexit
34:55
and you were solid there and I was behind you, absolutely. But, yeah
35:02
Thank you. No, it is. Don't take a hat. Anger and impatience. No, I think you might be right
35:07
I do. Actually, as each day passes, as each hour ticks by
35:11
people change. Perceptions change. He might have been baying for Keir Starmer's blood
35:15
at the beginning of this week, but by the end of it, you're baying for West Streeting to wind his neck in
35:20
and the government to get on with governing. And I don't know Keir Starmer at all
35:26
I think he is a strange character. I think he is, sitting in Downing Street at the moment
35:34
convinced that he can pull this off. And as long as he is convinced that he can pull it off
35:39
he's not going to go anywhere without a fight. And if you know that, and you're the one that might start the fight
35:46
that should give you pause. He thinks he can pull it off. He got Labour elected for the first time since Tony Blair was in charge
35:56
And the idea that after two years he gets binned, it just objectively seems unfair
36:03
And yet, if you are prioritising electoral success, then maybe a change of personnel is what's needed
36:09
But I tell you what, Nicky and Helen and lots of texters and blue, not blue skies, what's the other thing, Whatsappers, really sharing in that sense of anger and impatience
36:22
Just get over yourselves. And if Wes Streeting does move today, he becomes a receptacle for all of that feeling
36:29
He becomes the target for all, the focus of all of that feeling. So a general sense of unhappiness with chaos
36:38
with instability, with challenges, which goes back now to 2019, really. It goes back to Boris Johnson
36:46
essentially trying to get rid and succeeding in getting rid of Theresa May
36:52
And that idea, I've had enough of all of this, where Streeting could stumble into a position
36:58
where he carries the can for all of that dissatisfaction and all of that disillusion
37:02
which is why the phrase, wind your neck in, Wes, is probably going to be the one that emerges most strongly from this programme
37:09
It's 10.45. James O'Brien on LBC. Does it need a missed information
37:15
some of the ridiculous coverage of the Angela Rayner story? The story was crystal clear to me from the beginning
37:23
As soon as Keir Starmer referred it to his independent advisor on ministerial ethics and the advisor concluded that she hadn consciously or deliberately done anything wrong that by dint of her status precisely because she was a government minister
37:37
deputy prime minister no less, she should have worked even harder to establish exactly what was required and what was not
37:45
So she shouldn't have taken at face value duff advice, being held to a higher standard than the rest of us
37:51
And the HMRC investigation that was also triggered by the underpaying of stamp duty on our £800,000 flat would have looked for evidence of deliberation, if you like
38:03
Yeah, I think we probably should speak to Dan Needle from the Taxpayer Associates
38:11
He's a really good, you know Dan Needle, of course you do. He sort of led the line on the Nadeem Zahawi stuff
38:16
And he's got interesting things to say about Angela Rayne and Nadim Zahawi and Zach Polanski, who of course is facing questions over his council tax situation on a c boat
38:26
A quick word before we get back to the phone-in proper. The only reason that you know about Nigel Farage's £5 million donation from a Thai-based billionaire who's made a lot of money out of cryptocurrency and is set to make a hell of a lot more if Nigel Farage becomes prime minister is because of journalists
38:46
journalists at the Guardian did it and I appreciate it's pathetic for the Daily Telegraph to run an interview
38:52
with Farage in which he talks about a firebomb attack that the police
38:56
have never heard of as far as we can tell rather than the £5 million donation
39:01
so they refused to answer the Guardian's questions and went running to the Daily Telegraph
39:04
in the hope of getting a soft ride and they got a soft ride so I can understand how you can critique some
39:10
journalists but you can't say why aren't journalists doing more about this when you only know about
39:14
it because of journalists. In this case, journalists at The Guardian. I'm
39:18
guilty of it myself, saying things like the media. But we need to be a little bit more specific. We need
39:24
to talk about the right-wing media, if you like, or the propaganda machine, because it is the media that
39:30
is the reason why you know about that £5 million secret gift. It's also
39:36
the media is the reason why you know about his girlfriend being the one that bought a house in
39:42
Clacton or just up the road in Frinton-on-Sea for just shy of a million pounds, despite
39:46
having no real visible means of paying a bill like that. And that, of course, happened shortly after he said he was buying the house himself
39:54
And by a complete coincidence, shortly after, he received a secret five million pound gift
39:58
from a Thailand-based billionaire, for which, as you will know, he is now being investigated
40:05
So just a little reminder that when you put the boot into the media, you're putting the
40:11
boot into all of us including me little old me 10 51 is the time cameron is in manchester cameron
40:17
what made you pick up the phone i think before the first caller my view was that very much there
40:23
should be a leisure change asap but with a pathway ideally for andy burnham to take over
40:28
yeah but hearing her speak about it my view changed and i think i'm in agreement we need
40:33
more stability more than anything right now um and i think when the mayoral elections come up in
40:39
2028 there should be a pathway created for andy to try and then be on the ticket for the next
40:45
general election we can't just keep replacing people over and over mid election cycles and
40:50
we look completely unstable and ungovernable from other countries it just doesn't make sense
40:55
i i think i love the idea of helen just up the road from you in manchester or down the road
41:00
possibly being the reason for your pendulum swing but but the way you've just explained it
41:06
makes perfect sense, really, doesn't it? It's as if, you know those machines
41:10
not machines like the toys that you have to, they need a bit of momentum, like nodding dogs in the back of the car
41:16
It's as if the dog has been nodding furiously for the best part of 10 years
41:20
and it's just started calming down. And another leadership battle now would involve slapping the
41:26
and it starts nodding furiously again. And we've had enough friction. Go on
41:32
It's like, with that, exactly like that, we've finally got a bit of stability, and it's like we've gone over the smallest of row bumps
41:38
I mean, at the end of the day, it's not like there's been a big... Well, sorry, there has been a big scandal on Manderson
41:43
but I'm going to say the local elections weren't a massive scandal. They lost a lot of people
41:48
But for reform and for Raja treating it, it's like, oh, we have a mandate now
41:52
The country wants someone different. No, they don't. They wanted someone different at the local level
41:56
Speaking of Nigel Farage, guess who's just pulled out of a big speech in Sunderland
42:00
because he's terrified of scrutiny. Exactly. I think it was interesting what you were saying beforehand about the media
42:07
because a lot of the time they say, oh, the legacy media are against us, we don't want to talk to them
42:13
Oh, but I'm just going to talk to The Telegraph. Yeah, I know. Well, this is the man who claims to be anti-establishment
42:17
He's the son of a stockbroker who takes millions of pounds in secret gifts from foreign billionaires
42:22
But he's definitely a man of the people, and he's definitely anti-establishment
42:26
Against the BBC, because the BBC are awful. But no, I'll go on question time as much as you want me to
42:30
More than David Dimbleby. Do you want to know a secret? if I tell you a little secret about this conference
42:35
that was supposed to unfold in Sunderland today but Nigel Farage has bottled it you have to promise that you won't tell anybody else OK promise
42:44
you and me yeah seriously just not anybody else they tried to get us to pre-submit questions for approval
42:51
by five o'clock yesterday I presume all media organisations were only going to be allowed to ask them a question
42:56
if they pre-submitted it for approval before five o'clock yesterday it's ridiculous
43:02
I mean at the end of the day don't tell anyone that, that's top secret I don't know if I was supposed to tell you that
43:07
but this is the great champion of free speech and accountability and scrutiny
43:12
and transparency ordering media organisations to pre-submit questions for approval and then even after
43:18
trying to introduce that hideous measure pulling out of the whole thing because he's a massive coward
43:23
what are they called, taco Trump is it, Trump always chickens out
43:27
Nacho Nigel, is it? Is it Nacho Nigel? What is it? Never? Oh, I don't know. Someone a bit cleverer
43:33
than me will come up with a half-decent nickname. Cameron, thank you. I love the idea of one caller
43:37
changing the mind of another caller, but it's kind of what we expect to happen, isn't it, on the
43:41
programme? Kit's in Liverpool. Kit, what do you reckon? Good morning, my lovely. It's an absolute
43:47
honour to talk with you. Don't be ridiculous. It's an honour to talk with you. What would you like to
43:52
say? I think that you posed the question, what should West Street Inc be instructed to do
44:00
And my advice would be back off the mic. Back off the mic. Psych. Psycho. Across the board
44:08
I genuinely think that whilst all the runners are putting the names forward, at this juncture
44:13
of our political uncertainty, where they're all so involved about, oh, I want to go down
44:21
in history to be the next prime minister. What they're still willing to consider
44:24
is we are in a global political atrocity. Over the last few months
44:30
all the global warfare, all the global uncertainty, they're underestimating exactly what a great force that Kirstama has been
44:41
They're underestimating. They can't, they can't switch around the side and say, also tell me
44:46
fill me in on this person, that person, the other person, who are they? we are on the cusp of World War 3
44:51
we already involved in World War 3 if they underestimate the power of diplomacy that Keir Starmer has got they absolute fools You can call him mellow yellow you can call him what the heck
45:05
you like, but as a communicator with a limited name... Are we in danger here, Kit, of getting
45:11
a little bit high on opium? Because, I mean, I completely agree with you about
45:15
his performance on the world stage. And yet, I have to remind you that
45:19
he will get attacked from one side for having been complicit in, for example
45:23
Israel's genocide in Gaza and attack from the other side. He was booed at a Jewish solidarity march this weekend
45:30
because Benjamin Netanyahu often singles him out for attack for not being friendly enough or supportive enough
45:36
of what Israel is doing in the Middle East. Well, in the West Bank and the Gaza Strip and now in Iran as well
45:44
So although you and I see diplomacy and strength, all of the people that see either a man who is too closely allied with Israel
45:54
or a man that is not closely allied enough with Israel, all of those people have a vote as well
46:00
Well, I don't think it's just about Israel, is it? No, no, I know, but I'm just pointing out that when we're talking about
46:06
how he's performed on the world stage and standing up to Donald Trump and Netanyahu over the Iran intervention
46:12
is the most recent example, it still brings an awful lot of criticism and brickbats in his direction
46:18
Of course, it does, and you raise Trump quite rightfully, because look at the way in which the media have reacted
46:26
Trump is one of the ones who is trying to fool Keir Starmer. One has to ask the question, why
46:30
Why? I know. Why does he have such a problem with Keir Starmer
46:33
He's got a problem with Keir, because Keir is trying to retain world peace
46:38
And if we ever underestimate for one single moment exactly what threat we are at
46:44
and exactly how under-equipped we are at militarily to face that threat
46:50
well, we're dancing with wolves because there's absolutely no excuse. Now, I know that they're all about this
46:57
They all want to be leader of the Labour Party. They all want to be MP. But at this juncture
47:02
I don't think any single one of those candidates has the same ability as Keir has
47:09
to defend us in a global situation. Yeah, and they could make that point more powerfully, of course
47:15
or they could hit their marks more effectively. But again, at risk of being part of the problem I described a moment ago
47:21
it doesn't matter how loud you shout something if nobody reports it or if hardly anybody reports it
47:26
And if you were to compare the coverage, for example, of Angela Rayner's stamp duty affairs
47:31
with the coverage of Nigel Farage's financial dealings, you would be left wondering what exactly the standards are
47:41
that much of the UK media abides by. And the same is true of Starmer
47:45
You know, you should be reading more about his diplomatic successes than you are about Donald Trump's insults
47:53
But I think more people will click, for good or for ill, on a story saying Donald Trump has called Keir Starmer horrible names again
48:01
than you will on an article saying, Crikey, I didn't think Keir Starmer had it in him
48:05
but he's managed to walk an absolute tightrope with regard to Iran
48:10
I don't know. Maybe it's not fair. James O'Brien on LBC. Three minutes after 11 is the time
48:18
So if I said it now, if I said to you, I don't like to tempt fate, as you know
48:23
And I do worry sometimes that I have a sort of jinx quality, although I'm not a superstitious person generally
48:29
If I said to you now, I think the moment is passing
48:33
I don't know why I think this the problem is that when I talk to you
48:40
I calm down and I find myself I think Helen in Manchester is a sort of totem of today's show
48:48
isn't she? I find myself thinking yeah I think I've had enough of this now
48:53
just wind your neck in just calm down just stop it's too early to do this
48:59
and if you are going to do it do it in a much more disciplined fashion later
49:05
And, of course, if I was in... If I went to an event tonight
49:10
I don't go to many events, but I think I've got the Paul Foot Award at Private Eye coming up soon
49:15
And if I was in that room, and it'd be full of other journalists, and it'd be full of political journalists as well
49:21
then I'd be absolutely lapping it up. I'd be loving it. Oh, and what do you think's going to happen
49:26
And there'll be politicians there as well, and some of them will be indiscreet
49:31
And I quite enjoy all that. And I'm not mad for it, otherwise I'd go to things all the time
49:35
I'd go to about two a year between you and me. But when I talk to you, in what I would describe as the real world, the normal world
49:45
then I get this sort of sense of fatigue, eh? The hatred, the visceral hatred of Keir Starmer appears much easier to describe than it is to justify
49:56
So people might think they hate him. And look, I know, yeah, I have to stop saying Billy Buncher numbers with the Bulldog avatar on Twitter
50:02
because I think they use their real names now. The sort of out-and-out racist since Elon Musk bought it
50:10
Why would you hide your identity if you're not going to get into any trouble for being a Nazi? It's a fairly obvious kind of interplay there
50:19
So I say to you, I think the moment has passed and then just before Mystery Hour
50:23
West Streeting will resign as Secretary of State for Health and we'll have to go all action stations
50:27
So I don't know is the short answer. I do know that Andy Burnham, and indeed one of my listeners brought this to my attention before it was officially confirmed
50:37
Thank you, Malk. Andy Burnham has pulled out of his regular phone-in slot on BBC Radio Manchester
50:45
That would be with Mike Sweeney, wouldn't it, on the mid-morning slot
50:50
He does it quite regularly and was scheduled to do it today, but has decided not to
50:58
He has decided to, quote, prioritise discussions arising from last week's election
51:03
So, you know, he's on manoeuvres of sorts. Angela Rayner, as we know, has been cleared by HMRC of any wrongdoing over her tax affairs
51:15
which should have come to a surprise as a surprise to precisely nobody
51:19
except, I suppose, people so bent and broken that they still pretend to believe that Boris Johnson got rinsed as Prime Minister
51:29
because he had some cake or drank some Prosecco and who were treating Angela Rayner as if she'd committed mass murder
51:35
when it turned out that she had taken advice over her stamp duty affairs
51:39
that was not as good as it should have been. Extraordinary selection of standards that you can pick and choose
51:46
but one thing on which we can all agree today, Nacho Nigel is a thing
51:50
Nigel always chickens out. Nacho Nigel, has pulled out of a speech he was supposed to make in Sunderland today
51:57
despite having ordered members of the media to pre-submit their questions for the Q&A
52:04
I think they've probably realised they're not allowed to. So they would have said to the media, you must pre-submit your questions
52:10
Nigel Farage, who will talk about anything, anywhere, anytime, anyplace, except the James O'Brien programme, which he's too terrified to appear on for 12 years and counting
52:19
He can actually order journalists only to ask him questions that he likes This is the problem isn it if someone sets up an entire TV station to hasten your march to power You begin to think that you can do that Or you look across the Atlantic or across the world at the politicians you most admire
52:37
like Donald Trump and Vladimir Putin, and you, if you're the sort of pound shop version that we're lumbered with in this country
52:43
you think, well, why shouldn't I control the media? Why shouldn't I only get to answer questions that I want to answer
52:49
Why should I have to be exposed to uncomfortable questions about secret £5 million gifts
52:54
and house purchases. And so he tried to do that, and presumably someone said to him
52:59
we can't make them ask the questions they've pre-submitted. They might say
53:03
yes, we would like to ask Nigel Farage just how he has ended up being so wonderful
53:09
But then when they actually get handed the microphone and stand up, they will say, how come you're being investigated for something
53:14
you said that involved no wrongdoing whatsoever? Or other questions, perhaps. I still think that the house in Frinton-on-Sea
53:21
has not been properly explained. the source of the cash for that purchase
53:26
So anyway, Nacho Nigel. Nigel always chickens out. I don't think he even gave the response to the King's speech
53:32
That was left to Reform UK donor Richard Tice. I suppose they sort of take it in turns, do they
53:38
All the donors to have a go when Nacho Nigel is away
53:45
I don't know. Nine minutes after 11 is the time. But I do know this. If I say that I think the moment is passing
53:50
then West Streeting will announce his resignation. It's a form of O'Brien's law
53:56
O'Brien's law originally involves me saying something nice about a right-wing politician
54:00
and then that right-wing politician doing something awful. Because I'm not a tribalist, you know
54:05
I tried to see the good in everybody and not that long ago it was easy to see the good in some conservatives
54:12
despite not sharing their economic ideologies or their beliefs in things like trickle-down economics
54:17
or the fundamental laziness of unemployed people. Those are not things I believe in
54:23
But I could see the good in many conservatives. Unfortunately, Boris Johnson threw almost all of them
54:28
out of the Conservative Party, so O'Brien's law kind of fell apart at that point
54:32
I said nice things about Matt Hancock during Covid that I look back on with a shudder
54:38
And latterly, I've still said quite nice things about James Cleverley, which I may well expose him to O'Brien's curse
54:47
but not too much at the moment. So we're back to the question of do you want one
54:53
Do you want West Streeting to announce today that he is mounting a leadership challenge against Keir Starmer
54:58
And if you do, or if you don't, if I gave you his ear, what would you whisper into it
55:04
What would you say? Does anyone want to improve upon Helen Inmac? We have Brian Inbracknell, by his own admission
55:09
not a Labour supporter or a Labour voter, but very much of the view that West Streeting
55:13
is a more electable leader than Keir Starmer. I mean, it's a view. It might well be true
55:20
It's hard to measure. It's hard to count. But that isn't necessarily what the party should be prioritising in 2026
55:28
Mid-2028 may be a completely different question. But the argument that he hasn't had long enough
55:38
to justify a dismissal seems, to me at least, pretty powerful. Shall we break the habit of a lifetime
55:47
and take a call before the junction? I think we shall. Jim's in Wigan
55:51
Jim, what do you want to say? Oh, hi, James. Congratulations on new figures
55:56
Oh, I don't like to talk about them, Jim. Yeah, we'll keep it free now
56:00
Thank you very much. No, all I would say is, as a living in the Labour heartland
56:06
and being a Labour supporter and with no great enthusiasm. But I do believe that it is time for a leadership change within the Labour Party
56:18
I would thank Keir for what he did, because there was no one happier when we won the last election
56:24
But unfortunately, I think just things have gone wrong for him. And I think it is the cult of personality
56:33
I think people do dislike him. And if you ask them why, they probably don't really know why
56:38
And I think it's just contagious. And I'm just really worried that in two and a half years' time
56:44
we will have a reform-led government. And I think that has to be opposed
56:50
I mean, the thing is that just because streeting is the one most likely to trigger a challenge
56:54
does not mean that streeting is the one most likely to prevail. I thought that the suggestion yesterday that he might have done it to sort of encourage the others
57:03
pour encourager les autres was really interesting, as was the suggestion this morning from another colleague
57:10
that he may have been played a little bit by Downing Street
57:14
They may have put out that story yesterday because the fact that it happened as the king was making his way to Parliament
57:19
painted streeting in a rather unattractive light, but in no particular order, he's a southerner with a small majority
57:26
and heavily associated with Peter Mandelson and the Labour Together right of the party
57:32
So quite what his appeal to the people you're talking about in Labour heartlands up north would be compared to Keir Starmer's, I don't immediately see
57:42
No, I mean, my thought is, and it's not necessarily West Streeting as is, but it needs someone to take that initial step of the challenge of laying down the gourd
57:52
And then we have to open it up to a wider pool of people and have that debate
57:57
and, you know, call me biased, but I do think Andy Burnham has to be in that discussion
58:04
Why do you think that? Because I don't want to start raining on everybody's parade
58:08
And I certainly subscribe to that thing I said earlier about Ed Miliband
58:13
is that just because somebody didn't cover themselves in glory 10 years ago does not mean that they should be excluded from consideration 10 years later
58:19
They grow, they get better, they go away, they learn. But what's Andy Burnham done since losing two leadership elections
58:26
that makes you want him to win one? Obviously, being in the North, I think..
58:32
Don't say trams. No, no, trams, obviously. But I just think he is a very well-liked politician
58:40
And I think part of it is being a leader. I think that's the problem where Keir's maybe fallen down a bit
58:47
There's been that... And I don't want to keep harming onto that to people
58:51
It's like a... But with the U-turns, I think just coming in and making decisions
58:55
that he didn't need to make at that time. And you think two years
58:59
because this is where I push back at you a bit with the sort of Brenda from Bristol thing
59:04
Everything you say is true, and yet it's arguably far too soon
59:10
to be reaching the conclusion that it's time to sling him out. I mean, that turns Labour into Tories
59:16
I think historically you can say that. It's not, you know, I don't particularly want this
59:22
I wish it wasn't happening, but we are where we are. and last week's election results were catastrophic
59:28
So even though we say it's only two years, that's what's happened after two years
59:33
I know losing Wales. In Wigan, it wasn't the full election, but they lost 24 out of 25
59:42
I think it's just a trajectory that I don't think it can get better
59:46
Fair enough. No, fair enough. I thought it was going to get better
59:50
I'd say, you know, if we didn't need it, and we could get better and there was a ray of hope that he could change this round
59:57
I just don't think that he can. that's with a heavy heart. Yeah, I hear the heaviness, and I hear the absence of hope
1:00:04
It's an expired hope, isn't it? It's not a hope that never existed. You have run out of hope
1:00:09
Most of my callers today still have hope, but no one is really arguing that any of that hope has yet been justified
1:00:15
except possibly, well, for me at least, definitely on the foreign stage, on the international relations stage
1:00:22
But even that has been tricky, because, of course, pandering to Trump and sucking up to Trump in the hope of getting an easier ride
1:00:28
worked very well until it didn't. Thank you, Jim. Quite a northern flavour to the show today
1:00:33
which is A, nice, and B, interesting, isn't it? Because so many of the players in the current space are northern
1:00:43
Most obviously, Andy Burnham and Angela Rayner. And I've told you before, the shallowest political opinion I have
1:00:49
is that Labour would benefit from having a leader with a northern accent
1:00:53
It's pathetic, and it's shallow, and you may think it's condescending even
1:00:56
But I just can't help, I can't shake it. And Keir Starmer doesn't
1:01:02
And nor does Wes Streeting. James O'Brien on LBC. It's 18 minutes after 11
1:01:08
Kevin Schofield is the political editor at HuffPost UK. In the last few minutes he has written that it's looking increasingly unlikely
1:01:15
that Wes Streeting will challenge Keir Starmer today. So if it's the curse of O'Brien, it's going to be the curse of Kevin Schofield as well
1:01:22
But I'll tell you what, if he messes up Mystery Hour, I may never forgive him. Some in his team, writes Kevin Schofield at HuffPost UK
1:01:28
are not convinced that he, West Streeting, has the 81 supporters locked in to formally launch a contest
1:01:34
There's also suspicion that Angela Rayner's announcement this morning that she's being cleared by HMRC is making Streeting think twice
1:01:44
And then he adds, I think somewhat disingenuously, I don't know the fellow, but he's a very, very good journalist
1:01:50
that readers may be getting fed up with the uncertainty. You're not alone. and journalists would like a bit of certainty too
1:01:56
I don't know about that. I don't know that journalists generally behave as if it's the certainty they crave
1:02:02
as opposed to the feverish speculation that they engage in. But hey-ho, there it is, another suggestion
1:02:07
that the moment is passing if it hasn't passed already. And Angela Rayner's very, very timely announcement
1:02:14
of exoneration by HMRC, which will come as a surprise only to people so politically bent
1:02:20
that they still pretend Boris Johnson got ditched because of eating some cake
1:02:26
That is a message to Wes Streeting, that, look, I don't want to go
1:02:31
but if you go, I'll go. As in, I don't want to make a move on the leader at this point in proceedings
1:02:36
but if you do, I will. And if I do, then your chances, your path to power suddenly becomes a heck of a lot more complicated
1:02:41
than it does if Andy Burnham's stuck in Manchester and nobody else fancies tossing their hat into the ring
1:02:47
So I think that's probably what Rayner did, But then I'm engaging in that speculation
1:02:53
90 minutes after 11 is the time. I've received one homophobic message about West Streeting
1:02:59
I don't know what you... I don't think I'll read it to you. Why would we... I'll bleep out the relevant word
1:03:06
Why would we want a blank as Prime Minister? And I've said to you now for some time
1:03:12
that once you take the lid off the pressure cooker or for one bigotry or for one hatred
1:03:17
then you don't get to control all of the ones that follow
1:03:21
I think most obviously the way that Donald Trump hitched himself to the anti-trans bandwagon that had been built by people
1:03:30
who would go to their grave insisting that A, they were right and B, that they meant well
1:03:35
But when a fascist like Donald Trump starts using it as an entry point for his racism and his misogyny and his homophobia
1:03:41
you do just feel very sad. And I think the same happens
1:03:46
because as I get a message from someone being homophobic about West Streeting
1:03:50
I read that Nigel Farage has offered his full support to a self-described Christian
1:03:56
who preaches that homosexuality is an abomination and would lead to eternity in hell
1:04:02
So there's your Christian values from the leader of Reform UK. And this is one of those people that turns up in public places
1:04:11
and shouts abuse under the guise of godliness and then complains when they get moved along
1:04:18
or complains when they get asked to be quiet. A bit like the people outside abortion clinics
1:04:23
that J.D. Vance, the American vice president, lies about claims or breaches of free speech
1:04:28
when actually they're breaches of exclusion orders. You get them lying about that
1:04:35
But that's the thing that we have all set in motion in this country
1:04:39
the return of ancient hatreds. you know anti-semitism of course uh on on the rise in hideous ways prince harry's written a
1:04:47
piece for the new statesman talking about anti-semitism and anti-muslim hatred it's a
1:04:51
really measured and interesting piece but looking at some of the headlines uh reporting this piece
1:04:56
in the new states when they've decided to drop the uh islamic element of his critique from from
1:05:02
the headlines and focus exclusively on his condemnation of a rise in anti-semitism i don't
1:05:07
know why you do that. If I wrote an article condemning anti-Semitism and anti-Muslim hatred
1:05:11
and then it got reported by the BBC on a headline that didn't mention anti-Muslim hatred, I'd just
1:05:16
be very confused. But there we are. That's what's unfolding at the moment. And one of the criticisms
1:05:22
of Keir Starmer is that he hasn't very successfully stood up to any of this, to which the most
1:05:27
optimistic response available is simply, yet. He hasn't stood up to any of this. Yet
1:05:37
Kate's in Bern in Switzerland. Kate, what would you like to say? Hello. Hello, James
1:05:42
Lovely to speak to you. Likewise. I'm Swiss, so I'm looking in from the outside, kind of
1:05:48
But I've been following in the past few days and weeks, and it feels a bit like people have the patience of a toddler
1:05:56
They just want change yesterday. It doesn't matter what's going to change
1:06:01
They just want something different. It doesn't matter if it's worse, as long as it's different
1:06:06
and I think sometimes you forget that times are rough for all of us
1:06:11
not just in the UK, in mainland Europe as well. There's no one going to just come in and solve all our problems at once
1:06:21
no matter who it is. And I've also heard plenty of people say
1:06:26
yeah, we're the laughingstock, sir, here's the laughingstock of the world. But actually, I never felt that way
1:06:31
I think you'd only be the laughingstock if you got yet another PM after, what, two years
1:06:38
I think that the lies that are told about this country and some of our politicians online
1:06:43
and by foreign politicians can get halfway around the world before the trees have got its trousers on
1:06:48
But Keir Starmer isn't the laughingstock anywhere. I mean, for a start, just look at the United States of America
1:06:54
and tell me that we should be taking lectures from them on political leadership or democracy
1:06:59
It's comical. Someone, having someone who's an admirer of Trump and of Putin
1:07:05
and they think somehow he's going to represent the UK better than the current government
1:07:10
It's really terrifying to see. Well, it is. And, of course, we've been given an indication of how a reform UK government would perform at the national level
1:07:18
by their success in councils, which brings me to some breaking news from Worcestershire
1:07:22
where reform has just lost minority control of the county council after being overthrown by a rainbow coalition of Conservatives Greens Lib Dems and Independents So the Green councillor Matt Jenkins is the new council leader there
1:07:36
Twelve months in power, but they have now gone. So chaos, chaos, chaos
1:07:41
Why would Labour introduce a bout of self-inflicted chaos by having another leadership challenge
1:07:47
I mean, there's a thing, isn't there? There's a great line in politics about you just sit there
1:07:50
and let your enemy hurt themselves. Labour don't seem to have learned that lesson
1:07:54
Can I add something completely unrelated? Yeah, of course you can. But do you want to borrow some money
1:08:02
No. You like Ghost of Yote, you might enjoy playing Greedfall. What's it called
1:08:10
Greedfall. Like greed, as in greed. Yeah. And then the number four
1:08:15
Four. Four. Greedfall. Like the season. Okay. No, okay. You might enjoy it
1:08:19
Well, thank you, because I'm always looking out for new games to play. and Ghost of Yotei is going to take some replacing in my affections
1:08:26
I was thinking of going back to it and playing through again, actually. But there we go
1:08:30
We should phone in on video game recommendations, shouldn't we? Next time there's an election
1:08:34
If Eleanor could shake her head, if Eleanor shook her head any more violently than she's shaking it now
1:08:38
it would actually fall off. Thank you, Kate. So, I mean, a very, very solid consensus
1:08:45
that we do not want a leadership election. I've got one and a half million listeners now
1:08:49
Someone should mention that more often. and, you know, the massive majority of you
1:08:54
will never ring into the programme. There's a self-selecting element, I suppose
1:08:59
to the kind of people that do. Ditto, there's always a slight danger of echo chambers
1:09:05
and things like that when you have programmes presented by people with supposedly strong personalities or strong views
1:09:10
But it's hard to make sense of a desire for change. and then you have that wonderful ysis there from switzerland from kate that it is as if
1:09:24
toddlers they don't know what they want but they know they want it now what do you want change
1:09:29
when do you want it yesterday why do you want it well just because well i just do because i've got
1:09:36
used to change i've got used to constant flux we've become a little bit addicted to chaos
1:09:41
So, seriously, and this isn't a sort of, I hope, an artificial attempt at balancing things out
1:09:47
give me a ring now and tell me why you do want somebody else to be Prime Minister
1:09:51
So we'll put West Streeting ever so slightly on the back burner and you can bring anybody you want to the party
1:09:58
So if the moment is passing, as it seems possible, if not probable now
1:10:03
then we probably won't be talking about this again for a while
1:10:07
And all things being equal, it will be Mystery Hour at 12 today, and I want to talk to Dan Needle from Tax Policy Associates
1:10:13
just before that. So you've got a few, you've got a good opportunity now
1:10:17
to put forward the case for change, the reason why you do want somebody else
1:10:23
anybody else, and you can choose whichever candidate you want, to replace Keir Starmer as leader of the Labour Party
1:10:31
and hence as Prime Minister. So who do you want to do it, and why do you want it to happen now
1:10:37
0345 6060 973 is the number that you need. Why do you want him or her
1:10:46
And why do you want it to happen now? And I think there are lots of strong cases to be made
1:10:53
for almost all of those candidates. I just wonder, actually, and I know we've just popped him on the back burner
1:11:00
I just wonder whether West Streetings case is among the weakest of all the other contenders
1:11:05
the more you dig into it. I don't know. But you do, and you're about to tell me
1:11:09
by dialing 0345 6060973. Paul's in Morecambe. Paul, what made you pick up the phone
1:11:15
Hi, James. Sorry, I'm still answering the question on my... I don't want to change
1:11:19
No, that's fine. I mean, you were waiting to come on while I asked the next question
1:11:23
It wouldn't be fair to expect you to answer a question that I hadn't asked when you rang into the programme
1:11:26
to answer a question that I had asked. Never know. Go on. Thank you
1:11:32
Yeah, I don't want Starman to step down, and this is coming from a person that joined the Labour Party
1:11:39
to support Jeremy Corbyn. I am a very left of the party type of supporter
1:11:45
But I've always felt that since Starmer first got elected, the pressure would mount more and more
1:11:53
the closer he made closer ties with Europe. I think there's a lot of entities
1:12:00
we'll call them entities politely, who put a lot of money into opposing anything like that
1:12:08
That would be including whether it's the political parties or whether it's the media or all that sort of thing
1:12:15
And I think that is the main thing that they oppose because of the financial penalties or implications
1:12:23
that might have for them. Well, there's regulation of profiteering. You know, membership of the single market involves rules that protect ordinary people from rapacious capitalism, from conscienceless pursuit of profit
1:12:41
And of course, if you're in the business of conscienceless pursuit of profit, then the European Union is something that you despise and have successfully persuaded a population to leave
1:12:52
So that would be why elements of the right have got such a bead on Starmer
1:12:58
Why would there be so much dissatisfaction from within his own party, which would be broadly euro friendly, unless it is, you know, in good faith belief that someone else would be more likely to win another election
1:13:13
I can't 100% say on that. I know there was a lot of talk when he was first elected and I didn't vote for him when the elections came around for a new leader
1:13:23
and there was a lot of talk about, oh, he's Blairite or he's..
1:13:30
I think he's more left than Blair in many ways. Yeah, yeah, and he was taking money from the Israeli lobbies
1:13:39
and things like that. I saw some of that coverage. I can't say for any certainty on all that
1:13:44
I do remember when he was... The thing about Starmer is he's not my type of lead
1:13:51
He's not what I really want. I have to say I'm a Corbyn supporter, but I'm a bit of an odd one
1:13:56
because I also understand the practicalities of the policies Corbyn want, although I support the policies he wanted
1:14:02
But the practicalities, I'm not certain. But watching Starmer absolutely take apart
1:14:08
the argument for leaving the EU when he was in that ministerial role
1:14:14
I thought was really, really good. So that's where I'm coming from
1:14:20
I think you sound very pragmatic, actually, albeit that your political principles are
1:14:26
I think, under your own ysis there when you talked about practicalities, idealistic
1:14:32
There's nothing wrong with being idealistic, but pragmatism probably demands that Starmer stays in post, actually
1:14:38
because the alternative is mess, chaos, and disarray until someone makes a strong case for candidate X or candidate Y
1:14:47
I mean, I could probably argue I'd rather so-and-so was currently Prime Minister
1:14:51
but that not the same as arguing that I want so to replace the man who is currently Prime Minister That I think the nub of the point that we been exploring together today It 11 Dominic Ellis has your headline James O on LBC
1:15:06
It is 11.35. Goodness me, it's like Marmite, that suggestion that we would do a phoning about video games next time there's an election on
1:15:13
Some people absolutely mad about the idea. And some people absolutely mad about the idea, with the two different meanings of mad
1:15:20
See what I did there? Barumtish. well I mean it's unlikely that we'd ever do it
1:15:24
but I was only sort of making conversation which is after all my job 11.35 is the time
1:15:29
Nacho Nigel pulls out of a scheduled speech in Sunderland just as he bottled responding to the King's speech yesterday
1:15:37
because he does not want to be asked questions about this secret £5 million gift he received
1:15:42
from a foreign-based billionaire so I thought that we'd improvise I thought we'd cobble together our own little speech
1:15:49
regarding Nigel Farage, so that his fans do not feel too deprived of his input
1:15:57
And that speech that he's pulled out of, of course, was the one where journalists had been ordered
1:16:01
to pre-submit their questions for approval by the great leader and his top team of weirdos and criminals
1:16:10
So there it is. I'll do that shortly, but I want to get a couple of answers to the question
1:16:16
of why and who you want instead? Sean's in Coventry. Sean, what do you reckon
1:16:22
Well, firstly, the video game debate, 100%, we need to have one
1:16:26
Well, then someone else is going to come on and say 100% we don't. Anyway, carry on, carry on
1:16:30
Right, so I think, for me, Angela Rayner, I would love to see somebody like Angela Rayner in
1:16:37
I'm a big lefty. Yeah. And I think, pragmatically, having someone like Angela Rayner
1:16:45
who's got strong beliefs that link very strongly to the left, but aren't too far, they're not Zach Polanski left
1:16:51
but they're left enough. Well, they're plausible left. I mean, I don't want to activate the Zach Polanski fans
1:16:57
who are all perfectly decent people, but Angela Rayner is in power
1:17:02
so she can't make promises that she won't be able to keep later
1:17:06
So there's just a difference in pragmatism there. Do you want her enough to approve of a change now
1:17:13
a battle now? because you don't just get to anoint her and push her into Downing Street
1:17:17
You've got a big scrap over a period of quite possibly four months and all the damage that will do without any guarantee at the end of it
1:17:23
that your candidate gets the nod. Yeah, I think you have to
1:17:27
I mean, look, the problem is that we as a country are a little bit
1:17:33
falling into this short attention span piece, right? And I think giving her a good enough run
1:17:39
I mean, what would that give her, two and a half years near enough if she got in in about four months' time
1:17:43
Yeah. So two and a half years. Three years, arguably. Yeah, so it's a long enough run for her to implement some decent changes
1:17:52
start winning over the Labour fans and supporters that Keir Starmer had lost
1:17:57
She has a warmth. She has genuine stardust, I would say. And obviously that will mean both her class and her sex
1:18:07
will mean that elements of the British media come for her with even more viciousness
1:18:11
than they came for Ed Miliband's dead father. but she's seen a little bit of that as well with coverage of her vaping
1:18:18
or going in a little dinghy on the coast and some horrible comments and coverage of that
1:18:24
But she's nothing if not thick-skinned. Out of all of them, if it was literally easy to say
1:18:30
right, he's out, she's in, Angela Rayner is the most immediately likable of the bunch
1:18:37
and that matters, I guess, in modern politics more than ever. Thank you, Sean
1:18:41
Marcus is in Merton. Marcus, what do you reckon? Yeah, I mean, morning, James
1:18:48
I mean, I think the key thing I would say is that for Labour, they absolutely have to do this because of the polls
1:18:53
I don't think they're going to. I don't think they're going to. Well, I just think if they don't, they're in trouble
1:19:00
They're going to face this wipeout. I mean, I also think it's vital for the country because, I mean
1:19:04
ultimately, what is the radical platform? What is it going to improve living standards
1:19:09
What is going to deal with the cost of living crisis? A growing economy is the short answer to that
1:19:17
And I think much to many people's surprise, that's exactly what has been announced today
1:19:22
And then you've got the increase in living wage, which is going to affect the people who need help most
1:19:26
You've got the abolition of the cap on benefits for the poorest children in the entire country
1:19:32
So there's lots of evidence of some lives being improved. and we have to guard against the populist desire of seeing my life improved
1:19:40
and stuff everybody else. But I don't know what any leader would do differently
1:19:45
on any of the fronts that you describe. I mean, it's interesting you say that
1:19:50
but I think we can't lose sight of distribution. So we can talk about growth
1:19:54
But if we don't talk about distribution, I mean, if you think about Gary Stevenson
1:19:59
it's a very good point. There's a few other on the left in terms of economics
1:20:04
But distribution is vital. so we can do growth. But if that growth is not going to be down to the kind of average people..
1:20:11
So per capita. So then you're looking at the mansion tax and then you're looking at the abolition of the VAT exemption
1:20:17
on private education. So they are targeting the people with the quotes, most end quotes
1:20:23
in ways that other governments haven't, but there is absolutely no rebutting the argument
1:20:29
that they should target them a lot more. And you've seen what Mamdani's done in New York
1:20:33
with a tax on second homes and wealth taxes get talked about a lot
1:20:37
No one's really crunched the numbers sufficiently to state with absolute certainty whether it would work well
1:20:43
or whether it would make little difference or whether it would prompt a sort of exodus of people to places like Dubai
1:20:50
Yeah, so who would it be then for you, briefly, Marcus? Who would be the kind of..
1:20:55
I mean, I think, you know, very briefly, I mean, if we're thinking about wealth tax re-nationalisation
1:21:02
we need to think about these kind of things. Who is going to be doing that re-industrialization and wealth tax
1:21:07
that kind of framework? Someone on the left like Clive Lewis, maybe Angela Rayner, I would hope
1:21:13
Andy Burnham, can you remember I believe in Jeremy? I agree with Jeremy
1:21:18
Even though we're talking about Andy, but when he got faced off with Corbyn, he was always like, yes, I agree with Jeremy
1:21:23
Well, that's, again, I don't know whether... I mean, I keep saying just because someone fluffed it 10 years ago
1:21:29
doesn't mean they shouldn't get another chance now. And I do mean that in the case of Andy Burnham and Ed Miliband
1:21:34
It's a short-termism. It's a slightly childlike approach to politics to think that you get one bite of the cherry and then it's game over
1:21:41
We never would have had Stanley Baldwin and we never would have had Winston Churchill in Downing Street
1:21:46
if we'd subscribed to that school of thought 100 years ago. But, yeah, I mean, I don't know that any of them
1:21:52
would necessarily deliver the kind of pledges or policies that you desire
1:21:58
And, of course, as you've just reminded us, Zach Polanski and his Green Party will be on the sidelines
1:22:03
promising to deliver precisely those sorts of policies and promises. And that is a problem that any Labour leader is going to have to deal with
1:22:10
Thank you, Marcus. Caelan is in Salford. Caelan, what would you like to say
1:22:15
Good morning, James. Yeah, I think it's with great regret, really, that I think I'm now in favour of a Labour leadership contest
1:22:23
Go on. I thought Jess Phillips letter the other day said it all which is I genuinely believe that Starmer is a fundamentally decent person Yes But for whatever reason he has
1:22:35
He sort of summons this hatred from all sides. There's that and a sense that he's squandered something
1:22:42
even if it's hard to specify precisely what it is that he's squandered. But the combination of personal unpopularity
1:22:47
and a perceived failure to deliver, it could be toxic. I think he is completely hamstrung
1:22:54
because he ran an election campaign where he had to be all things to all people
1:23:00
He had to play to the Corbyn side of the party. He had to play to the Blairite side of the party
1:23:05
He had to try and win votes from reform. And when you run a campaign like that, everyone is going to feel this sense of hope
1:23:13
and all will be left unsatisfied. So I think that's why I'm now in favour of a Labour leadership contest
1:23:20
because having an opportunity to set a new course whilst Starmer's working away in the background
1:23:26
he can go on his sort of trips and do that very positively and successfully
1:23:33
whilst a new direction is set to the Labour Party. There's such a massive built-in majority
1:23:38
that the next person who comes in will have set this course, this path
1:23:44
which Starmer has been unable to do and actually hit the next two years
1:23:48
So you fight an election with something to defend and something to propose and promote
1:23:54
And the chaos argument, Caelan? Yeah, the thing is I view what we're in now as chaos
1:24:01
Fair enough. And if we have the next two years of this, will he stay, will he go
1:24:06
Because I think we've just reached that point now. I don't know if summer is ever going to be popular
1:24:11
with the majority of this country. And that might not be fair
1:24:16
but it is also true. And in fact, apropos all of this
1:24:20
it's just been announced that NHS waiting lists have just enjoyed their largest reduction in 17 years
1:24:26
So what does that do to your pendulum? Sort of, where's Streeting then
1:24:31
Sees his star rise a little bit because he is, against, you know, extraordinary difficulties
1:24:36
apparently doing quite a good job at the Department of Health, which is not something you ever really find yourself saying
1:24:40
about Secretaries of State for Health. But at quarter to Mystery Hour
1:24:44
I still think that we will not be today reporting on LBC that the Secretary of State for Health, West Streeting, has offered his resignation to the Prime Minister in preparation for a leadership challenge
1:24:56
I do not think that's going to happen today. I was 52.48 at 10 o'clock this morning, and at quarter to mystery, I'm 75.25
1:25:05
80.20. 78.28. No, 22. I'm moving. I'm trying to be like one of those graphs on a computer screen
1:25:15
It's pathetic, really. Do you want me to improvise a Nigel Farage speech
1:25:22
because he's chickened out of giving one in Sunderland? He's terrified of being asked questions about the secret five million quid
1:25:28
and God knows how many other secret donations he's taken from billionaires
1:25:32
I mean, God knows, as in no one does. There might be none, there might be shed loads
1:25:36
They might all have been taking donations from billionaires privately. Who knows
1:25:41
That's one of the problems, isn't it, with allowing extremists and populists into the public space
1:25:46
is that you can't take anything for granted when it comes to transparency and decency
1:25:51
Would you like me to improvise a speech to fill the whole left by him chickening out of giving one in Tunderland
1:25:57
Because if you do, I'll do it before Mystery Hour. But immediately after the next break, we're talking to Dan Needle from Tax Policy Associates about
1:26:04
well, I'd like Tim to talk about Angela Rayner, but also Zach Polanski and Nadeem Zahawi
1:26:09
for reasons that will shortly become clear. James O'Brien on LBC. It is 11.49
1:26:17
We're trying to raise Dan Needle from Tax Policy Associates. So in the meantime, I will acquiesce to your desires
1:26:23
and improvise a Nigel Farage speech for you because he's chickened out of giving one in Sunderland
1:26:28
So terrified of his same reason why he chickened out of appearing on Laura Koonsberg, of all people's show
1:26:33
a Sunday or two ago. And presumably the same reason why he chickened out
1:26:37
of being in the House of Commons yesterday because he's very, very, very uncomfortable being asked questions about..
1:26:43
Well, you know he is because in the first part of our improvised speech, you can hear how uncomfortable he is being asked questions
1:26:48
about his secret £5 million donor right now. We talked about some difficult questions of funding for local councils
1:26:57
You've had some difficult questions about your own funding. Yeah, yeah. We'll talk about that any other time you like
1:27:02
Something else I'd quite like to talk about is who has been conducting these negotiations
1:27:08
Oh, very, very interesting. I've already got two countries agreeing that if we win the next election, they will cooperate with me
1:27:16
The Taliban, I mean, by the way, they're not my mates, but the Taliban have said they would accept people back from us to Afghanistan
1:27:24
They've said that already. I'm genuinely fascinated by that because it would suggest that somebody from his inner circle
1:27:33
has been conducting negotiations with the Taliban. I'd be fascinated to find out who
1:27:39
I hope it's 30p Lee. That would just be funny. But there it is
1:27:44
Oh, crikey. Bernard Manning. And then you have the admiration for Vladimir Putin
1:27:49
which he's not only expressed, but also lied about. Some television presenters, and indeed radio presenters
1:27:54
are capable of handling his lies, others somewhat less so. Happily, David Dimbleby is in the first category
1:28:02
I don't admire Putin. What I said was he'd outwitted and outclassed you all over Syria
1:28:07
I also said I didn't like him as a human being and I wouldn't want to live in Russia
1:28:10
But what I want to do, let's not meddle. Let's not meddle. Hang on, just before you go on, you did actually say you admired him
1:28:17
As an operator, not as a human being. The question was, which current world leader do you most admire? As an operator, I would say Putin
1:28:24
Yes. So he did it and then he lied about it, but David Timberby didn't let him
1:28:28
Oh, and speaking of lies. If Brexit a disaster, I will go and live abroad
1:28:32
I'll go and live somewhere else. And also, of course, anti-Semitism. He makes the point that there are other very powerful foreign lobbies
1:28:40
in the United States of America, and the Jewish lobby, with its links with the Israeli government
1:28:46
is one of those strong voices. 11.52 is the time. Speaking of strong voices, he was on with Nick Ferrari
1:28:54
towards the end of last year, talking about a company perhaps you'd never heard of before
1:28:59
a cryptocurrency company called Tether, which is the one that Christopher Harbourn owns 12% of
1:29:07
So the bloke that gave Nigel Varage a secret £5 million also owns 12% of this company
1:29:14
which he spoke to Nick about without mentioning on-air or off-air that he'd just taken £5 million from one of the owners
1:29:22
Tether is a stablecoin. Stablecoins are the way which money goes from conventional currencies
1:29:27
through into cryptocurrencies and back again. Tether is about to be valued as a $500 billion company
1:29:34
You know, stablecoins, crypto, this world is enormous. And if you're just joining us, we're trying to cobble together an improvised Nigel Farage speech
1:29:44
because he's chickened out of giving one in Sunderland, so terrified is he of being asked questions
1:29:48
about the secret five million quid that he took from Christopher Hardborn
1:29:52
Is it Sankritz, who operates under a different name in his home
1:29:59
country of Thailand. And I don't know why we've added this one to the list
1:30:05
but I don't think that you will hold it against me. I've got to say, I'm immensely grateful to you
1:30:13
for everything you've done in British politics over the last few years. I used to be an ardent Remainer
1:30:18
I voted Remainer. I believed in the European project. I believed that staying in the European Union
1:30:24
was the best thing for us. and then something happened and something monumental happened
1:30:30
It completely changed my opinion on the whole situation. What was that monumental thing, Mark
1:30:37
I was kicked in the head by a horse. Right, very good
1:30:41
OK, fine. Bird of Manning. What? Bird of Manning. And finally... Bird of Manning
1:30:50
Cathy's in Axminster. To steer us back to the question of a leadership challenge
1:30:55
Cathy. What would you like to say? Oh, what an interesting... What lovely callers
1:30:59
you've had today. Very thoughtful. Yes. Don't spoil it, Cathy. Go on. Several of them
1:31:07
I'm so... I despair about this infighting at the moment when we need what is a calm
1:31:13
ship, basically. I'm not mad about Starmer, but he's calm and he's thoughtful, and he's not
1:31:18
reactive. The last thing we need is someone reactive, like we're streeting
1:31:23
But an earlier caller said that everything... Oh, no, sorry, they were like you, weren't they
1:31:28
They were talking about the public being too reactive. It's like we want everything yesterday, and if we don't like it
1:31:33
we'll take a bite out of it and put it back on the shelf and then pick something else up. It is just childish, isn't it
1:31:39
Yeah, I listened a little bit to Nick Ferrari this morning. I never hardly listened to him, but I caught the political historian..
1:31:48
Oh, yes. Anthony Selden, I think, was it? People are treating politics like they're treating an Amazon delivery
1:31:54
Yes, they are. They want it all in 20 minutes, or they'll send it back
1:31:58
And that's possibly culturally what's going on in the country at the moment
1:32:04
thanks to, I don't know, media and stuff. Not your media, I love your programme
1:32:08
Oh, you're very kind. So that's why I thought, oh God, please not West Streeting
1:32:15
I think he strikes me as a bit of a media queen
1:32:19
I don't dislike him, but I don't want him leading our country, for God's sake
1:32:24
Just to clarify, the Queen there is not a reference to his sexuality
1:32:28
Oh, no, no, no. I know, I'm just clarifying that for the benefit of the tape
1:32:32
No, but some people love the cameras. Keir Starmer obviously doesn't, because he's a quieter, shyer man
1:32:38
Yeah. I want him to continue for the moment. I've always been a Labour supporter, but I've been very unhappy lately about... No
1:32:48
I've voted other things, but I don't think this is... This is the time, this is not the time for a change of leader
1:32:55
It really isn't. Have you felt that all week? Or has your position moved a bit in the course of the last few days
1:33:01
Because mine has. I've been a bit up and down, like one of the ballers
1:33:06
And you get kind of bought into this, I want change and I want it now
1:33:12
And then when I sat down quietly, I thought, no, I really don't
1:33:17
And when I saw that Wes Streeting was electing himself, I thought, no, I really don't want that
1:33:23
I want Starmer to continue. He's dull. His body language is very unappealing
1:33:29
He's not a reactor. He thinks he's on a mission. It's just because not many of us can quite work out what the mission is
1:33:38
But if the mission is simply managing and stability, then more of that
1:33:43
Or at least let's start seeing more of it soon. Because that, for me, at the beginning of the week
1:33:47
was the big area of contention, was that he'd failed on the thing that he was actually supposed to deliver
1:33:54
So you can forgive all of the things, Cathy, that you mentioned, the lack of this and the lack of that
1:33:58
or the poor this and the poor that, because he is a process-driven managerial politician
1:34:03
and therefore will forgive all of the faults and failings. But then he failed on process-driven managing
1:34:10
That's the problem. But just because he failed yesterday does not mean that you will fail again tomorrow
1:34:16
Thank you, Cathy. From Devon to Cumbria, Frank's in Carlisle. Frank, last word to you on this
1:34:20
I think, what would you like to say? Hi, James. I think I'd like to see a new leader for the next election
1:34:26
but I don't want it to happen today. I don't want it to start now. I think the problem with Starmer is
1:34:31
he doesn't have the star power that allows him to stand up next to the populists
1:34:36
and sound like he's an attractive proposition. And Spring doesn't have that either
1:34:41
Not even slightly. Do you think? But if you add somebody like Andy Burnham in
1:34:46
I think you'd get, yesterday, somebody said on your show, that when Tony Blair was elected
1:34:53
there was a feeling of joy. And when Starmer was elected, it wasn't like a feeling of joy
1:34:57
It was like a feeling that, thank God, the people who'd been staying in your house had finally gone
1:35:00
You know, the relatives had left. But I think what we need for the next..
1:35:07
I think it would be great if Keir Starmer, in about a year, say, just said
1:35:12
right, we're now about to start looking at the next election. And I think this is a good place for me
1:35:18
to step aside, let some new blood in, get a bit of excitement behind the thing
1:35:23
because then we'll have a base of all of the good work that they've been doing quietly
1:35:27
the stuff that the messaging has been rubbish about. And hopefully by then, people will actually be able to feel it
1:35:31
Nice. I think that's quite a nice point to end it, actually. And, of course, that leaves the door open
1:35:36
to some sort of miraculous transformation of Keir Starmer as well, but only very slightly ajar
1:35:43
Yeah, absolutely. And it gives people like Rainer a chance to not just be back off the hook
1:35:49
and it means that Burnham could find a way into politics that doesn't involve somebody jumping to one side really quickly
1:35:56
and just looking... It looks shonky. Shonky's a great word. No, I was actually searching for the word to describe that
1:36:02
something a little bit more expressive than chaotic, but yes, it does
1:36:07
It's a bit sort of make-do-and-mend, isn't it? It's a bit hodgepodge. It's shonky
1:36:11
Great stuff from Frank, and that is it. As far as I can tell, no announcements have been made
1:36:16
no resignations have been offered no challenges have been launched which means Mr. Hour should proceed unscathed
1:36:24
if you've got a question that you want to get on the board you know what to do
1:36:28
if you hear somebody else ask a question to which you know the answer you know what to do
1:36:32
I'm just keeping one eye on the screen because knowing my luck
1:36:36
it is going to be announced directly to coincide with or clash with Mr. Hour
1:36:41
in which case we would obviously have to put Mr. Hour back in the fridge
1:36:45
but I'm going to say it, I think we're okay. James O'Brien on LBC
1:36:53
A little bit of light relief, although some of you felt that yesterday's coverage of the King's speech
1:36:57
or at least the preamble to the King's speech, fulfilled that role of much-needed levity as well
1:37:04
So thank you for your kind words regarding that. Mystery Hour, however, is scheduled and weekly
1:37:08
a guaranteed giggle, consequent dependent of course upon the questions that you ask and the answers that are offered the
1:37:16
magic happens in the margins if you've no idea what this is all about then uh i'll tell you
1:37:22
someone rings in with a question right yeah and someone else rings in with the answer that that what happens and my favorite contribution of the week wins a wonderful prize of which more later It the radio equivalent of newspaper features that can take weeks to reach fruition
1:37:38
but here we like to do it in less than an hour, or thereabouts
1:37:43
So the who, the why, the what, the where, the when, the wither, and even the occasional wherefore
1:37:50
If you are successful, if you do submit my favourite contribution of the week
1:37:54
and you win a Mystery Hour game, then your celebrations will be audible from space
1:37:59
But you can find the full terms and conditions for that at lbc.co.uk
1:38:03
If you want to find out more about the Mystery Hour games, plural
1:38:09
plural, because there's two games now. If you've got one, you should probably get the other
1:38:14
Then head over to mysteryhour.co.uk, where you can find out more about the original Mystery Hour board game
1:38:20
and the Mystery Hour travel game, which is in a tin. and is measurably and completely different from the Mystery Hour ballgame
1:38:28
not least because they contain completely different questions and, of course, answers
1:38:32
Six minutes after 12 is the time. Shall we crack on? Shall we crack straight on
1:38:36
Keith, have I forgotten anything? Anything going on there? Is everything all right? No, I've said you can have a giggle
1:38:40
I'm not doing a guaranteed laugh-out-loud moment because you just never know, do you, anymore
1:38:44
It depends on my mood, that, to be honest with you. If I'm in the right mood, I'll guarantee a laugh-out-loud moment
1:38:49
If I'm not in the right mood, I won't. So maybe I'll change my mind halfway. We'll see. Let's get going
1:38:54
Jamie's in Kettering. Jamie, question or answer? A question, please, James. Carry on, Jamie
1:38:59
So, I'm watching Legends on Netflix at the moment, and this won't make anyone laugh
1:39:03
but basically, it's obviously starring Steve Coon. Amazing. Definitely watch it. But in that programme, they have..
1:39:11
It's set in 1990, and they have one scene I can think of in particular
1:39:15
where there's a kitchen... Oh, the Mick McCarthy thing. No, no, no. What is it
1:39:20
It's about customs officers. Oh, I didn't know Steve Coogan was in that
1:39:26
Yeah, Steve Coogan's in it. Yeah, one of the main characters. It's amazing. That's another reason to watch it then
1:39:31
I'll watch him in anything. So, in the Penguin Diaries, it was amazing as an aside as well
1:39:38
I don't know if he's seen that. He gave a great speech at the BAFTAs as well this weekend as well when he picked up yet another one
1:39:43
Yes. So, basically, in that, it's set in 1990. In one of the scenes of the kitchen scene
1:39:48
they have, like, ketchup bottles and another product. And it's all exactly from that time
1:39:53
And I'm wondering, do the production company make it themselves, or do they go to the manufacturer to have them make it for them
1:40:00
Because obviously it's free advertising, effectively, for them. Neither. Ah. You know this, do you
1:40:06
I think I do, and I'll be corrected if I'm wrong, but there are specialist props companies who will have a warehouse
1:40:13
In the same way that you can get, you know, like costumes, are going to be, some costumes will be made from scratch
1:40:20
but some won't be. where was I recently? It was a suit of armour that Kenneth Brenner had worn in Henry V
1:40:27
I can't remember where I was. But it wasn't that recently, that's why I can't remember
1:40:32
But there would be companies that have like, you know, in the same way that you have cars
1:40:37
there's one out in Ealing, I was looking over a railway bridge the other day into a sort of, it must be a vintage car
1:40:45
they must supply cars for films because they had such an interesting selection of them
1:40:48
So in the same way that you've got cars, there'll be other companies that have got a sort of
1:40:52
storage units full of ketchup bottles and furniture and things. Yeah, because it's interesting, they have the cars
1:40:58
as well, so I was thinking that, I was thinking, well, how do they do that, that probably makes sense
1:41:02
I mean, can we put it on the board as a... Yeah, yeah, we can, because we'll get some, someone has to
1:41:06
go definitive on it, but it will be something like that. There's a place near me
1:41:10
that's just reopened after a period of refurbishment called the Duke of London
1:41:14
in Brentford. For people who like vintage cars, it's, it's, it's, I think
1:41:18
it's open Wednesday to Sunday and they do they store like prestige
1:41:24
automobiles for the owners but they also have a kind of exhibit of them as well so there's a lovely little
1:41:30
coffee shop and a lovely little bar it's just on the quay in Brentford
1:41:34
which is rapidly becoming the Brentford Riviera and it's full of cars some of which
1:41:38
are featured in films and television programs and some of which have not but they've got
1:41:42
everything from like racing cars right through to sort of vintage Ford Capris and stuff like that
1:41:47
If anyone's ever, James, if anyone's ever on the North York Railway
1:41:52
there's a... Gotham is the station that Heartbeat used, and they've still got in Gotham more sheep than people, I believe
1:41:59
but they've still got all the props from Heartbeat. So some of them will be specific to the production
1:42:06
and some of them will be coming from a sort of agency that specialises in them, but we'll get someone who's actually done it themselves
1:42:12
to confirm with us the full details. Jamie, lovely question. Thank you
1:42:19
And a great recommendation, actually. Legends, it's about the customs people going undercover, isn't it
1:42:25
in the 1990s to take on big drug dealers. Chris is in Lim. Chris, question or answer
1:42:33
It's a question, please. I can give you a little bit of an answer to the last discussion
1:42:37
You're not supposed to. What are your qualifications? No, it doesn't matter. Move on, move on
1:42:42
Tell me what your qualifications are. Well, I like classic cars and such
1:42:47
Okay. And it's Goatland, by the way, in Yorkshire. Oh, well played. Goatland
1:42:52
Okay. And my mate has classic cars, and he rents them out to..
1:42:58
To fills and stuff, yeah. I mean, I think we're confident on that side of it. It's the ketchup bottles we're interested in
1:43:04
Yeah, I can't... Set dressing, as it were. No, that's all right. What's your question
1:43:08
So, this is about rivers, please, where they meet the sea. Yes. So when you go on holiday, you go down to the beach
1:43:14
and most beaches have a little river going in them, don't they? Many, many beaches
1:43:19
And very often, if you look at high tide, you can see where that river's meeting the sea
1:43:26
And you get a separation line between where the fresh water's meeting the salt water
1:43:31
You can see a visible line in the water. Are you sure? I've seen it, and loads of people have seen it
1:43:37
We've been chatting about this at work. You can see it, James. Yeah, but it's not. If you put one foot on one side and one foot on the other
1:43:43
you're not going to have completely clear water on one side and completely salty water on the other
1:43:47
That's more likely to be a line caused by the movement of the tide, isn't it
1:43:51
That's what I'm asking. And how far does that bracket... Is it just that
1:43:56
Is it just that? I mean, you'd think it would just homogenise immediately, wouldn't you
1:43:59
You'd just think it would mix straight off. But you can see that visible line
1:44:04
And it's... I don't know. That's the first... It's a bit of a two-part of this
1:44:08
Does that part, please? And the other part is how far can the freshwater fish go
1:44:14
the saltwater fish go up the river? How far can they go up? Well, you're only allowed one question, Chris
1:44:19
Sorry. No, I'm not telling you off. I'm just asking you to focus on what it actually is
1:44:25
Well, we'll stick with the first part then, please. So can you see where the saltwater stops and the freshwater begins
1:44:31
And vice versa. Okay, so is there a line? and I got a feeling that Teddington
1:44:36
is relevant to this for some reason. So the brackish, so Tide End Town
1:44:42
would be Teddington. So that would be where the Thames ceases to have any salt in it at all
1:44:49
Yeah. I don't know. I've got something in it. So it's brackish water is what it's called, isn't it
1:44:53
That where the word comes from But I don think there a fixed line But maybe there is I mean technically there has to be doesn there If you got fresh water at some point and salt water at another point then there has to be a point where one stops and the other begins
1:45:07
Yeah, it must homogenise. It's got to do, hasn't it? It's got to mix
1:45:11
But I've seen it loads of times, and you can see that line. Right, you're on
1:45:16
And there's a name for it. So is that what that line is? I like that question
1:45:20
Thank you, Chris. That's film sets and rivers. James is in Southampton
1:45:24
James, question or answer? Question. Carry on. Yes, me and my wife have just come back from a trip to Canada
1:45:31
Oh, very nice. I would say thank you very much to Global Player as well
1:45:34
for keeping us company on our road trips. Oh, that's very nice as well. We weren't prepared to get up at 5am local time
1:45:39
to listen to you as much as we love you. No, I think that's perfectly reasonable in the circumstances
1:45:43
Carry on. But yeah, so on a Friday night, we went to see the Toronto Blue Jays play baseball
1:45:47
in Toronto, obviously. No, not obviously. It could have been an away game, couldn't it
1:45:54
Well, there's no other teams in Canada. Oh, is there not? All right, you got me. I didn't know that
1:45:59
Fair enough. We were prepared to go to America for political choices. No, fair enough
1:46:04
Yeah, we're part of the American boycott at the moment. But, yeah, towards the end of the game
1:46:08
the crowd started doing a Mexican wave. And I've seen this numerous times at cricket and other baseball games
1:46:15
I actually tricked me. Where did the Mexican wave originate from? Please don't say Mexico
1:46:21
Unless it is Mexico. but we need a little bit more detail than that
1:46:24
This is a lovely moment to remind newcomers to this feature or this programme
1:46:29
that you're not allowed to look anything up because this presumably is something that's quite easy to find out
1:46:34
if you were to search for it but you're not allowed to do that and we will be able to tell
1:46:38
James and I, if you come on and answer this question, we'll be able to tell whether or not you have just looked it up
1:46:44
so we want only established knowledge and understanding in response to this question
1:46:49
So where does it come from and why is it Mexican? Yeah, and how did it get into a sporting context
1:46:54
I'll ask the second question, but I only ever see it in a sporting context. Yeah, that's almost certainly where it started, isn't it
1:47:00
Yeah. I would have said. Perfect. All right, you're on. Nice one. And welcome back. Thank you very much. 12, well, quarter past 12 is the time
1:47:07
Where do, if you're making a film set in the 90s, where do you get all the gear from
1:47:11
Like the sort of, not the cars, we know about the cars, but where do you get the ketchup bottles from
1:47:15
or the television sets or the period items, The period props. There you go, the period props
1:47:23
When the river meets the sea, is there a line? Is there a line in the water
1:47:30
a visible line in the water between the salt, the water that's got some salt in it
1:47:35
like the brackish water and the fresh water? Chris is absolutely adamant that there is
1:47:39
but we want it definitive. And speaking of definitive, where did the Mexican wave begin
1:47:45
and why is it Mexican? It's quarter past 12. James O'Brien on LBC
1:47:51
16 is the time you're listening to James O'Brien on LBC, where Mystery Hour is underway
1:47:57
Your weekly opportunity to achieve the sort of satisfaction not ordinarily available anywhere else on your radio dial
1:48:03
With the minor caveat that if a leadership challenge is mounted, then we will have to look away from Mystery Hour
1:48:09
and look instead at said leadership challenge, which as yet has not been mounted
1:48:14
which hasn't stopped some of the 24-hour news channels from talking about nothing else now
1:48:18
for the best part of 24 hours. Martin's in Bethnal Green. Martin, question or answer
1:48:25
Question, please, James. Carry on, mate. My question is, why are the metal zips on trousers called flies
1:48:33
Oh, I should know this. I should know this. It feels like one you may have answered before
1:48:38
We probably have, but you know what my memory's like, mate. It's hard enough remembering all Nigel Farage's missteps and lies
1:48:45
I can't be expected to remember all the mystery hour questions and answers as well
1:48:49
Is it something to do with flapping? Flapping? Yeah, flapping. When the flies are open, they flap, so the zip
1:48:56
But then that would apply to a button fly as well, wouldn't it? Well, that's called a fly as well, isn't it
1:49:01
It doesn't matter whether it's buttons or a zip. It's the opening. It's the aperture in your trousers that is called the flies
1:49:09
I could only think that it might be sort of shiny like a fly. No, because... Really
1:49:15
Shiny like a fly? What are you talking about? Fly's wings are kind of..
1:49:19
Oh, I see what... Yeah, silky. They flap up and down. Yeah, but..
1:49:24
Because it's metal. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. I mean, flies aren't..
1:49:30
Flies are unpleasant, generally, aren't they? So I can't... It's a bit of a lot of one
1:49:35
It flies... Well, they've got two sides. So they've... Yeah. All right, yeah
1:49:39
Why... Why... I mean, it's not just the zippers, though, because it's called a... Yeah, I bought myself... In fact, I think I've got them on
1:49:44
I'll show you. Here you go. I bought myself some 501s at the weekend
1:49:51
Because when I was a kid, I thought they were the coolest trousers in the history of humanity
1:49:55
The Levi's 501s with the button flight. You'll never guess where I bought them, Martin
1:50:01
No, I can't guess. John Lewis. No, I bought them at A1 Jeans in
1:50:04
Kidderminster, which is where I bought my first ever pair of Levi's
1:50:09
501s in approximately 1987. Trip down memory lane, though. It was a trip there
1:50:13
I couldn't believe it was still there. All the other shops in that area have either shut or closed or been knocked down
1:50:18
But there's this tiny little shop called A1 Jeans in Kilimanjaro that has not changed
1:50:23
It's because it sells 501. Well, I mean, it sells vintage gear now, but it wasn't vintage back in 1987 when I was buying it
1:50:30
It could be. I mean, it's a beautiful shop. I nearly, Martin
1:50:34
nearly bought myself a denim jacket as well, but I wasn't quite ready to go there. I did get one of those recently
1:50:40
Did you really? I'm older than you. What brand was it? It's a very fashionable one for a second hand job
1:50:46
I can't remember the name of it. Oh, very nice. Very nice. Does it have the sheepskin collar
1:50:51
No. I've never had a denim jacket with a sheepskin collar, but I'm thinking I might be approaching that time of life
1:50:56
They're nice. They are nice, aren't they? Anyway, where were we? Why are zips called flies
1:51:00
Why are flies called flies? I have a slight answer to the Mexico one. You can't. I'm not allowed to
1:51:04
Oh, man, I wish people wouldn't do this. It makes me feel mean. But you've got to clear it with the producer, Martin
1:51:09
Oh, have I? Yeah. Well, it's not an answer. Oh, go on then. Tell me something interesting
1:51:13
I could definitely tell you when it came to prominence all over the world
1:51:16
Go on. Which was the 1970 World Cup. I'm pretty certain. 1970? It goes back that far
1:51:21
Because I don't remember it when I was a kid. Germany beat England, and Gordon Banks didn't play
1:51:28
I don't remember it from my childhood, but if it's been around that long
1:51:33
it obviously went into hibernation for a while, until probably 84. I wasn't, thank you, Martin, lovely stuff
1:51:39
it's 20 past 12, Sally's in Epsom. Sally, question or answer? Hi, James. Nice to speak to you
1:51:45
So, my question is, does the heart of a caterpillar stay, it's a caterpillar question
1:51:51
does the heart of a caterpillar stay in it as it goes through the
1:51:55
chrysalis stage, does it take it with him or her's butterfly self
1:52:03
Or does it die off? Get replaced by what? Well, I suppose that's..
1:52:11
A butterfly must have a heart, mustn't it? Why? It can be right meanies
1:52:16
Does a butterfly even have a heart? Do insects... I mean, you're bringing a mammalian anatomical..
1:52:21
I don't even know. Does an insect have a heart? Is it an insect? I think everything has a heart doesn it I don know Oh gosh I was trying to think of a politician then I was going to be really funny but I missed the opportunity
1:52:36
I just slipped out of reach. I should have gone for Jacob Rees-Mogg, maybe
1:52:39
Anyway, why do you want to know this? Where did this question come from
1:52:44
I'm fascinated by nature, but I've also got too much time on my hands
1:52:48
I'm fascinated by nature as well, but I've never found myself wondering whether a caterpillar's heart
1:52:53
stays inside the creature when the caterpillar becomes a butterfly. I'd be surprised if it didn't
1:52:58
Well, these questions need asking. Well, they do now. Actually, that's not true
1:53:04
They don't need asking. But once they've been asked, they do need answering. Yes, they do
1:53:09
So it's the butterfly's heart that we're interested in. It's the caterpillar's heart
1:53:14
whether it goes through the chrysalis stage to the butterfly self, yeah
1:53:18
Okay. Thank you. No, thank you. Have a lovely day. It's 22 after 12
1:53:23
Nick's in Lambeth. Nick, question or answer? Question. Carry on. James, when I travel in Europe
1:53:29
I often see euro notes of 100, 200 and even 500 euro notes
1:53:36
Yes. In UK, I've never seen a sterling note of 100 or 200
1:53:41
Well, if you did, it wouldn't be real. Well, why do they have such high denominations in Europe and not here
1:53:49
That's a good question. I think I can answer it from the other end of the telescope
1:53:52
It did have something to do with organized crime, in that the really, really high-denomination notes
1:53:57
were the favoured currency of criminals, obviously, trying to move money between countries and over borders
1:54:05
I think there was a 500-euro note at one point, you know. That'd be mad, wouldn't you
1:54:09
No, I've seen 500-euro notes. Have you seen a 500 one? Yes, yes. So, possibly the Bank of England is taking a stand on this
1:54:17
in ways that the European Central Bank has not taken a stand. Maybe, maybe
1:54:22
But I don't know. So which way round do you want to do the question? Why don't we have bigger denomination notes
1:54:28
Yes, that's in a nutshell. Because inflation has been with us. I mean, the £50 note has been the biggest note for a very, very long time now
1:54:36
Yes, yes. So by rights, they've abolished the little ones. They got rid of the half-p
1:54:40
Have they got rid of the penny as well, or is it just the half-penny that has been abolished
1:54:43
So they got rid of the little ones because they seem to be worth... But they haven't increased the value of the biggest
1:54:49
I like that. You're on. Thanks. OK. Thank you. Why don't the UK have higher denomination banknotes
1:54:55
What's the biggest in America? Do we know, Nick? There's a $100 bill in the States, is there
1:55:00
I think there's a $500. Is that? You sure, really? Does Scotland
1:55:05
I'm not sure. I think Scotland might have a $100. Anyway, I'm getting off into the grey areas now
1:55:10
I don't know what I'm talking about. Nick's question was pretty straightforward. Why does the UK, why does England
1:55:15
Oh, man, I'm going to upset all of Scotland again. I hate it when I do that
1:55:19
24 minutes after 12 is the time. Peter is in Stockport. Peter, question or answer
1:55:23
I have a question, James. Carry on. Is there a word which is unique in each language
1:55:30
And I'll tell you the reason that I thought of this question. Go on, then
1:55:35
Pre-Brexit, I had a lot of friends who were from different countries
1:55:39
Yes. And in the UK. And the word that they could never pronounce was squirrel
1:55:44
They really struggled with squirrel. And I struggled with the French version of it, a croix
1:55:49
It's really difficult for me to say. Right. And then one of my friends was Polish and they said the word
1:55:54
and it was also completely unpronounceable and didn't seem related to any of the other words
1:55:59
So I was going through the languages like in Italian and this, that and the other
1:56:05
And eventually I found that esquilo sounds quite like squirrel, which is the Portuguese word
1:56:10
So I kind of failed on my sort of... Hang on, this question involves the knowledge of all the words
1:56:16
in all the languages in all the world. You must ask somebody. Who's going to answer that, man
1:56:21
Please put your hand down. I tell you what, at least you'll have a really fun word
1:56:26
Next time you have somebody that's not a native English speaker ask them to say the word squirrel
1:56:30
I'm not going to do that. That's a bit racist. I can't be mocking people for not being able to say things
1:56:35
I'll end up on GBBs. What? So, hang on. You want to know..
1:56:39
This is the maddest question anyone's ever... Is there a completely unique word in every language
1:56:45
What would an answer sound like, Peter? Well, I think you'll... I'm sure somebody will try and answer this one
1:56:54
I'm sure they will. Yeah, but what would it sound like, the answer? I've no idea, but..
1:57:01
So, yes, every language does have a completely unique word. I'll just run through them all now, starting with, I don't know
1:57:07
what's the first language in an alphabetical list? Sorry, obviously... Alaskan? Obviously, languages travel through the same language, generally, don't they
1:57:15
Yeah, but I mean... You've got the Latin link, but there must be... I don't know, maybe it is..
1:57:20
I'll tell you what, is there an English word that has absolutely no relationship to any other foreign words
1:57:28
Okay, I'll... Because, I mean, that might at least get an answer. Yeah
1:57:34
But you don't sound very pleased, because you're never going to get an answer. I'm not even joking. To answer your question would take decades
1:57:41
You'd have to know all the words in all the languages in all the world
1:57:45
and compare them all to each other in pursuit of uniqueness that may not even exist
1:57:50
And then you've got to do them all again with all the other ones. Is this the most difficult question you've been asking
1:57:55
No, mate, you're giving yourself props there. It's not difficult. It's daft, isn't it
1:57:59
It's the daftest question I've been asked in a very long time. I'll take that down
1:58:04
Thank you. Have you ever eaten a squirrel? Have you ever eaten a squirrel? Not to my knowledge
1:58:09
Have you ever eaten a squirrel on live television? No, don't be crawling in your mouth
1:58:14
while you're sleeping once every year That makes one, no, that's spiders
1:58:18
That makes one of us As David has reminded me, I'd completely forgotten about that
1:58:22
I remember you eating a squirrel on Newsnight says David It's true, I did
1:58:27
I was presenting the programme I didn't just come in to eat the squirrel and then leave again
1:58:32
but I can't actually remember why Possibly it was a story about roadkill
1:58:36
Peter's question That's what I'm going to call it because no one's going to answer it
1:58:40
but if there is a truly unique English word, a word in the English language that is entirely self-contained
1:58:47
it doesn't have any derivation from other... I mean, how would that even have happened
1:58:51
Now, Brexit is like a... It's a compound word of Britain and exit. So, you know..
1:58:55
And also, you've got Frexit. So, it doesn't... So, it has a lineage, a word that just appeared
1:59:01
It'd be like... It'd be a neologism, wouldn't it? It would be a new word, but it is only in the English language
1:59:07
I don't know. Max is in Southwark. Mac, question or answer? Answer, James
1:59:11
Carry on, Mac. It's about the props. Oh, yes. Some of them are made specifically for a production
1:59:19
Of course. Some of them are hired and some of them are bought in. It just depends on the rarity and what someone specifically wants
1:59:25
And so there are agencies, if that's the right word, like costume agencies, who supply props
1:59:31
Props companies. Props companies. Qualifications? I have a props company. What sorts of props do you provide
1:59:38
I specialize in plug sockets and light switches. Wow. Because that is one of the things you'd notice, isn't it? Yeah
1:59:48
Those old-fashioned sort of 1970s solid white ones. Yep. And then really old ones you do, like Bakelite and stuff like that
1:59:57
All the Bakelite stuff, all the... Right back to the... 1800, 1890. I wish you'd phoned in before
2:00:02
I could have given you some. When we moved into our new house, it still had Baker-like fittings
2:00:07
We pick them up often. We pick them up often from car boots and stuff. Oh, good
2:00:11
I'm glad there's not a shortage of them. Yeah, yeah. What are your proudest moments, professionally speaking
2:00:19
Professionally speaking, well, I'm more the historian, so I just get involved in all the old catalogues
2:00:25
some of the beautiful old catalogues. But proudest moments, I guess. just finding some amazing old breaker boards
2:00:33
and some of the Bakelite stuff is just really, really fun. I can't tell you that as well. The house hadn't been touched in years when we moved into it
2:00:40
and it still had those old fuse boxes there that have, like, the glass bubbles in it
2:00:45
What sort of films have you worked on, Max? All sorts of things. Latest one, we did the latest Jason Stratham movie
2:00:52
Some stuff I can't talk about because obviously they're not being released yet. That's all right, no one's listening
2:00:57
Oh, I tell you, one and a half million people are every week. Oh, just one and a half million, James
2:01:02
Yeah, and counting. Oh, I love that. You get a big round of applause
2:01:06
You can't be much better qualified than that. Thank you. Thank you. What's the holy grail in your business
2:01:11
What's the thing that is really... I mean, is there such a thing? Is there like a kind of..
2:01:15
When you found it, you'd be like, well, crikey, that is it now. I've made it. That's the thing
2:01:20
Not really. It depends on what type of props, really. I mean, there are companies that make stuff as well
2:01:25
So if you can't find it, then you make it. But it's easier to hire it than make it. And there'll be companies that have loads of ketchup bottles
2:01:30
and things like that. People who have particular bottles, but then the labels will probably be printed by a printer
2:01:37
Because they can do it now. They can make stuff. I love it. And, of course, one of the great joys of being a geek
2:01:43
is looking out for anomalies and mistakes and things that haven't been spotted
2:01:49
by either the continuity people or the props masters. Thank you very much indeed
2:01:54
I'm just going to jot Max's name down next to Jamie's because she answered the question that he asked
2:01:59
Here's Amelia Cox with the headlines. James O'Brien on LBC. It's 12.33
2:02:05
Film sets we've done. So when the river meets the sea, do you see a line where the brackish water
2:02:14
i.e. the water that's got salt in it, meets the fresh water? The origins of the Mexican wave
2:02:19
Why do we call flies flies? Not the ones with wings, but the ones with buttons or zips
2:02:24
And speaking of flies, or indeed insects, when a caterpillar turns into a butterfly
2:02:29
does it keep the same heart? I love that question, but if a caterpillar doesn't have a heart
2:02:34
it must have a heart, right? I mean, crikey. Why do we not have higher denomination banknotes in this country
2:02:44
By which I mean England. Or Scotland, but if it's in Scotland
2:02:48
then I think they do have a £100 note. I've never seen a £100 note in Scotland
2:02:53
Have you? Anyway, why don't we have higher ones? Because I've done Mexican Wave and Peter's question
2:03:01
Don't forget Peter's question. Paul's in Broccoli. Paul, question or answer? Good afternoon, James
2:03:07
It's an answer. Good man. Bring it on. And the answer is to Mexican Wave
2:03:13
It originated in World Cup Mexico 86. How do you know? Qualifications
2:03:20
Qualifications? a passionate, absolute passionate football supporter. Yeah. And it was the first World Cup that I can properly remember
2:03:29
Well, then how do you know it didn't happen to the ones you can't remember? No, no, no
2:03:33
It was definitely... How can you say you just literally said you couldn't remember any ones before that
2:03:39
So how do you know it didn't happen there? It was... Well, because it was my proper first World Cup
2:03:44
Yeah. Absolutely. I can just remember commentators sort of commentating on this phenomenon
2:03:51
that was the Mexican wave, and that's what they started calling it
2:03:55
Because there was other stuff that happened in that World Cup as well, and it just makes it... No, you're wrong
2:03:59
Remember. You're not, I'm not, you're wrong. No, 100%. Ah, well, do you want to put money on it
2:04:06
Not after the footballing week I've had, no. Fair enough, but 1984 Olympic football final
2:04:12
I remember that. Brazil and France. Brazil and France was in California
2:04:17
There was a Mexican wave there, and that was two years before the World Cup was in..
2:04:21
But it originated in Mexico, the Mexican World Cup. But they did the same thing in California two years previously
2:04:29
No, I don't... What do you mean no? They did, it was on the telly. Everyone saw it
2:04:33
It was in the Rose Bowl. No, I mean... But you can't just say no, it happened
2:04:39
Well, that might have been just the American wave. The Mexican wave
2:04:42
Well, it's practically Mexico, isn't it, Pasadena? Exactly, exactly. No, you're not getting anything
2:04:47
I'll tell you what, your losing streak is not over yet, Paul. You're not getting anything
2:04:51
Oh, come on. Absolutely out of the question. I didn't get on with my question a couple of weeks back
2:04:57
and I thought I was guaranteed my first ever round of applause. Oh, well. It's 86. No, you can't have that
2:05:03
No, because it was, I mean, maybe it wasn't called a Mexican wave before that, but it still existed
2:05:07
Yeah, but the question was the origin of Mexican wave. Yeah, but what is a Mexican wave
2:05:12
A Mexican wave is when lots of people in a stadium stand up to create a wave that goes around the stadium
2:05:17
and they did that in Pasadena in 1984. And the person who asked the question, was it James
2:05:23
He thinks he saw it in 1970. Oh, I wasn't born in 1970, so I wouldn't know about that one
2:05:29
Yeah, but lots of things happened in 1970, Paul. Just because you weren't born doesn't mean they didn't happen
2:05:35
No, I promise you. No, right, all right. Well, I'll come back to you and give you a round of applause
2:05:39
in the highly unlikely event of me deciding that I've made an unfair decision on this one
2:05:43
But as it is, sayonara. Thank you, Paul. Geoff's in Hazelmere. Geoff, question or answer
2:05:49
Stewards inquiry. Well, we haven't got... Which one? Which question? The Mexican way
2:05:53
We don't need a stewards inquiry yet because I haven't given out a round of applause. So the floor is yours
2:05:57
The floor is yours. Yeah, I love you, James, but... Thank you, Geoff
2:06:03
I love your callers more. Yes, fair enough. If only we could squeeze in more of them
2:06:06
and do something about the monologues. Carry on, Geoff. So it originated at a baseball stadium in California
2:06:13
in the early 80s, 81 or 82, Yes. And it was adopted at the 1986 Mexican World Cup, which is why we remember it
2:06:23
But it had already, so that would explain why it was done at the World Cup final in 1984
2:06:29
in Pasadena. Correct. Why 81, 82? What are your qualifications? So my brother moved to LA in 82 and he used to go to a lot of baseball games and if you ever been to a baseball game not a lot happens no and people have to keep themselves entertained and some kind of super
2:06:48
fan I can't it might be the Oakland something or the LA Dodgers I can't remember yeah um he kind of
2:06:54
he started it and it got picked up and then it's become synonymous with football since
2:06:59
I'm somewhere where I can't check this on You're not really allowed to
2:07:05
No, you're not allowed to You're not allowed to check And I wouldn't check it
2:07:10
No, I know I mean, it would be wrong if you didn't I like this I think this is a strong answer
2:07:15
And it fits with all the available information Including the 1984 Olympic football final
2:07:20
Shortly after it had become popularised In exactly that part of the world
2:07:23
And then Californians Quite an easy trip to Mexico for the World Cup
2:07:27
and quite a lot of, you know, movement over that border. So the habit, the trend got imported as well
2:07:34
They took it to Mexico in 86 and the rest is history. But it's going to be called an American wave now Donald Trump's in power
2:07:40
Yeah, it's going to be called a Trump wave, mate, if you give him any ideas like that. La hola, I think in Spanish, la hola
2:07:46
But for us, the Mexican wave. Round of applause for Jeff. Thank you, thank you
2:07:51
Fantastic. And stop correcting me. It was an Olympic final in... I'm not saying it was a World Cup final in 1984
2:07:57
It was the Olympic football final between France and Brazil, I think
2:08:05
So don't correct me when I haven't made a mistake. In fact, don't even correct me when I have because it makes me embarrassed
2:08:10
Great stuff from Geoff. Simon's in Gower. Simon, question or answer? Answer
2:08:15
Carry on, Simon. It's to do with salt water and fresh water mixing
2:08:21
They don't mix very easily at all. You can see a very, very clear boundary quite frequently
2:08:26
particularly with larger rivers like the Congo, the Orinoco, the Amazon. Really
2:08:30
You can see this big black border of, say, Congo water off the west coast of Africa
2:08:39
30, 40 miles out to sea, and you're sailing through it. You'll be sailing through clear blue water
2:08:45
and all the gear towed behind the boats, all fine and dandy, and within one metre, it goes into black, fresh water
2:08:52
and all the gear that I'd be taking will be sinking. And you can see these really, really clearly
2:08:56
Because of the density of the water being different, having different buoyancy. Yeah, it's to do with the differential density caused by both temperature and salinity
2:09:04
So, for instance, the warm water that comes out of the Mediterranean into the Atlantic
2:09:10
mixes by a strange motion called salt fingering, where it comes up in huge, big fingery-type things, and it slowly mixes like that
2:09:17
Or stormy weather will mix it, or eventually, and you can see it in little rivers around here
2:09:21
but it's much more clear in a big, dirty river going into a nightly clear sea
2:09:26
This is one of my favourite answers of all time. What are your qualifications? I did a degree in oceanography
2:09:32
and I worked in offshore exploration on ships for 37 years. I mean, they are not marks of uniqueness, are they
2:09:42
Quite a lot of people do degrees in oceanography and I presume quite a lot of people work
2:09:47
So would a lot of people have been able to provide such a brilliant answer? Most mariners who've sailed the oceans
2:09:53
will have seen these things really clearly, and they can cause you a lot of problems
2:09:57
if you're towing gear, like we used to do. Yeah, clearly. You balance it all for one density of water
2:10:02
and all of a sudden, within one metre, you're in a totally different density, and it sinks, yeah
2:10:06
That's amazing. You're a good man, Simon, but you've just talked yourself out of a railiotar
2:10:10
Tim in Oxford has been in touch. He says, ask your current caller. Say the words salt wedge to your current caller
2:10:17
Yeah, salt wedge, that happens in estuaries, and can cause a lot of problems where you get saline water coming up a river
2:10:23
and you get the fresh water going over the top. Oh, wow. Because of that density difference
2:10:29
Yeah, you can get barrages where suddenly you get a large wedge of salt water and it will kill all the fish there because a lot of fish aren't used to it
2:10:35
The other part of the question, how far can fish go up rivers into salt water
2:10:40
and into fresh water, it depends on the fish species. Some of them have very good osmo regulation, mullet, bass, etc
2:10:48
And they can swim all the way up into fresh water when it suits them. Others are very saltwater dependent and don't
2:10:54
And then there's the ones that will hover in the brackish water and change their metabolism
2:11:00
And these are the salmonids and things like that. I'm going to give you a Ray Liotta
2:11:06
I think that's just... I'm Ray Liotta and you're listening to James O'Brien on LBC
2:11:12
I feel honoured. You are. They will come. Because that was... I mean, two things
2:11:17
Number one, you have a gift. I always think of Fred Dibner. Do you remember Fred Dibner
2:11:22
Yes, very much. Some people have such an enthusiasm for their subject matter that they make it communicable
2:11:27
They make the enthusiasm contagious, regardless of what the subject matter is
2:11:30
because he was a steeplejack. But you've got that gift, Simon. And you also have a magnificent voice
2:11:36
a proper, beautiful basso profundo voice. So it's been an absolute pleasure listening to you
2:11:41
Thank you very much. Thank you very much. And you also, did you get the round of applause on the end
2:11:45
We've done the round of applause as well. Lovely. Well, there it goes again. That was Barry White, mate
2:11:50
That was magnificent at the end. Thank you, Simon. 12.43 is the time
2:11:53
Joe's in Manchester. Joe, question or answer? Hi, James. It's a question, please
2:11:58
Carry on, Joe. And a bit of an actor follow as well. He was great, wasn't he
2:12:04
Yeah. My question is, does a cat's mew have an accent? So, does a cat from Manchester? Yeah
2:12:16
Will it mew differently than a cat in Spain? A bit nasal
2:12:22
Where's a bucket hat? Where's a bucket hat? I'm all slightly of Gallagher. I don't know
2:12:29
I love this. We've done this before. Many, many years ago, in the very earliest days of Mystery Hour
2:12:34
when we had absolutely no idea it would become an institution and spawn its own games
2:12:39
someone asked about pigeons. Someone asked whether pigeons had accents. and he was adamant, I think, that they did
2:12:48
So I asked him to do the impression of the pigeon with different accents and he did
2:12:53
But unfortunately, I think this was in the days before everything got clipped up and went viral
2:12:57
but it was one of those moments when I first appreciated what magical radio sounded like
2:13:03
and how it just appears most unexpected. I just leant into the microphone
2:13:07
I went, can you do a Geordie pigeon? And he just went, cool, cool
2:13:13
I did what you did I just got the giggles I couldn shake them at all But I don know is the short answer to whether or not cats have access Can you detect the region that a cat is from by the sounds that it makes
2:13:26
I love that question. You're on. Nice one, Joe. Great, thank you
2:13:30
No, thank you. Mind how you go. 12.45 is the time. Is it possible that cats give away their geographical origins
2:13:40
by their meowing or their mewling? It's 12.45. James O'Brien on LBC
2:13:46
48 is the time. You're listening to James O'Brien on LBC. Questions that need answers
2:13:54
We've done that, we've done that, we've done that. Why do we call flies flies? Do caterpillars and butterflies have the same heart
2:14:00
So does a caterpillar keep its heart? Why does the UK not have higher denomination band notes
2:14:05
Peter's question. And do cats give away their geographical origins by the sounds that they make, like a kind of accent
2:14:13
Mark is in Barrow Inferno. Ooh, so it's Peter's question then. Well, yes. Hi, James
2:14:20
Hello, Mark. Yeah, well, any language is liable to have words that are unique in the sense they're not related
2:14:28
to any other known word in that language or in any other language, perhaps
2:14:33
Yes. And one, for example, in English is the word dog. Really
2:14:39
Dog is not related to the words for dog in other related languages
2:14:43
such as German Hunt. Canis, Hunt. Yeah, which is hound. And Canis is the same origin as Hunt, in fact
2:14:49
although they don't look very similar. Oh, I didn't know. But, yeah, Indo-European
2:14:53
and Indo-European words often end up with H in Germanic and K in Latin
2:14:58
Same as hundred and Kentum meaning a hundred. The same origin. But dog, the earliest we know it
2:15:05
it means mastiff, that particular breed of dog. Right. And then that then gets back into the midst of time
2:15:12
to the stage when English wasn't being written much. We're back to Old English for that
2:15:17
And we didn't have... So that's it. Dog is just here. So no one like you, an etymologist
2:15:25
who'd never come from another country, would not be able to work out what that meant
2:15:30
using the usual tools of etymology? No, well, no, you wouldn't. There's no common root, there's no derivation, there's no..
2:15:39
Wow! Are there many? I mean, are there lots and lots of them? The earliest form is doga, double G-A, doga
2:15:46
Yeah. And that's it. But of course, languages have only been written for so long
2:15:50
Of course. There are lots of words whose etymology is not known because it goes back to the period when the languages weren't written
2:15:57
And there are some odd examples of words that are very similar in different languages
2:16:02
despite those languages being thousands and thousands of miles apart. I often find myself intrigued by those
2:16:08
So when I... Often accidentally. Yes, yes, yeah. I think, for example, the German for to have is haben
2:16:15
and the Latin for to have is haberi. Of course. And although those two languages are actually related
2:16:21
albeit not very closely, that similarity is by chance. It's a complete coincidence
2:16:26
A complete coincidence. Was, I mean, don't hold back, Mark. Was I a bit unfair with Peter
2:16:31
Was the question actually better than I allowed? Well, I think it's two questions in a way, though, isn't it
2:16:36
Because another part of it is, what words are especially difficult to pronounce? Yes
2:16:41
And that depends on what your first language is, obviously. And you might get a word where all the individual sounds are shared
2:16:48
but the particular combination is not shared. So, for example, in languages like Russian and Polish
2:16:54
you could have like S-H-C-H. Yes. So there's a word which means soup. Yeah
2:17:02
And people who don't speak those languages natively will have trouble articulating that
2:17:07
because that combination is not found in their own language. Because it's a bit like muscles, isn't it
2:17:12
It's like your mouth hasn't done that, so it is unfamiliar to you and therefore hard to do
2:17:17
This is a beautiful answer, as I always get from you. What about, is that, Wyn's been in touch
2:17:21
suggesting that the word, the colour brown, might be similarly unique. I don't think that's true, because it's Brun in French, isn't it
2:17:29
Brown isn't. Can we think of other examples, apart from dog? Oh, let me try and think
2:17:37
I can't offhand think of any good ones. It was a good question then
2:17:41
I apologise to Peter. There will be, but often it's because the etymology
2:17:45
is simply not known. Sure. But in this case, there are some colour words
2:17:52
The brown does not qualify. You've got it in German as well. That's what I thought. And so forth
2:17:59
But if I hadn't been taken by surprise by this, I might have..
2:18:03
No, you've got yourself a round of applause. Don't worry, Mark. Lovely stuff
2:18:07
Thank you, James. No, thank you. Two Marks, in fact, from Barrow-in-Furnace to Burgess Hill
2:18:12
Mark awaits. Mark, question or answer? Answer, James. Carry on, Mark. It's about the banknotes, actually
2:18:18
Oh, yes, the banknotes. So, I'm originally from the EU, so I actually lived through..
2:18:23
Aren't we all, Mark? Aren't we all? Well, fair enough. But I lived through a period from the Eurozone, let's put it that way
2:18:30
And I lived through a period where we learned about the high banknotes
2:18:34
but then at one point they got banned. And the reason for that was due to money laundering
2:18:39
So it was in an effort to curb money laundering, which is easier when you have high banknotes
2:18:44
So what's the highest denomination currently available in the EU, in the Eurozone
2:18:49
Well, I've not seen anything above 50. Okay. I believe, I might be wrong on this one
2:18:55
it's not above, you won't find anything above 100 in stores. Okay
2:19:01
Even that is rare, I mean even 50 is rare. So they introduced them, they became very popular with criminals and money launderers
2:19:09
and so they tried to deintroduce them, as it were. That's right, yeah. So, of course, it's a chicken and egg thing, isn't it
2:19:14
Yeah, so banks accepted them, you know, and you were able to deposit them. But over time, they just faded away
2:19:20
because no shop would accept them and no bank would issue them. So, in fact, there's a 500 euro note in circulation
2:19:27
but it hasn't actually been issued since 2019. Yeah, I think 2019
2:19:33
I'm not sure. No, I think it was earlier. Just check that. Maybe it was earlier
2:19:37
but that's the point, isn't it? So the highest in circulation is probably the 200
2:19:42
but that's going to be rare as well. Qualifications? So I'm originally from the EU
2:19:46
and I worked in fintech in the UK. I know that the anti-money laundering laws in the UK
2:19:51
are among the strictest, and so that would be logically why the Bank of England hasn introduced higher bank notes I love it Thank goodness that the money laundering laws in this country are among the strictest Mark in Burgess Hill take a round of applause Thank you That my first one
2:20:06
Let's hope it's not your last. It's a wonderful achievement. And, I mean, apropos nothing in particular, there is another report emerging regarding Nigel Farage's housing affairs
2:20:17
It looks like he paid £1.4 million in cash for a brand new house
2:20:21
shortly after receiving that £5 million donation from, secret donation from the Thailand-based billionaire
2:20:30
No doubt more on that story will be emerging after I've come off air
2:20:34
Yes, here it is. Financial Times reporting a £1.4 million property bought for cash
2:20:40
shortly after Farage received a £5 million secret gift from the billionaire Christopher Harbourn
2:20:46
who's also given 22 million. Sky News has seen these property records
2:20:52
and that came just weeks before he reversed his decision not to stand in the general election
2:20:58
A spokesman for Reform said, the offer and process for purchase of this property
2:21:02
commenced before the gift. Commenced before the gift. Commenced, like began. So if, for example, you knew someone was about to give you 5 million quid
2:21:12
and you went out and bought a house, before the five million quid had actually arrived
2:21:17
and then the five million quid had actually arrived, and you completed the purchase for cash, you could reasonably claim that the purchase had commenced
2:21:24
before the five million quid had landed in your current account. Ha, ha, ha
2:21:30
Ross is in East Calder in West Lothian. Ross, what would you like to say? Meow
2:21:34
What language? Oh, that's a Geordie cat. It's a Scottish cat. Go on
2:21:39
I am the owner of... Sorry, I am not the owner. I am owned by 10 cats
2:21:47
10 cats, wow. They all have different accents. Oh, come off it
2:21:55
Yes, they do. They've just got different meows. No, they don't. Well, I mean, what you need is two from the same neck of the woods
2:22:02
who sound the same. I have two from this neck of the woods who do sound the same
2:22:07
One ginger, one black. Oh. Okay. Yeah. My Russian blues have a completely different meow
2:22:16
My Maine Coon has a... Yeah, but this is species-based. This isn't geography-based
2:22:21
You need cats that are the same, essentially, breed, not species, the same breed of cats from lots of different places
2:22:29
to do your experiment. Oh, I do, because I have ones from Devon
2:22:33
Yes. And I have ones from Scotland. Right, what does a lot from Devon sound like
2:22:38
It's very soft. Go on. It's very meow. And the Scottish one
2:22:42
Meow. Really? Yeah. It's in Glasgow, is it? It's not fun. I don't think I want to fight with them
2:22:54
Nor do I now. I know which one. So, I mean, qualifications, I've got ten cats
2:23:00
I've got ten cats. Some are gravelly, some are gravelly. I adopt abandoned cats
2:23:07
Oh, good for you. A lovely thing to do. Yeah. Oh, he's got you a round of applause
2:23:12
Thank you very much. What does the Russian blue sound like before you go
2:23:18
It just depends how much vodka he's had. No, just do the noise. I'll do the jokes
2:23:24
Go on. Meow. Meow. Stop it. Thank you, Ross. Take care
2:23:34
I wonder if that call of the pigeons exists anywhere, Keith, in the archives
2:23:38
Last word to Dale in Brighton. Question or answer? Answer, James. Carry on
2:23:44
Yep. A fly. It's called a fly. It refers to the flap of fabric that covers the opening
2:23:50
It doesn't refer to the opening itself. There it is. And that is kind of like a flag that flaps
2:23:55
So it's a fly. Exactly. That's exactly where it derives from. It actually comes from an old English word, flowen
2:24:01
Oh, I love that. Mark in Barrow and Furnace would enjoy that. Qualifications
2:24:06
It came up in an English language. want an A-level. That'll do. Round of applause for Dale
2:24:11
Squeeze in one more. Mark in Barnsley, question or answer? It's an answer, James. Super quick
2:24:18
Butterflies and caterpillars do not have hearts. They take in their oxygen through passive diffusion, through
2:24:24
little tubes in their sides called spiracles. It is the one limiting factor
2:24:30
that limits the size of insects. Do caterpillars have hearts? No, they're all heartless
2:24:36
They're all heartless. Yeah, they are. That's why they eat all your lettuces. That's exactly right
2:24:41
Qualifications? An ex-teacher. That'll do. Great work. Round of applause for Mark as well
2:24:47
What a great mystery. We've ticked them almost all off. And I'm going to give the board game to Ross, haven't I
2:24:53
The cat man. That's it from me for another day. If you missed any of today's show
2:24:58
you can listen back on Catch-Up on Global Player. Are you waiting to interject
2:25:02
Or are you just doing your world-famous meerkat impression? Were you just conscious of my head
2:25:10
Yes, I was. I was looking at Keith as if to say, put the mic up
2:25:15
I want to speak to James. That's what I thought you would do. And he didn't do it. That's why you're here now
2:25:19
Well, listen, in the conversation about the accents, the cat accents, which I very much
2:25:23
enjoyed, did anyone bring up birds having accents? No, but we have previously done pigeons
2:25:30
Do you think birds do have accents? Well, I speak with no expertise at all
2:25:33
Sean Renane, have you heard of him? He's an Irish ornithologist. who goes around recording birdsong both in Ireland and around the world
2:25:39
He follows their migration patterns, and he says when they go abroad
2:25:45
by the end of their time there, their song is different. Like Steve McLaren, football manager, when he went to Holland
2:25:50
How do you remember that? If you missed any of today's shows
2:25:55
you can listen back on our free Global Player app or the LBC app, where you can also stay up to date with all the latest news, videos and opinions
2:26:02
You can listen to a range of podcasts, including James O'Brien Daily, the best bits from my LBC show every day
2:26:07
How did he do it? Stephen can download the official LBC app for free
2:26:12
from your app store when he was talking to a Dutch journalist and he started trying to sound Dutch
2:26:17
because he thought that would make it easier to understand. Anyway, Tom Storbrick's with you at four. Sheila Fogarty is with you now
2:26:22
The meerkat of LBC. Congratulations on your figures, by the way. Streeting's gone. Streeting's resigned
2:26:27
Streeting's gone. Oh, my goodness. There it is. He waited for Mystery Hour to end. Health Secretary Wes Streeting did wait for Mystery Hour
2:26:32
He's resigned from the government. It's on. That rather changes the programme that I'm about to present
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