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Senators Roundtable - Nick Cousins Signing, Choosing an Identity, Moving to LeBreton Flats & More
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Sep 6, 2024
In this episode of The Hockey Writers Senators Roundtable, Ottawa Senators writers Jacob Billington, Dayton Reimer and Paul Quinney get together to discuss the Nick Cousins signing, and how it further cements the fact that the Senators have finally chosen an identity to build around. They also talk about LeBreton Flats and whether the team should seriously look at moving from their current location in Kanata. 0:00 Intro 0:25 Reaction to Senators Signing Nick Cousins 2:47 Senators Have Finally Chosen a Direction For Their Identity 5:15 Does Norris Fit With the Long-Term Identity of the Senators? 6:58 Are the Senators One of the Toughest Teams in the NHL Now? 9:54 Are Playoffs the Expectation This Season? 13:17 Should the Senators Move to LeBreton Flats? 17:00 Is having the Senators in Kanata actually that bad? The Senators Roundtable crew are great writers too - Jacob Billington - https://thehockeywriters.com/author/jbillington/ Paul Quinney - https://thehockeywriters.com/author/pquinney/ Dayton Reimer - https://thehockeywriters.com/author/dreimer/ Subscribe to The Hockey Writers Ottawa Senators Substack for all the best Sens content - https://thehockeywriters.substack.com/subscribe
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0:00
Hey everybody, welcome back to the Senators Roundtable
0:03
I'm your host, Jacob Billington, joined by Paul Quinney and Dayton Rimer, as usual. It's been a while since the three of us have been together
0:10
It was, I think, four weeks ago, three weeks ago that we did some trivia. There's been a little bit of Senators' news
0:16
It's been fairly quiet over this month in terms of the Senator's stuff
0:21
But over the past week or so, we've gotten quite a few things. So first of all, the Ottawa Senators signed Nick Cousins to a one-year, $800,000 deal
0:30
already have Brady Kachuk and Ridley Greg, of course. And then they bring in David Perron and now they bring in Nick Cousins
0:38
This team is going to be tough to play against. I'm going to save my thoughts for the end, see if either if you touch on it
0:45
What are your quick thoughts on the signing? I like Cousins. Like he's kind of the worst, but I like him for the senators, if that makes sense
0:57
I think he will mesh very well with at least what the team is kind of building around
1:07
which is Brady Kachuk, right? He doesn't take a ton of penalty minutes, but he is physical
1:13
He gets under guys skins. And that's someone that Ridley Gregg has been described as, right
1:21
So I think you have a mentor now in Nick Cousins and someone who would mesh well with this
1:27
with this core and I think yeah it's that this is a move
1:34
that you make when you want to compete you don't add this kind of guy
1:38
when it's still rebuilding and you're you know let's wait it out
1:43
let's try to get some veterans to add some leadership and some skill
1:48
no like he's a veteran yes but this guy makes you unbelievably tough to play against
1:54
and that's a that's a competitive move. So I think this is very clearly the senators are aiming for the playoffs
2:04
Yeah, I agree. Paul, what are your thoughts? Well, the only thing I add to what Dayton said is, you know, if you look at the lineup
2:13
projected lineup, you know, all four lines are going to have a veteran
2:19
and three of those veterans have won Stanley Cups. So I think that votes well for the senators
2:24
There's, you know, I was just thinking again, Steyos said, I'm going to add a veteran presence to this team
2:31
And wow, did he ever? I thought he might have stopped that Peron, but he kept going
2:37
So good marks for Mr. Steyos this summer, in my humble opinion
2:43
Yeah, I strongly agree. We talked about it a couple times before that it's important to choose a direction when you have two superstar players
2:53
and Tim Stutzel and Brady Kachuk. You can make one of them fit in the system
2:57
that fits the other player better. I think you were kind of preaching that Dayton
3:02
And so we have, this is now a Brady Kachuk team, and there's a lot of players that play Brady Kachuk's game
3:09
And Tim Stutzel is going to fit in really well. And as the skill guy, as the go-to skill guy on the team
3:16
when Pierre Dorion couldn't pick, whether he wanted to build a fast-skilled team
3:21
or a tough and gritty team like Brady Kachuk plays. So it's nice to see that Steve Stales finally picked a direction
3:28
Do you have any additional thoughts on that, Dayton? No, I completely agree with what you're saying there
3:33
You need to have a clear goal, and that will reflect in the dressing room
3:40
I think for the longest time, the senators didn't have a great dressing room because they didn't know what they were
3:46
They didn't have an identity because, oh, are they Brady Kachuk? Are they Tim Stutzler
3:49
are they somebody else? Nobody really wanted to make that choice. But I think the team made that choice and then just waffled on it, right
3:58
They picked Brady Kachuk fourth overall when he shouldn't have gone forth overall
4:03
According to projections, now he probably goes higher than that, right? He was the perfect pick for the senators at that time
4:11
And he's supposed to be the face of the franchise. Tim Stutzler is fantastic
4:18
definitely one of my favorite guys maybe ever on the Senators, love him with the team
4:24
He's, I don't think somebody you build around. I think you add him to make the team even better
4:30
And I think last season might have shown that a little bit with the dip when the Senators weren't as competitive
4:37
That could be, you know, just some growing pains. But I think this is a very clear, you know
4:44
step in a direction that you are building around Brady. This is the team you want to
4:48
to build and this is the culture that we want to establish and there won't be any more
4:54
kind of waffling. We have a clear direction, a clear identity. And that's what the senators
4:58
needed, I think, to be a competitive team. Yeah. Let me go ahead. Go ahead, Paul. Well, no, I was just
5:06
going to say, let me throw a question out here then, gentlemen. You know, you got a team here that's
5:11
building the image of Brady Chuck. Where does Norris fit into this thing? On LTI
5:18
Yeah, he's a bit more of a, like a Tim Stutzla build, right
5:27
He's a fast skill player and you kind of got to wonder, is that going to fit in long term
5:36
For now, it's great. You know, if he plays, he makes the team better
5:41
But does he have a long-term future with it, especially as the team gets, you know, a bit more hard-nosed, a bit more, you know
5:48
scrappy, a bit more pesty. Because I don't, I don't see that in Norris, unless I've been missing something
5:55
No, I don't see that Norris either. But one thing that a lot of people overlook is Norris' defensive game
5:59
I think that he's very underrated defensively. And he's a really good option at the second line center if he's healthy in play
6:06
and that the 35 goals strong two-way player that he was a couple years ago
6:10
But with that being said, you got Shane Pinto, who might be able to fill that void
6:15
which makes Josh Norris expendable. and Pinto does play with a little bit more bite in his game than Josh Norris does
6:22
So if you can find a way to kind of slide Shane Pinto into Josh Norris's spot and move on from him
6:28
if it makes sense, yeah, I think that you would like to have Shane Pinto and $8 million over Josh Norris as the second line center
6:40
That's just my thoughts. No, I think you probably hit the nail on the head there
6:45
that's Norris is great but is he $8 million great healthy we don't know
6:51
like yeah I don't know he just needs to stay healthy one thing that I see a lot of people saying is
7:00
that with this Nick Cousin signing this team is going to be the
7:05
everybody's least favorite team to play against and I said I put this on Twitter
7:10
I said it doesn't matter how physical and tough they are if they're not going to win game
7:15
this team is not going to be the most hated team in the league if they're 23rd in the standings
7:20
They need to win hockey games or else this all does not matter
7:24
And that's been the issue with the senators over the last few years. They just haven't won hockey games for a few years to start the rebuild under DJ Smith
7:32
This team is hard to play against. Every team was giving them credit in the post game every night And then the last few years that kind of fell apart The team lost their identity Because believe it or not like Josh Brown Braden Cobra and Erica Branson
7:47
these guys were all part of the identity. They sucked to play against. They weren't good defensively
7:52
That's why Ottawa lost many games. But they were physical. They were tough and all that kind of stuff
7:57
And Ottawa got away from that. And it's very apparent that Pierre Dorian did not have a long-term plan
8:03
and so I think it's all a moot point if Ottawa doesn't win any games
8:08
And like you said, Dayton, the signing indicates that they're serious about contending. You can be as serious as you want
8:14
It's the players that do the work from now on. No, for sure
8:18
This season is definitely going to be defined by, can they win
8:24
And if they can't, that's going to, I think, put a ton of pressure on Steve Steyhouse
8:30
Like, we're going to have to ask maybe some very difficult, questions if this team suddenly just can't win because these have been moves to win
8:39
I think you could have got better players, you know, skill-wise, for the prices that they paid
8:45
but they didn't do that. They went for, you know, role players, guys who fit a very specific
8:52
identity and a very specific, you know, type of team. You don't trade Jacob Chikrin for Nick Jensen
8:59
unless you have a very clear idea of what you want. And I think
9:03
that was a good trade, but I don't think you got a better player than Jacob Chikron
9:08
if that makes sense. Yeah, you're a better team with Nick Jensen than Jacob Chikram
9:13
He's not the better player, but you're a better team. Yeah. Same thing with David Perron, right
9:18
He's a great player, but you could have got someone, I think, maybe more skilled for the amount
9:24
of money that you spent. I think the same thing with Nick Pheasants
9:30
You maybe could have got somebody who was more skilled. and I even threw an article out there
9:34
you know, what about Philip Zadena? He has more skill than Nick Cousins
9:40
but is he a better player on this team? Arguably not because Cousins is here and Zadina is in Switzerland
9:49
Yeah, that's a great point. Paul, do you have anything else to add on the Nick Cousin signing? Well, you know, I don't know when all this winning is going to happen
10:00
Steve Stales, our press conference this week, never mentioned one time the playoffs
10:07
So, you know, I know there's a lot of outlawful expectations in Ottawa
10:12
There always is in September, you know. But even he's not going out on a limb in predicting playoffs
10:19
So, you know, I think that expectations need to be tempered, you know, despite all the additions
10:28
they're going to be, it's going to be a really tough thing for them to make the playoffs this year
10:34
Yeah, you say that, but I think it's playoffs or bust this year. I think very good chance that Brady Kachuk wants to go if they don't make the playoffs
10:43
Claude Jaroos not going to resign. Like, this team might have to go through another rebuild
10:50
Like, we might be looking at another Buffalo Sabre situation here, where it's been so long and unsuccessful
10:57
Like, you look at the Sabres. they drafted so many good players like Sam Reinhardt, Jack Eichael, a few other good players
11:03
And they didn't work for them. So they had to redo it and go through it all again
11:10
Ottawa might be in a similar position if they don't make the playoffs this year. Even if they're five points out, it's just another year that you're done in the beginning of April
11:19
They're not going to stand for it. Well, as long as they're not done by the end of November
11:24
and that's been the case in a lot of years, right? yeah so well we should see quickly you know i wrote a piece um talking about uh again they've got
11:37
a really tough schedule you know it's going to be challenging uh for the first two months and i think
11:43
we'll get a glimpse of just whether or not their playoff bound uh within the first well
11:49
eight weeks to the season there was a piece uh graphic posted by i have no idea who i'd like
11:56
to credit if i could um But it was talking about the most travel for each team
12:01
And I believe Ottawa had the least amount of travel among all teams over the course of the season
12:05
So which makes sense. I mean, they're fairly central to the entire league
12:09
But yeah, they had the least amount of travel or very close to us
12:15
Well, you know, in the first October, November, I think they've only got one road trip
12:21
Three games out west, easy games. And then they come back. Most of the games are in the Eastern Times
12:27
own and there's a rhythm to it. Unlike last year, you know, it's going once every, once every other day
12:35
which I guess is the ideal schedule for an NHL team, a game every other day. So, yeah, it's definitely
12:43
more favorable than it was last year. All right. Moving off of all that, the playoffs and Nick Cousins
12:50
and whatnot, there's been some not really news, but some updates about LeBretton Flats and the senators
12:56
moving to a downtown location. Again, not too much to build off of
13:01
but the decision is going to have to be made by the end of this month
13:04
And I just want to know what your guys' thoughts are. Paul, I know you wrote a piece about saying how LeBretton is not the answer
13:12
Dayton, I'm not sure if I've heard your opinion on things. But Paul, I'm going to ask you first
13:17
Just like, what are your whole thoughts on should Ottawa move to LeBretton Flats? Does it make sense
13:22
What do you think? ideally sure they should move downtown that would be great but there's a whole bunch of things
13:32
that they've got to get over and i don't think i don't think le breton platts is the place you've got
13:42
major issues no parking down there access to that site via road even if there were parking is very
13:51
poor. You don't have any major thoroughfares. I think the NCC is the National Capital Commission
13:58
who owns that property. You know, they expect the senators to rely on the light rail system
14:07
in Ottawa, which is notoriously bad. That's as reliable as the senators. Yeah. I mean
14:14
if you, I mean, it's awful. You know, it stops working when it gets too hot in the summer and golly, gee
14:21
know who designed it, but, you know, when it gets too cold in the winter, it stops working. So
14:28
what's Ottawa? The second coldest capital in the world. So major design flaw there. But all of that
14:35
to say, you know, if you're the senators, it's a nightmare. You know, if you had a big playoff game
14:41
and, you know, 20,000 of your fans are trying to get there and the rail system didn't work
14:47
that's just not on. And then the other thing is they want an arena district
14:55
kind of the same thing that Edmonton has, but it doesn't look like there's any provision being made
15:02
in terms of land for that to be constructed. And you've got environmental considerations
15:08
I think to use the property, you'd have to, there's massive amounts of money
15:13
you have to spend to remediate all the content contaminated soil remove it and whatnot And then I think the biggest kicker here is going to be money
15:27
And again, I don't blame the senators. One or all three levels of government are going to have to come together
15:34
and they're going to have to give Mr. Ann Lauer and the other owners of the team
15:40
a whole pile of money. I think it's about a billion dollars
15:45
I think that's the price. tag now for a new arena anywhere in the league
15:52
And I don't know how that's going to get done politically. So I wouldn't hold my breath on downtown, certainly not LeBretton Flats
16:02
What makes me wonder, too, is the tone of Sir a leader
16:09
He's coming out making noises, well, you know, there's still a long way to go or worse to that
16:14
a fact, we've made a little bit of progress. There's still a lot of work to be done
16:19
If this deal were close and it's got to be done in two weeks, I don't think he'd be
16:25
saying, he wouldn't be saying much, you know, it would be in the bag and just cross
16:31
the T's dot the I's. So I think they're far apart. Yeah, I think that's a very good case of like Craig Oster's negotiating in the media
16:41
trying to get something to happen because it doesn't look like it is
16:46
That's what it sounds like to me as well, Paul. I'm not sure how often you go to games
16:52
but I'm in Nova Scotia, Dayton's and Saskatchewan. You're the only Ottawa native here
16:59
Is Kanata really that bad? Oh, it's terrible trying to get out of the parking lot
17:07
Yes, it is terrible getting out of the parking lot. but is like you could do renovations and changes to make the parking lot a better system but is
17:16
from ottawa to canada really that bad of a situation no i mean i may have to go into a witness
17:26
protection program if i'm saying what i'm about to say but you know come on ottawa you're spoiled
17:32
i mean when they when we talk traffic jams and commutes in ottawa it's ridiculous it means 20 minutes
17:39
go to any other major city in North America and, you know, you're talking an hour or more
17:48
It's not that bad a commute. The other thing, too, though, is in January, I try to avoid games because you have to walk in from the back 40
18:03
And by the time you get into the arena, you're suffering from hypothermia
18:07
So, you know, it's not pleasant, but given all the alternatives, you know, it's not bad
18:17
And I know the people in Gatano, they're trying to pry them away from the Montreal Canadiens
18:23
And they'll say, well, you know, the people in Gatinau is going to Canada is too far, to which I would ask, what
18:31
And Montreal's closer? I mean, come on. That's a three hour drive
18:35
don't get me that but um well and so i i went up in october uh last year for a home opener
18:42
and it was my first time actually driving through the city to get to the game and it wasn't
18:47
that bad like it's from what is it from downtown ottawa or what they whatever they call
18:52
downtown it's about half an hour to get to the rink that's not that's not bad like from anywhere
19:00
in edmonton you're probably half an hour from the rink with traffic and everything
19:05
or in Fort Lauderdale. Well, in sunrise, I know that the rink
19:12
Ameribank Arena is not in a great place either, but you're not right there
19:16
If they could develop more around Canada, like there's not much there
19:20
There's like, what, an ultramar across the street from the rink, a couple of shops and everything
19:25
But if they could develop more and have more of like an event district
19:29
kind of like you were talking about with Edmonton, it would be great
19:33
Like it's just, there's just nothing to do in, Canada. Well, yeah, but, you know, in defense of Canada, and by way of full disclosure
19:42
that's where I live. Fair enough. Well, that would come out. People would track that down
19:50
But, you know, objectively, Canada is the high tech center. It's probably one of the biggest
19:59
high tech centers in all of Canada. The income is here. The companies are here
20:05
These are the people, these are the company that buy the boxes and can afford to pay the ticket prices
20:12
Why would you want to leave a market like that to go downtown
20:19
Because I don't think you're going to replace it. Civil servants, the civil service, I should not civil servants, the civil service generally, they don't buy boxes
20:31
It's not in the budget, but the companies in Canada do. So you alienate them at your peril
20:40
Yeah, if they could build, I don't know what the zoning is like over there
20:45
but if they could build like some good clubs and bars and some good restaurants right close to the rink
20:53
like I think it would be good. And so my experience there was I spent the day in Ottawa and then drove out to Canada
20:59
didn't mind it all, mind you. My perception was a bit skewed after driving 16 hours to get to Ottawa
21:05
So a half hour probably nothing. And then I left the game and I went to arm prior to stay with some family
21:13
And it was a fine experience outside of just getting out of the parking lot
21:17
Like we were in the parking lot for almost an hour trying to get out. It was horrible
21:22
But that can be fixed somehow. I'm not an engineer or architect or whatever
21:27
But like I didn't mind the location at all. And I've been kind of sitting on that for the last years
21:33
Is it really that bad? No, it's, but, you know, like I say, there's massive hurdles to moving out of, out of the West End, out of Canada to go to Antown, the cost of construction, building a new arena
21:49
And like I say, no NHL owner of which I am aware builds a new ring on their own nickel
22:01
Government step up, like, give me one example of an NACL. owner that's built his own rink. And, you know, I can tell you, there's a whole lot of people in Ottawa
22:14
These aren't my words, but saying, look, we're not giving the billionaire owners money to build a rink so a bunch of kids can shoot rubber pucks around
22:26
I mean, it's not going to fly politically. So I don't think it's going to happen anytime soon
22:31
So anytime you want to come to the c to jake. can be in, stay at my place and we can take an over. Perfect
22:42
Dayton, have you been to Canada? Have you been to the rink? No, I've never been able to get out
22:47
there. I've been to Ottawa twice, but it's been probably decades since I've been out there
22:52
There some fun family trips A lot of what you guys are saying though does kind of strike a chord from some of the arenas I been able to visit on my WHL journey So for those who don know I trying to see all 22 WHL arenas
23:09
I've seen five so far because the WHL is annoyingly spread apart
23:16
It's way more spread out than the OHL or the QMJHL. You can just go see those all over
23:22
It's not that hard. Whereas in Saskatchewan, I'd have to go drive to Seattle to see a game
23:31
Anyways, I was at, you know, of course, the Saskatoon Arena. They have an arena that is outside of the city, pretty much
23:42
Getting out of the arena when the game is done, even in a WHL market, takes forever
23:48
Not an hour forever, but you're basically waiting there until everyone else leaves
23:52
And so I just hang out and watch for the three stars. and wait till everyone else. Okay, you can go. Yeah, good. Cool. It's not popular. People don't
24:03
like driving out there, even though it's hardly a drive. There is plans to set up a downtown arena
24:08
and make one of those districts. Parking is going to be a nightmare, like you guys mentioned
24:15
But, I mean, Calgary has a downtown arena, essentially, right? And I was there in March, I believe
24:25
it was not hard to find, you know, just a random parking spot, and then we just walked to the area
24:30
It was very easy. I mean, you get outside a little bit, and sure, during the winter, not so fun, but in March, the weather was beautiful
24:39
Nice walk. Didn't have to go through too many crowds. So I don't know if it's a massive issue, and it does seem to be that, you know, that transition
24:53
at one point it was moving all the arenas outside of the city center
24:57
Now we're bringing them back in. And those that are outside of it are struggling
25:03
So one that is definitely, you know, it's hurt by its location is the Medicine Hat Tigers
25:09
They decided in 2015, I believe, to build an arena basically five minutes once you leave the city limits
25:17
It is not in Medicine Hat. I think even like technically it's not in medicine hat
25:25
But it's a beautiful arena, you know, all of the state of the art stuff
25:31
And it's annoying to get to. And then trying to get out, you have one highway that's all clogged up because that's the only exit that you have
25:40
The parking lot, it's huge, but it's designed really poorly in that it's tough to get out of that too
25:46
So they have, you know, some significant issues that they very recently put in
25:55
You know, one of the problems in Ottawa is, you know, the downtown core has been decimated
26:02
And that's because civil servants are not working. They're working from home for the most part
26:07
And you can fire a cannon down most streets in downtown Ottawa and you wouldn't hit a bar that's open
26:15
And there's boarded up restaurants and bars everywhere. I mean, that's what the city, the mayor is, that's the value he's placing on trying to get the senators to move down in Stittown
26:29
It would be a way to reinvigorate the central core. But, you know, I don't think that's going to change
26:36
I think civil servants working from home the majority of their time is, that's going to be permanent
26:45
You know, I don't know that there would be bars and restaurants for people to go to downtown
26:50
Certainly, you know, the number of, what are there, 40, 41 games, that that's it, that the Senate is playing Ottawa
26:58
And I don't think that number of games would be big enough to support a, you know, a renaissance of bars and restaurants that closed during the pandemic
27:09
Well, then I just think one of the biggest pieces of feedback you hear from players, and I believe
27:15
I believe it was Nick Jensen that said it. He's like, I've never even seen Ottawa because we don't go to Ottawa to play games
27:23
Like, I've never been in the city of Ottawa. And that's one of the issues that some players have
27:28
But again, if you get more of a, like, I don't know if you remember the plan that the coyote's owner, I'm blanking on his name
27:39
Marillo? Yes, Morello. The plan that he had was to build a big event
27:45
Plaza. And while it was very far-fetched, he didn't have the money to do it. And I'm not
27:50
I'm not talking about the water parks that he was talking about. But like, just all the event stuff
27:55
like have a good place for concerts, like outdoor concerts, have, just have a couple venues there
28:01
and have the bars and the clubs and the whatever. The players can enjoy stuff while they're in Ottawa
28:08
while they make the trip to Canada. There's just nothing for them to do. And you kind of have to
28:13
tend to the players needs in a sense while obviously looking for the fans the fans would enjoy
28:19
an outdoor venue and maybe some sports plexes and bars and whatever it might be you just need
28:27
to make it more of an appealing location around the rink i know the rink needs upgrades on its own which
28:32
and lowers done a good job of doing since he arrived so i'm told but you just need to improve
28:39
the area around it and that's not michaelan laur's job but it should be the city of
28:43
of, well, I don't know how that really works. If the city of Ottawa would build out there, probably not because it's not technically
28:52
in their city, but some sort of partnership between municipal and provincial and the team
28:59
working something out. Well, we're going to see, put it this way
29:07
Bring Stanley Cup to Ottawa, and there will be plenty of people only too happy to
29:13
enjoy the amenities of canada. They'll be having tailgate parties out in the 75 acres that surround the
29:21
the Canada, Canadian tire place. And I don't think you'll hear very many complaints about people having to go
29:32
all the way to Canada, 30 minutes. You don't hear anything about Amerit Banerina in Florida after they just won the cup
29:40
Not a word. Nobody minds. And, you know, and that's the other thing I hear criticism or the argument is, well, can you imagine what would happen to ticket sales
29:52
They'll go through the roof if the senators were located downtown. Now, I've seen the senators
29:57
I've followed them from the beginning. And when they put a good product on the ice, that place is sold out
30:03
Actually, let me take that back. They don't even have to put a good product on the ice
30:07
Last year, they had record crowds. So that argument that they'd be doing better financially by being downtown is a bunch of hogwash, frankly, in my humble opinion
30:21
Yeah. All right. Well, that'll wrap things up for today. Thanks everybody for checking it out
30:26
Paul Dayton, thanks for joining me, as always. Nice to be back
30:30
And I think we're going to be back regularly now. Seasons about to get started, training camp and rookie camps and all that fun stuff
30:37
So we'll see you next time on the next episode of the Senators Roundtable
30:41
Thank you
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