Up next in 10
Welcome to Adaptable | Behavior Explained! This episode goes over healing and reinventing yourself after divorce with special guest Tracy Kindeski. Discover how to rebuild your identity, reclaim your peace, and move forward with clarity after a life-altering breakup.
I'm Kelly O'Horo, Attachment based EMDR Therapist, EMDRIA Consultant, and Advanced Trainer. I'm a mom of 5, Nonna of 5, wife, and a healer. I have the honor of spending my workdays walking along side people while they brave their healing journeys. I try to live with the generous assumption that we're all doing the best we can with what we know. Therapists are teachers for the "life stuff" and "emotional vocabulary" that may not have been learned due to gaps in our care givers capabilities. In the last 15 years I've learned that people are freaking amazing, resilient, and inspiring. Most importantly, we are hardwired for connection and for healing!
I hope to bring an authentic, compassionate, and unpolished approach while we explore a variety of topics such as parenting, marriage, relationships, dating, trauma, attachment, adoption, depression, addiction, anxiety, and love! There's a why for all behaviors and an explanation that makes perfect sense as emotion is at the root of it all.
-- Links --
https://linktr.ee/kellyohorolpc
https://youtu.be/rLnARKekvgo
https://www.emdria.org/find-an-emdr-therapist/
Show More Show Less View Video Transcript
0:06
hi everyone I'm Kelly O'Horo and this is
0:09
Adaptable Behavior Explained Hello there
0:12
Thank you so much for tuning in to
0:14
Adaptable I'm your host Kelly O'Horo and
0:17
today we're going to be talking about
0:19
divorce after a long marriage and
0:21
reinventing yourself because let's just
0:24
face it nobody plans to get married for
0:26
20 25 30 years and then end their
0:29
marriage And so I'm doubly excited
0:31
because my guest today Tracy is a friend
0:34
a colleague a therapist as well as a
0:37
divorce and has been remarried since But
0:40
it's just such a a hard chapter for most
0:42
people's lives And so we thought we
0:44
would talk a little bit about it and
0:46
help any of you who might be going
0:47
through something like divorce whether
0:49
it's after a short marriage or a long
0:52
marriage Hopefully we can help make that
0:54
journey a little bit more smooth So uh
0:56
without further ado Tracy please tell us
0:58
a little bit about yourself Thanks for
1:00
being here Yeah it's so good to be here
1:01
I have been at Infinite for a little
1:05
over two years I love it I have three
1:08
adult kids I've gained a new son-in-law
1:11
in the last year So yeah I'm just
1:14
recering reinventing and Yeah And and
1:17
you're a therapist Yeah that's what we
1:18
do at Infinite And so you're a trauma
1:20
therapist an EMDR therapist as well And
1:23
tell us a little bit about your you know
1:25
your personal experience what happened
1:28
and why you ended up divorcing And tell
1:30
us how long you were married Yeah I met
1:33
my um ex-husband when I was 22 in
1:37
college um married two years later and
1:41
you never think you're gonna get
1:42
divorced I don't think anybody plans for
1:44
that on the altar and says you know
1:46
we're gonna end this in 27 years And so
1:50
I found myself when my marriage was
1:52
getting rocky I pretty much gave
1:55
everything to my marriage I was a my
1:58
identity was I'm a wife and I'm a mom
2:01
and I loved it up until I didn't just it
2:07
was a rocky journey figuring it out
2:11
right and it didn't happen overnight
2:14
Sure It didn't happen in a year right it
2:16
took several years right you mean once
2:18
you guys finally decided to part ways i
2:20
think just things had to be I've heard a
2:23
saying that once women get the courage
2:27
to leave it's been almost maybe three to
2:29
five years And because that you know I
2:32
didn't want that right i didn't I didn't
2:34
want to split my family apart I didn't
2:37
want to do that to my kids right and
2:39
when I got to a point that I just
2:43
couldn't be who I think I was really
2:46
supposed to be in that relationship
2:48
right took the bit the hard bullet and
2:52
started that new journey which was also
2:54
kind of long and grueling So how long
2:56
did your divorce the process of your
2:58
divorce take it took a couple years It's
3:01
so hard
3:02
and you know this person that was your
3:04
best friend and your partner and the you
3:06
know the one you're you think you're
3:07
going to do life with having to unlearn
3:09
that it's really harding really hard
3:13
yeah I can't imagine so what um what
3:16
talk talk to us about what it was like
3:18
you know after the divorce and what that
3:20
process was like for you going from your
3:23
identity of being a wife of being a mom
3:25
and now you have to figure out who am I
3:27
when I'm by myself it was a roller
3:30
coaster
3:31
I look back now and go I don't even know
3:33
how I got through all that It was very
3:36
scary It was unknown I didn't know where
3:39
I was going to live I had nowhere to go
3:41
I wasn't financially independent I
3:44
didn't have a career I had just applied
3:47
for my graduate program when things were
3:50
getting a little rocky and my kids were
3:53
getting older Two had moved out So the
3:57
process h it just was grueling It was am
4:01
I gonna do this am I not going to do
4:03
this what it would I felt all over the
4:05
place and it felt really really messy
4:07
And I ended up moving in with friend
4:10
from seventh grade in her apartment in
4:13
the guest room living out of a suitcase
4:15
under her bed Wow And how long did that
4:18
part of your season last so I lived with
4:22
her I thought I was going to live with
4:23
her for like a week I had no idea what I
4:26
was doing And it turned into six months
4:29
And then by that point filed for divorce
4:32
and got my own apartment At that time I
4:35
was in school I picked up a couple
4:38
different part-time jobs just to make
4:40
ends meet Wild Just figured it out as I
4:44
went along Yeah What were some of the
4:46
hardest parts of that initial stage of
4:48
you know finding your way into your next
4:50
chapter oh gosh I think it was just like
4:54
what like who am I and what am I gonna
4:57
do and really my whole identity was
5:01
being a wife and being a mom and I was
5:04
really scared to leave I think that's
5:07
why it took so long It was like I can't
5:09
do this like how am I going to do this
5:10
alone i had a lot of codependent um
5:14
tendencies and people pleasing and a
5:17
lack of boundaries
5:20
even despite you know going to therapy
5:22
Well we're all works in progress and
5:24
healing is not linear Yes I always say
5:26
to my clients we're not dead so we're
5:27
not done Like there's something we can
5:29
find to work on and heal For sure I mean
5:31
I had um we went to therapy I mean I had
5:34
gone to therapy since you know being an
5:36
adult and we had gone to therapy and all
5:39
the things but yeah it was just I didn't
5:41
know what I was I had no idea what I was
5:45
going to do That was really scary Yeah
5:47
Or the identity thing felt like when you
5:51
introduce yourself you know it's like oh
5:54
I've been married x amount of years and
5:55
here's my three kids and and here's my
5:57
perfect little family Was like oh gosh
6:00
now what now what am I right What am I
6:04
isn't that interesting how would you say
6:06
that uh going to graduate school and and
6:09
becoming a therapist influenced your
6:10
healing process oh gosh I remember like
6:14
my mom my brother saying "How are you
6:18
going through all this and I hadn't been
6:21
in school for right i remember when I
6:24
applied this was a funny story and I
6:26
applied It took me I wanted to really do
6:29
it and I put it off and I put it off and
6:31
I don't know about going back to school
6:32
and I didn't really like school the
6:34
first time around
6:35
and um and you're going to get a
6:37
master's degree That's going to be a lot
6:38
of school Yeah And so I remember finally
6:42
calling and I had to call ASU and
6:45
they're like "Oh what was your email
6:47
when you went here?" And I'm like we
6:49
didn't have email like or their computer
6:52
and it was like you know pull out the
6:54
archives you know and so it that was
6:57
scary you know I just I I had little
7:00
part-time jobs but never really had my
7:03
own career Sure But looking back it was
7:07
hard but it was a blessing in disguise
7:12
that it kept me focused on something
7:16
that I was really really passionate
7:18
about because in my undergraduate I
7:19
wanted to be a therapist Okay I I don't
7:21
think I knew that about you Yeah Yeah I
7:23
was um volunteered at Crisis Pregnancy
7:25
Center So we got to kind of counsel the
7:27
people that came in I was like "This is
7:29
what I want to do This is what I'm
7:30
passionate about." but then got married
7:32
and had boom boom boom had three kids
7:33
and off to the races But yeah it was
7:36
like my therapist at the time said "When
7:38
are you going to go back to school this
7:40
is what you've always wanted to do."
7:41
Because she's known me since I was 18
7:43
But it was a blessing in disguise
7:45
because you have to focus You have to do
7:46
all the papers and all the homework and
7:48
all the reading and go to class and I'm
7:49
going to class with kids that are my
7:51
kids age right so that was a little
7:54
interesting too So that was one of the
7:57
ways that you coped through this
7:59
tumultuous chapter But what are some
8:01
other things you found really useful or
8:03
helpful because if there's listeners
8:05
that are going through it now you know
8:07
help us understand some coping
8:09
strategies that you used during that
8:11
season Yes I have to say biggest thing
8:14
is my faith I don't consider myself
8:18
religious but for me what my faith looks
8:21
like is when I'm clenching because I
8:25
can't figure it all out and I'm so
8:26
scared and I have no idea what I'm doing
8:28
My faith lets me go okay I I just got to
8:32
let it go and surrender and I know I'm
8:34
going to be okay And so it just helps
8:36
you relinquish that you know I'm going
8:38
to white knuckle through it right and
8:40
that just helps my central nervous
8:42
system go I don't know what it looks
8:43
like I don't even know what tomorrow
8:45
looks like but it's gonna be okay So
8:47
that for me was my biggest thing Support
8:50
My mom and dad I'm super close with them
8:52
They do you know thank goodness I didn't
8:54
have to move in with them They probably
8:56
would have loved it but I was like "Oh
8:58
gosh I'm either moving in with one of my
9:00
kids or my parents because I have no
9:03
career." Um but friends and support are
9:08
just big You just can't like anybody
9:10
that's going through that pick your
9:12
people wisely right because you're
9:14
already so drained and so exhausted and
9:17
scared and all the emotions and and
9:19
you're angry and and I mean you're all
9:21
over the board right and so don't pick
9:24
the person that's kind of draining right
9:26
but like just be selective about your
9:28
support and but I would say also don't
9:30
be afraid to lean on them Yes I not
9:34
really good at asking for help and I
9:38
talked to multiple people every day
9:40
because I just had to get out of my head
9:43
So people support my faith is a big
9:46
thing and then exercise I didn't want to
9:48
do it but I would I would be on the
9:50
treadmill balling crying
9:53
and the apartment complex that I was
9:56
living in I didn't really care Like it
9:58
it felt so you can't even think about
10:01
anything else you know and I remember
10:03
later people going like "Oh yeah you
10:06
were the girl crying on the treadmill."
10:08
I'm like "Yep So heartbreaking That was
10:10
me But you did it You know you got
10:12
through it." And and there's such an
10:15
incredible amount of loss and grief You
10:18
know like you shared your identity who
10:20
you thought you were going to be I mean
10:21
we picture ourselves growing old with
10:23
our partner and our grandkids coming
10:25
over and sharing all of those things And
10:27
there's just a lot of loss and grief
10:29
that comes from not having that picture
10:32
of what you wanted for yourself come to
10:35
fruition So what are what are some other
10:37
things that you would say about
10:38
navigating the grief and the loss you
10:41
know it's so you don't know until you go
10:44
through it And I never wanted to go
10:46
through it Sure But grief and loss it is
10:50
like somebody died but it's weird
10:53
because they're still alive Well and a
10:55
part of you died Yeah And so the grief
10:58
and loss it just overwhelms all your
11:02
thoughts and all your emotions
11:05
But the biggest thing is just let it all
11:09
out right it's like there's no good and
11:12
bad emotion right did you find that were
11:15
you far enough in your healing journey
11:16
that you knew you just have to let this
11:18
system Yeah I mean I had done enough
11:21
therapy and it felt good to me I'm not
11:24
like a super emotional person and I I
11:27
think I used to kind of be that you know
11:29
keep it all together make everything
11:31
look great And and so it was kind of
11:33
releasing Sure And this was by far the
11:37
hardest thing I've ever been through So
11:39
it was like bubbling up and bubbling up
11:40
and bubbling up And so yes to your
11:43
question of advising other people is let
11:46
it all out Cry on the treadmill right
11:49
like whatever Scream in your pillow
11:51
write the letters journal like just get
11:53
it out because it doesn't do any good
11:56
just trying to you know down I thank you
12:00
so much for your cander on that It's
12:02
just such a There's so much anguish that
12:04
comes from a loss like that And uh and
12:06
then all the other like you mentioned
12:08
all the other confusing feelings around
12:10
who this person was and now is and
12:12
everything else to you and and also the
12:15
sense of guilt and shame that you
12:16
weren't able to make it through it or
12:19
work or fix it or heal it or repair it
12:21
Like that's just all of those feelings
12:22
are so they're so complicated So talk to
12:26
us about what reinventing yourself
12:27
looked like How far past your divorce
12:29
are you now so
12:32
moving out was over four years ago So a
12:36
few years Okay A few years The timing of
12:39
the school even though it was really
12:41
really hard was perfect because this is
12:45
what I kind of always wanted to do but I
12:47
got the opportunity to stay home and be
12:49
a stay-home mom which I loved And so
12:52
looking back the timing was really
12:54
really good So it helped I would say the
12:57
reinventing is dig down and find out
13:01
what you're really passionate about And
13:03
so when you lose this whole thing the
13:07
identity the family how everybody knows
13:09
you and you lose all this you really
13:11
have to slow down and think not what am
13:14
I supposed to do or what should I do but
13:18
I believe like we were all born to do
13:21
something great Like we all have that
13:23
like little voice or that little like
13:24
tug on our heartstrings of like oh I
13:27
kind of always wanted to do this or I
13:29
kind of always want to do that and we a
13:31
lot of times ignore it because we're
13:32
fearful or I'm scared or it's not the
13:34
right time or school's hard or it cost
13:36
too much money or there's so much risk
13:38
And so um being pushed by my therapist
13:41
of like you know when are you going to
13:43
apply um for school um and sign up that
13:46
the reinventing is slow down and think
13:49
about well what am I really passionate
13:51
about because who wants to have a job
13:54
and a career that you don't even really
13:56
like so many people do though most of us
13:59
don't get to do what we do where we love
14:01
what we do and we get to make such a
14:03
difference and and if you're not yeah if
14:06
you're not fortunate enough that your
14:09
job is not your passion well then find
14:11
your passion in other ways right whether
14:13
it's volunteering or helping others And
14:16
and that's what I found was it's really
14:19
hard to be hurting when you're being
14:23
helpful
14:24
Yeah It's the same thing is we can't be
14:27
in anxiety when we're in gratitude When
14:29
we externalize something that's going on
14:31
outside of self we it kind of level sets
14:34
the situation which I think is really
14:37
helpful when we're going through times
14:38
of strife For sure Yeah Absolutely What
14:41
what what patterns or habits do you see
14:44
people struggling with uh you know in
14:46
whether it's friends or in your client
14:48
uh and I can share some about mine that
14:50
people go through when they are going
14:53
through a divorce What are some of the
14:54
patterns you see i mean I did a lot of
14:57
them um before I selforrected but um
15:01
living ruminating right and um I did a
15:05
lot of that and I it doesn't get you
15:07
anywhere right but it's you know if I
15:10
could have just done this or what if I
15:12
did this or what if what if what if what
15:14
if If only they Yeah I mean any of those
15:17
And so don't look back just look forward
15:20
And so the ruminating doesn't help And
15:23
then the worrying about the future I
15:25
mean neither one We can't change the
15:27
past and we can't predict the future
15:28
Neither exists anymore Yeah Today And so
15:31
today and it's hard And it sounds so
15:34
cliche you know be in the present But it
15:37
is just for me it was the slowing down
15:40
and looking inward
15:43
so beautiful and it's really you're such
15:46
a an example because there are so many
15:48
people that would say things like you
15:50
know it's too late I'm I'm over 50 or
15:52
over whatever age and I can't do this
15:55
now because then what you know I'm only
15:57
going to work for this this long and
15:59
I've always thought with what we do we
16:00
just get better as we age you know it's
16:03
life experience yeah you bring all this
16:05
additional wisdom I'm like it's great
16:06
you're gray and all those things happen
16:08
and people just really respect the fact
16:10
that you've been around the block a
16:11
little it even more So I don't think
16:13
it's a bad it's a nice solid choice and
16:16
this day and age we're going to live so
16:17
long you know we might as well do
16:18
something that you enjoy for sure What
16:21
would you tell your past self or someone
16:23
going through this in the p now i think
16:26
trusting your gut and trusting your
16:28
intuition I doubted that a lot and then
16:31
it just took longer and kind of just
16:36
being able to call stuff out that wasn't
16:39
working I um kind of jumped through
16:42
hoops and walked on eggshells and
16:44
avoided wasn't being authentic
16:48
Okay And so um if I could have just been
16:53
a little more like hey you know I could
16:56
have maybe
16:59
not drugg out the pain and the anguish
17:03
for so long when the inevitable inevit
17:07
inevitable was just going to happen
17:09
right okay that's good That's good
17:11
feedback I the trusting yourself and and
17:14
I would say something else that I see a
17:16
lot of is the doom and gloom You know
17:19
it's just it's never going to be okay
17:21
And the thing about it is is when we are
17:23
faced with an with an opportunity to
17:26
grow The discomfort is we all want to
17:29
avoid the discomfort but when we're
17:30
faced with this opportunity we you just
17:33
never know what you can pull off when
17:35
you're given the chance And I think
17:36
that's what I would say is I mean who
17:38
would have thought that you know you
17:40
would be at this season I mean when we
17:41
first met 18 years ago or whatever it
17:45
was like who would have thought we would
17:46
be having this kind of conversation this
17:48
long Never later But the strife helps us
17:52
to dig deep requires us to dig deep and
17:54
figure out who we want to be Yeah I
17:57
don't think um obviously I'm not an
18:00
advocate of divorce at all or tearing
18:02
apart a family but um going through
18:06
something like that really really hard
18:09
Um let me turn into who I was really
18:13
supposed to be It's like I got a second
18:16
chance That's a beautiful way to look at
18:18
that And I think that it's hard to see
18:19
when you're in the throws of the pain
18:21
but hopefully this is an opportunity for
18:24
those watching to go you know there is a
18:27
chance to get through it And you know
18:28
you I like that you talked about the
18:29
fact that you know you didn't have any
18:31
financial independence or any of those
18:32
things And so and you still manage to
18:34
find your way to uh you know a career
18:37
that that you know can help you live a
18:40
good life and things like that So it's
18:42
really cool Yeah Well I really
18:44
appreciate you sharing this with us and
18:46
um from the counselor's perspective also
18:48
from your personal perspective I'm
18:50
really grateful for your time today and
18:52
we're going to do another episode on
18:54
some of the other things related to
18:55
being um divorce a uh uh in another
18:59
episode So you'll have to tune in to see
19:01
that episode because I think you'll find
19:03
it helpful But Tracy thank you so much
19:06
for being here today I really appreciate
19:08
your courage and your cander and your
19:10
authenticity It's been a real treat to
19:12
have you here Thank you It was great to
19:13
be here too And for those of you
19:15
watching I just appreciate your time I'm
19:17
sure if you're going through this uh
19:20
unfortunate time hopefully you you
19:22
gained a little bit of insight and
19:24
hopefully that you you will feel a
19:26
little bit more hopeful that you can get
19:27
through it and you can be okay And we'll
19:30
go ahead and leave a couple of resources
19:31
in the description for you to perhaps
19:34
find some support groups or a therapist
19:36
of your own in an area if that's
19:38
something that you choose to pursue So
19:40
thank you so much for being here And
19:42
until we meet again don't forget to lead
19:44
with love It'll never steer you wrong
19:47
[Music]