Up next in 10
Tips for persuading your audience to fall in love with your service or product with Sopha Dagnon
5 views
Feb 11, 2020
Copychat: Tips for persuading your audience to fall in love with your service or product and make you irresistible to solve their problems with Sophia Dagnon Links: Guest Sophia Dagnon Website: https://sophiadagnon.com/ LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sophiadagnon/ GetUplift: https://getuplift.co/ Copyhackers: https://copyhackers.com/ Co-Founder: UnMassmarket https://unmassmarket.com/ Articles on Principles of Persuasion: https://www.influenceatwork.com/principles-of-persuasion/ Article at GetUplfit - https://getuplift.co/7-persuasion-principles/ =============== https://www.copyflight.com/ #copywriting #contentmarketing #digitalmarketing Follow me on our other social media platforms:
View Video Transcript
0:00
hey everybody this is Todd and I welcome to the copy chat show my name is todd
0:05
Jones of copy fight and at the copy chat show we reside at the intersection of
0:11
copywriting content marketing and digital marketing so when I come on it's
0:17
gonna be on one of those three topics and I may very well have a guest on like
0:23
I do today who is in one of those fields can give us a little bit more expertise
0:29
and my guest today is a long time copywriting friend Sophia dag nan and
0:37
she is just we used to have these chats like we're doing right now this is like
0:43
old times sake right here for us and we used to chat about once a month once a
0:48
quarter that kind of thing and kind of spur each other on and and I think it's done really well for her not sure about
0:54
me but has been really well for her so Sophia would you like to tell the audience a little bit a little bit about
1:00
who you are and what you do sure well I think chess just it shows how valuable
1:06
chats were to me so it was what some a week did we talk dude I can't believe you're like well we've started out once
1:16
a month didn't we or something like that it got harder and harder to keep that up
1:23
so you know we started doing it farther and farther apart but you know yeah once a week so it was a bright spot in my day
1:31
I know that so Sophia and what you do
1:39
and who you work with and that kind of thing so I'm a copywriter and I'm the
1:45
co-founder of unmask market which is basically the place that the SAS marketers go to when they want to learn
1:51
how to use email to grow their companies and careers and I also work with two
1:56
companies go get uplift and copy hackers and I do copy for them
2:02
strange dinner so I would say you're not a copywriter I would say you're a conversion
2:07
copywriter I think a lot of
2:13
people especially in the copywriting industry don't make a difference between them because you think oh well you're a copywriter you're supposed to be a
2:20
conversion copywriter but outside of that field I don't know that they there's a little bit of a difference and
2:27
I'm not sure everybody understands that and a conversion copywriter is solely
2:32
focused on getting conversions for their clients yes which usually basically
2:39
means that today we're trying to help make more money but conversions can mean
2:44
anything else as well but it's typically centered around like how can we use or
2:49
do digital assets that you have to basically help you win more customers and bring in more paying customers
2:56
and it's not about being a wordsmith no
3:02
research process also sounds good research and testing that's the thing
3:09
I've learned from Joanna been on so many of those Suzy a tutorial she's done and
3:15
several the ones that Talia has done as well and you know people tend to think
3:21
about well yeah and this is really in the website world so I haven't probably will have some website developers
3:26
listing as well they tend to like do the website and hand it off to the client unless they're on a maintenance plan for
3:35
their website that's it they hand it off and and I think some people think of that as a copywriting but it learned
3:40
over the years from people like Joanna and Talia and joke like a some of the
3:46
others that there's a whole lot of testing that happens after the project's done - not really - tweak I don't want
3:54
Josh Garofalo slapping me through the video camera but you're you're you are
3:59
kind of tweaking your but you're tweaking based on what you've already done to make more conversions is that
4:05
accurate or are tweaking is this too
4:14
tight blegh - there's more than two but there's basically two major types of optimization so you put your copy out
4:20
there and the first thing is the copywriting is never actually finished it's something that you're going to keep iterating it's rating well Twitter
4:29
so that kind of splits into two camps in one you're going to just when you're
4:34
first starting out a lot of the optimization is going to be taking what you're learning survey see seeing what
4:40
your customers are clicking on which emails did you send get openings which one's get responded to like good
4:46
response is bad responses and what people are saying and doing base new copy and at this point you're just
4:53
optimizing by kind of rewriting based on what you're learning but there's another kind of optimizations well once you're
5:01
performing like your copy is doing well that's when you do strategy optimization so let's say like you have an onboarding
5:07
sequence for your email list and that's performing like pretty good your open rates are like in his 30s forty percent
5:14
you're getting good click-through and so like you're happy but look we're doing good so that's when you do strategy
5:20
optimization so you take all the research which we'll probably talk about later and you look into what your
5:25
customers are doing and what they need to see from you and that's when you use that data to create a new hypothesis
5:32
that you create that sequence on so that's kind of water what we do as sounds like science class to me
5:39
yes which is what makes it awesome yes you would love that so optimization is a better word than
5:46
tweaking I think that was the only thing I could think of I knew that Jo that Josh didn't like that he's he's probably
5:53
gonna chastise me for that later but optimization so you take what you've
5:58
already done the optimize so and and there's usually it's a lot different
6:04
than your average copywriter who writes copy and then hands it off and never
6:09
touch it again so I just wanted people understand that because I think it's not maybe not understood as quite as well so
6:17
I'm going to do something new on this one that I'm going to try to do is some the gasps it's called I'm gonna call it
6:24
get getting no you the lightning round so it's made not to be drawn out necessarily just to kind of get to know
6:31
a little bit about the gasps so these will be kind of quick questions hopefully quick answers you ready
6:41
see here we go cake power cookies hey
6:47
what cake pie or cookies dessert pie
6:53
okay favorite TV show ever
6:59
that's hard see that's not lighting up right now that discussions on this along
7:06
the way you and I Oh deep space 9 space 9 okay favorite holiday Christmas snowy
7:15
except for in taxes well unless you're yeah unless you're the south in the United States favorite author token
7:24
joking okay what would you sing at
7:30
karaoke night any Disney song any Disney song ever like well I'm thinking about
7:38
frozen let it let it go or whatever I actually I'm more like 1911 Aladdin okay
7:47
okay if you had a warning label what would your say go away just beware
8:00
probably beware firecracker present okay how's the captive murders do yes
8:05
see we're okay aside from necessities what would what is one thing you could
8:12
not go a day without coffee
8:17
necessities here I was a necessity but maybe others wouldn't count as a
8:22
necessity well Savin coffee well what could you not go down food food you're just a very
8:32
simple person and that's good this is kind of a weird one so but you are in
8:38
Houston so would you rather ride a bike ride a horse or drive a car okay
8:48
it would be way cooler you can be a cowgirl yes okay if you could live
8:53
anywhere where would it be Antarctica where Antarctica you like the
9:01
cold do you yes this is why I moved to Texas yeah okay
9:06
I think this is the last one what celebrity would you like to meet at
9:12
Starbucks for a cup of coffee or anywhere really did it have to be alive or dead yeah
9:21
teri present ooh Sir Terry Pratchett okay all right
9:28
not as familiar with him so that's cool okay so today Sophia is is a conversion
9:39
copywriter email strategist is that correct to say yep and I want her to teach us a
9:45
little bit of voodoo and maybe that's the wrong word to say but when it comes
9:52
to writing our content and our copy I think people tend to be way too informative so we're gonna talk about
9:58
some things you can do to be more persuasive at least one thing and so I
10:06
wanted to talk to Sophie about that now there's there I'm on petition show notes
10:13
but there's the principles of persuasion I think I am saying I've been saying for
10:19
a while now that content and I'm not dumb I copy writing like landing pages
10:24
and emails I'm talking about like your blog post whatever but there's a blurring of lines between copywriting
10:29
and content writing because content writing has to be more persuasive now
10:35
than maybe it was 10 years ago when we were probably a little bit more matter-of-fact and you know informational I think you
10:44
have to go beyond the information do you think that - so fear my way off on that
10:50
I think it's more that like it's becoming more normal and conversational
10:57
to write content so like nobody actually enjoys reading boring things I mean just think about the things that you enjoy
11:02
reading like you like somebody that puts together persuasive arguments and it's interesting
11:08
this kind of teaching you something that you're actually oh you know what I enjoyed the fight that I spent five
11:13
minutes reading this back in the day when you're trying to find information if the only information that you could
11:18
find is just ridiculously boring yeah I mean you'd read that cuz that's the only thing out there because there's
11:25
so much out there now we just actually have to write things that we like changed well I think a blog post maybe
11:33
10 years ago sometimes that kind of content was written more like what we would call a knowledge base really just
11:38
very much just the facts I know that well if you go to copy hackers and read
11:44
an article and by the way selfie has an article maybe one maybe more than one I don't know you I know you got one over
11:50
there you go to copy hackers those are incredibly long articles okay
11:57
they're not gonna put out one that's long that long that's gonna take you 15
12:02
20 minutes to read or more if it's not written in a way that you will stay engaged all the way through I mean who's
12:10
gonna read a article that takes 20 to 30 minutes to read if it's not engaging so
12:22
I like the idea of being more persuasive whether it's in your content the
12:29
articles are writing on your website whether it's in your emails and that's really important and I hope you bring
12:35
that up because that that is your area of expertise but boring emails are
12:41
frankly just really boring and if you're if you're building if you're doing a TV
12:48
or video shows like this one or a podcast I mean no one wants to get on their list of somebody who's monotone so
12:56
I think persuasion is probably one of the single most important things you do
13:01
with your content agree disagree agree but remember that persuasion is
13:08
something that you're already naturally doing like whenever you're hanging out with your friends or like whenever you're trying to like persuade your
13:14
partner or your friend like what movie you guys are going to pick from Netflix hey that's persuasion in action these
13:20
are all things that we do all the time but when you sit down and write it's somehow like your brain just blacks you're like wait
13:28
like these are words how do these words go onto page it's about moving kind of past making writing a different thing
13:35
and just tapping into the principles that you already naturally use in your like day to day life
13:41
so how can a typical business owner tap
13:46
into that for their content that they do for business in general I think the
13:53
first thing is to stop separating your business so much like from the way you would normally talk but that's like
13:59
that's a really easy thing to say but how did you actually do that so one of the persuasion principles that me and
14:06
Todd we're talking about before we started recording is likeability so how do you come across as likable and this
14:13
is again like one of those things where if you read like just be more like with like yeah like I'm not going out of my
14:20
way to make my customers hate me like what does that like on the page and so I
14:27
made some notes earlier which I'm not going to look at but one of the things
14:33
about likeability is that as a business owner you have this at least like a lot
14:38
of the business owners I've spoken do you have this desire to make a product everybody likes and so the second you
14:44
get pushback on marketing or likes you send out say like an email a sales email
14:50
for like your latest launch and you get several replies just like ah you know this was the worst most salesy thing
14:57
ever I hated it I never want to hear from you again like who do you think you are and
15:02
you take that to mean that you're not being likable but that's actually not a
15:07
rubbish in order to be likable like to be likable somebody out there has to
15:13
dislike you you can't have like people think oh you know this person is an
15:18
amazing I want to learn from them without somebody else thinking like nope
15:23
this person is the worst like I want nothing to do with them it actually comes down to a law of physics so for
15:30
every action you need an equal and opposite reaction so to be like other people have to dislike you so
15:38
when you think about likability you have to think about what did the people I actually wanted to connect with so the
15:44
people who are my dream customers who I want to deal with on a day-to-day basis like I want these guys behind my
15:50
products because we're just they're going to really use my products they're going to make the most out of them and they all said you like to work with
15:57
because as a business owner you don't want to work with people who don't like yourself like you're not really going to
16:02
be able to provide a very good service for them so when you think about being likable think about those people and
16:10
kind of you start from there yeah and that brings up another point about and
16:18
that shouldn't be in this video but about who those people are how do you determine who those people are and you
16:26
know well my friend samantha is a market marketing genius she talks about I think
16:33
the first time I ever heard the ideal not just the ideal climate the perfect client I forgot how she put it but it
16:40
was really it's a person who aligns with you the most and I'm afraid in business
16:45
sometimes we hear too much talk about there is a target market your target
16:50
market is that ideal client whatever but we really put a lot of stock in niche and really what we mean by niches
16:56
industry and industry is only one part of the equation when it comes to you
17:04
know generating who your target audience is I think that's why I encourage a lot of people to look at psychographics you
17:10
know over demographics a lot anyway I'm sorry I kind of got off to change it
17:16
yeah actually that brings something about likability I've been thinking about so you mentioned things I say graphics and you mentioned nishan down
17:22
to industry for me it's also about mission down to philosophy so like what's your business philosophy is and
17:29
so this is an example for my personal life back in my I think was July I was like dude I need to start doing some
17:35
form of exercise because just working from my home office is not going to cut it and so I joined a kickboxing studio
17:42
and like there philosophy is very much like oh you know
17:48
we need to get in and lose weight for the summer and look great in lake bikinis and just and it was very that
17:55
kind of like we want to get fit for this extrinsic result which happens to
18:02
diverge from my fitness philosophy but what you learn a lot of yeah I just like
18:09
punching bags so Michael Oscars like I want to punch the bag really hard and they're like oh yes you lose those 10 pounds and I was
18:16
like no I'm just interested in how hard I can push this back but it motivates a
18:22
lot of the other people in the gym and so I stopped going because I want philosophies just diverge like they're
18:29
good studio they cater great to their audience I'm just not their audience but few days
18:34
ago I joined a CrossFit still you just down the road for me and their philosophy is let's just lift a bunch of
18:40
like stuff and see how much we can this I was like hah that is that is the
18:46
philosophy that makes you like about you because you're pushing me you're like I'm aligning with what I want how to
18:51
fitness which is to see how much you're taking lift versus like the other philosophy so to be like mo to the
18:58
person and make it's not like the kickboxing city are not likeable they are is just they're not likeable to me
19:05
yeah find your people like who are you actually targeting and don't let go out
19:10
and cop out and say oh everyone you're not targeting everyone exactly nobody targets everyone you have people that
19:16
will just love your product it will be really well with what you've got going on so make figure out what your philosophy
19:23
is and one great way to do that is to talk to them like talk to you back s
19:29
customers like what do they love about you like what do they want to see more of that's the stuff that's going to make
19:35
you likeable and get you more people like them yeah yeah and and I think not
19:44
delved into this about page thing last year and did some tear downs which are
19:49
on the YouTube channel and I did some tear downs for other key well actually
19:56
that's actually who they here for I put our tweet hey what do you say
20:01
would you know about page tear downs and about nine people said yeah yeah you
20:06
could do mine like let her rip okay so I did it but anyway during that process and also
20:12
I helped this seems really benign but
20:19
Joel from case study buddy he's like hey man we don't have anything for LinkedIn
20:25
page you know the about part flight okay so did a little research for him and I
20:32
took pretty much mostly what he had from his about page on his website and
20:39
formatted it for because it's all pretty much straight text so I did a little formatting and put it up there for it I
20:45
sent it to him and he put it up and I realized that doing that was even about
20:50
the same as doing about page but anyway I go back to set to say as I developed my about page framework one of the
20:56
things that you do is hone down on what your values are and so actually going
21:04
through that right now with a client and I and I use a question you know basically and other people have said
21:11
this question so it's not unusual but basically what about your industry pisses you off what really makes you bad
21:20
and because that right there is a slight this a little touch button issue in
21:25
which people will build their business around so there's a lady I work with here in town who has a cleaning business
21:32
well she realized that most cleaning services will have and I know this from
21:38
experience will have companies to are not company they'll have the house owner
21:44
to put things aside and kind of straighten up before they come in clean well she decided she was gonna offer
21:51
what she called maid service with it so not only do you get the house your house
21:56
clean but they also like mow make up your bed and you know I'll discuss something it's like don't worry about it
22:02
will take care of and I think it wasn't even know she understands how powerful
22:07
that is to be honest with you but it's huge but it's a it's a little thing
22:13
that she didn't like about how her industry did something that she decided to do differently it is a
22:19
differentiation so differentiating around something that is important to
22:24
you can make you make you more likeable to your target audience is that kind of what you're saying
22:32
like find what you do different like find what you believe that's different just because like we all do we all have
22:38
specific things that we want and when you pick a fight that like your audience is also P okay just a great way to
22:45
connect I mean just think about all the really solid friendships you made like when you were younger even now like a lot of them like in your face around
22:52
things you like but a lot of them are based on things you dislike together like shows you this like together like
22:58
activities you dislike together so there's a lot of power in that yeah so
23:04
okay let's look that around just a little bit you're saying you know this could make you very likeable but at the
23:10
same sides can also there's somebody who won't like you how do i as a business
23:15
owner I'm trying to be more likeable I'm really tapping into my own values and
23:22
treating my business around that so I have people being attracted to me from that same framework but you may have
23:31
somebody mad at you or maybe they don't maybe this is not just a benign I don't like what you're you know how you do
23:37
like you with the the was a kickboxing you know you didn't hate them they were
23:43
likeable it just didn't align with what you want to do but sometimes in doing so not only do they not align it treats a
23:53
sense of threat and they become angry at you how does a record business owner handle that that's what the really hard
24:01
things that if if you're going to make something that is really different like if you're going to differentiate
24:07
yourself in a way the candidate stands out you will get that there isn't like an easy or a nice or like a step by step
24:15
to deal with that and what I personally do and what I recommended that other people do is you have to look a why you
24:23
pick values in first place so when you pick like the values that you stand for they have to be something that he actually
24:28
stand for they just believe in so then when you get that negative feedback as long as you're being honest and ethical
24:35
and truthful about what you do you're not exaggerating or you're not basically doing any of the dodgy stuff that you
24:41
wouldn't do anyway then you just kinda have to take it on the chin so again people will dislike your business but is
24:48
that worth it for the people that will really love you stuff and will keep buying your stuff and recommending you
24:53
stuff and if it's not well then maybe you should rethink the strategy if it is
24:59
then you just have to keep that in mind I think this is interesting where this conversation went because I certainly
25:05
did not expect it to go down this road and it really aligns with some of the stuff I'm doing because I'm talking to
25:10
people about messaging all the times like you know and I've got this new thing for me anyway that I call you know
25:18
how you talk about product market fix fit or whatever I call your your market
25:24
message fit or your message market fit is your message fitting with your market
25:30
or buy it by market I mean your target audience so what you're talking about here actually plays right into that
25:36
which is really cool but you're saying not only is that a good thing to do anyway makes you more likeable which
25:43
makes you more persuasive to the right audience that correct yes we tend to be
25:49
more persuaded by people that we already like and so we build stronger bonds and
25:55
sometimes and as I said earlier and to be likeable to your audience to the people you want to attract going to be
26:01
dislikable to their opposite thank you sir now your target audience is likes you
26:08
and it's not just like oh I like them it's like I really like because I like what they're doing and I line whatever
26:14
but you're saying on the flip side of our on the back side of that is they become superfans
26:20
for your business was that accurate to say I think a percentage of them well
26:28
yeah yeah but I have a friend Brittany Hodak who started it's caught it was
26:34
called a zine pack at the time now she calls a superfan she's starting to consult businesses about basically it's it's good customer
26:41
service that leads to being a super fan but uh that's what I thought of when you were talking about that they become
26:47
people to share your stuff and and really recommend you so they really like you so that's hard likability part of
26:56
that is though some business practices so you can't just be likeable and then have businesses that are big your
27:02
customers deliver you got a delivery got over deliver you can't ignore customer service and I
27:11
think also in a started reading book that you've probably already read called profit first here's ideals probably
27:20
first but he makes you know it's not what it sounds like I mean it kind of is but it's not but
27:28
you've got to have it you got to build a business that's sustainable which is kind of what you're talking about and in order to do that you've got to
27:36
continue to service your product and your customer well but I think when we
27:43
think about growth and revenue almost exclusively which is kind of ways referring to the book you tend to not
27:50
think about taking care of people in the back end because your focus on can we get more people can we get more people
27:56
you know and it was a it's just a subtle shift I think but I think the profit
28:02
first mentality allows you to think more about sustained growth and which should
28:10
I think mean you take care of your customers on the back side so yeah
28:16
persuasion only like Chris evasion is going to help you get more people to say
28:21
yes to you but it only creates profitable business that's sustainable and long-term them if like your product
28:27
has to be solid like it has to be good you have to have good customer service you have to treat your like if you have
28:34
employees or a team or contractors they have to feel good about what you're doing because they may see the face of
28:40
your company if you're like they feel bad sure persuasions gonna get people through the door but you won't be able
28:47
to keep them and likeability is something that helps people sign up there's us something helps you retain
28:53
them long-term which is how you build a sustainable business so I think you can
28:58
use the likeability in the service part of as well I mean you know well I use an
29:06
example I use SiteGround for hosting I know some people have had some issues with them for whatever reason over the
29:11
years but I really like them the products good certainly but every time I
29:17
reach out for something you almost always chat I mean very seldom is it
29:24
anything less than a stellar experience so in that way they're retaining or
29:29
they're maintaining their likability status and I think a lot of companies do
29:35
that as well that's not yeah I like what you say so Mike ability can get you in the door you certainly got deliver on
29:42
the product and the service but I think you can continue likability in the service you definitely should yeah oh
29:50
yeah yeah absolutely so okay well any other persuasion tips
29:58
for us dig in to another one cuz it
30:04
almost feels like then it would be over time so I'm just gonna wrap up on like
30:10
do you think it's what they gave to how to find out what's likeable like quickly search tips or you know yeah okay so a
30:19
quick way to find out like if you're thinking they're like ah but how do I know what my what my best customers are
30:26
first thing identify your best customers so like who are my best customers there
30:31
should be people that spend a good amount of money with you but also like
30:36
people that you enjoy working with long-term these are the people you want to keep so if somebody like just dropped
30:42
20k on you but you're like working with them has just been a nightmare that is not your best customer if somebody's
30:50
consistently dropping like 2k a month and yeah and they're delightful to work with that is your best customer so you
30:57
make a list of those people ideally like typically those would be in smaller service businesses those with people you
31:03
know Wow so if you're a bigger business you can run a survey with them and just kind of
31:09
ask them specific questions about their experience with you so you can learn more if it's a smaller number just like
31:16
ask them for 15-20 minutes at the time and like you can give them a Starbucks gift card that I like to do that at the
31:22
very end after the interview so ask for the favor we'll chat and then I offer something at the end as a thank-you so
31:28
you're less bribing them and more appreciating the fact if taking the time right you can google about like
31:36
interviews online there's a lot of really good resources and I'm sure we can link them oh yeah talk to them about
31:41
the experience for the about like what they love what would they say to their friends if they would describe you if
31:47
they were down at the pub or the coffee shop like how would they describe what you do and what they love about you make
31:52
a sentence with you why do they keep coming back to you but a competitor's and start basically in a building like a
31:58
Google Doc or a notion doc like whatever you work in of that information and so
32:04
that's going to show you what you need to do more oh and what kind of things you need to touch on in order to be more
32:09
likeable in both your like marketing materials and also throughout your
32:14
customer service experience don't stop being likeable that's what I'm going to don't stop being likeable yeah
32:20
that's good that's a good line don't stop being likeable what are some questions you would recommend for a
32:26
survey either in person or using something like Google Forms or type form
32:32
or whatever I always it really depends
32:38
on what you're trying to find out so what I can do instead of just like listening up a bunch of context list
32:43
questions I can give you a couple of links to a couple really good articles on surveys again I walk you through basically what their hypotheses were
32:50
like what they were trying to find out what questions they asked and then you can use this as inspiration to kind of a
32:56
look at on your own question oh and one resource is I'm looking behind me to
33:01
find out what the title of the book is cause I don't remember but coaching habit it's good the coaching habit and
33:07
that has some really good kind of questions and interview techniques and
33:12
things I can just help you build like your own questions on but always start from like the information that you need to
33:19
find out now talking about customer surveys and interviews now that now now
33:26
you just created another interview option for me now I want to get Hannah
33:33
Raji on there and chefs her specialty she's really good at that kind of stuff so yeah yeah exactly I was gonna say
33:43
first especially for the companies that are local you know take them down
33:48
ask them for coffee at the coffee shop and I'm just you know how I am about
33:54
coffee I go to all the the the
33:59
independent ones in town so I mean it's easy go Starbucks they have one on every corner and if that's your go-to then
34:05
then do that but go like here maybe go to blue sell coffee or whatever your
34:12
favorite coffee shop is you talked about getting the gift card get a gift card for that coffee shop so now last fall
34:18
last December actually you know Pam Moore she was doing some interviews survey and put out her email and I said
34:26
yeah I'll do it and I got a toy car gift card to Amazon actually she gave me two
34:31
or three options but I chose the gift card that and a couple gift cards for
34:36
Christmas and the head about seventy bucks to spend and I just got about five books including the Robert chale chale
34:44
Dini book the the persuasion principles I just picked that one up prophet first
34:49
and even permission marketing by Seth Godin so I got it I got about five books
34:56
out of that so I mean not from the but Pam gave me a gift card and then I had some others and so yeah it was pretty
35:02
cool and all I did was what we're doing right now she got me on the phone a
35:07
couple years ago and the bills Aziz did the same thing he put out a
35:13
message on one of the Facebook pages I said yeah I'm in this field or I've done this before and he booked and the bill
35:20
paid me for my time he paid me for my time so yeah I mean not everybody can do
35:26
that but surely find something for your company I'm a little Besant
35:32
because if you're compensating somebody up front it's going to affect their answers play oh they don't think it's
35:39
going to make their answers but it just is it's how the brain works he did not tell me he was gonna do that
35:46
thank you yes yeah so yeah I see it but I know let's
35:53
just say I met somebody at blue cell and to ask them these questions and I buy
35:59
their coffee but before they ever come in I say you may attend to our gift card and then when I'm done you go hey I
36:06
really appreciate you sitting down with painters a gift card the blue cell you know yeah or service I mean I've offered
36:12
a quickly copy because it's something I do it so when I do like interviews when I filled it they're basically giving up
36:20
white doing me a favor by taking the time I've offered something like hey
36:25
like if you send me like a landing page I wrote I would review of it show you what to optimize its the prints for
36:38
reciprocity yeah yeah so like you we
36:44
just went on we just talked about like ability for a long time and then you through reciprocity in there which I
36:50
like - that's a good one ah now we know there's seven of the
36:55
principles were swayed and we didn't go into all of them but I added another one
37:00
so you want to know my other this will
37:06
be on video tape so I nobody else can take credit for it okay
37:13
obviously somebody else has probably done it but mine is nostalgia I am amazed how any product or something that
37:23
reminds us of a better time so in fact eBay basically lives on that
37:32
right being able to buy the toy when you were eight years old that you loved you invited on eBay just about I thought
37:39
about one spot just metal lunchboxes I don't know if you had that good went up in Scotland by
37:44
we had those metal lunch boxes when I was kid and you know just anything that
37:50
reminds us of stuff that we really loved when we were much much younger and
37:55
people spend money for that too let me stop just a drive-by night nostalgia moment I mean people will pay
38:02
to relive that childhood so I think nostalgia is a principle persuasion but
38:08
whatever see wasn't see what tell you says bring it up so hey this is what
38:13
Todd said she may think I'm nuts but yeah okay just to go okay
38:21
speaking of folks like that so Tarzan did her quiz final last year which I'm
38:29
sure Shanti helped her with tell about Tarzan K so for anybody's watching don't know I'm talking about and it was it was
38:36
an 80s theme right so people were like taking it not because necessary stars in
38:44
but it's like this 80s vibe going on which is when I grew up I know Tarzan is way too young to know what the eighties
38:50
are but anyway I mean but that's nostalgia right I mean a little bit I
38:56
mean how many people took that to find out what their eighties thing was you
39:02
know so did you take that quiz I'm pretty sure I did I think that was a
39:11
Kmart or something like that anyway it had it was a funnel to get you into her
39:20
basically learning how to value yourself more make you know charge more money company and I was Kmart special or
39:28
something like that which tells you a little bit about me but anyway he's probably right no idea what that means
39:34
was a kind of a cheap in store for it was like Walmart before Walmart really
39:40
but Walmart lasted longer so but you
39:47
know and they just have the blue light special and then that blue light came on everything certain things were on anyway
39:53
it's just it was just synonymous with cheap basically and or you know that viewing yourself is
39:59
cheaper or whatever so you raised your prices Yeah right everything quadrupled after that but I
40:10
am likable so I think anyway no I'm but but I really think about that because
40:16
and I think a lot of those quiz finals actually tap into that can tap into that not everything but I think that's
40:23
something sometimes you'll see websites with the branding that's kind of retro I mean red shows a thing so I can see how
40:30
nostalgia as I think about it that's pretty good persuasion principle
40:38
experience I think that's what makes it so powerful you're basically creating a group of people who like the same thing
40:45
yeah yeah Electric football games you remember those things that vibrated to me they still make them I think yes you
40:52
look at me like I'm weird but that's okay sorry eighty ninety nine miss miss babies yeah yeah yeah okay now I
41:00
remember how old I am over 30 thank you yeah and my birthday
41:06
was last Friday by the way I was waiting for it with bated breath for your
41:13
birthday wish
41:26
I'm but I try to answer every single person where did you send it to me through Facebook well that's that's Gen
41:37
X for you we're always ignored ok very good how can people find you online you can
41:46
find me at unmask market.com or also at sofia diamond which would
41:53
give you a link to unmask my yeah and also linkedin like all the socialist thoughts that i am i used to be a social
42:00
media marketer which means that i now suck at social media for myself so linkedin is pretty much the best days
42:06
yeah so we'll put all that in the show notes and in the description below
42:12
I do like the the the new Sophie daggone page it's a the landing page it's got a
42:18
really cool picture of you there look at all the director Joe the other places yeah well yeah that's what a lot of us
42:24
do I mean we have a like for our name domain that's what we tend to do you
42:29
know I still have WordPress install for that but if you go there now it's a landing page with there's a link to this
42:34
and here's a link to that yeah well so
42:44
be it was great to catch up and get your Thank You persuasion
42:50
now you got me wondering should I maybe I should call Hannah and see she'll jump on down the road there maybe Nikki I
42:57
love deke Nikki zone Nikki's awesome as well i 100% recommend her not just
43:03
because she is my confounder but mostly that why would you have her Chuck what do you think she's talked about Oh
43:09
either email marketing or interview she is very good I don't want to get well
43:18
space those out I want to get some content markers on as well but I do have a couple of copywriters coming up so I'm
43:25
pretty excited about that okay well thank you so much for hanging me and
43:30
hopefully it wasn't too unprofessional and hopefully people watching this will learn a little bit more about using
43:36
persuasion and likeability in their daily content Amara
#Marketing
#Sales