Up next in 10
Tom Swarbrick is joined by Prince Andrew's ex-girlfriend Lady Victoria Hervey, to discuss her doubts about the legitimacy of Virginia Giuffre’s claims against the Duke of York.
Hervey suggests Giuffre was not a victim but a willing participant, and questions the decision to settle the case. She criticises the media's portrayal of Andrew and defends his character.
She also suggests she has tapes of Giuffre saying that Andrew 'did nothing wrong.'
On the controversial photo of Andrew with Giuffre, Hervey claims, 'That photo is not real.'
If you or someone you know has been affected by the matters discussed in this episode, contact one of the following helplines: www.samaritans.org/how-we-can-help/contact-samaritan/
www.mind.org.uk
Listen to the full show on Global Player: https://app.af.globalplayer.com/Br0x/LBCYouTubeListenLive
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0:00
Thank you very much for coming in
0:01
Can I start with Virginia Dufresne's death and the comments that you made about that
0:08
You said, when lies catch up with you, there's no way out. Do you think Virginia Dufresne killed herself
0:17
Good question. Well, we have not seen a body yet. This is the weird thing, right
0:21
Normally you would see the body on a stretcher, like something, but we haven't seen anything yet
0:27
And the original, like the release was NBC, which is also I thought was kind of bizarre
0:34
That was the first person. Did she kill herself? I wrote that post because there had been like a lot of stuff obviously going on in that month before her death with that whole four days to live story, which as it got dissected, it wasn't a bad crash
0:55
No one was injured. what really was going on with Virginia Dufresne, right
0:59
Her family put the statement out to say that she'd taken her own life. It doesn't seem that it's in her family's interests
1:07
to lie about that or to make that up. Who knows, really
1:13
Look, she definitely, like, things were catching up with her. The lies were catching up
1:21
She was sort of finally crumbling, And I feel like at that point she was no good to the lawyers anymore
1:28
The cash cow of Virginia Dufresne being able to sue so many people, that was gone
1:35
You call them lies. I mean, one of the things that you claim is that the famous picture of Prince Andrew, Virginia Dufresne, Ghislaine Maxwell
1:43
That's what I want to concentrate on. Is one of those lies. You say that's a faked picture
1:47
Yeah, there's nothing real about that picture. Now, when that picture first appeared, actually, like the papers that wrote about it, they got her height wrong
1:59
They said she was five foot seven. She's actually five foot three on Wikipedia
2:03
The fact is, which I don't know if I even mentioned that last week, but we have phone recordings of a conversation
2:13
I have hours of tape, which the FBI has, which I'm waiting for Pam Bondi and Kash Patel to release of Virginia Giuffre
2:21
in phone recordings saying nothing happened to Andrew. To who? To this guy, George and Maria Farmer
2:30
Why don't you put that out there if you have it? I just had George on the phone just now before coming in here
2:36
So, well, the FBI have got it. So we're basically giving them like another week or two
2:42
to see if they're going to release it. And if they don't, we will release it
2:46
Fine. But him, he's just worried legally. And basically his best friend whose idea it was to record died last summer
2:57
Right. Ad bar. So. The problem is if you part of your argument is this woman is very traumatized, has had a really tough life
3:06
She basically was saved from Jeffrey Epstein, to be honest, like her life was so bad
3:10
I don't think he was the catalyst that made it worse. Like he actually put her into rehab
3:17
But you say you have tapes of Virginia Dufrae. We have recordings, phone recordings, saying nothing happened to Andrew
3:23
Let's come back to this photo. And that is one of the reasons I've known about that for over two years
3:29
That is why I've been able to be so vocal. I want to come back to that. But can I come just on the photo
3:35
Prince Andrew was obviously asked about this by Emily Maitlis, asked about that picture. He told Emily Maitlis, that is a picture of me
3:42
It is definitely me. You say it's not definitely him. No, but he knows the story
3:48
Now, he knew it was a photo of a photo of a photo. So when he did that interview, I hadn't even started looking into this stuff
3:54
So he just... Look, you look at that picture and you're like
3:59
looks like him, but it's basically not his body. So that is Jeffrey Epstein's body
4:03
But it's his head. You say it's a collage. With his head. But the head, I've got an example of how the collage was done
4:10
His head, but if you look at it, it's like it looks slightly... The scale is a little wrong
4:15
Right. That head looks... You have to have a really trained eye to see this stuff
4:21
Well, there's a forensic photography experts have looked at that photo and said it's not been doctored
4:26
It is a real picture. Well, the ones I'm in touch with, I have a lot of forensic experts that will say it is
4:31
So why hasn't someone gone and found where the picture of his head was originally from that was apparently cut and pasted
4:40
It was in a private photo album. We've been looking. So the guy that basically says he's the one that cut the head out, it was from these private photo albums
4:48
So where is that original picture that you say this came from or his head came from
4:53
Well, we've been trying to find it, but it was in a private photo album
4:57
But that should be easy to find, at least by him, wouldn't it? He would be very easily able to get that to you
5:03
I've actually tried with some royal biographers that have been trying to find that particular head
5:09
The problem is you can't really find it because they pixelated the eyes
5:14
So like if you actually try and find that image, you can't because the eyes have been changed
5:19
If you look at the eyes, the eyes look weird. You're saying it's a collage image done before really the advent of serious AI technology where this could have played a part
5:29
So relatively easily traceable. Basically, the scale of that room is completely real
5:34
It's a real room. The scale is exact. the people have been inserted the size of the bodies in that room literally like i wish the
5:46
owner of the house would just be like okay guys come on in and just see it because it's a bit like
5:51
when you meet an actor for the first time you know i lived in hollywood so it's like you have
5:56
this perception of these actors being tall and hunky and stuff and then you meet them in real
6:01
life you're like oh my god they're so short and they're little and it's like the guy's up to my
6:05
shoulder that is sort of the experience that I had at Kinnerton Street this is the house that you
6:10
you went to yeah where the picture was taken as a buyer to get in and you say the the measurements
6:15
don light up line up it impossible to get three people in there it it like I have I have videos of me actually measuring and it corroborates with Glenn old house manager of what measurement she has And that banister is 60 centimetres
6:30
which is less than two laptops. And that sidewall is 55, and his body comes out about 15
6:38
Yeah. You literally just can't fit them. The problem is... It doesn't matter what scale, it doesn't matter what angle
6:44
It's not... Yeah. No lens. They don't fit in the space. if you cut the space out on the ground
6:50
they do not fit doesn't matter the lens and all of that rubbish
6:55
the difficulty of the argument that you're presenting is you don't know where the original picture is from
7:00
of his head could be found but apparently can't be no it was apparently in a private photo album
7:05
so who knows I mean that should be something he could find presumably if he was keen to prove his innocence
7:09
no it was an album that was not he did not give that album so just to take the sort of the Occam's razor principle
7:15
Prince Andrew is friends with Ghislaine Maxwell and Jeffrey Epstein he attended Jeffrey Epstein's
7:23
Manhattan apartment after Epstein had been found guilty of sexual abuse and paedophilia
7:30
he spent four days at that apartment he was clearly friends with Ghislaine Maxwell
7:34
he hung around with those two and young women who were brought to the various
7:39
events, he went to the island it seems like it's very hard to say that he wasn't there
7:42
I knew, yeah Yeah, look, I've always said in all these interviews I did
7:47
I was around that scene. I never saw underage girls. Like, they were like, I would have been at least 20 at that point
7:58
early 20s, and I definitely didn't see sort of 15 or 16-year-olds
8:03
But there were underage girls. I mean, even if you didn't see them. I didn't see them. Well, I think in one interview you suggested that Virginia Dufresne..
8:10
She was 17 when she met Galen. She was not 15 now
8:14
She first lied. Her first time when she pretended 15. And actually, no, it turned out she was 17
8:22
Sorry, just go back. You said that Virginia Giuffre had suggested, or at least you were saying about her
8:28
that she had watched or taken photos as a 12-year-old was raped
8:33
So there were young girls there. Oh, you mean she watched it
8:37
You said that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, she did. Well, I was... So there were young girls
8:41
I was talking to a girl, which I haven't met in real life
8:45
So I don't know if she's like, you know, one of these people that make stuff up
8:50
But she did say to me, Virginia watched her being raped. You say you were around this scene
8:59
In what way were you around it? You were presented as... I was a socialite. I was like the socialite of London at the time
9:05
So you were young. I was out. I was going to all the glamorous events. I was, you know, I was I was in the newspapers like pretty much on a daily basis back then
9:14
Did you think that there was something pretty weird and seedy about older, very wealthy men hanging around with lots of very young, attractive women
9:25
No, because I was a model and that is what the scene is like. It's like you go to Saint-Tropez if you've ever hung out in Saint-Tropez in the summer
9:34
That's what it's like. You have these wealthy guys and they'll have a nice yacht and they'll have a lot of attractive people staying on the yacht
9:43
And a lot of them will be models like the girls. You stayed at Epstein's place in Manhattan
9:48
He didn't look like any different to another rich guy that you would have with people around
9:56
Although I wonder whether the difference for you was when you were at Epstein's place
10:01
you say you felt exceptionally uncomfortable and you felt like you were being watched yeah that was
10:07
that was weird yeah I do I do remember that and um you know maybe it was some sort of paranoia but
10:13
I remember I I was staying at one of the apartments and um you know I was there for a while but I then
10:21
moved into my friend's apartment who used to live right next to the Carlisle who was actually a
10:26
mutual friend of the lens as well um but you were being taped i don't know i didn't well there are
10:32
existing of inside the the house that's that's what want that's what um uh cash patel and the
10:37
attorney general of the united states right so that then sort of that got me a bit paranoid when
10:41
i did read that if that video were to be released what might it show based on your experience of
10:45
being in that house i don't know wouldn't it show wouldn't it show a lot of young women
10:50
having sex with or were in sexual contact with older, richer guys
10:55
Presumably that's the point. So when I was in an apartment, I wasn't in the house
11:00
I was in an apartment on my own. So my video is not going to be very interesting
11:06
But that must have gone on. I mean, of course that went on. That's the point, isn't it? Right
11:11
Surely. Of having young, very attractive women knocking around an apartment with older, richer guys
11:17
they're going to have sex with them. well the apartment situation i think was different because they were sort of like model flats so
11:26
and there was no guys in the apartment like i had my own apartment there was no one in it
11:31
with me but i think that was because i was a young girl in new york i i maybe i was about 19 or
11:38
something and i didn't know new york very well back then so maybe i was just like a bit paranoid
11:43
and scared being in a new city so I ended up at my friend's place it's a bit with respect it's a
11:49
bit naive though isn't it to think that's not what these rich older men are after with these young
11:54
beautiful women yeah it is naive and you know as being a model obviously like I saw a lot of that
12:02
because you know the guys they want you around because you're a model and then it brings people
12:09
in so you know the more i had no idea at the time but model agencies would like be paid by
12:15
restaurants or clubs to bring all the models because then that makes the guys come right so
12:21
they want to go to make the rich guys come the powerful guys it makes them want to go to that
12:27
club prince andrew's not a club guy he's not he's never he's never had alcohol
12:32
prince and he was not at tram with virginia jufrae but he went to that tram she would not
12:38
of, she is a tramp, she would have got into tramp but she wouldn have got in You can wear that clothing to tramp You cannot Now maybe because the rules are different it been sold But back when Johnny Gold head Tramp you could not look like a Tramp
12:55
Why are you so supportive of Prince Andrew as his ex-girlfriend? You must be the most supportive ex-girlfriend in history. Right
13:02
And it's not really him. For me, it's like about the Queen being screwed over
13:07
It's about this country being screwed over. But by who? By what
13:11
whoever set him up you know and he chose to go himself to see jeffrey epstein no but i'm saying
13:18
who set him up in that photo who set him up with that picture in the park you know this i i see this
13:26
as a monarchy takedown what megan is doing similar things she's doing the same thing with harry let's
13:32
leave let's leave megan for a moment yeah um if you said this is an attempt to destroy the british
13:38
monarchy you think yes it is uh anyone it could be a cia thing it's it's it's it's foreign government
13:48
doing this but you have no evidence of this so or this is the paparazzi in a in a in new york
13:56
knowing a pedophile billionaire is hanging around with a member of the royal family
13:59
and and inexplicably that member of the royal family goes to his house for four days with young
14:05
Jeffrey Epstein had how many passports in his safe? He was found with six or seven passports
14:11
And the islands and the jets. How do you think he's got all those passports? I have no idea
14:17
I have no idea how he got his money. I mean, there's a great question to understand about how rich he was
14:21
But that's a question for Jeffrey Epstein. The question around Prince Andrew is, you are saying that he has been set up
14:26
he's been wrongfully implicated, and it's all very unfair. And, you know, I only started looking into this three and a half years ago
14:35
and it was investigative journalist, independent one. She reached out to me on Instagram and she said
14:42
you know, I was in the courtroom at Ghislaine's trial. Don't believe these girls, there's something more to this
14:49
And her and I have become good friends now. Actually, we were together in Washington
14:55
the night when the news came in about Virginia, which was like really a crazy experience
15:01
because of all the people I was with. I was with Jessica. but going back to it okay do I think she killed herself I think she probably did kill herself
15:12
you know if she didn't kill herself who did you know the family all want money she was no use to
15:21
the lawyers anymore but you know as far as what's been going on I know the FBI had reached out to
15:28
her and knocked on her door recently and they were supposed to be telling her about the recordings
15:34
that we have on her. So I think it was a bunch of stuff
15:40
and obviously her husband, we don't know much about the husband. Her father says that Jouffre showed him
15:48
the picture that you say is doctored before it went in the mail. Of course, it doesn't matter
15:53
Whatever she showed him was the doctored photo. It's not a real image
16:00
But if it weren't a real image, if it weren't a real image, You would be able to show that very clearly
16:05
The scale isn't a real scale. Based on the tech at the time. Look at their heights
16:10
She's five foot, if she's five foot three, or even give her an extra inch and make her five foot four
16:15
with three inch heels on, she's still going to be like here on
16:20
Now, Ghislaine is rotting in jail right now for 20 years for basically statements that were not true
16:27
By, you say, by the girls that were alleging they were chaffered? No, the only reason, the only reason Glenn is in jail is because of Karen and Adriano
16:36
Virginia didn't stand up in trial. Virginia, just to be really clear about this, Virginia is so not credible
16:44
The US government did not pick her to stand up in the courtroom
16:50
She wasn't picked. Although she was the poster girl for the whole Glenn Maxwell Epstein trial
16:56
she was not picked by the US government to stand up there and say something
17:00
because she would screw it up. Do you say you feel sorry for Maxwell
17:05
You clearly, I think it's fair to say, feel sorry for Andrew. Yeah, because he lost his life
17:11
You know, this has been going on for... Well, he's a member of the royal family
17:15
and able to stay in all the palaces that he wishes and travel around. Yeah, but he's a military guy
17:19
I think probably one of the worst things for him is, like, losing the military titles
17:23
He's the only one of the family that actually, like, fought in a war. It's an unbelievably poor decision by a member of the royal family to hang around with a paedophile billionaire
17:34
I know. Did you ever say anything to him? Did you say, what the hell are you doing
17:38
Get away from this bad guy. No, I mean, you know, to me I'm just so puzzled, you know
17:43
But it's like, why didn't he have just better people around him
17:51
Or himself to make that decision. Yeah. Why wasn't he? You know him
17:55
I don't know, I've never spoken a word to the man. Why isn't he going, this is probably
17:59
probably should steer clear of this bloke. Yeah, and I think he did think like that
18:03
But he went anyway. But why, but he's very stubborn. And I think that's probably like one of the
18:08
you know, really not a good quality because, you know, same thing
18:12
stubborn, wanted to do that interview. And I remember when he did that interview
18:18
and I thought, well, and at this point, I really didn't know that much of the story
18:22
I was like, is he guilty? Is he not guilty? like I hadn't I hadn't researched it at all I remember saying this in 2019 I was like that
18:29
that photo does not look real to me I've always I've always said the same thing I've never
18:36
backtracked in anything that I've said no but I said about him doing that interview I was like
18:41
there is no way someone like him and his position would he do an interview
18:46
if he's guilty there's no way well hopefully he'll do I mean if he wants to he could do more
18:53
I don't think he's ever going to do another interview. Do you know what I mean? Two final thoughts
18:58
You talk about this potential conspiracy from foreign governments to bring down the monarchy
19:03
It happens all the time. Like it this stuff you know internal wars that are going on like you know China and the US whatever If it like whatever happened at Heathrow recently where suddenly there the power cut and the thing
19:18
You know, we don't see war as it doesn't always have to be tanks and guns and war planes
19:24
This is grey zone warfare to bring down the monarchy. This is a different kind of war, yeah
19:28
So who else do you think is implicated? It's a lot of these anti-monarchist groups that are trying to turn us into a..
19:35
Well, hang on a second. That's not my question. Well, how do you think if they want to turn us into a republic, what's the easiest way to do that
19:41
So you create all this negative press about the royal families, all these crazy young people
19:47
Arguably, Victoria, they've done it. Prince Andrew has himself done it. He chose to go. He has been responsible for the tarnishing of the reputation of Her Majesty the Queen and the monarchy as a whole
19:57
It's his fault. Look, I you know, he's he really like messed up for sure
20:01
So the two questions I want to ask you finally is, who else is going to be implicated
20:06
In your experience of hanging around with this crowd, which other people are going to be implicated in this by being on the island, by being in the mansion that is yet to come out
20:17
I don't know. And this is a thing. Like, Gylen is in jail for doing what exactly on her own
20:23
Well, trafficking young girls. But trafficking to who? To the... Where are all the guys
20:28
she's been in there for what five, four years? Well the guys aren't going to
20:33
throw themselves forward to say it was me just come and arrest me now
20:37
but you know of people who are going to be implicated in this Do I? No, I know
20:43
the people that were falsely accused by Virginia but no, I don't know who's going to be implicated
20:48
Do you ever, I mean you say that you've picked this up relatively recently
20:55
three years or so ago. Yeah, three and a half years Do you ever think you might be wrong
21:00
Do you ever think that you've got this wrong? No, and having got actually into Kinnerton Street
21:06
do we want to see any of the pictures? Sure, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Just to kind of show you
21:12
Just to actually kind of really see the small area where... So that is the original fake
21:26
And... So you went into the house where this photo was taken because you posed as a buyer
21:31
Yeah, and it took me a year and a half to get in. Yeah. Do you want to just show it to the camera
21:38
Oh, right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It took a long time to get in there because the owners obviously, like, you know, to be honest
21:48
like the owners actually need to realise, like, if I can prove that this never happened in their house
21:53
they'll be able to sell the house probably a lot more easily um and you think you can but that's
21:58
not you i'm confused because that's not what you're trying to prove you're not trying to prove it wasn't there you're trying to prove that it was there happened yeah but in that place because it
22:05
was so small i'm i'm trying to prove that photo is not a real photo it's not a real image so just
22:10
just show that to the camera this is um this girl is very very petite in that um she didn't want her
22:17
face in there so i've cut it but that's the original carpet and how it was and there to there
22:25
is a 61 inches there and this is 60 centimeters wide and if you show what you say is the the
22:34
doctored photo so well this is 60 centimeters wide which is there's the measuring tape it's
22:39
it's small it's less than two laptops um now he's supposed to have fitted
22:44
so you see the depth of it is not far that's 60 centimeters that's that little bit there
22:52
um this wall here is 55 centimeters so what i actually want to try and do
22:59
is um you know if we can't get back into the house is try to recreate it and your point is
23:07
um my point is your point is they wouldn't be able to have fitted so this is this is then okay i will
23:14
find you one second and then that's tim so my friend is a photographer he's been a photographer
23:21
for for 30 years we met on one of the first photo shoots i ever did i bumped into him after i hadn't
23:29
seen him in a few years just flip it around for a second yeah so so just to show you the height
23:35
comparison so it's a bit harder to see because this is all the lines of all blurred um it's
23:44
done on purpose like that so it's harder to see i'm sure but his head to here so he's he's five
23:53
foot eight he said he's five foot nine when the hair is spiky and all of that and he's actually
24:00
he's shorter than Galen but Galen is quite low down in that. Do you know if any renovation work
24:09
has happened on the house? No the only thing that's changed is the paint. Right so there's
24:13
no structural work done on the house? No structural work at all so like everything is as is
24:21
and having spoken to Galen's lawyer the house was only ever all the same colour it was like a cream
24:30
color you've so you've shown what you say is is the evidence that you think we show this wrong
24:34
let's wait for those phone calls to emerge you say you're going to publicize them
24:39
and let's speak again as and when that happens yeah that's all right yeah you see basically um
24:46
the guy who's on the phone calls he um he said he's gonna have to like probably go into hiding
24:53
when they come out and uh we're not going to hiding but it's like you know it's it's a lot
24:59
of pressure right you know having something like that but if the I guess uh if the truth is important
25:05
to him to you yeah you'll find a way of making those public presumably yeah and and look things
25:10
are better now than they were a year ago he was put on a gag order by a judge and um in the southern
25:17
district of Illinois so I did an interview with him about two years ago literally as he had tapping
25:24
on his door that they were gonna threaten to arrest him. Because one of the other girls
25:31
because we started putting out her text messages on Instagram
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