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Emmy Award Winning Director Stanley Nelson Talks ‘Tulsa Burning: The 1921 Race Massacre’
Jun 8, 2021
Stanley Nelson on Sway I know The Morning speaking on the Tulsa Massacre.
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Emmy Award Winning Director Stanley Nelson Talks ‘Tulsa Burning: The 1921 Race Massacre’ https://youtu.be/sA8XIh7SwiI
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0:00
we need to do something about what
0:01
happened in tulsa
0:03
there could not be any justice
0:06
to there is proper respect restitution
0:09
that repair
0:13
we have them here db
0:19
mr nelson how you doing
0:22
i'm doing fine how are you welcome to
0:25
the show mr nelson we got stanley nelson
0:27
on the line with us right now hello
0:32
hi how are you welcome welcome to our
0:35
show
0:36
uh we really appreciate you coming on
0:39
uh you've done so much amazing work in
0:41
your career
0:42
you know and i've been a fan of yours
0:45
without even knowing it was you
0:46
you know freedom riders jonestown the
0:49
life and death of
0:50
people's temple i watched that sweet
0:52
honey in the rock raise your voice
0:54
the murder of emmett till um i i've
0:56
watched a lot of your work
0:58
and didn't realize that it was you so
0:59
forgive me sir but it's an honor to have
1:01
you on this show
1:03
yes oh thank you so much i really
1:05
appreciate it
1:06
absolutely um let's let's talk about
1:09
let's talk about this
1:10
you know a lot of folks what we found
1:13
talking about
1:14
the you know tulsa burning the 1921 race
1:16
massacre
1:17
we found out mr nelson that a lot of
1:19
people weren't aware
1:20
of what happened in tulsa did you find
1:23
that to be true as you started to build
1:25
on this documentary
1:27
yeah i mean i think one of the pieces of
1:29
the story is that the
1:31
massacre was completely covered up so
1:34
that you know the the
1:35
the black paper was was burnt out um and
1:39
you know was not publishing and and the
1:42
white papers did not
1:43
uh report on the massacre at all um
1:46
it wasn't taught in oklahoma schools it
1:49
wasn't taught
1:50
you know in oklahoma universities um so
1:53
much less anywhere else in the country
1:55
so um
1:56
it's not surprising in many ways that so
1:59
many people don't know about the
2:01
massacre how about when did you learn
2:04
about it how did you learn about it did
2:06
you learn about it at school was it your
2:07
parents
2:08
that told you i can't remember when i
2:11
first learned but it was probably
2:13
it was after school schools uh you know
2:16
i mean i've been making documentary
2:17
films for about 40 years now
2:20
so um in many historical documentaries
2:22
so
2:23
in researching the documentaries i've
2:26
you know
2:27
i learned a little bit about the
2:28
massacre then about three years ago we
2:31
did a film called
2:32
the boss about uh black on
2:34
entrepreneurship
2:36
you know it covered kind of 150 years
2:38
from the civil war up until today
2:41
uh and at that point we did a
2:44
seven-minute segment
2:45
in the film about tulsa about the the
2:48
race massacre
2:50
and at that point i realized that it was
2:52
a much larger story than can be covered
2:55
in seven minutes and it really
2:57
uh was a story that deserved to be its
3:00
own film
3:01
uh and i became very interested in
3:03
making uh this film
3:04
yeah and we're very grateful that you
3:06
did mr nelson this is tracy thank you so
3:08
much for joining us this morning
3:10
would you mind going into
3:13
the how you navigate the research
3:16
for this and just how much and where
3:20
it came from yeah i mean i i think that
3:24
that
3:24
really was interesting about uh you know
3:26
the story of tulsa and greenwood and the
3:28
massacre
3:29
is that there is so much um
3:32
documentation
3:33
there's so much footage um so you know
3:36
greenwood was
3:37
uh probably the the biggest and the
3:40
baddest and the best
3:42
uh of the african-american towns in the
3:44
in the west
3:45
and um someone in the community you know
3:48
in in 1919 1920
3:51
1921 uh with a movie camera filmed
3:54
uh you know african americans you know
3:56
sitting on their swings outside their
3:58
homes and building their churches
4:00
and their businesses and also there were
4:03
uh great still pictures of the community
4:06
so one of the things that that it made
4:09
possible
4:10
was for audiences you know of the film
4:12
to really see
4:13
the community community not just talk
4:15
about it
4:16
but also uh the you know people took
4:19
pictures and
4:19
and uh film of the aftermath
4:23
of the massacre so you see the town
4:26
flattened
4:26
uh you see uh the white mob
4:30
with guns uh approaching
4:33
uh greenwood so uh that's that and
4:37
that's really amazing because you know
4:38
you don't see very much
4:40
uh of african americans you know that
4:43
early on
4:45
um except you know when they would go to
4:46
a photographer and get
4:48
all dressed up in their best clothes and
4:50
you know pose
4:51
but but these are our you know films and
4:54
still pictures of of the community
4:56
so so that that was really um essential
4:59
but the other thing you know is the film
5:02
it goes back and forth in time so it
5:05
it it's about the building of greenwood
5:08
and the destruction of greenwood
5:10
in 1921 but also about uh you know today
5:14
um you know we made the film in the over
5:16
the last year so we made the film
5:18
in the shadow of george floyd and and
5:21
and uh you know the protests
5:23
and black lives matter and um that
5:26
that's essential to the story and also
5:29
in 2020 the
5:32
tulsa sea of tulsa um started
5:35
uh excavating and looking for remains
5:39
of of african americans who were killed
5:41
in the massacre because
5:43
um many african-americans were just were
5:45
dumped in mass graves
5:47
and unmarked graves and so um the
5:51
ongoing uh with the film
5:54
about 1921 uh is another film
5:57
you know rolled in into one um of of
6:00
looking for
6:01
the remains in 2020 2021
6:06
what what made you um by the way we have
6:09
stanley nelson is on the line with the
6:10
citizens you want to talk to him he's
6:12
one of the directors of the
6:14
tulsa bernie the 1921 race massacre
6:17
it's on the history channel uh right now
6:20
and then also the doc originally aired
6:23
on may 30th
6:25
uh but those if you missed it you could
6:27
catch up on history.com
6:29
if you have cable to be on through 6 20
6:31
on june 29th and then you could catch it
6:34
on hulu starting june 30th in the beach
6:36
air that's a two-part series
6:38
what made you decide uh to do this
6:40
documentary
6:43
well so many things i mean one it's such
6:45
an important story it's such an
6:46
unknown story um you know we we knew
6:50
um when we started over a year ago that
6:52
the 100th anniversary was coming up
6:55
uh the 100th commemoration it's not
6:57
really an anniversary you know
6:59
anniversary
7:00
kind of um implicates or or implies
7:04
you know celebration but it's the
7:06
commemorative commemoration of the
7:08
massacre
7:09
um and and you know as we started we
7:12
realized that it had so many echoes with
7:14
today
7:15
you know with where african americans
7:16
are today with the murder of george
7:18
floyd and so many other murders
7:20
that have taken place over the you know
7:22
last years
7:24
okay uh stan stanley nelson is with us
7:26
db you wanted to jump in
7:28
yeah sure um uh stanley uh
7:31
as a filmmaker these days i feel like
7:33
you you have
7:34
somewhat more challenges than filmmakers
7:37
did
7:38
uh prior to you know social media and
7:40
the internet and things of that nature
7:41
with
7:42
attention spans being so low and you
7:44
also have these sites with
7:46
aggregated reviews that some people may
7:48
or may not pay attention to
7:50
and so i wanted to know if do you find
7:52
it challenging to get younger audiences
7:54
to want to watch
7:56
these informative historical
7:57
documentaries um as
7:59
you know some people don't even want to
8:00
sit through something like avengers end
8:02
game because it's three hours so
8:03
um is it tough to find a way and
8:06
i hate to call it entertaining but uh a
8:09
way for younger audiences to want to
8:11
watch
8:11
these types of documentaries uh you know
8:14
i mean i i don't think so i mean i think
8:16
one of the one of
8:17
you know the missions of of documentary
8:20
filmmakers is is
8:21
to also to entertain you know and and to
8:24
hold an audience
8:25
i think it is riveting a riveting story
8:28
i
8:28
i think that you know a lot of times we
8:30
give
8:31
you know younger people younger
8:33
generation kind of uh you know
8:35
a short shift you know and and we talk
8:37
about their attention span but i think
8:39
you know um they younger people go to
8:42
movies
8:43
or used to go to movies you know watch
8:45
movies watch movies on tv
8:47
and you know again one of one of our
8:49
mission
8:50
as filmmakers and one of the things that
8:52
i hold dearly is that
8:54
you know it we're also um trying to
8:57
entertain
8:58
you know we're trying to tell an honest
9:00
uh real story
9:02
um you know well-documented story but
9:04
also
9:05
you know we know that that people are
9:06
sitting there with the remote control in
9:08
their hand
9:09
and can you know go go to you know
9:12
reruns of
9:13
you know luke cage or friends or
9:15
whatever they want to watch
9:16
you know uh at that click a little you
9:19
know
9:20
a button so you know that that's part of
9:22
that's part of what we hold dear
9:24
um so you know um no i i don't i don't
9:27
i don't i don't really subscribe to the
9:30
fact that that that younger people
9:32
um you know aren't interested i think i
9:34
think young people really are
9:36
um and and really interested in in in
9:39
history yeah and you know really you
9:41
know
9:42
it's kind of mirrored with with you know
9:45
so many young people out in the streets
9:47
you know over the over the last year
9:50
okay uh this is a great documentary by
9:53
the way citizens so make sure you check
9:55
it out uh
9:56
tulsa burning the 1921 race massacre
9:59
i was speaking with peabody and emmy
10:01
award winning director stanley nelson
10:03
and recently we saw president biden call
10:06
on americans to face what he called dark
10:08
sides of history
10:10
on the anniversary of the tulsa massacre
10:12
and the white house also announced
10:13
tuesday that the administration has
10:15
taken several steps saying that
10:16
narrowing the racial wealth gap
10:19
um in your opinion you know just seeing
10:21
so much and documenting so much is rare
10:24
that we see any presidents acknowledge
10:26
what took place in tulsa how big was
10:28
that for him to actually be there and
10:29
make these comments
10:32
i mean i i think it's big i i think in
10:35
so many ways you know
10:36
it it draws the interest of of certain
10:40
sections of population that might not uh
10:43
know the the story of greenwood and the
10:45
story of tulsa
10:46
or might not i think think that they're
10:48
interested you know so that
10:50
when biden goes there you know it it has
10:53
to be covered
10:54
you know it has to be covered you know
10:56
um by msnbc and then you know and and
10:59
abc
11:00
cbs and this is the networks you know
11:02
and
11:03
and and also hopefully it's covered by
11:05
fox news
11:06
you know i'm not sure if it is but
11:08
hopefully it is so i i think that
11:10
that that that it's a it's a it's a good
11:13
thing
11:13
and you know it the the what happened
11:17
in tulsa the massacre i think needs to
11:19
be
11:20
you know attacked from all different
11:22
sides right
11:23
so people learned about it from from
11:26
watching you know watchmen
11:28
people learned about it from watching
11:30
lovecraft country people learn about it
11:32
from
11:32
from our dock people learn about it
11:35
because
11:35
biden goes there you know so i i think
11:38
it's all good and it's all
11:40
it's all needed and it's all relevant
11:42
you know we can't
11:44
i don't think uh talk too much
11:47
about what happened in tulsa because
11:49
it's not only tulsa it says so much
11:52
about this country and it wasn't only
11:54
tulsa
11:55
that was burnt out you know it was us so
11:58
many other african-american communities
12:00
and african-american businesses you know
12:03
tulsa is is really important because it
12:06
was probably the worst
12:08
racial massacre of african americans in
12:10
this country but it happened
12:11
over and over again you know with
12:13
communities or with single businesses
12:16
being destroyed
12:17
or african-americans being just driven
12:19
out of business because of jealousy
12:22
and so the the more we learn and know
12:24
about it the better
12:26
okay um we got a caller on the line from
12:29
tot
12:30
from oklahoma who used to live in tulsa
12:32
goes by the name of floyd floyd grand
12:34
rises
12:35
hey how floyd guys doing
12:38
uh sway heather db
12:42
tracy love you guys love you long time
12:45
listener
12:46
um this way i remember being a teenager
12:49
watching you on mtv rap saying hey man
12:51
there's somebody that looks like me
12:53
so i appreciate what you guys do thank
12:55
you sir thank you
12:57
i watch the different um documentaries i
13:00
think it's an awesome thing
13:01
getting the education out there the
13:04
awareness
13:05
um one thing is being a professional
13:07
black that
13:08
that i saw that i wish i i could have
13:11
seen them do more of
13:13
is speak and at least put the microphone
13:17
and allow them to say no comment of the
13:19
people who are actually in power
13:21
in this state senators uh inhofe
13:24
uh rep tom cole mark mullane
13:28
some of the different congressional reps
13:31
and some of the different senators
13:33
because they're the ones who actually
13:34
will the power in the state
13:36
to first acknowledge it and then also
13:39
bring about some actual change
13:41
so i just you know with all the
13:44
awareness having the celebrities having
13:47
the intellectuals talk about it bring
13:49
awareness speak into the
13:50
to the survivors to the family members i
13:53
just wish that we would
13:55
put the microphone in front of the
13:56
people that actually have power we know
13:58
which way they lean and they may not for
14:02
whatever reason
14:03
want to discuss it but but kind of
14:05
forcing them to
14:06
either say something about it or not say
14:09
anything about it i think would speak
14:10
volumes
14:14
that's interesting yeah yeah you have
14:16
any conversations with any of the
14:18
senators here in the state or or
14:20
with the reps while you're filming this
14:22
documentary did you reach out to them
14:25
uh yeah i mean the the documentary
14:28
really isn't
14:29
about you know um what's happening in
14:32
in the state in terms of reparations or
14:35
the state commissions um because that's
14:37
that's kind of
14:38
you know and a shifting stand you know
14:41
the uh it it's changing every day
14:45
and so that you know we have to lock the
14:47
documentary you know months ago
14:49
uh or a month ago at least you know to
14:52
to to put it on
14:53
so that that that's really not the focus
14:56
of the doc but there's a has
14:58
been a lot of articles and a lot has
15:00
been said
15:01
in in the past week or so about
15:04
um you know where where the state is and
15:07
uh you know the commission and kind of
15:10
the infighting that's going that's going
15:13
on um
15:14
with it but that's really not the focus
15:16
of the documentary
15:18
okay hey floyd but i like your point
15:21
though
15:21
i like your point um and maybe that's
15:24
the documentary you got gotta start
15:27
i i would love to i would love to
15:30
okay you know stanley busy all right
15:34
you're a citizen though floyd in the
15:36
morning you know uh mr nelson uh
15:39
i want to say thank you again for being
15:40
on the show this is great work we've
15:41
been trying to really drive people to
15:43
watch tosa burning the 1921 race
15:45
massacre
15:46
and then also um i got a chance to
15:48
really meet and sit down and do an
15:50
interview with the philanthropist
15:51
russell westbrook
15:53
i'm curious to how did he get involved
15:56
he was involved early early on i mean
15:58
one of the things that that russell said
16:01
was that
16:01
um you know that was one that was the
16:04
film that he wanted to make
16:05
when he began his production company and
16:08
you know he had spent so
16:09
so many years in in oklahoma
16:12
um and so that he was really a driving
16:15
force he was on the film before i
16:16
i got attached to it and you know i
16:19
think that that russell's name
16:20
opened a lot of doors when we were
16:22
shopping the film around and we
16:23
finally landed on the history channel
16:26
but i think that
16:27
uh you know russell was really
16:28
instrumental in getting the film made
16:30
okay um tracy you good yeah well before
16:34
mr nelson peace is out i want to see if
16:37
i can squeeze in one thing i'm curious
16:39
when you have to do such a deep dive
16:42
into
16:43
a massacre you know or any other dark
16:45
side of american history
16:47
do you have to do any preparations for
16:49
your mental health because
16:51
there's potential that you can be
16:53
triggered by something or do you allow
16:55
your emotions to be
16:56
a team member in a project
17:00
um i think one of the things you know as
17:02
a filmmaker is that
17:04
is that the filmmaker side of me takes
17:06
over
17:07
um and you know i i'm telling a story
17:09
and i'm telling a story that that
17:11
happened a hundred years ago and i'm
17:12
just trying to
17:13
to tell it um with uh as much accuracy
17:18
and and and emotion as i possibly can
17:21
i'm trying to
17:22
you know we want people to be moved by
17:24
the film we want audiences to be moved
17:26
and so
17:27
you know we're kind of concentrating on
17:29
on that
17:30
um and so in a way you know i i
17:34
i it's not really triggering me in a way
17:36
i'm just so
17:38
honored to be able to tell this story
17:40
and i think i think that
17:42
i i feel like it's such a uh
17:45
not a burden but you know um it's really
17:48
necessary that that i tell it
17:50
you know in an emotional way in an
17:52
accurate way so i have to get out of the
17:54
way of myself
17:55
and let the story take over yup okay
17:58
uh mr stanley nelson big round of
18:00
applause for him director of the
18:02
documentary along with
18:03
marco williams tulsa burning the 1921
18:06
race massacre
18:07
uh on the history channel you also go to
18:10
history.com
18:11
if you have cable to be on through june
18:13
29th and then you can catch it on hulu
18:15
starting june 30th to be a two-part
18:17
series
18:18
mr nelson thank you for joining us today
18:20
we appreciate you and your work
18:22
well thank you so much for having me on
18:24
all right absolutely continued success
18:27
man and next project we'll have you on
18:28
again brother
18:29
all right all right my man give it up
18:32
for stanley nelson citizens come on
18:48
you
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