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Biggie’s Son, CJ Wallace & Justin Tinsley Talk His 50th Birthday, New Book, Tupac, Diddy & More
May 21, 2022
In celebration of the Notorious BIG’s 50th birthday, his son CJ Wallace and author Justin Tinsley stop by Sway In The Morning to talk about the new biography of the late great rapper.
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Biggie’s Son, CJ Wallace & Justin Tinsley Talk His 50th Birthday, New Book, Tupac, Diddy & More
https://youtu.be/YN-0aF0BwZo
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0:00
nobody can teach me how to be
0:02
the best rapper better than
0:04
the best rapper
0:06
so i'm handling that
0:08
yo
0:09
that was um
0:13
[ __ ]
0:14
that was like a
0:16
oh what one of the what was the second
0:18
to last conversation i had with the
0:20
notorious b.i.g okay aka biggie smalls
0:24
aka big
0:25
aka frank white the one and only
0:28
christopher wallace when you speak about
0:30
goats
0:34
you speak about goats you have to
0:35
mention his name greatest of all time
0:37
christopher wallace you have to say his
0:39
name
0:40
in a short period of time that he was in
0:42
this music business the music that he
0:44
made we talk about 25 years after his
0:47
untimely demise as if it was made
0:49
yesterday had to be
0:52
that's how prolific he was a movement
0:55
are you kidding me i was in oakland
0:57
california dreaming of days i could walk
0:59
the streets of bernstein clinton hill
1:01
did you want to have those tims on did
1:03
you want tim's back then i did but they
1:05
hurt my knees
1:06
[Laughter]
1:08
i couldn't i couldn't assimilate east
1:10
coasters know how to walk in tim's way
1:12
i'm sorry
1:12
[Applause]
1:14
such a word smith
1:16
this man was right
1:18
his words were powerful
1:20
his wrote his words spearheaded a whole
1:23
era of music and mindset and thought
1:27
he made us want to be better
1:29
he made us feel like our dreams were
1:31
within our arm's reach it was all a
1:34
dream
1:35
and then you saw that dream manifest
1:37
absolutely we often talk about
1:39
manifestation in this era because we
1:42
become more emotionally intelligent and
1:44
progressive and so we are more in tune
1:46
with our feelings and we are more in
1:48
tune with our power
1:50
people like notorious b.i.g christopher
1:52
wallace had it
1:54
he had that light that makes us
1:56
celebrate him all day i got a picture of
1:58
him that we took when he first came to
2:00
the bay area
2:01
crazy
2:02
man now big looks sexy but do y'all see
2:05
me
2:18
come on man you got the light skin going
2:20
on
2:24
that's not why we're here today
2:27
you know but
2:28
that movement
2:29
in
2:30
in in those words and that artistic
2:33
expression
2:34
that he shared with the world
2:36
um was truly a gift from god this man in
2:39
my opinion was truly anointed his story
2:41
his journey if you saw the biopic if you
2:44
saw the docu-series if you read this
2:46
book it was all a dream biggie in the
2:48
world that made him and you learn about
2:50
his mother and her journey and how she
2:53
even made it to brooklyn uh from jamaica
2:56
to london and all the different places
2:58
she had to go to find peace and land in
3:01
the borough of brooklyn is amazing and
3:04
it all ties in if you look at the
3:05
context of what context of what's going
3:07
on in society at the time that this man
3:10
was born in the early 70s i'm a 70s baby
3:13
so i could get it that's why i could
3:15
relate to it when we start seeing this
3:17
man win through all the environmental
3:20
pressures and pitfalls that we would put
3:22
up against not just
3:24
psychological as well emotional as well
3:26
what we were experiencing in the society
3:29
at that time that this music came out
3:32
that's what made what he said in his
3:34
word so powerful because we always felt
3:36
like he's speaking for us
3:39
right
3:40
he's inspiring us
3:42
and i pray and i thank god that i was
3:45
able to be there
3:47
i was able to sit with this man and have
3:50
these conversations and we joked and my
3:52
brother and
3:54
took them around oakland all over the
3:56
bay area and cared for them because my
3:58
brother was official thorough individual
4:01
and so when our promotion company cj
4:03
imma talk to you about this at a
4:04
promotion company called streetwise
4:06
promotions
4:07
justin you may not know this because
4:09
it's not in the book for some reason
4:14
that's my fault second edition it's all
4:15
good it's a company um that i formed
4:18
with a man by the name of anthony
4:19
daltrey a.d who had a company called the
4:21
daughtry group and ingrid bess is
4:24
somebody who we all know and love now
4:26
was one of the first people we hired and
4:28
a person by the name of crystal isaacs
4:30
and a young lady by the name of bianca
4:32
and all these different people who went
4:34
on to be prominent in this game today we
4:36
were responsible for taking your dad
4:37
around protecting him feeding him
4:40
uh
4:41
you know accommodating his vices
4:45
all of it all right but in the process
4:47
him and i had some really solid
4:49
conversations he would ask me questions
4:51
right and at that time i didn't realize
4:53
how important that was
4:55
because he was reaching out for
4:57
understanding you know in the beginning
5:00
um the the climate was one way and
5:02
towards the end the climate became
5:04
another way because of what was going on
5:06
in the media provoked
5:08
so-called battle between east and west
5:10
coast and we got to talk and live
5:11
through it all right you know and i saw
5:13
your dad uh the week of his untimely
5:16
demise
5:17
and uh
5:18
your dad was one of the most comedic
5:20
people you would ever want to meet he
5:22
kept us laughing right little seeds was
5:25
there that's why my relationship with
5:26
seeds is so tight to this day i got
5:28
pictures of seeds when he looked like he
5:29
was in the sixth grade i don't even know
5:31
how he got into that
5:33
but i'm proud to say that
5:35
we have a really critically acclaimed
5:38
journalists with us today that did a
5:40
really thorough job in
5:42
documenting the life and times of
5:44
notorious big and adding context to it
5:46
that many don't really bother to dig
5:49
dive in and really remind us of what was
5:51
going on in that time and era and
5:53
perhaps what kind of informed the lyrics
5:56
that he gave the world and the behavior
5:58
that he exhibited to the world was based
6:00
on so i want to say give this man a
6:02
round of applause for excellent work the
6:03
one and only justin tinsley appreciate
6:06
it thank you thank you thank y'all thank
6:08
y'all thank you for having me for sure
6:09
absolutely and man we got his legacy
6:12
here with us right now
6:14
hey dog you know what this man he's no
6:16
slouch himself heather we saw him when
6:17
he broke out on the big screen playing
6:19
as the younger version of his father we
6:22
didn't know he had thespian skills i
6:24
know this man was an entrepreneur
6:26
putting things together big and heavy
6:28
into fashion this man hangs out in
6:30
oakland his name ring people call me
6:32
when you be in oakland you don't even
6:33
notice
6:34
and uh we just recently had to be handed
6:36
me the front page of the paper and saw
6:38
that mayor adams uh gave you a
6:41
proclamation mm-hmm you got it right
6:42
there sorry where is it
6:45
okay
6:46
that officially may 21st in the city of
6:50
new york yeah it's official yeah
6:52
christopher
6:54
yeah victoria's b.i.g
6:56
wallace what i'm talking about
6:58
that's what i'm talking about please
7:00
welcome cj to the show
7:04
hello man
7:06
thank you for having me come on man you
7:08
know i met you a few times every time i
7:09
see him i met you he don't even bother
7:11
now he said i don't remember before even
7:14
that's what everybody says man
7:16
i see this picture of you holding this
7:17
proclamation about your pops and i know
7:19
people always ask you the same things
7:21
about your pop right but what did it
7:23
feel like for you to be holding this
7:27
it still don't feel real yeah honestly
7:29
just even look like the fact that this
7:30
is real is crazy yeah it's it doesn't
7:33
feel real
7:34
yeah it's something we've always dreamed
7:36
of like you know my grandma my sister
7:38
and myself we always dreamed of
7:41
you know me and my sister joke like it's
7:43
big day it's always been big day so
7:46
this is big day people call march 9th
7:47
big day
7:48
ready to die anniversary life after
7:51
introvert but this is the official big
7:53
day so for this to yes sir it's it's set
7:56
in stone and it's written yeah
7:58
that's so crazy that's phenomenal it
8:01
doesn't feel real
8:02
that's phenomenal man we're still going
8:04
big would be 50 tomorrow that's crazy
8:06
wow that's crazy right
8:08
come on man
8:09
and you know it's it's the way new york
8:11
city is putting on today is incredible i
8:13
know it's the dinner tonight or the
8:15
empire state yeah um and there's so many
8:17
of i don't even know all the activities
8:19
that are taking place it's a lot it's a
8:21
bunch of stuff going on i'm just
8:24
scrambling wherever tiana's at that's
8:25
where i'm at
8:28
how's your grandma she's great she's
8:30
gonna be at the at the lighting ceremony
8:31
as well tonight okay i'm gonna be there
8:33
as well yeah so i'm coming through
8:35
beautiful um you can't just say lighting
8:37
ceremony let them know what they are
8:39
freaking lighting up are you kidding me
8:41
cj don't say lighting he's so they they
8:43
lighten up the empire state building
8:46
the empire state building
8:48
the empire state
8:50
and with what
8:54
i think it's going to represent the the
8:55
colors of the ready to die album ah
8:58
red white white and gold at the top
9:00
incredible
9:01
do you feel like through other people's
9:03
stories and reading these books and
9:04
hearing this energy from someone like me
9:06
or have the bee that does it it gives
9:08
you any deeper understanding of who your
9:10
dad was oh of course
9:11
of course
9:13
people like you said you brought it all
9:16
up his comedic energy his
9:18
you know his maturity
9:20
it just further establishes like
9:23
everything that i've been told so
9:25
for it to be keep coming from different
9:27
places
9:28
you know it's it's just scary the fact
9:31
that we were so we're so similar yeah
9:33
yeah and it's in the dna as well it's in
9:36
the dna you know and i think it's great
9:38
because we all want better worlds for
9:40
our kids you know i got a 23 year old
9:42
daughter who just graduated from nyu
9:44
um and i never got a chance to graduate
9:46
from college you know how i grew up in
9:49
oakland is way different from how she
9:51
grew up right you know in the private
9:53
schools and all of that different things
9:54
she's from l.a like you ula dude you
9:56
know um uh in your book in the chapter
9:59
that you wrote about cj yeah cj is a man
10:02
now yeah okay
10:04
last chapter in the book you mentioned
10:05
that uh big had did an uh interview with
10:07
eagle tripping shout out to ego tripping
10:10
sure maybe a week before his untimely
10:12
demise and one of the things he said is
10:14
he didn't want his son to have to grow
10:16
up selling drugs or picking up guns yeah
10:19
it was powerful man like one of the
10:21
people asked me about the process of
10:23
writing the book what i got out of and
10:24
what i learned the most and like what
10:25
moved me the most
10:27
uh one of the reasons i wanted to do
10:28
this book because i didn't want to just
10:30
focus on the highlights or the the
10:33
salacious parts or whatever you know
10:34
what i mean like yeah it's not just soda
10:36
little drugs beef or tupac and then you
10:37
know unfortunately lost his life in a
10:39
tragic manner yes some of those things
10:41
happen but it's not the entirety of the
10:43
story like i wanted to peel back the
10:44
layers and one of the most powerful
10:46
things for me was just
10:47
like he was
10:49
he was having like a spiritual awakening
10:51
in the last couple of months of his life
10:52
because you know he was in a car
10:53
accident and he was on a cane and he had
10:55
to go to rehab for a few months and he
10:57
just he gave he gave an interview he was
10:59
basically like yo i'm living too fast
11:01
like i can't be doing the things that i
11:03
was doing before and not thinking some
11:04
things are going to catch up with me and
11:06
he was like
11:06
uh the people who i spoke to people
11:09
excuse me people who i spoke to who were
11:11
talking to him those last weeks and
11:12
months of his life he would always be
11:14
like yo i can't wait to get back to new
11:15
york take tiana to the park i can't wait
11:17
to see cj and just like you know what i
11:19
mean take him to you know his practices
11:22
if you want to do that if you want to
11:23
you know join this club he can do that
11:25
like you mentioned the ego trip
11:27
interview one of the most powerful
11:28
things he was like yo i want cj to be
11:30
able to do whatever it is he wants to do
11:32
in life he don't have to pick up a
11:33
microphone he don't have to do that you
11:35
don't have to sell a drug because i've
11:36
done that and i'm here and
11:39
i think he was just grown in the
11:40
fatherhood and you know this spiritual
11:42
sense in a way that it was just so
11:44
beautiful to witness it's so beautiful
11:46
to hear from other people man it's like
11:48
that's the you know that's a that's an
11:49
element about
11:51
you know not even just biggie smalls
11:52
that's the element about christopher
11:53
wallace that then my eyes doesn't get
11:55
talked about nearly enough right that's
11:57
amazing
11:59
did you read the book cj i haven't read
12:01
it yet okay i haven't read it you should
12:03
have seen what he wrote about you didn't
12:04
even be fair
12:07
you gotta worry what he said about
12:09
[Laughter]
12:12
but one of the things um i know that
12:14
you're big on is entrepreneurship and
12:17
financial literacy right yeah and so
12:19
he's like the living manifestation yeah
12:21
he was talking about absolutely and big
12:23
in his lyrics made us
12:25
yearn for more you know made us want to
12:27
work for better work for bigger the way
12:29
he talked about opulence you know and
12:31
made it seem reachable to us it made us
12:34
very goal-oriented
12:36
right and so talk about your plight and
12:38
how you're taking that part of his
12:40
legacy
12:41
unbeknownst to you that you're doing
12:43
you're extending his legacy so what is
12:45
that about it's manifestation i feel
12:47
like he's spoken into existence because
12:49
i believe in you know just manifesting
12:51
your dreams into reality and you know
12:54
everything he talked about
12:55
basically sort of came to fruition and
12:58
you know which is why i don't like to
13:00
talk about negative things you know what
13:01
i'm saying he talked about a lot of
13:03
negative that's something my dad you
13:05
know the man who raised me todd russo i
13:06
talked about you know when you bring
13:08
that on it's going to come back
13:10
and you know
13:12
everything that i do is frank white at
13:13
this point you know you see it right
13:15
here yeah
13:26
[Laughter]
13:31
but yeah like
13:33
i feel like
13:34
if i wasn't doing this i wouldn't really
13:36
have a purpose you know
13:39
if it's not continuing the legacy taking
13:41
it to places that it's never been
13:43
um you know
13:45
branching off talking about those
13:46
stories that don't get talked about
13:48
you know that's the important thing for
13:50
me thinking about how we can be creative
13:52
and continuing the legacy
13:54
yeah that's that's what me and my sister
13:55
all think about
13:56
i hear a certain frequency in the tone
13:58
of your voice can you
14:00
can you say baby baby
14:05
[Laughter]
14:28
wait a little bit okay you committed
14:30
though well
14:32
speaking of babies and that two things a
14:34
question for each of you um cj i
14:36
literally
14:37
met your mom first time ever meeting
14:39
your mom when she was pregnant with you
14:41
she'd been singing and a star and i
14:44
would happen to be on 57th street one
14:45
day and she was across the street
14:47
heather and i'm like oh [ __ ] and she was
14:49
pregnant and i remember rubbing her
14:52
belly and just walking away thinking
14:55
like damn biggie and faith are going to
14:57
have a baby like this is going to be
14:59
crazy and this is the first day i'm
15:01
meeting you
15:02
so you talk about manifestations just
15:04
not know it is super
15:06
freaky to me right now that's why i
15:08
hugged you so tight like one of them
15:10
aunts like
15:27
but when did it like what age for you
15:30
did it click
15:32
that your parents were famous like
15:34
super you know what i mean like legacy
15:37
it was really early because like when we
15:39
lived in atlanta
15:41
i was probably between six and like
15:43
eight or
15:44
five and eight i don't exactly remember
15:47
but
15:48
i was really young when i realized like
15:51
because we had a studio in our house and
15:53
you know my dad and my mom
15:55
you know we were raised
15:57
to
15:57
you know be regular kids it wasn't like
15:59
we were right you know always hanging
16:01
around or doing stuff that was
16:04
revolved around music like we didn't
16:06
really we played basketball you know
16:08
what i'm saying regular kids you know we
16:10
played sports we was doing active stuff
16:12
in in our in the communities that we
16:13
were raised in so it wasn't like we were
16:15
always on the road with my mom we would
16:18
come to the tours every now and then
16:20
but
16:21
yeah one side once we would go to the
16:22
tours that was kind of where we knew
16:24
like oh something is there
16:26
you know being in the studio with my mom
16:28
late nights i just remember
16:30
really wanting to you know do that like
16:33
that was always the fun thing being up
16:34
late and being in the studio with our
16:36
mom like
16:37
sitting in the booth while she was
16:38
recording that was probably the earliest
16:40
memories i remember
16:42
just being in the studio but
16:44
it was very early very early very early
16:46
and i knew the significance of this
16:48
legacy like probably around
16:51
15. i want to say 15 when i really when
16:54
it really set in like when my grandma
16:56
sat me down and talked to me like okay
16:58
like
17:00
you do realize like in a couple years
17:02
you're gonna have to yeah
17:04
yeah it was basically that type of
17:07
conversation thank you for sharing that
17:08
and with you justin hearing all of this
17:10
because i'm always thinking about the
17:12
person when i heard when i met you the
17:14
other day up here right and my horse
17:16
told me my husband was like he had he
17:18
wrote the book
17:19
i'm like here we go
17:22
you got this is a lot to take on what
17:25
was your approach and how did you feel
17:27
were you worried about that whole there
17:28
we go mentality like were you nervous
17:30
hell yeah cause i had it you know the
17:32
the thing was
17:34
i first found out about it probably like
17:36
fall of 2019 and i'm just going through
17:38
my email i'm just deleting all this spam
17:40
and one said like biggie book and i'm
17:42
like all right what the hell is this so
17:44
i opened it and uh it was the gentleman
17:46
who eventually became my editor on the
17:47
book basically saying you come highly
17:49
recommend it i've read some of your
17:51
stuff on like big and hip hop and i'm
17:52
looking to commission
17:54
uh somebody to write a book on big for
17:56
his 50th birthday in may 2022. so now
17:58
when i first heard that i'm like may
18:00
2022 it's like september 2019 that's
18:03
like an eternity
18:04
i got plenty i got plenty of time to
18:06
work on that not knowing that not
18:07
knowing that the world was gonna shut
18:08
down for two years how about that um but
18:10
you know fast forward a little bit we
18:12
signed the contract and in the book
18:14
publishing world you get half of your
18:15
money up front and another half once you
18:17
submit the manuscript when i got that
18:18
first check i ain't gonna lie to you
18:20
that was the biggest check i've ever had
18:21
in my life at one point i'm like oh we
18:23
doing this book
18:31
but then it hit me like damn
18:33
what the hell am i going to tell people
18:35
about biggie smalls that they don't
18:36
already know
18:38
at this point he's a folk hero and he's
18:40
he's he's an icon in our culture and
18:42
world culture and
18:44
i got scared i was like god
18:46
i didn't got myself into something i
18:48
can't get out now and i haven't already
18:49
spent the money
18:52
if it felt like a drug deal going bad
19:01
all right
19:02
um and you know so i started uh one of
19:04
the one of the first people i talked to
19:06
about this is uh cheo hidari coach
19:12
that's a great dude right there and i
19:14
was nervous to tell him that i was doing
19:17
it because i knew he knew big personally
19:20
he's one of the last people to talk to
19:21
him and you know big really trusted him
19:24
you know big told him like i want you to
19:26
be basically my alex haley and so like
19:30
i'm like okay i'm i
19:31
that doesn't make me alex
19:32
[Music]
19:34
god damn like so but he was like yo just
19:37
like take your time like if anybody was
19:40
going to do this book i'm glad it's you
19:41
like i trust you to make this right and
19:44
uh you see the title biggie in the world
19:46
that made him i was like all right
19:49
it's going to be a biography about big
19:51
but i think if i provide context to like
19:53
what's going on in the world at certain
19:55
points then you know his life will come
19:58
into more of a distinct
20:00
uh visual than it has in the past like
20:03
for example you know ready to die one of
20:05
the greatest debut albums if not the
20:07
greatest debut album in rap history came
20:09
out september 13 1994.
20:12
a lot of people don't realize earlier
20:14
that day the 1994 crime bill was signed
20:16
into law and that was the law that
20:18
basically came up with the term super
20:19
predators and basically saying that like
20:21
these people in the inner city are going
20:22
to rob and kill you and xyz whereas if
20:25
you listen to ready to die under that
20:27
pretext it's basically big responding to
20:30
congressman or
20:32
washington dc saying like okay y'all are
20:34
painting us in this certain light in a
20:36
certain picture that yes you know things
20:37
have changed over the years but i really
20:40
live in these communities i'm really
20:41
going through these type of things so
20:43
when you listen to that and you listen
20:44
to a song like things don't change you
20:46
listen to a song like ready to die or or
20:49
even suicidal thoughts
20:51
like that like it just
20:53
you look at biggie smalls differently in
20:55
a great way not not different in a bad
20:56
way so
20:58
i did that throughout multiple points of
20:59
the book and it just it just worked and
21:03
there was it was honestly a quote from
21:05
like nipsy hustle that really made me
21:07
think of big in a way uh he was doing an
21:09
interview
21:10
and he was he he basically broke his
21:13
logic down why he felt he was so
21:14
important and i i felt like it applied
21:16
to big like
21:17
if we say
21:19
america is important to the world right
21:21
in terms of like you know geopolitical
21:23
stuff cultural things like that and new
21:25
york city is important to america which
21:27
is important to the world
21:29
and i know from somebody like me who
21:31
wasn't from new york the first person i
21:33
used to think of when i heard new york
21:35
it was biggie smalls it still is it
21:37
still is ig so if biggie smalls is one
21:39
of the most important people in new york
21:41
and new york is one of the most
21:42
important things about america and
21:43
america is one of the most important
21:44
things about the world then biggie
21:46
smalls is one of the most important
21:47
people to ever live yeah right and if
21:49
you think about big's career if you take
21:51
it from the started ready to die to the
21:53
time that he lost his life that's two
21:54
and a half years
21:56
nobody did as much in a short amount of
21:59
time
22:01
nobody no no nobody else like so when we
22:04
talk about these all-time great
22:05
musicians like you know
22:08
or wordsmiths like mark twain or william
22:10
shakespeare or like no biggie smalls is
22:12
right that for me he's more important
22:14
because i got way more out of biggie
22:15
smalls than i you know i fell asleep
22:17
reading shakespeare in school not saying
22:19
that it wasn't dope but like that's my
22:21
that's my
22:22
show
22:23
yeah let him and park and jay and all
22:25
these type of people so i mean let me
22:27
let me add a layer of
22:29
uh
22:30
divine thank you for the connection to
22:32
that thank you
22:33
the day park passed away um
22:36
september 13th yeah
22:39
yeah we're just
22:40
two two years later right two years
22:43
after
22:44
ready to die was released on september
22:46
13th
22:47
their cosmic connection
22:50
you know it's bigger than
22:51
those that the divisive headlines yeah
22:54
cj i met your father uh
22:58
introduced him to me by tupac
23:01
wow first time i met your father who was
23:03
in new york and they were performing i
23:05
want to say at the palladium
23:07
and i was friends with park i used to
23:09
hang out with park and oakland be at his
23:10
house the whole night those two dudes
23:12
were beautiful together yeah so when the
23:14
[ __ ] happened it was like what's
23:16
happening
23:17
they were beautiful together bro like
23:19
you know you got friends this is a he's
23:22
more than a friend to me rich nice is a
23:24
brother right you see us interacting
23:26
people go what's going on with y'all
23:28
that's a beautiful thing right and
23:31
pitched him to me because we had
23:32
syndicated radio if you went to we were
23:34
those dudes cj i'm just going to tell
23:36
you
23:37
man
23:38
they don't tell you the history
23:40
to tell you that history could tell you
23:42
yeah and the new york guys don't always
23:44
say it jcj
23:46
with those dudes flex he'll tell
23:48
you all right
23:49
and poc came down the stairs yo sway you
23:52
got to know him you got to know this
23:53
this is biggie smalls
23:55
okay what's up man your pops was so nice
23:58
and humble man you got to have them on
24:00
the show pockets always yeah electric
24:02
100 on 100 and i was like okay i was
24:04
like you coming to cali it was coming to
24:06
cali to do that whole yeah big mac
24:09
campaign yep yep um that they had i said
24:11
well when you come to the show
24:13
you better bring bars
24:16
to your pops and and so i just find
24:20
even that connection was amazing until
24:22
it wasn't right yeah right and you you
24:24
tap into that in a book a lot i felt i
24:27
felt like oh my fault
24:29
i felt like
24:30
in the quarter century since both of
24:32
those like you know icons have been gone
24:35
i feel like they've in a lot of ways
24:37
been reduced to like these negative
24:38
qualities like beef and like black men
24:41
like going against each other and of
24:42
course the way that they um pass like
24:45
yes
24:46
how they fell out it was tragic it was
24:48
one of the great
24:50
you know
24:51
injustices i think in rap history that
24:53
they fell out because like you said
24:55
their their friendship was so
24:57
it was so intense it was so pure and i i
25:01
think one thing i definitely wanted to
25:02
do in the book was yes i focus on what
25:05
happened when it went wrong but there's
25:07
a there's a good chunk of the book that
25:09
talks about their friendship because i
25:11
think when we don't talk about their
25:12
friendship we strip biggie and tupac
25:14
away from their humanity yes so how did
25:16
they meet
25:18
so
25:19
they met a
25:21
big said in a in a vibe interview like
25:23
big was uh poc was um
25:26
filming uh poetic justice and you know
25:29
they they met initially there but while
25:32
poc was filming poetic justice like john
25:34
singleton would always be like when poc
25:36
wasn't on set he would always be playing
25:38
partying [ __ ] he was like that was
25:40
his favorite song like he just kept
25:42
playing it to the point where
25:43
you know like john singleton was like
25:45
all right play something else like he
25:46
would just play like on repeat and you
25:48
know poc was in i'm not poc big was in
25:51
la for like that big mac tour and poc
25:53
pulled up on the sheraton uh in los
25:56
angeles where big was staying and poc
25:58
was basically like yo roll with me come
25:59
to my house and that's when that whole
26:01
epic you know freestyle session happened
26:03
at pock's house um groovy lou was
26:06
telling me about this and he was like
26:08
and so pop pulled up at the hotel
26:10
and he was like yo b.i can i roll them
26:12
you know big was like if you whip me you
26:14
whip me you like come on so they went
26:16
over the pox house and they freestyle
26:18
for like an hour straight like poc would
26:20
freestyle for like five six seven
26:21
minutes then big would do it and like
26:23
pockets like gassing them up the entire
26:25
time like come on keep going keep going
26:26
keep going and then pop you know you
26:28
know poc always erratic he stopped
26:30
freestyling goes into the kitchen cooks
26:32
everybody's food like they talk
26:35
they change smoking they chain smoking
26:37
blunts they drinking whatever and then
26:39
out of nowhere pot he leaves again and
26:41
goes to get like this entire duffel bag
26:43
full of like unloaded guns and so like
26:46
groovy lou tells this story about how
26:47
pock and big are just running around in
26:49
pock's backyard know you know chasing
26:51
each other with the guns like basically
26:53
like being little kids like
26:55
look like cops and robbers type thing
26:56
and it was just
26:57
and you know he says like yo bro when
26:59
they were around each other dog it was
27:01
just like you you can tell they loved
27:03
being around each other like no pak
27:06
would pull up on fulton street with like
27:08
trash bags full of weed and they would
27:09
just smoke out the corner and like
27:12
you know like little seeds would have to
27:13
run to the store and go grab like
27:15
dutches back and forth which is like
27:16
because it was a constant like
27:18
assembly line just like and it was the
27:20
good times like those good times
27:23
aren't discussed anywhere near as much
27:25
as you know to hit them up to the world
27:27
or bad boy death road and things of that
27:29
nature and i i just think we we stripped
27:32
them of humanity and especially we had
27:34
these conversations about black life in
27:36
america and what it is now especially
27:38
like in the post george floyd post
27:40
brianna taylor world like we got to
27:42
focus on their lives just as much as you
27:45
know you know unfortunately
27:55
yeah right
27:57
that's right crazy that voice is
28:04
the world that made him and we have his
28:05
son cj here
28:07
who's um continuing the legacy handsome
28:10
young man too
28:12
thank you sir no problem man you single
28:14
cj what about me
28:16
yo justin
28:19
was already getting props
28:22
fair enough like it is like a nephew
28:24
that's different man
28:25
[Laughter]
28:28
you need to be securing yourself
28:32
that's what you're personally and we all
28:33
struggle with things
28:40
you're a handsome chance a distinguished
28:41
gentleman i appreciate
28:53
because you're a celebrity in your own
28:55
right right and so you know i'm sure you
28:57
get a lot of attention how's your social
28:59
life being the son of some people who
29:01
are so iconic like you like
29:03
like you were talking about i stick with
29:05
my crew you know it's it's me and my
29:08
boys just like how it's crazy the
29:10
similarities in the both of us like if
29:12
you're with me you're with me like wow
29:14
and it's really like that uh-huh you
29:16
know i try to make sure
29:18
you know
29:19
everybody says my dad used to just look
29:21
out for people all the time to a fault
29:23
you know what i mean and i'm the same
29:24
way so you know
29:27
my close close-knit family that's what
29:29
we call it mm-hmm so okay did you you
29:32
picked up the mic once right yeah yeah i
29:34
remember that yeah i still i still
29:36
dabble i'm just not that's not the focus
29:38
for me but okay yeah definitely i love
29:41
to write i love to
29:43
you know i'm a i'm i'm a
29:45
enthusiast of rap not just rap but r b i
29:49
sing too you saying so yeah go ahead
29:54
i probably sing like jokingly more than
29:56
i rap
29:57
wow i'm bad at that i ain't mad at that
30:00
that's dope let me hear something man
30:03
he's trying to put me on the spot trying
30:05
to get biggie
30:12
he got harmony in his laughter though
30:14
he's cute
30:17
and his mama started out in the church
30:20
so far
30:27
um you know i'm so grateful for both of
30:29
you guys because you've added so much
30:31
color to an icon to your father and i'm
30:34
curious cj because we've had many
30:37
conversations with um kin of very famous
30:40
couples we've seen many conversations
30:42
and sometimes the pressure of
30:46
keeping a legacy intact can be a lot you
30:50
know what i mean when you think of like
30:51
okay passing the torch you know the air
30:53
to the throne and i wonder like is it
30:56
difficult for you to ever
30:59
make sense of keeping your dad's legacy
31:02
alive but also carving out your own
31:04
legacy or do you see it as really just
31:06
focusing on keeping the wallace legacy
31:09
yeah um
31:11
it's definitely difficult to
31:12
[Music]
31:13
you know you want to you want to
31:14
separate yourself obviously you want
31:16
individuality
31:18
um
31:19
but yeah like everything we've been
31:21
doing with frank white is going to
31:23
support the legacy at the end of the day
31:25
yeah and you know frank white is is a
31:27
living
31:28
breathing version of me you know another
31:30
version of me and you know that's my
31:33
that's just my creative
31:34
uh expression you know that's that's
31:36
just how i can get those ideas out um
31:39
you know with all the different
31:40
partnerships that we've been doing
31:42
um which we've
31:44
announced in the partnership with lexus
31:45
this week we so we're working with lexus
31:48
access they have to talk about that
31:50
drive elections
31:51
you know the connections there yeah it's
31:54
been there he's like we said he's spoken
31:56
into existence
31:57
um so yeah they they brought back the
31:59
the lexus lx
32:01
the all-new 600 i got to drive it around
32:03
brooklyn that's right wow that's the
32:05
flag we did a little mini docu
32:08
documentary with them and
32:10
just talking about this talking about
32:11
legacy and pushing legacy forward
32:14
in my way you know doing it differently
32:17
um you know obviously i love music it's
32:19
going to always be connected to me as
32:21
something as a passion even if i'm
32:23
supporting other people you know getting
32:25
my diddy on uh
32:28
i love to executive produce just as much
32:31
as i love to write and be involved in
32:33
the process that's what's up yeah it's
32:35
it's never going to be
32:37
separate from me it's always going to be
32:40
focused on you know it's unified exactly
32:43
do you consider your pops the ancestor
32:45
like do you feel like you forged a
32:46
relationship with him beyond the
32:48
physical
32:49
definitely you know his his spirit is
32:51
everywhere for me yeah it goes with me
32:53
everywhere and i can't escape it at all
32:55
so it's it's definitely there um
32:58
especially when i'm in brooklyn or with
33:00
my grandma with tiana you know with the
33:03
people that knew him most and loved him
33:05
most do you feel it or is it something
33:07
where it's like you can hear it where
33:08
there's maybe even direction
33:10
um
33:12
i feel like he's he's just everywhere he
33:14
comes in certain people that i meet you
33:16
know he's definitely if if i'm hearing
33:18
him that way you know especially with my
33:20
grandma
33:22
it's it's
33:23
being in the in her house in in she
33:25
lives in pennsylvania in stroudsburg and
33:28
it's just like
33:29
you walk in and you feel that energy
33:31
yeah you feel that energy and it's a
33:33
it's a calm energy it's definitely a
33:35
loving energy
33:36
and yeah you know he lives through her i
33:39
definitely feel that that's special your
33:41
mother i'm glad you have that
33:42
absolutely absolutely and uh
33:45
your grandmother
33:47
your grandmother is an icon yeah in her
33:50
own right you know these mothers these
33:52
black mothers
33:54
that have to endure
33:56
losing their children
33:58
and continue yeah even prior to his
34:01
untimely demise
34:02
raising the kid raising his raising her
34:05
son the way she had to do it primarily
34:07
on her own you know
34:09
what she had to endure to put him in a
34:11
position to become who we became exactly
34:13
well we're talking about him to this day
34:15
we got to acknowledge your grandmother
34:17
give her a round of applause you know
34:19
she's amazing
34:21
and regal
34:23
those cheek bones make you straightened
34:24
up
34:27
i'm on my best behavior i'm not using
34:29
slang or nothing around your
34:32
most humble i love love you meanwhile
34:35
absolutely she's going to hear this for
34:36
sure absolutely i sees called me earlier
34:40
in the week or two weeks ago and and um
34:42
and somebody from kim's camp had called
34:44
and invited me to the event tonight and
34:47
was asked me to kind of host
34:49
to some extent
34:51
i said man i'm you know
34:53
we got too many family members and
34:54
friends that's going to be there that
34:56
you know i'll help direct it but right
34:58
let's let everybody get it off yeah you
34:59
know however they if you need me i kind
35:02
of want to be the fly on the wall and
35:03
experience right yeah i got a chance to
35:05
as a promoter put big on the stage and i
35:08
know what's going to take place tonight
35:09
you know um so i had a chance to
35:11
experience it but i think it's so
35:13
amazing to see kim
35:15
and sees
35:17
in unison again and they have been for
35:19
years but sure yeah i remember a time i
35:21
told this story earlier when i was doing
35:23
some coverage for him tv and kim wanted
35:26
to drive through the neighborhood so she
35:27
was like you got to give me a rolls
35:28
royce and i didn't even y'all know those
35:30
cars so uh i had him tv getting and we
35:32
was driving through the neighborhood and
35:33
i had to call seeds i'd have been
35:35
hanging with him
35:36
like the week prior eating at some
35:39
shop he took me to or something and i
35:41
had seeds i'm coming to the neighborhood
35:43
with kim and i'm letting you know i'mma
35:45
be there really to say man just pop up
35:47
yeah and so we had everybody came out
35:50
what was it 2-2-6 st james yeah they
35:52
came to that location and kids from
35:55
everywhere it was in droves just came
35:57
out to see kim yeah and i remember i
35:59
seen the interview and kim for him tv
36:00
you know i see c's in the peripheral i'm
36:02
like oh snap damn is this going to jump
36:05
off what's about to happen should i have
36:06
not said nothing right and c's gave me
36:09
to what's up and the whole nine i'm
36:10
talking to kim and she said i see your
36:12
boy over there
36:16
i was like oh yeah so i'ma explain it to
36:18
her she said it's okay it's okay
36:20
and then i pushed it i was like you
36:21
think we could get you two in the
36:22
interview or she looked at me then she
36:24
was like we could take a picture so i
36:26
got them all both of them up there to
36:28
take a picture and i was thinking this
36:30
is the dream right
36:32
everybody so tonight is the dream yeah
36:35
tonight is the dream
36:37
everybody that's gonna be there that
36:39
tapped and touched your father yeah oh
36:42
man i'm about to tear up something get
36:43
in there somebody get ready
36:47
come here
36:49
it's a beautiful thing man it'll be
36:50
beautiful it's a beautiful thing so
36:52
beautiful i want to ask uh both of you a
36:55
question yeah so uh i'll start with cj
36:57
so i know it's um
36:59
everywhere you go people always want to
37:00
know about music and with your dad and
37:03
what's going on what is this is there
37:05
something that you want to do that
37:06
doesn't pertain to entertainment at all
37:09
um
37:11
yeah that's a that's a long list so
37:15
um but yeah like we talked about my
37:17
acting and stuff i definitely want to
37:19
continue that
37:20
um
37:22
i'm directing i'm i'm huge
37:24
behind the scenes just as much as i love
37:26
you know i love taking photos i'm a
37:28
little fake photographer on the side so
37:31
hire me
37:33
but yeah
37:34
i love just being creative in any way
37:37
you know if it's the fashion if it's you
37:39
know putting parties together
37:41
um just i like i like to be a host i
37:44
like to host people i like to cook you
37:46
know i know i don't know if you'll be
37:47
seeing my smoothie videos and stuff i'll
37:50
be having fun like i like to just do
37:52
whatever i like to you know whatever
37:53
makes me feel good that's dope yeah
37:56
and then for you sir
37:58
this book
37:59
i haven't got to read it yet but i
38:01
haven't heard any talk of track masters
38:02
in this book we got to talk about that
38:04
what's going on is there no mention of
38:05
trackmaster what song should y'all do
38:07
rich um ready to die oh that's in there
38:10
yeah sorry nobody uh uh um
38:13
that's the title of the album one more
38:14
chance remix oh yeah oh yeah
38:17
oh yeah is the talk of it in the book oh
38:19
yeah no there's an entire scene about
38:21
how the the one more chance remix came
38:23
to be uh rob stone told me an incredible
38:26
story about how
38:27
uh well i don't want to ruin it for
38:29
everybody but it's in there you know
38:30
about how it came to be because the
38:32
third single from the album was almost
38:34
uh
38:35
machine gun funk and rob was like i
38:38
don't know if that's the way we need to
38:40
go you start with juicy then you go big
38:42
papa and it's about to be the summer we
38:45
can't hit people with the summer and
38:47
machine gun phone and like it's a great
38:48
song easy mo beat uh produced the
38:51
classic but he was like i think you need
38:52
puff you you basically invented the
38:54
remix like give us a remix to one more
38:56
chance and the story goes from there but
38:58
yeah we got juicy about how
39:01
you know big was initially reluctant to
39:03
record juicy and how mr c
39:06
who big trusted implicitly you know that
39:09
was one thing i came to learn about big
39:11
was like if he trusted you like he
39:13
trusted you to the end until until he
39:16
gave until you gave him a reason not to
39:17
trust him and mr c was
39:20
um one of the many people that got him
39:22
in front of puff and he told puff like
39:25
this this guy's the one this guy is the
39:28
one and you know but big we had to tell
39:31
him because big wanted
39:33
ready to die was originally going to be
39:34
called teflon don
39:36
and puff was like nah that ain't it we
39:39
got we got to go with something else and
39:40
you know big would kind of get a little
39:42
perturbed sometimes because he wanted to
39:43
do his own thing but puff would always
39:45
tell him like look
39:47
90 of the album you can rhyme as hard as
39:49
you want i want you to but that 10
39:52
you got to give me a big papa you got to
39:54
give me a juicy trust me i know what i'm
39:56
doing
39:57
this is puffy like look i i got jodeci
39:59
popping i got mary j blige pop and i'm
40:01
working with heavy d like i i know what
40:04
i'm doing here and so mr c would have to
40:06
tell him like
40:07
look just trust puff like he's it's
40:10
going to work and so he recorded juicy
40:13
and i mean well wow we know we know what
40:15
happened with that shout out to my
40:16
partner's poking tone cause we took a
40:18
lot of heat from that song oh man look
40:20
look now
40:21
i think what the the bbc called it the
40:23
the quintessential
40:25
rap tale of all time it was voted the
40:28
the number one hip-hop song of all time
40:30
bbc wow wow thank you rich nice listen i
40:33
i know you guys got other things to do
40:35
i'll keep you all day you know
40:37
okay
40:38
[Laughter]
40:40
baby baby there it is
40:51
[Applause]
40:57
thank you man um we got we got the
40:59
artist marlon craft who's here i don't i
41:01
don't want to um cut his
41:03
his sign moment but of course you live
41:05
in l.a yeah yeah we're broadcasting on
41:08
next week in l.a you want to come back
41:10
and talk most definitely come take
41:11
pictures we can see your photo game yeah
41:14
okay i brought my camera now so we can
41:16
see it hey
41:17
just stay in there and take that ready
41:18
ain't got to get ready definitely and
41:21
then la we'll be broadcasting all every
41:23
day come through come hang out will you
41:25
talk more but we got artists coming
41:27
through you want to get some pictures go
41:28
to work yeah go to work son
41:31
definitely i'm trying to get my
41:32
portfolio right there you go let's go
41:34
cool let's go uh christopher wallace
41:38
christopher george la torre george
41:41
latoya wallace yeah victoria wallace
41:44
jr
41:45
um
41:46
oh my name my name your name christopher
41:48
jordan
41:49
i thought we were saying christopher
41:50
george that was that was your dad's name
41:53
and yours is christopher george
41:54
jordan jordan
41:58
god bless you sir all right thank
42:01
thank you
42:02
you represent so much for us you do it
42:04
well i'm glad you turned out great a lot
42:06
of these famous kids man
42:12
we ain't gotta go down that road yeah
42:13
man thank you bro justin said that's the
42:15
next book
42:17
not for me
42:19
please thank you man continued success
42:21
yeah you got a global tribe around you
42:23
yeah
42:24
you have nothing but success
42:26
in your journey you will never fall
42:29
and even if you're down you got people
42:31
to hold you up you don't have to be
42:33
perfect you could be with flaw you can
42:35
make mistakes you're a young man you're
42:37
25.
42:39
how about that you're the age your dad
42:41
was i just passed it yes
42:44
he was he was he was 24 when he passed
42:47
so wow
42:48
turning 25 was a very big deal
42:51
absolutely
42:52
yeah i always looked at that day like
42:54
man
42:55
wow like that's crazy right that's kind
42:57
of crazy the legacy lives on big lives
42:59
on yeah thank you always i'm always
43:02
thank you when i see you because i see
43:03
your dad in your eyes and it's like i
43:05
feel like cracking jokes on you
43:09
yeah i gotta ah yeah man this dude made
43:11
me want to show that
43:13
as glossy as hell look at that
43:15
flavor flavor had her son at 63.
43:18
knock it off his name
43:21
knock it off sway don't go no i don't
43:23
want to
43:38
before you get a job you got to go
43:40
through the review board
43:42
this is the review board that's all and
43:45
then well
43:46
you got you guys get your credit he got
43:47
his mom his sister his brother you get
43:50
past that level
43:54
that's the jury yeah
43:56
then you're going to bring them here
43:58
and i'm just looking
44:01
not judgmental not judgmental
44:04
just looking just look just looking
44:07
thank you heather uh justin tinsley
44:09
congratulations appreciate it brother
44:11
thank y'all thank y'all so much thank
44:12
you created a milestone in hip-hop
44:14
history yeah you should be proud as a
44:16
journalist i'm very proud
44:18
of journalism has become really murky
44:22
that it has in the past recent years
44:24
that it has especially broadcast
44:25
journalism it's becoming murky yeah you
44:28
know people are changing stories to fit
44:30
their agenda and the truth isn't there
44:34
here you captured the truth in a way
44:36
that i've yet to see thank you so much
44:38
so congratulations i appreciate that
44:40
absolutely i appreciate that thank y'all
44:42
okay y'all go have a great day i'll see
44:44
y'all tonight the empire state yes sir
44:47
i don't have the black tire tire they
44:49
they requesting
44:51
would you stamp me though if i could oh
44:53
yeah okay
44:55
he's with me okay
44:56
easy thank you man i appreciate it uh so
44:59
i want to um play the last
45:02
known freestyle that i know of that big
45:04
did
45:05
was
45:06
was on my show with sway and king tech
45:08
and dj revolution
45:10
and um i'm proud because he was a
45:13
rapper's rapper
45:15
you know he was somebody that no matter
45:17
how huge he became he was he was
45:18
promoting the second album he didn't
45:20
have to do that due to the importance of
45:23
of preserving that part of our culture
45:25
that's unique to this culture alone
45:27
that's our identity you ain't seen rock
45:29
dudes freestyle you ain't seeing country
45:31
music guys freestyle like sure this is
45:34
what helped us catapult this important
45:37
leg of the culture and your father was
45:39
true to culture
45:40
from day one yeah all right so thank you
45:42
all appreciate you we got marlon craft
45:45
coming up next here's big
45:49
[Music]
46:01
you
#Arts & Entertainment