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"I think you're absolutely disgusting, I really do."
Caller Lyn cannot believe the nerve of James Hanson to suggest pensions shouldn't be rising as much as they are.
Lyn thinks she's found a much better cost-cutting measure: Stop the boats and scrap foreign aid. But, as James points out, the numbers don't quite add up. Whose side are you on?
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0:00
Who do you think you are
0:02
You haven't got a clue. £12,000 a year? That's what my husband's got
0:07
I should have retired at 60. They shoved another seven years on my retirement date
0:12
Yes, we own our own house. We don't go out. We don't go on holiday. I mean, what do you want me to do
0:17
Euthanise him? No, of course I... Of course... Come on, Lynne. Come on, Lynne
0:22
No, no, you listen to me. Stop the boats and stop foreign aid. Problem solved
0:27
Well, it's not problem solved, is it? because it's £15.5 billion a year being added to the national debt
0:34
because of the triple lock, even if we stop the boats. Oh, because of pensioners
0:38
Yes, because of pensioners. No, you're wrong. And also, Lynne, you say you should have retired at 60
0:43
I mean, that's ridiculous that you were ever able to retire at 60
0:47
67 is a far fairer retirement age for both men and women and, frankly, it probably needs to rise further
0:53
Well, I think you're absolutely disgusting. I really do. Why? I mean, you know, stop the foreign aid. Stop it
0:59
straight away. And the millions we're spending every day on the boats that the pensioners have
1:04
got to pay, we own our own house. If one of us needs care, they'll take that, all of it
1:09
Lynne, why should a working age person who is not getting an above inflation increase in their
1:16
standard of living each year subsidise through their taxes an above inflation increase in your
1:22
standard of living? What makes you so special? What makes us so special? You're unbelievable
1:28
Why should working people subsidise the boat people that have never put in a penny into the system
1:35
That's more realistic. But Lyn, I'm not even saying we should cut the state pension
1:40
I'm not saying we should keep the state pension where it is. I'm saying we should increase the state pension every year
1:45
but just not buy as much The triple lock is a guarantee that pensioners will get an above inflation increase in their standard of living each year or at the very least an inflationary increase
1:55
in their standard of living each year. I'm just saying don't increase it by that much
1:59
because we can't afford it anymore. Is there anything so wrong about that? Yes, there is a lot wrong
2:04
Start looking at other areas to cut down and stop taking these people every single day
2:10
Don't take it out on the pensioners. I mean, a pensioner should be on 20,000 a year
2:14
No, it's $12,000 a year. $20,000 a year? Yes, absolutely. But you haven't paid in $20,000 a year over the course of your lifetime in taxes
2:24
I've paid in since I was 16. I'm now 63. Yeah, but not that much
2:28
Yeah, but how much am I going to get in my state pension? 10 years? 15 years, maybe
2:33
Well, why should you get more out of the state? Because most pensioners, you hear this argument that
2:39
well, I've paid in all my life, so therefore I'm entitled to it. That doesn't apply to most pensioners
2:43
most pensioners end up being net beneficiaries from the welfare state. And that's because, and this is a good thing, we're all living longer
2:50
And so a lot of pensioners living into their 80s, 90s, so they're spending 30 years plus on the state pension
2:54
That's a good thing. But it's simply not true that most pensioners are getting out what they paid in for
3:00
I mean, young people at the moment, right, when they start work, they have to pay into a smart pension, right
3:06
That only started when I was in my 40s. If I was told at 16, you need to provide for yourself
3:13
I would have done. But now I'm 63. It's too late. I haven't got the money to put into that pension
3:18
to get a decent amount out. I think make sure they start preparing now
3:24
the young people, but not the people that have paid in all these years
3:28
and probably will get 10,000, 15,000, and if you need to go in a home
3:33
we'll have your house. They take the lot It not fair It old people demonising it Oh they use the welfare state they use the NHS blah blah blah You know let them freeze to death over the winter It not fair
3:46
I think an important point to make, Lynn, because you mentioned the point about small boats
3:50
and the cost of migrants and all of that. Millions. Yeah, but it's nothing compared to what we spend on pensions
3:56
It is a drop in the ocean. Do you know how much we spend on the state pension each year
4:01
Oh, go on, then. Over £150 billion. And how much do we spend on small boats every single day
4:08
Bearing in mind there's about 500 to 700 coming in every day
4:12
Hotels, free NHS, free glasses, free dental. I can tell you, it's not £150 billion a year
4:18
It's nowhere close. I think it is. It's really not. You're entitled to your own opinion, Lynne
4:24
You're not entitled to your own facts. Oh, really? No, the facts are the facts
4:30
You can have an opinion. You can't quote false facts. I mean, I don't normally listen to the radio this time in the morning
4:38
How old are you? I'm 32. 32. You haven't got a clue
4:43
32 years old, you probably earn good money, which I don't blame you for
4:47
You know, you do a good show, you earn good money, but you can't
4:51
You've got to give old people a good amount to live on. So I should subsidise you getting an above-inflation increase
4:59
in your standard of living each year when working-age people like me don't get that
5:03
yeah you will because people your age are paying into smart pensions and private pensions when i
5:09
was young that didn't exist you were always told that you would pay from the day you started work
5:15
from the cradle to the grave and all that which is total rubbish doesn't work we can see that
5:20
but you can't start taking money away from people now you know prepare the young people that are up
5:26
and coming now to look after themselves in their old age but not demonizing old people like as if oh you know waste of space euthanise them get rid of them you know No but Lynne I not
5:36
I'm not trying to demonise old people. I'm really not. The problem is, I think this is part of the
5:41
reason the politicians are terrified of having this conversation, because every time they do
5:45
pensioners claim that they are, you know, being victimised somehow. Well, I'm sorry, they're not
5:52
Pensioners have done relatively well out of this government over the past 15 years
5:58
Well, I mean, it's just, I mean, 12,000 a year, you haven't got the earning capacity
6:05
If you tell somebody at 16 that's starting an apprenticeship or a job, you need to look after yourself
6:11
they've got the time to save up. People my age haven't. My husband's retired
6:16
I mean, you know, I still work part time. I'm of ill health, but I still go out, I still work, you know, and do our thing
6:25
We don't live on a lot of money. We're careful with our money. But start it off now with the young people
6:30
Start it off now. I've got some figures for you, by the way, Lynne, on the cost of asylum seekers
6:37
This is figures from the Guardian. Apparently accommodation for asylum seekers is expected to cost around £15 billion
6:43
which I would agree with you is too much, but that is a tenth of what we spend on the state pension each year
6:48
Yeah, but it's a start, isn't it? And £15 billion is the rate at which the state pensions bill
6:52
is forecast to increase by, by 2030, according to the OBR, each year
7:00
And what about the money that David Ham is flinging all around the world
7:04
to countries that have nothing to do with that? Oh, I'm with you on the Chagos Islands
7:09
I think it's ridiculous to spend money giving away British sovereign territory
7:13
I'm with you on that. I mean, is it Syria, £97 million
7:17
Surely that's a start. Well, come on, 97 million is a drop in the ocean, Lynn
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