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Two Labour MPs who were denied entry to Israel and deported have said they are "astounded" by the decision.
Yuan Yang and Abtisam Mohamed were rejected because they were suspected of plans to "document the activities of security forces and spread anti-Israel hatred", according to a statement from the Israeli immigration ministry.
Ms Yang, who represents Earley and Woodley, and Ms Mohamed, the MP for Sheffield Central, both flew to the country from Luton on Saturday.
Sharing a statement following the incident, the pair said it is "vital" that parliamentarians are able to "witness first-hand" the situation on the ground in Palestine.
It comes after Foreign Secretary, David Lammy said it was "deeply concerning" that they had not been allowed into the country.
Now, Iain Dale is joined by Natasha Hausdorff, international lawyer and legal director of the UK Lawyers for Israel Charitable Trust.
Listen to the full show on Global Player: https://app.af.globalplayer.com/Br0x/LBCYouTubeListenLive
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0:00
Natasha Hausdorff joins me, barrister specialising in international law, who's also the legal director of UK Lawyers for Israel Charitable Trust
0:07
Natasha, very good evening to you. What's your conclusion as to the rectitude of the Israeli action here
0:16
Good evening, Ian. I'm surprised by some of the hyperbole over this. It's not an issue that has anything to do with freedom of speech
0:24
these MPs can say whatever they like, they can do whatever they like
0:28
they just don't have a right to enter Israel. And individuals who consistently attack Israel spread falsehoods about the Jewish state
0:36
One only has to look at their Twitter history. They are considered, I think properly, not to be conducive to the public good in Israel
0:45
Actually, some of the sort of baseless falsehoods about Israel that we just heard from your previous contributor, Azriel Bermond
0:52
Hang on, he didn't utter any falsehoods. Don't insult one of your fellow guests
0:57
It's really rude. Well, calling Israel, saying that it is no longer a democracy
1:02
or saying that it is not a democracy that can deal with criticism within the country, I'm afraid he's baseless
1:07
There is great debate all the time, and indeed individuals calling for boycotts against Israel
1:13
within Israel itself. So why aren't Labour MPs allowed to do that
1:18
Surely if Israel... Hang on a second. If Israel believes in freedom of speech, then surely it shouldn't be afraid of some of the arguments that these MPs have put forward, given that people within Israel have put the same arguments forward
1:33
It is difficult to understand where this projection of fear arises from
1:37
Israel's statutory framework and its laws since 2017, the country's law of entry, has been very clear
1:45
I think this was also referenced by Kenny Badenoch, that Israel is to refuse entry to activists who publicly call for or have committed to participate in a boycott against Israel
1:57
And Ms Badenoch was also right. I think the examples she was referring to were Moshe Feiglin and Gert Wilders, that this is a practice that the UK has also engaged in
2:07
I'm sorry, you cannot equate two Labour MPs with Gert Wilders. I don't know the other gentleman that you referred to, but he was a political extremist who would have stirred up racial hatred in this country
2:22
That is not what these two MPs were They were on a legitimate parliamentary delegation and should have been treated accordingly These two MPs are stirring up hatred against Israel in their Twitter feed No they not They arguing their case in a democracy
2:39
Ian, may I answer? They're not. They are spreading hatefuls about Israel
2:43
and calling for a boycott, which is why they fall into this issue. Well, then argue against them
2:47
But forgive me, may I also correct another aspect of what you have said? They were not on an official parliamentary delegation
2:54
to Israel. They have been clear that they were on a delegation
2:57
that was organized by the Council for British Understanding, an anti-Israel lobby group, and Medical Aid for Palestinians
3:04
which incidentally only stopped funding a designated organization when UK Lawyers for Israel complained to the Charities Commission
3:11
about their links to terror. So these two very questionable organizations, so far as Israel is concerned
3:17
organized a delegation, it seems, with these two members of parliament to the West Bank
3:22
There was no record of a parliamentary delegation to Israel. So the overriding issue is here
3:27
When immigration officials ask for information as to the purpose of your visit and you provide information which is not correct, that in most circumstances will put you straight on the next plane home
3:39
So quite apart from the hyperbole here, which is causing a diplomatic incident, everything that you have repeated from Labour members of Parliament and even ministers calling this out and ignoring the sheer hypocrisy, which is pretty staggering, considering that this is the sort of legislative framework that the UK also has and has not infrequently adopted against those that are not considered to be conducive to the public
4:09
good. And if they were going to Israel to stir up hatred or support Palestinian terrorists or
4:15
whatever, I would have absolutely no problem with the Israeli state deciding they were not conducive
4:21
to the public good. But that is not the case here. Now, you are correct when you say that the
4:26
Foreign Office website gives advice to, and I've got the page up here on my laptop, it gives advice
4:33
to, it says, foreign nationals can legally be refused entry if they publicly call for a boycott
4:38
of Israel or Israeli settlements or belong to an organisation which has called for a boycott
4:44
So, from that point of view, Israel can say, well, we've warned people in the past about this
4:49
The Foreign Office website states it. So, therefore, fair do's. But no normal democracy behaves in this way, do they
4:58
I mean, name another country that does. It the United Kingdom No it doesn The leader of the opposition gave you two prominent examples of politicians Yes and I told you that in one of those cases the example doesn really work
5:14
Well, I would disagree because the nature of the conduct of these two members of parliament
5:18
and unfortunately they are not alone in the Labour Party, in targeting Israel, in singling it out for falsehoods
5:25
And a public smear campaign falls very much within the confines of not conducive to the public good in Israel
5:34
which is exactly what this statute was introduced to cater for. And it is important to understand that they represented something that was untrue to immigration officials
5:44
when they claimed to be on a parliamentary delegation in Israel. That is information that can be easily checked
5:50
It can be, and they were. the Council for Arab-British Understanding said that the women were part of a parliamentary
5:57
delegation on a trip organised by them and medical aid for Palestinians
6:03
So I did just address this, Ian, but perhaps it was missed. They were not on a parliamentary
6:07
delegation to Israel. Well, to get to the occupied territories, you have to go through Israel
6:14
Am I not right? Well, let's be clear that this was not an organisation
6:20
an anti-Israel lobby group that had made any preparations it seems on the ground in Israel
6:27
or any attempt to arrange a parliamentary delegation in the country in which these two MPs were arriving
6:34
So on every level here the response can have only been expected
6:40
One almost wonders whether this whole exercise has been with every expectation of the result
6:47
as another PR stunt and to create a diplomatic incident. Because let's be clear, the organisers..
6:52
Well, again, a disgrace of the allegation with no proof at all. Well, let's be clear that the organisers of this so-called delegation
7:00
Kabu, and Medical Aid for Palestinians, have a very thorough track record of anti-Israel activity
7:08
and have no, and mainly on this occasion, had no preparations on the ground
7:14
This was not a parliamentary delegation to Israel. Can I ask you a question? I've been very supportive of Israel since October 7th, but various things that they've done, certainly in the last six months, I have called them out on air
7:29
I think some of the attacks in Gaza have been totally over the top I think Benjamin Netanyahu himself has been very culpable for a lot of this Would that mean that if I decided I wanted to go and present a programme from Israel that I could be refused entry because I had the temerity to say something
7:47
that the Israeli government might not like? That is, I'm afraid, a misrepresentation of what has gone on here
7:54
Do you know what? I've had enough of you repeatedly accusing my guest of misrepresentation
8:02
and now you've done it to me twice. you don't get a third chance
8:07
Ian, I have offered over the last 15 months repeatedly to come on to address the concerns that you are raising
8:14
and that offer has been refused. No, it's not. You've been on my programme before in the studio
8:20
Right. Not to address the issues that you have claimed to have concerns about
8:24
with respect to Israel's military conduct on the ground in Gaza. Any individual who wishes to properly understand the situation
8:32
have the ability to do that and engage with experts, those like me that have been on the ground in Gaza in September
8:39
and have seen these situations with my own eyes. Those repeated offers have been refused
8:45
And all I've had in coming on and answering your questions, straightforwardly, as I've been invited on to
8:52
is being told that I'm in some way being rude because I disagree with your previous guest and with you
8:59
You can disagree, but you don't accuse fellow guests of misrepresentation and you don't accuse the host of the programme of what you have done
9:08
Because if you do, don't expect to be invited back. Ian, the comparison that you have just drawn is not a fair comparison
9:16
and it is misrepresentative of what these members of Parliament have done. OK, you've done it three times now. Goodbye
9:21
Dear, oh, dear, oh, dear. 7.24. Thank you
9:59
Thank you
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