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(College 101 Series: Chapter 17) Choosing a major when you get to college is already hard enough, trying to decide if you should go for a double major or minor can be even more of a challenge, especially if you don’t have all the information. Join us as we discuss what it means to go for a double major or minor, and we share our opinions on both. They might not be what you’re expecting.
Episode link: https://play.headliner.app/episode/15943684?utm_source=youtube
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0:00
Welcome to the Reschooled Podcast, the show that discusses all the things that schools
0:17
may have missed with your hosts, AJ Couttee and Jason Gordon. Hey everybody, welcome back to the show. We are the Reschooled Podcast, the show that
0:25
discusses all the things that schools may not have prepared you for. As always, I'm AJ
0:29
and sitting across from me, the drummer, apparently extraordinaire. Y'all didn't get to see that on camera, but Jason, Jason, how you doing
0:36
Oh, pretty good, man. I couldn't help it. I was like, I hear our intro episode so much, I had to airdrum it with my head some sticks beside me
0:44
I hear you, man. Well, we're back. How was vacation? Rest, relaxed, ready to go, ready to rock and roll, man
0:53
I hear you. Are you the type that needs a vacation after vacation? Yeah
0:58
See, I don't need a vacation ever. Yeah. Like I need time to work and extended time
1:06
Like I just, I don't, I need to uncrunch deadlines. But as far as of vacation, I never, I get frustrated by vacations because I'd rather be doing what I like doing, which is kind of my work, right
1:20
I'd rather be making videos. I'd rather be teaching things. I'd rather than sitting on a beach
1:25
It's just the way I am. Right. What about you? I'm not. I'm not
1:29
So when we just got back from the beach, I'm not a big beach person. Like I'm not
1:33
I have friends out there and I'm sure there's listeners. Both of them are probably listening and they're saying that I'm completely stupid
1:40
I'm not somebody that can sit on the beach for eight hours, like just take everything
1:44
out there in the morning and just stay the entire day. I have friends that can do that. I'm just like, I would lose my mind
1:50
My wife is somebody. I got to have things to do. Oh, my wife is that person
1:54
She can take a chair, one of those layout chairs, lay on the beach for like eight hours with a book and she's completely fine
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I am not. My ADD kicks in and I've got everything going in my head trying to figure out what I should be doing, what I could be doing
2:10
And I like action. Like I like even when we do, you know, go down to the beach, I love bringing games, whether it be cornhole or, you know, different games
2:20
There's a Frisbee game that we're playing. So I have to actually be doing something
2:23
I can't just lay there. You know, and I actually have the bad habit of, you know, if I'm playing cornhole or I'm playing bocce or something like that, and then I just kind of walk around and drink beer, you know, at the same time
2:36
But I really, my favorite thing to do on the beach, I love to fish
2:40
I love to, you know, throw out a line and stuff. But, you know, that's kind of you throw out a weighted line, get a couple of liters on it and just wait
2:46
But I love throwing the baseball or throwing the football. Yep. Yep. I absolutely love it
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You know, like I could stand there. I'm one of these repetitive type people
2:55
Even in high school, I could stand there and throw a ball for four hours straight
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When I would get tired, like hard throwing them, you know, you start doing underhand throws, you know, and sidearms and stuff
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I'd even switch over and I got pretty good at throwing left-handed just because of, you know, I'd spend my time like that, you know
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So no, I was going to say like, that's for me, there's been times where we'd come back
3:22
from vacation. I would feel like I need Tommy John surgery because I was just throwing the baseball or
3:26
throwing the football so much. Um, and then to your point about the beer, like you, when you play corn, anybody that
3:32
plays corn hole or bocce ball knows you got to have a counterweight in your hand and that's
3:36
your beer. So yeah, I mean, that's, that's a hundred percent. We, uh, you know, it was, it was a fun time
3:42
Well, today's episode, we are getting into double majors and minors. Which is going to be an interesting topic because I think we both have our opinions on this
3:53
And I'm interested to see if they match up or not. I can't tell
3:58
This is not something that we talked about prior to recording this. So I'm really interested to see kind of where you're going, see if we're on the same page or not
4:05
But I definitely have strong opinions on it. Yeah. Before we jump in, though, got to remind everybody, Reschooled.com
4:11
Check us out. Social media profiles. Check us out there. Of course, on your favorite podcasting app
4:16
Give us all the stars, all that good stuff. But big thing, we want to hear from you guys
4:21
Send us the messages that, you know, if you like our stuff, tell us
4:25
If you hate our stuff, tell us or just tell AJ, you know. Send me an email privately
4:30
Yeah. If you think he or I sound ridiculous, you should tell him, right
4:36
Ridiculous? Did you just call it ridiculous? Yeah, I think that's what I said
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That's pretty much our show right there. Yeah. So anyway, that's it
4:46
We want to hear from you. Give us something to talk about. Absolutely. Quick question, and this is probably going to be the most ��
4:53
I'll say this is going to probably be the quickest question we've ever had. Did you have a double major or minor
4:59
No. Okay. I did not. There was a lot of kicking it around, thoughts about it and stuff like that
5:06
but I did the mental math, and it just didn't make sense for me
5:11
And I didn't have it, but I think I was – a couple hours or a couple classes shy of having one of them just because I went so far into my
5:23
biology degree or my chemistry degree for pre-med that if I would have taken a couple more classes
5:30
I probably would have had one of the two. But I mean, what's a chemistry or biology major good
5:36
for if you're a business, you know, you're getting your business degree. So I just decided not to
5:41
to take on that. Brings up a good point. We need to go ahead and define for people
5:46
Yeah. Not everybody's in college yet, that type of thing. They haven't read these words or made
5:52
these decisions. We need to tell them what a major is, what a double major is, all that kind of stuff
5:56
what that means. So, yeah. So a double major is two majors. I got that one. I got that one on lock
6:03
But we got to define what is a major. So, okay, go ahead. You know, there's this long history in
6:08
the U S people don't realize that we've, our system of education is different than many other
6:13
places in the world, right? Now, other places in the world, particularly Europe, you know
6:17
they were conquesters and all that type thing. So, right. They imperialist and they, they kind of
6:24
installed their educational system in a lot of places, but the U S, you know, we kind of took a
6:28
little bit of a different route in terms of, you know, the way things played out in our higher
6:35
education system. So start with other systems say, you know, you learn on your basic stuff
6:40
your English, your histories, your social sciences, that kind of stuff in high school
6:44
And then you go on to college and well, you go on and you learn what you're going to do
6:50
your trade, your skill, your craft, that type of thing. Now, some of the more elite universities
6:55
were for scholars, right? They were for thinkers, all that kind of thing. You know, people who are
7:01
going to do, you know, probably aristocrats and things like that who already had positions
7:07
that they were going into. They had family companies. They had all those things. They were going to inherit titles and blah, blah, blah
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So, yeah, to be deep thinkers, to study philosophy, to study the, you know, past historical, you
7:22
know, works was something of benefit to them. Now in the United States we quickly after the revolution or during the revolution we trying to create a kind of an aristocratic class Right We were trying to match that of Europe and stuff
7:36
And basically, so our higher the institutions of higher education, our early places like UVA, Harvard, things like that
7:42
We adopted in the U.S. a full liberal arts system, which basically said we're going to create a well-rounded person
7:50
So college early on didn't even have majors. all it had was just this general focus of you study things under other people who were very
8:00
knowledgeable and that's how education systems started hiring PhDs and things like that because
8:04
they were like well you know you can go out and practice you can work under practitioners and
8:08
learn how to do things the big thing about college is you need to learn how to think and
8:12
who's out there thinking about things are people who study it all the time and just research it and
8:17
those are your your doctors of philosophy right PhD stands for doctor of philosophy right
8:23
So you hire these people. Now, over time, that changed. Right. You're sending more and more people to college
8:29
Not everybody is going to be an erudite. Right. Somebody who's just the expert in whatever they're doing
8:34
I know you got to use that big word. Right. We're in college now. So not everybody's going to be like that. Right
8:42
School had to orient itself more towards practical use in general fields
8:47
Right. And you had to set up for people to be able to go down a given track. So they developed things that said, all right, you're still going to get a arts based degree or a science based degree or whatever, but you're going to do concentrations in it
8:59
And they eventually called those majors and they put together all these classes
9:02
So now in college, a major comes out to be about 30 to 30, somewhere between 30 and 40
9:09
Right. 40 would be the very highest end. Most of them are about 30 to 36, but 30 to 40 credit hours in most courses
9:16
Right. For every I want to say it's for every about 30 to 40 hours of academic contact expected
9:26
You get one credit hour. So if you have a 15 week semester in the course meets for three hours a week to two sessions of an hour and a half each
9:36
Right. That is generally going to be three credit hours because you put three hours of academic classroom time into the course
9:46
per week. So that's how you get up. It's a three credit hour course. You meet for approximately
9:52
three hours per week. And you're taking 15 credit hours for the semester. You're in the classroom
9:59
15 hours a week. Now you're supposed to study outside the classroom and continue to learn and
10:04
all that stuff, though that is becoming less and less as college becomes more standardized
10:11
students are starting to expect to get everything from in class, right? Which is kind of an
10:16
impossibility, right? You have to do some work outside of class to do some reading. You have to
10:20
do some of those things and try to expand your knowledge. But anyway, bottom line, a major has
10:25
become this collection of classes that is normally some 30 hours of defined classes. So you can take
10:31
a certain set that they've defined that says, you know, 21 or 24 of the hours have to be this
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and this additional 10 to 12, you can choose courses from this list
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They all go together and there's a concentration within your school. And that is a major for you
10:49
And even within majors, sometimes you even have concentrations. So your major could be information technology
10:55
But of those courses that you have the opportunity to choose from, if you choose all cybersecurity, right
11:01
you can get a concentration within your major of cybersecurity or in business
11:06
If you want to take a bachelor's of business administration and you take all these business administration classes, but you take 18 of those hours in accounting, you can get a concentration in accounting. Right. And so you have your majors and then within the majors, you'll sometimes have concentrations
11:23
And then some schools will even say, you know, you don't have to take all of these classes
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You don't have to take 36. You could take 10 or 12 hours, right
11:32
Four classes or 15 hours in some given course of study. And we'll give you what's called a minor
11:38
And a minor is usually somewhere between one third and one half of the number of courses you have to take in a given area to get a major
11:47
So that's what we're kind of baselining it on. And schools will vary a little bit in how many hours fit into a major, a minor and a concentration
11:56
Right. But that's the common parlance that you're going to hear. Major, minor
12:02
There you go. So now we're ready to run with it. Everybody understands what we're talking about
12:07
Yeah. And I will say, too, for the most part, I look at concentrations very similar to minors, minors within your degree
12:14
So, like, for instance, at our college, we have concentrations. and it's, we don't have, we have one major in the school of business and it's a
12:24
bachelor's of business administration. But under that we have concentration. So you're not going
12:29
to take 36 hours of accounting to get an accounting major. You're going to take 36 hours or you're
12:37
going to take so many hours. I can't remember how many there are, but you're going to take so many hours of business classes, which some include accounting, but then you're also going to take
12:45
like you said, the 18 specific to accounting. So you're going to get that. Here's my major of
12:50
business in general. And then I'm going to have this minor, which we're going to call
12:55
concentration because it's within that degree. We're going to call it accounting or whatever
12:59
it is, marketing, whatever you're going for. So I kind of look at minors and concentrations as
13:04
similar. Yeah. Depending on the structure of the college. Minors normally, people have to do that outside of their common school, right? You don't get your
13:11
major and then a minor within your major. You get a concentration, you know, and they kind of fit
13:16
together. Your concentration classes satisfy, you know, towards your major. You're just taking that
13:23
concentration. But a minor, normally most of the classes are separate. They do not double count
13:31
right? They don't satisfy your major and your minor, at least from what I've seen in most places
13:37
Yeah. So just to kind of give you some examples, let's do it this way because you just did a great job defining majors, minors, concentrations. Now let's go into the double majors. Again, we don't have to go into the minors because we just talked about that, but double majors. Oh, I guess we can go into minors
13:56
Let's give some examples of possible double majors or minors, majors with minors that you can think of
14:04
So for one, for instance, for me, you know, I've seen quite a few students at our college come through and they're getting a major in IT, but they're getting a business minor, some business minor, because they work hand in hand
14:18
I would honestly say the sky's the limit. You can get double major in anything you want to
14:24
It's just about whether you're willing to stay there, to take the time, to take the classes
14:30
Lots of people come back. They graduate from college and they come back again and get a separate major, right
14:36
Because they're like, I graduated with this. It's not the career field I want to get into
14:40
I realized that I should have studied this other stuff and I need the credential
14:44
I need it. I need something to say that I've, you know, taken this line of courses without just saying
14:50
I've taken a few courses there. So they want that certificate you know for the full course load So they come out and get a second major right Some people know early on that they want to do something that might not work out So they have a fallback plan So they
15:07
study two things. Other people are just very interested in two things and can't decide
15:12
They're like, I just want to learn about these things. And they follow the course sequence and
15:16
they get majors. So while strategically, logically, there is a way to maximize your time
15:24
and get multiple majors, majors and minors, majors and concentrations. But as long as you've got the time and the money, don't hold back, right
15:39
Expand yourself in however way. And in a perfect world, we would all take a lot of classes in a lot of areas
15:45
that would expand us as people, right? But time is a factor
15:50
You have to move on with life. You have to make money. You have to take on responsibility and you can't afford to just be a perpetual student
15:58
So there you go. Right. Well, let's get into the biggest question of this entire episode
16:03
What is your opinion on Double Made in Minds? I have a really strong opinion
16:08
It might be better to hear your opinion first. What's your opinion? I'm not a big fan of them
16:12
I don't see. To me, there are a few, very few situations where I can see them being advantageous to the point of me saying, yes, I think you should go to double majors or a minor
16:29
But in all other situations, there are other better options out there
16:35
the one that comes to my mind always, because I have a lot of students, I've had students in the
16:40
past, I've seen students in the past wonder this, whether it was when I was in undergrad
16:45
But for some reason, and I think it's just because of the, they feel like there's a job demand for it
16:53
or it opens the door more maybe, giving them a greater kind of net to cast. But for some reason
17:01
And I've had, you know, or I shouldn't say had because we don't have major, we don't have different majors in business in our school
17:08
But I've seen students in other schools, I've talked to them, where they were contemplating doing a double major in accounting and finance
17:15
And again, if you're looking at it from the outside, you're like, okay, well, you're just, like I said, you're building this net
17:22
It's a wider net to cast. So you can say you can go into accounting or you can go into finance
17:27
But to me, from a hiring perspective, I think most hiring companies or companies that are hiring for positions, whatever, they're looking for a specific specialization
17:41
They kind of want somebody that knows a lot about a little but not a little about a lot
17:46
And if you're really kind of, and I've said this to my students specifically, if you're really interested in looking at a finance and accounting degree and you're willing to put in that extra time to do the double major, then go get a master's
18:01
Master's is going to set you up even higher. So like if you want accounting and finance, then get an undergrad in accounting and a master's in finance or vice versa
18:09
Get an undergrad in finance and get a master's in accounting. but what you're doing is by getting the master's you're setting yourself up further I mean to be
18:18
able to say that you got a graduate degree versus somebody who has an undergrad it's going to make
18:21
you look different it's going to make you look a little bit better when it comes to the hiring process so instead of spending the time to get a double major another undergrad why not just take
18:30
that time and go into a master's program minor is kind of the same thing the only time I would say
18:35
a minor would be important is if you're really looking to expand your knowledge on a certain
18:44
topic. So I guess another way to say that would be, I would almost say if you're thinking about
18:49
a minor, if you're doing it for the purpose of the degree, don't do it. If you're doing it for
18:53
the purpose of the education, then you have something that's justifiable in terms of the
18:59
minor. But for the purpose of doing it for a degree, there's so many better options because
19:04
Again, you're going to be spending more money and more time. Why not go get a higher level degree
19:09
That's my opinion on it. What's yours? So the reason my opinions are so strong on this is because I have serious reservations about where the higher education system is going and what it's become
19:24
In my opinion, much of college has become the 13th, 14th, 15th, and 16th grade
19:31
And I have a lot of frustrations with that. I have I'm strongly oriented to the very career focused general learning and education through your career focus type of thing
19:44
But even for people who don't have a career focus, I'm very focused on general knowledge and understanding about being a well-rounded person
19:53
OK, skills you can acquire on your own. You barely need college for that
19:58
And, you know, everything I believe you could be an accountant without ever taking a day of college classes
20:04
I believe you could be a lawyer without ever taking a day of college classes
20:09
But I don't think you could be a well-rounded, thoughtful individual without having the exposure that college gives you
20:18
Now, you could get that through travel. You could get that through concentrated area in study, research and things like that
20:26
But most people don't have the resources, the knowledge or ability to do that
20:29
So school is the most structured approach to it. Now, with that being said, I will differ on your opinion a little bit about what employers want
20:38
Employers just want somebody these days who can communicate well, who has been through something
20:43
They oftentimes don't even care about their majors and stuff like that
20:47
It would be nice if they come in with some level of skills, but they realize that if you're a good student, you're diligent, you work hard, you can learn how to do anything
20:55
And but so many students, because we're sending more and more a higher percentage of our population to college, it's just eroding the quality of the student in college
21:05
Right. We've you know, you honestly, you just have to lower the standards across the board
21:09
I've got college students who cannot write a clear, concise paragraph. They cannot write a grammatically correct combination of sentences in a paragraph
21:19
And that never used to be the case with a college graduate. it, right? Not only could they write grammatically correctly, they were well-rounded in the history
21:29
of where they came from. They had some exposure in their field normally through internships and
21:33
practicums. They could quote philosophy. They had this area of acquired knowledge that was
21:41
more well-rounded. Now you have people who are just checking the box, going through classes
21:45
And honestly, if I had to honestly assess at the end of the semester whether my students know the subject matter, which I've taught them the whole semester, the answer is maybe one out of 50 could score even a 20 or 30 or 40 percent
22:06
Their knowledge base at the end of it is so low by comparison
22:10
So college is coming to become this thing of just exposure without a level of mastery
22:16
at all. And that's kind of what we have to have to work in
22:20
Right. And that's you have to you have to play the system. I would love to see a revamp of the entire system But understanding what our system is like and how employers look at things Oftentimes employers like I say will look at your major and say it
22:37
good, right? You've studied finance, so you should at least have some level of exposure. It'll be
22:43
easier to teach you what it takes to do your job here and things like that. Having a second major
22:50
towards that same purpose usually is not very useful. But if a second major allows you to go
22:58
down roads that you otherwise could not, meaning that without getting a major, I could never get
23:05
this second certification, right? Without, for example, like, you know, I went to law school
23:12
but I can never practice patent law because I can't sit for the patent bar. I would have been
23:18
undergraduate had to have had an engineering or specific science or computer-based major
23:25
Now, I am very happy with the well-rounded major that I chose, but I also didn't realize
23:33
that if I ever wanted to do some of that, I'd be limited. So if I do realize, right, I want to do those things, I probably should have gotten that
23:42
second major. And it's not just taking the courses, right? You know, by the time you've taken all those courses, you've got at least a minor
23:49
You've probably got a major. So, again, there's this signaling function that comes along with it
23:54
Same way with medical school. You can major in just about anything you want to as long as you take the minor or excuse
24:01
me, not a minor, but the courses that are required to sit for the MCAT exam
24:07
Right. And to meet the entry requirements into medical school. So you can take the biologies, the chemistries, the anatomies, the physiologies, those types of things that will prepare you for the MCAT and that type of thing
24:19
But by the time you've taken all that, you've at least got a minor type thing
24:24
And in many situations, to actually have that certificate has a signaling function that means something
24:33
So anyway, these are all obviously my personal opinion. Right. They they don't represent the opinion of anyone else, not another school, not another person type thing
24:43
But if you're trying to, you know, you and I just have a slightly different opinion on it
24:49
I have frustrations with less about the education system and more about what the hiring world expects and how education is fitting into that now
25:00
I really believe in a new model where, you know, you're a well-rounded person, but you're a well-rounded person because you are engaged by and driven by your career path
25:12
Right. That type of thing. So anyway, that's so the the whole double major thing has its limited use cases
25:21
But just to get it to get it like getting something like finance and accounting together makes almost no sense
25:28
I certainly wouldn't stay another semester to get it. I certainly wouldn't do any of those things because one can do the other just fine
25:36
Now, if you needed if you're a finance major and you want to sit for the CPA exam and you need those extra accounting classes, well, go back and take the accounting classes
25:44
And that might result in a double major. Well, good for you. Right
25:48
That's a type scenario. But if you don't need something for some level of certification like a CPA, like sitting for the CFA exam, like being a financial planner, like whatever
26:02
I mean, I'm just throwing these out there, like going to medical school, like being a patent agent along with being a practicing attorney
26:10
Yeah, I don't see much value in it, quite frankly. Well, it kind of goes into the next question, which are the positives and negatives of it
26:17
Like, can we, let's go through a couple, if we can just point out a few points, specific
26:22
points of the positives and negatives of it. I think the negatives would be the most obvious one, which is an extra cost, extra time
26:30
Oh yeah. Cost and time. Yeah. That's the two biggest ones. And I don't think we need to go anywhere past that really, because I can't think of any
26:38
other ones other than, I guess you can go into secondary issues where it's like you're
26:44
depending on how you're taking it. So if you're taking double majors at the same time, you could be taking focus off of one class that you really should be needing versus putting on a class that you feel like you need to put that focus on, but it's really not going to help you
26:59
So I guess you have secondary issues, but we've both kind of talked about our opinions not being very good when it comes to double majors and minors
27:10
But let's see if we can come up with some positives as to why someone would go
27:15
Well, let me throw one negative out there. Sure. Yeah, please. It creates negative perceptions among others
27:24
If others are looking to you as the mentor or model of what you do in school, right, going through life, we all have these little minor models or mentors that we're following, right
27:36
The people that give us some direction and things like that. And you see somebody do one thing versus another
27:41
All of a sudden you're like, well, I should do that too, right? I should get that degree too
27:45
I should do that because that's got to be some signal towards their success
27:49
You see that with like graduate programs like MBAs and things like that. Oh, other people have it
27:53
So I should do it. Right. Even no matter the value that it gives to you. Right
27:58
You just do it. Right. I see one problem I see, and I see this primarily with people who have no educational background
28:05
prior to coming into college and stuff, trying to stack graduate degrees and they're kind
28:11
of lower quality online graduate degrees. And they just stack them one on top of the other and they do nothing for them career wise. Right. So there's this like societal and overall impression that it gives others when you do things that that is necessary. So in a way. Right. I'm a big proponent of you should be a you. We do have an obligation to others in society to be a model for them
28:42
maybe not actively and maybe not a pure mentor to them where they can talk to us
28:48
but to act in a way that represents just theories of goodness, right
28:55
That is just a positive element, how you treat others, how you, right
29:02
your acceptance of others, right? The values that you place on things, right
29:08
That type of thing, right? Materialism versus, you know, doing things for the common good, right
29:14
That type of thing, right? So everything you do, you are a mentor, you are a role model
29:21
And pursuing things and putting a lot of emphasis on it can create a misimpression to others about what is necessary or what you should be doing in college
29:32
So that being said, right, that's the only thing I can identify outside of cost and time
29:37
Um, uh, positive for me, I'm going to move over to the positive and I'm going to focus
29:44
more on minors because minors to me are the ones that I can say, okay, that's somewhat
29:50
justifiable in certain situations. Double majors are tougher. Um, again, if it's needed for a specific, uh, career, like you were talking about with patent
29:59
law. That's one thing more from a minor perspective, because you're not taking as many
30:05
classes as you would a double major. I'm going to go back to what I was saying earlier about my
30:11
opinion with, you know, double majors, minors, is that if you're doing it, if you're looking for it
30:15
for the purpose of the educational side of it, and you feel like that's where you're going to get the
30:21
best foundational knowledge of it, then that's a positive. So for instance, if you're going to go
30:27
into IT, you're going to get your major in IT and you're going to do something in IT, but you're
30:33
going to have your own business, then there is a need for you to understand the business foundations
30:40
how to set up your business, how to run a business, intrinsic motivations, extrinsic motivations
30:45
those kinds of things. You need to know those kinds of things. And those are things that you would get hopefully from business classes. Now, could you get those elsewhere? You probably could
30:54
but you're in the setting already. Once you get into your career
30:59
you're pretty much going 90 miles an hour and finding the time to get that extra little bit of education
31:05
may be a little bit more difficult. I was actually talking to some people
31:10
about possibly doing some work with them, some consulting work with them because they are so good at what they do
31:16
but not the business structuring side of it, if that makes sense
31:22
They were more or less struggling with the structuring of the business. And that's just something that you could get from possibly a minor or just taking some extra classes, but which could lead to a minor
31:35
That to me, the educational side of it is a positive or could potentially be a positive if you're doing it for that reason
31:42
If you're doing it for the – to me, and let me put this in a completely different way
31:46
If you're going into your majors still worried about your GPA, then you're doing it the wrong way because you are checking those boxes that you're talking about
31:52
If you're going in there and you're actually putting the work in and studying outside of class because you truly want to learn and be educated about this kind of stuff, then a minor, sure, that's completely worth it to me
32:04
Justifiable, I should say, because it's going to give you that. So it is the difference between the learning side versus the checking the box because you feel like you need to have this and you're going to the academic side of it
32:16
Um, that's where the defining piece is to me. So do it for educational purposes
32:21
Did you have one? I couldn't, I couldn't agree more. That maybe the only other one I've got is, like I said, society is what it is
32:31
You want to express that you have some exposure to something that can't be assumed
32:37
So a degree does have a signaling function. So if I tell somebody or if I going to talk with somebody about something or I going to need some level of credentials in order to be recognized as having knowledge respected in the area people willing to listen right
32:56
In order for me to in some way exert influence, right? That is to convince people in an argument, to show people that, you know, well-rounded is a good thing
33:09
a signaling function can be useful. If you, you know, you start talking with someone
33:17
it's kind of like this, you know, you start talking with someone, someone
33:21
shares their opinion and you share your opinion and they doubt you, right? Or they don't. And I say
33:29
well, you know, when I was studying this, right, you know, I have a degree in this, right? So
33:35
what it took me down was this path. I've noticed that people tend to put more cretins in what
33:41
you're saying. They're like, okay, you're not just coming up with an opinion. You've actually got an
33:46
informed opinion about what you're saying. So there is some credibility factor that comes from
33:58
saying, I've studied this to a certain degree, and that signaling function of attaching the degree to
34:05
it saying, look, I've got a full degree in that. People also in their minds go to, well, you've
34:10
taken 12 classes at least or 10 classes at least around that topic. You probably know a little bit
34:17
more about it than just reading whatever, you know, article on whatever platform, right
34:25
about that topic. So there is a signaling function where you can use it appropriately
34:31
Now, too many people depend on that signaling function to, again, like I say, they think that that signaling function is going to get them a job or going to create opportunities for them
34:45
And they don't realize just stacking degrees where you don't actually know that much
34:51
Right. You've just checked the box. Like I say, I've got so many students currently that, you know, I've been teaching for 10 years now
35:03
And I got to say, I'm moving academic institutions, right? And that is something I got to let the people know
35:09
And nothing I say represents the opinion of the academic institution that you and I have been at, right
35:15
And we still are there, right? But I'm going to a new academic institution because I love the business model more
35:20
I love the educational model more. I think it more aligns with what I see as the perfect type of model But I had students for so many years that again they finish my class and they just don
35:36
know much at all. But they'll tell people they've got a business degree or they've got to do concentration
35:42
in something. And that's a signaling function to the world. But at the same time, all they've really done is check the box or they'll go get a master's
35:51
degree in something. And truth be told, they really do not know much about that subject
35:58
Right. I've met people who've never taken a business class because I'm into entrepreneurship
36:03
I was on the phone yesterday talking with a nurse anesthetist. Right
36:09
That's just taking biology and nursing classes. But she has tried starting her own startup in a product based field
36:16
And she has more business knowledge and acumen than almost any of my business school graduate students who are graduating
36:27
And she acquired it 100 percent on her own type scenario. But somebody will say, oh, I got a business degree in, you know, whatever
36:36
And people will make an assumption that they know what they're talking about
36:41
And, you know, she lacks that formal credential. She was asking me, you know, should I go to an MBA program
36:46
Should I do this type of thing? And I was like, for what purpose? If you want a job that needs that credential, perhaps if you want to
36:53
But when it comes to do you have the knowledge or the ability to acquire the knowledge that you need to be successful in your startup
37:01
Then absolutely not. Waste of time, waste of money type scenario. So anyway, that's an example. Just my opinion. I'll throw it back to you now
37:10
I know I've been talking for a while, but so, you know, that's why I have such a strong opinion on this whole double major thing
37:16
Well, and I'll end it here too, because I think we're both kind of saying the same thing. Our end point is the same. So the direction that we get there is a little bit different. But I will say this, and this is something that we talked about on one of our very first episodes. I can't remember which exactly which one it was, but we were talking about, you know, is college for everyone
37:33
and you said yes to make a more well-rounded person and I said no because it's really dependent
37:41
on the end point but kind of the same thing because I mean yes it does but if your career
37:45
doesn't depend on it then it's not necessary for you to have one and that's what a lot of students
37:51
are going for right now is they say well I'm going to get a college degree because you know x y and z
37:55
has them and I feel like I need them but they don't know what their end result their their their
38:00
their end goal is. Same thing with a minor. I think a lot of students
38:04
and same double major too, but I think a lot of students see that, like you said
38:08
where they see double majors and minors being represented by their peers That what they going for And they think well I need to go for that And in reality there are possibly better options
38:19
And that's kind of what I'm getting to here with my last point is just take the time to understand what other options are out there
38:27
Like, you don't have to have a minor. Maybe a certificate would be better
38:32
You know, if you got a specific certificate and a certain skill set plus your normal major, which you have
38:38
which we've graduated with, then that's probably going to be even more beneficial than a minor
38:45
Or because you have specialized classes and you can put that on your resume versus just the minor
38:51
It's one of those things to say that you've got a minor in, I'm just going to use this hypothetically, to say you've got a minor in accounting, the person hiring you doesn't know
38:58
what that specializes in. They know you have a minor skill set that comes from accounting
39:06
if you are in if you got a certificate it's usually specialized
39:11
it's specialized in whether it be bookkeeping processes systems anything like that
39:20
so I would say that's probably the biggest thing for me is understand your options
39:26
there's opportunity costs out there because it's going to cost you more time and more money if you go through the minor
39:31
versus if you were to go through the certificate side The certificate side or any options that are out there, I think, could be more beneficial depending on your situation
39:39
So just take the time to do your homework to figure out which one is it really necessary
39:44
Don't go based on what somebody else is doing. So that's my last point
39:49
This has been a cool episode. I was kind of apprehensive about it just because I know I never had double majors or minors
39:56
And I had my opinion on it. And now listening to you, it's the same thing
40:01
You have your opinions on it as well. but you didn't have those. It's been a really interesting episode
40:06
Hopefully this will get some information, give better information to our listeners
40:12
so that they can make their own educated and informed decisions when it comes time
40:18
Well, this has been good. You got anything to say before we head out? Just remind everybody, visit our website
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because, like I say, we want to hear from you. Contact us any way you know how
40:33
awesome well we hope you enjoyed it we hope to see you next time goodbye take care thanks for
40:41
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