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Michel Eric Dyson Talks About our Racial Reckoning In New Book ‘Long Time Coming’ | SWAY’S UNIVERSE
Dec 28, 2020
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Michel Eric Dyson Talks About our Racial Reckoning In New Book ‘Long Time Coming’ | SWAY’S UNIVERSE https://youtu.be/YE_Q0DefQfo
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0:00
[Applause]
0:00
my next guest tonight is a professor at
0:03
vanderbilt university and a new york
0:05
times best-selling author of over 20
0:07
books
0:07
his newest is long time coming
0:11
please welcome back to a late show
0:12
michael eric dyson
0:14
professor dyson good to see you again my
0:16
friend always great to see you
0:18
you've authored 20 books this new book
0:20
long time coming uses a slightly
0:22
different form than you've used in the
0:24
past this
0:24
this is written in the form of letters
0:27
to
0:28
black victims of police brutality and
0:31
racism in the united states why did you
0:33
want to write these letters to these
0:35
people
0:35
rather than about them i didn't want to
0:37
further objectify them i didn't want to
0:39
exploit their death
0:41
as a way to sell books i wanted to
0:42
commune with them
0:44
by talking to them by communing with
0:47
them
0:47
i'm thinking out loud it's forcing me to
0:49
talk about how they died
0:51
how do we stop the train of incessant
0:55
killing of black people especially at
0:57
the hands of cops
0:58
but also by vigilantes and what can we
1:01
do
1:01
to derive wisdom from their journey so
1:04
that we can prevent others from
1:06
suffering a similar fate that voice
1:09
ladies and that voice is a voice of
1:13
power
1:14
a voice of academia he's an author he's
1:17
a preacher already a host a professor
1:20
he's a mentor he's a leader he's a guide
1:24
he's a brother he's a friend
1:26
he's a family member and he's a citizen
1:30
let's sway in the morning michael eric
1:32
dyson is back
1:33
[Applause]
1:38
yes
1:54
come on professor oh my god how great it
1:57
is to be back on with y'all
1:59
oh man i love it too man by the way rich
2:02
nice is on the line with us
2:04
hey rich nice and uh
2:06
[Applause]
2:10
did tracy do you have a birthday
2:12
recently i don't know
2:14
in november my dear almost exactly a
2:17
month ago
2:19
i figured but it was recent to me
2:24
and same with heather b as well you're
2:26
right on the nose i love you my guy
2:29
no doubt love you all too love all of
2:31
y'all yo yo
2:32
mike i want to get to it man i want to
2:34
open up the phone lines to 888-742-3345
2:38
we got professor michael eric dyson here
2:40
new book long time coming reckoning with
2:42
race
2:43
in america and i thought stephen colbert
2:46
did a great job of
2:48
kind of scaling the surface of what this
2:50
book is about
2:51
and you do uh begin chapters writing to
2:53
people who were killed at the hands of
2:55
police
2:56
um but even before that you wrote
2:58
something about someone who's still here
3:00
with us today
3:01
in the front of the book and the first
3:03
letter it feels like you wrote
3:06
um what's about lebron james
3:09
yeah yeah yeah and his significance in
3:12
these times and i thought it was so
3:14
eloquently written and everything you
3:16
said about them
3:17
is how i feel lebron james greatest
3:19
basketball player on the globe
3:21
in the conversation for goat founder of
3:24
the i
3:25
promise school for at-risk children
3:27
media mogul global business magnate
3:30
uh transformative philanthropists
3:31
outspoken social activists who refused
3:34
to shut up and dribble started at the
3:35
bottom now you're here for standing with
3:37
black people without excuse of apology
3:39
and for embracing people of all races
3:41
around the world talk about
3:42
lebron james's significance in this day
3:45
and age for me
3:46
if you can oh man yeah no doubt man
3:49
i mean the greatest athletic spectacle
3:52
since
3:52
i leave a man of extraordinary
3:55
character obviously uh ingenious
3:58
achievement on the court
4:00
as i said greatest ballplayer in the
4:02
world at this advanced age
4:05
jay-z said never been up this good this
4:07
long this hood this pop this one will
4:10
get cut up
4:11
this dude understands that he has to
4:13
take care of his body
4:14
18 years into his career still
4:18
at the apex of his talent still at the
4:20
height
4:21
of basketball wizardry and in the
4:24
conversation for the greatest of all
4:25
time and when you put it all together
4:27
what he's doing on the court what he's
4:29
done to change the game
4:30
by making the big three a thing in the
4:33
nba
4:33
and letting players determine where they
4:36
will go
4:36
by signing shorter contracts and
4:39
shifting the economic balance
4:41
of power uh from exclusively the
4:44
province of owners
4:45
into the hands of players he changed the
4:47
game that way
4:48
and then off the court he is
4:49
incomparable speaking up for black
4:52
people
4:52
talking about ordinary black citizens
4:55
starting schools
4:56
for young people whose you know
4:58
resources
4:59
don't match their ambition and providing
5:02
opportunity
5:03
to articulate our uh resistance to
5:06
anti-blackness being honest about how he
5:08
has been victimized no matter his wealth
5:10
by having the n-word scribbled on his
5:13
gates in l.a
5:14
this remarkable figure and unlike ali
5:17
who was forced into social
5:18
activism because the government snatched
5:21
away his title
5:22
at the height of his powers you know
5:24
lebron james on his own
5:27
using his athletic genius as a platform
5:30
to leverage social consciousness has
5:33
done something
5:34
i think even more remarkable without
5:36
being denied access into
5:38
an entree into the greater privileges of
5:41
fame and celebrity and wealth he decides
5:45
regardless of his access he will still
5:48
not pretend
5:49
he didn't come from where he came from
5:51
and he speaks out about racism
5:53
as articulately and as brilliantly as
5:55
any athlete ever
5:56
that's why he's in a class by himself
5:58
and a remarkable figure
6:00
and i wanted to dedicate this book to
6:01
him lebron james i'm not a
6:04
round of applause for that you can find
6:06
uninterrupted on pandora
6:08
here with our company um
6:12
i love reading this book
6:15
you know i love going through the
6:16
chapters and
6:18
you know some people you know how uh
6:21
some singers uh acquired taste and
6:24
you know and and others appeal to all
6:27
because of the way their voice is
6:28
universal
6:30
your writing is universal professor
6:32
dyson i appreciate
6:34
how you write um yo the visuals come to
6:36
life in my head when i read in your
6:38
writing
6:39
you said in this book the night of may
6:41
25th 2020 changed america
6:44
forever can you talk about that
6:47
yes sir thank you for the compliment
6:49
from one of our legendary
6:51
uh figures in not only hip-hop but in
6:53
american media
6:55
and in journalism you know um that night
6:58
was
6:58
significant because it was the night
7:01
that uh george floyd
7:03
uh was in minneapolis minnesota you know
7:06
minding his own business at a
7:07
convenience store with a couple of his
7:09
partners
7:10
in his ride had just bought some
7:12
cigarettes and other goodies
7:14
they're in the car a 20 bill was
7:17
supposedly passed that was
7:19
counterfeit but as the owner of the
7:20
convenience store later said
7:22
he probably didn't even know it he being
7:24
george floyd because most people with
7:26
counterfeit money don't even realize
7:27
they have it they acquired it somewhere
7:29
else
7:29
they're passing it along so here's a guy
7:32
who's
7:33
has the police caught on him by a couple
7:34
of the people in the convenience store
7:36
they get there
7:37
uh they immediately escalate the
7:39
situation draw their guns
7:41
and before you know it um this young man
7:44
six foot six
7:46
george floyd 46 years old is laying
7:49
prostrate
7:49
on the ground with the knee of derek
7:52
chovin
7:53
an officer from that police department
7:56
boring his knee into the neck of this
7:59
prostrate vulnerable black man on the
8:01
ground
8:02
who is begging for relief who was saying
8:04
i can't breathe
8:05
haven't we seen this film before yes
8:07
when we saw
8:08
eric garner begging for breath 11 times
8:11
saying i can't breathe
8:13
uh a few years ago six years before
8:16
and now here this sequel is and surely
8:20
derek chovin as an officer saw that film
8:23
surely he saw the consequence
8:25
of people hitting the streets as a
8:27
result of the horrible chokehold that
8:29
was applied
8:30
to eric garner and now he doesn't want
8:33
to repeat that no he doesn't care
8:35
with wanton disregard for darnella
8:38
frazier
8:39
who is the 17 year old black girl on the
8:42
street
8:42
recording his infamous decline
8:46
into fatality for mr floyd that his knee
8:49
is pressing harder and harder
8:51
against the neck of george floyd his
8:54
mortally depressed column being even
8:56
further
8:56
asphyxiated by this man's pressure he
8:58
puts his hand
8:59
in his pocket like i don't really give a
9:02
damn that i am indifferent to this man's
9:04
pleas and cries and even
9:06
at one point he goes look you're talking
9:07
so clearly you can breathe
9:09
this is a callous disregard for black
9:11
life and on that date
9:12
george floyd lost his life earlier in
9:15
that day unbeknownst to us
9:17
at the same time or at least on the same
9:19
day amy cooper
9:21
was talking to chris christian cooper in
9:24
central park and he asked her to leash
9:27
her dog
9:28
we all know the story she pretended that
9:30
he was a minister society a danger to
9:32
her
9:33
called the police and lied what we don't
9:35
know
9:36
is that she placed a second call saying
9:38
that her life was being threatened that
9:40
he was threatening to harm her
9:42
this is the kind of mendacity to which
9:44
some people will think
9:46
in order to further indict black
9:49
masculinity and black people more
9:51
generally so on that date
9:53
we saw the descent of america into some
9:56
depths
9:57
of horrible disregard for black life and
9:59
a lot of white folk for the first time
10:02
saw that what black people have been
10:03
saying was true wait a minute
10:05
he wasn't passing the police he was
10:07
saying officer he wasn't trying to run
10:09
from anybody he was on the ground
10:11
he didn't have a weapon he didn't have a
10:12
gun the police weren't afraid
10:14
this is an act of murder in front of the
10:17
world
10:18
and millions of white people saw that
10:20
because they were at home
10:21
during the pandemic watching their
10:23
screens so they were more
10:25
likely to see this in a different
10:27
fashion and they
10:28
flooded the streets the protest began
10:31
the swelling of those protests
10:33
with the bodies of white people were the
10:35
greatest protests
10:36
in the history of this nation against
10:38
racial injustice because for the first
10:40
time many white folk
10:41
who were outraged by what they saw
10:43
identified with black people asserted
10:46
that black lives matter
10:47
and that started one of the most
10:49
powerful movements for social justice
10:52
that evolved in our own century
10:55
professor michael eric dyson is here a
10:58
long time coming reckoning with raising
11:00
america
11:01
i love it um tracy jump in listen
11:04
i'm here to do just that mike so
11:08
i want to get your thoughts on one of
11:10
the most complicated forms of
11:12
racism which to me is massage misogynoir
11:16
the intersection of racism and sexism
11:20
and i think about our vice
11:22
president-elect
11:23
kamala harris right the daughter of an
11:26
indian mother
11:27
and a jamaican father she has risen
11:30
higher in this country's leadership than
11:32
any woman ever before her i would love
11:36
to know
11:37
how one you would come to her aid
11:40
when the inevitable happens where she
11:43
has to deal with
11:44
a psychological challenge of people just
11:47
spewing hate
11:49
simply because of sexism
11:52
and racism combined right what would you
11:54
say to her to get her
11:56
mind back at equilibrium and also
11:59
what do you say to those who feel
12:02
threatened by black women reclaiming
12:05
their power
12:07
i've also heard from those who feel like
12:09
they no longer even have an identity
12:12
particularly some white men who don't
12:15
know what their role is
12:17
in this world anymore and it almost
12:19
feels like a form of oppression
12:21
seeing black people seeing specifically
12:24
black women
12:25
enter spaces that they once dominated
12:27
what would you say to them
12:29
to i don't know bring their minds back
12:32
to equilibrium
12:33
right right as usual you're
12:35
deconstructing
12:37
modes of logic with clarity that are
12:39
edifying and insightful so let me say
12:41
this
12:42
uh the massage noir is a tragedy and a
12:45
trauma
12:46
misogyny in black faith misogyny by
12:49
african-american men misogyny against
12:52
black women uh expressed by a whole
12:54
range of male
12:55
suspects and patriarchal culture the
12:58
thing is is that this woman
13:00
got there the old-fashioned way she
13:01
earned it ain't nobody gave her nothing
13:02
she's 55.
13:04
she's brilliant she's been the attorney
13:06
general of california
13:08
she was a woman in charge of the biggest
13:10
department of justice
13:11
outside of the united states department
13:13
of justice
13:14
she has skills then she was a united
13:16
states senator
13:18
from california one of the few black
13:20
women ever to serve in that
13:21
august body of a hundred senators
13:24
representing the legislative priorities
13:26
of particular states
13:27
so ain't nobody gave her nothing she did
13:30
it the old-fashioned way she earned it
13:31
so if you are upset because kamala
13:34
harris has ascended to the heights
13:36
of american political order and she did
13:39
it because she was
13:40
chosen by the president-elect of the
13:42
united states of america joe biden
13:44
because she represented something
13:46
intelligent inspiring
13:48
uh and insightful that's your problem
13:50
not hers and i would tell her
13:51
kamala harris and i've known her for
13:53
several years to keep striving
13:56
keep stepping don't let anybody hold you
13:58
back
13:59
don't let me play uh you know mcfadden
14:01
and whitehead i know you're all too
14:02
young to know about
14:03
ain't no stopping us now so she's on a
14:06
path
14:07
of of tremendous trajectory and let's be
14:10
honest
14:11
she is set up to become the first female
14:15
president
14:16
of the united states of america that's
14:19
an experiment
14:20
a black man a black woman who is
14:22
unapologetically black went to an hbcu
14:24
hu
14:25
you know she represents that as well as
14:27
the largest society and i say the white
14:29
men get used to it this ain't the last
14:31
one this is the first one
14:32
to open up the doors and don't see it as
14:35
a form of oppression because
14:36
now you playing in the sandbox of life
14:38
and your mama tell you you got to share
14:40
your toys
14:41
white privilege has given you an unfair
14:43
advantage that allows you to lay claim
14:45
to things that because of your
14:47
mediocrity
14:48
you continue to lay claim to not because
14:50
you're more talented
14:51
not because you're more skilled but
14:53
because your white skin has given you a
14:55
privilege
14:56
that you know was unearned so learn to
14:58
share it with those who worked harder
15:00
fought deeper were more broad in their
15:02
understanding of the world
15:04
and now begin to share this this is not
15:06
a denunciation
15:07
of american society or repudiation of
15:10
american democracy
15:11
it is the living out as dr king said of
15:14
the true meaning of its creed thank god
15:16
for kamala harris
15:17
and let's all get on board and support
15:19
what she represents
15:21
and stand tall to be not only proud but
15:24
to be involved
15:25
in the redirection of american democracy
15:28
that don't mean you can't disagree with
15:29
her
15:29
that don't mean that everything she says
15:31
you down with nobody that you support
15:33
should receive your uncritical support
15:35
we saw that with uh both
15:37
donald trump and we saw it list quite
15:39
frankly with some black people who no
15:41
matter what obama did
15:42
were riding with obama too let's learn
15:45
to love and appreciate and support those
15:48
that we stand behind but be willing to
15:50
be critical
15:51
and introspective at the appropriate
15:53
point that we have to disagree with them
15:55
that includes everybody
15:57
including me and y'all and everybody
15:59
else we love
16:00
yeah it is a 4-5 michael eric dyson is
16:03
here rich knights
16:06
grand rising grand rajan first i want to
16:08
say i respect all the work you've done
16:10
and continue to do man
16:11
it's a pleasure to speak with you on
16:13
this day um
16:15
i love this book and the style that it's
16:17
in so follow me for a second i feel like
16:19
this is a pen pal moment for me
16:22
dear michael eric dyson i hope this
16:24
reaches you in a good state of mind
16:26
health and spirit
16:27
i was wondering what you thought it
16:29
would take for black america
16:31
to get sovereignty or something equal to
16:34
what native american tribes have
16:36
and will it take black america to take
16:39
their talents
16:40
somewhere else to achieve disrespect
16:44
wow look at that penmanship look at that
16:47
expression
16:48
of a deep idea about black sovereignty
16:51
that is predicated on
16:53
the most sophisticated black nationalism
16:55
that has been expressed within the
16:56
boundaries of american society everybody
16:58
from
16:59
the honorable elijah muhammad malcolm x
17:01
uh talking about
17:02
giving us eight to nine states in the
17:04
south and providing an opportunity for
17:06
black people to exercise and leverage
17:08
their authority
17:10
as a nation look dr king also
17:13
had an understanding of black power and
17:15
black being and he said this i ain't
17:17
going
17:17
nowhere i ain't giving up without him
17:19
built up
17:20
so i think that black sovereignty should
17:22
not be settled for
17:24
a mere eight states and nine states we
17:26
ought to settle for the united states
17:28
because we have infiltrated every state
17:31
in this society
17:32
every state in this country black being
17:35
black justice black
17:37
genius will redeem this nation i think
17:39
we give up too much if we leave
17:41
here and go somewhere else to start all
17:43
over again you know when michael jordan
17:45
was at the height of basketball
17:47
when he went to lake claim to baseball
17:49
he had to start at the bottom of the
17:51
pecking order
17:52
and that wasn't necessarily his greatest
17:55
gift
17:56
so the gifts of black people which have
17:58
been suppressed in this culture which we
18:00
need to remove the barriers the
18:02
impediments the obstacles
18:03
that prevent black flourishing but i
18:06
think we should stay right here
18:08
establish the sovereignty of our own
18:10
intelligence
18:11
our own being our own political order
18:14
and to infiltrate this society and give
18:17
to it
18:18
the the oxygen of democratic origins
18:22
small d not big d the oxygen of
18:25
understanding what
18:26
real true justice is about and to make
18:28
this nation as great as it can become
18:31
because we have built so much of it so
18:33
many of the institutions of america rest
18:36
on black labor
18:37
and black being has been insinuated into
18:40
the very nature of this culture
18:42
we have given the world beyonce jay-z
18:44
aretha franklin
18:46
leontyne price tony morrison john
18:48
coltrane
18:49
uh james baldwin angela davis we have
18:52
given them
18:53
so much and we have rooted it here in
18:55
this country i don't think we should
18:57
depart from it
18:58
i think we should build upon it and then
19:01
bring
19:01
all of this within the dominion of black
19:04
identity
19:05
and black courage because we've always
19:07
known that it's not about your pigment
19:09
it's not about your skin color it's
19:12
about your spirit
19:13
it's about your moral trajectory and
19:15
it's about your understanding that we
19:17
are all cosmic citizens
19:19
on a plot of ground that god gave to us
19:21
all
19:22
absolutely michael eric dyson ladies and
19:25
gentlemen
19:26
when you say it's not about your pigment
19:28
and it's not about your skin color
19:30
it brings to mind the whole concept of
19:32
white
19:34
like what is that you know what i mean
19:36
it's it's not a fact
19:37
right it's an idea can you break down
19:40
where
19:40
this whole concept of white came from
19:43
and why was it even created
19:45
great point and that's a very very
19:47
sophisticated understanding there
19:49
because
19:49
the anthropologists have told us for
19:51
years now that race
19:53
is not a reality it's not a biologically
19:56
determinate determined characteristic
19:58
it's not a heritable
19:59
characteristic you inherit from your
20:01
mama and daddy and them
20:02
just some something society tells us is
20:05
white white people ain't even white
20:06
they're pinker
20:08
sometimes blushed with redness
20:11
so so these color coordinated
20:13
conceptions of social identity
20:15
rest upon a philosophical argument about
20:18
identity with deep roots in western
20:21
uh imperial thought within european
20:24
culture
20:25
within greek ideas when we made
20:27
distinctions between
20:28
uh physical beings of people the size of
20:32
your forehead
20:33
if your cranium received a certain kind
20:35
of recognition
20:36
therefore you had a bigger uh brain and
20:38
a more thoughtful
20:40
active cerebral cortex and as a result
20:43
of that
20:44
they're trying to make biologically
20:45
determinable characteristic determining
20:47
characteristics
20:48
about intelligence that stuff is just
20:50
hogwash it's not scientific
20:52
it's pseudoscience the bottom line is is
20:55
when we determine through a heterosexual
20:56
account about what constitutes a race
20:59
is if you're able to you know have sex
21:01
with another
21:02
being of that particular order and
21:04
create a child that's in a heterosexual
21:06
paradigm
21:07
so the point is that we know races are
21:09
social constructions
21:11
they are generated out of the desire
21:13
especially of caucasian people
21:16
to extend the parameters of their
21:18
dominance and hegemony
21:19
her gender is a big word to talk about
21:21
how they master everything and bring it
21:23
under
21:24
uh their own control so here we are with
21:26
caucasian people seeking to
21:28
subordinate uh peoples of color starting
21:31
in
21:31
africa and fanning out and to
21:33
subordinate them to
21:35
their own vision and belief whiteness is
21:37
itself a construct
21:39
when when jews pose italians and irish
21:42
people and other white ethnics
21:44
come to america or go to a society the
21:47
crucible of race
21:48
pulverizes their ethnic identity into
21:51
something called whiteness
21:52
james baldwin reminded us in the fire
21:54
next time that these racial identities
21:57
are political
21:58
fictions they are projections of culture
22:01
and society and so when we hear
22:03
whiteness as you said brother sway
22:05
that is not a physiologically determined
22:08
characteristic
22:08
that is not a biologically rooted
22:10
heritable characteristic
22:12
that's the stuff we done made up that's
22:14
social dis
22:15
social identity and yes a social disease
22:19
projected onto people's bodies so what
22:21
we understand at the end of the day
22:22
is that whiteness has been turned into
22:24
american identity
22:26
that's why you hear a lot of white folks
22:27
say can't choose jiminy cricket can't
22:29
you stop talking about race
22:31
can't you stop talking about black and
22:32
brown and indigenous and red why can't
22:35
we all be americans
22:36
that's because your whiteness has been
22:38
rendered invisible
22:39
and now it's been seen as universal so
22:42
what you mean by american
22:43
is what you really mean by whiteness the
22:45
great philosopher beyonce giselle noel
22:48
said
22:49
it has been said that racism is so
22:51
american
22:52
that when you challenge racism it looks
22:54
like you're challenging
22:55
america no we're trying to broaden your
22:58
conception
22:58
of who and what we are so whiteness is a
23:01
political fiction
23:02
generated by imperial uh thinkers and a
23:05
dominant society that wanted to
23:07
subordinate people to its own agenda
23:10
and refusing to acknowledge the
23:11
proliferation of racial divergence
23:14
and diversity and difference that black
23:17
and brown and red and yellow people
23:19
represented
23:19
that's why as a social construction we
23:21
continue to challenge the mythology of
23:24
race and assert the primacy of our human
23:27
identities now
23:29
white people get to get confused wait a
23:30
minute if you're saying race is a social
23:32
construct
23:33
why do you consider yourselves black
23:34
people in america because blackness
23:36
is not simply a reaction to white
23:39
dominance
23:40
blackness is a self-defined
23:41
characteristic that we project onto the
23:44
world
23:44
not only in response to white supremacy
23:47
but in affirmation of the beauty
23:49
the power the integrity and the broad
23:52
diversity
23:53
of our understandings of who we are
23:55
that's why to get back to sister tracy's
23:57
point
23:58
about kamala harris when i hear some
23:59
people say well she ain't black
24:01
because her daddy was jamaican are you
24:03
really that idiotic
24:05
and her mama is indian who do you not
24:08
realize that when they dropped the
24:09
people off from the slave ship
24:11
they dropped some people off in the
24:12
caribbean in fact they dropped more
24:14
people off in the caribbean
24:16
than they did in our north america it's
24:18
just because we that cold up here in
24:20
north america
24:21
we have to do what we have to do that we
24:23
produce the amount of people we have who
24:25
are black
24:25
but the reality is we all in the same
24:28
family
24:29
so stop using these artificial
24:31
boundaries
24:32
imposed by scientific uh pseudoscience
24:35
to justify and legitimate some people's
24:38
imperialistic identities
24:40
and desires we are black because we are
24:42
deeply and profoundly humane
24:45
and human and we understand the
24:47
character of our origins
24:49
in cultures that have been dismissed by
24:51
white supremacy
24:52
and we stand tall in the pride of our
24:55
own identity and existence
24:57
michael eric dyson ladies and gentlemen
25:00
888-742-3345 the new book is long time
25:03
coming
25:04
great reeve over your holidays reckoning
25:06
with race in america
25:07
i got a few callers mr dyson they want
25:10
to talk to you
25:11
okay let me talk we got no we got nicole
25:14
nicole is in memphis tennessee grand
25:16
rises nicole how you feeling
25:18
hey nicole i'm doing well how are you
25:21
doing hey tracy d how are you
25:23
i'm swell mama what you got from
25:26
michael eric dyson so the first thing i
25:29
want to say to him
25:31
is i remember when he came to speak at
25:34
my church in memphis tennessee with uh
25:37
reverend dr kenneth robinson and his
25:39
wife reverend maryland
25:41
he was so dynamic so that was my first
25:44
time actually hearing him so from there
25:48
i followed him everywhere wherever he's
25:50
speaking whatever platform he's on i
25:52
tried to tune
25:53
in and so recently i just finished the
25:56
jay-z book and so now and like he comes
25:59
out with him so fast i can't even keep
26:00
up
26:01
but i'm going to go get this new one
26:03
today but my question was i had heard
26:05
through the grapevine
26:06
that he was getting ready to join the
26:08
university in vanderbilt
26:10
in nashville so my thought is like
26:13
you're going to be three hours away
26:15
do you foresee a speaking engagement
26:17
somewhere close by nearby
26:19
uh post corona where i could might
26:22
attend to come here you think
26:25
yeah but listen here with that sweet
26:27
southern uh
26:28
uh brogue articulating a serious and
26:31
profound engagement with the world as a
26:33
beautiful brilliant black woman
26:35
yes ma'am absolutely i am heading to
26:38
nashville tennessee they call it
26:39
cashfield they call it nas
26:41
vegas i'm just saying i'm there to go to
26:44
teach at nashville
26:45
to teach at vanderbilt to hang out with
26:47
people at fifth and tennessee state
26:49
and since i'm only three hours away it
26:51
would be my honor
26:52
to hang out again in memphis tennessee i
26:55
come to memphis from time to time
26:57
i visit the civil rights museum
27:00
led by the great terry freeman one of
27:02
the great citizens of memphis there and
27:05
i go visit
27:06
the the room where dr king lost his life
27:09
right outside of it room 306 at the uh
27:12
at the hotel there and the remain
27:15
lorraine motel
27:16
and which is part of the uh the civil
27:19
rights museum now and i cry like a baby
27:21
every time
27:21
but i'm absolutely desiring to come back
27:24
there you can follow me
27:26
on instagram at michael eric dyson or on
27:28
facebook at michael eric dyson on
27:30
twitter at michael e dyson
27:32
so hit me up ma'am and let me know
27:34
you're there and i'll respond back to
27:35
you
27:36
and when i come that way post corona
27:38
will certainly be able to meet and thank
27:39
you so much for your support buying that
27:41
jay-z book
27:42
and getting the new book as well okay
27:45
you're more than welcome and see i
27:46
follow miss
27:47
i i hope i said i don't know if it's
27:49
marcia or miss marcia
27:50
marcia l dyson the reverend martial you
27:53
follow her already well you following
27:55
the better dyson you ain't got to worry
27:56
about me
27:57
you're in good hands nicole you're a
27:58
citizen all right in the morning
28:01
all right let me uh we're gonna take uh
28:03
go to long island we got epidemic on the
28:05
line from long island grand rises
28:07
hey hey graeme ross and graham rosin
28:10
y'all greg
28:11
i just wanted to uh ask a question as
28:13
well as uh shout out y'all with some
28:14
praise and compliments
28:16
um i was born in queens raised in long
28:20
island i went to uh
28:21
mostly white high school um i'm jamaican
28:24
and puerto rican
28:25
light skinned but you know i've uh you
28:28
guys were like
28:29
an inspiration my mom put me on a
28:30
michael eric dyson sway i've seen you
28:32
since
28:33
x games mtv all that watched you
28:36
progress
28:37
congratulations on all your success in
28:39
the hall of fame as well
28:40
thank you but you guys made it i don't
28:43
know
28:44
kind of easier and more acceptable to be
28:49
black and be smart and be intelligent
28:51
and you know even though i experience
28:53
colorism against my own like oh you're
28:54
not black enough
28:56
even though i did all the things that
28:57
everybody else did and you know
29:00
i could hang out with the best when i
29:01
could you know got the words whatever
29:03
when it's necessary i'm a
29:04
you know kind of a chameleon that way
29:06
but because i was intelligent because i
29:08
spoke a certain way and wasn't afraid to
29:10
hide my intelligence it's all you're not
29:11
black enough what do you think that we
29:12
can do
29:13
as a people to try and encourage
29:16
education and not make it old he's a
29:18
nerd or he's not cool because he's smart
29:20
he wants to go to college he wants to do
29:22
well for himself
29:23
because i feel like we tear ourselves
29:24
down a lot professor dyson
29:28
what can we do to protect ourselves from
29:31
assaulting ourselves and tearing each
29:33
other down
29:34
you know this is what sister tracy g was
29:36
talking about earlier with massage noir
29:39
you know when black men attacking black
29:41
women why
29:42
because black women have been the the
29:45
carriers
29:46
of the burdens of both sexism and racism
29:49
and classism for that matter and yet
29:52
they continue to stand tall
29:54
in defense of black men even when we are
29:56
undeserving
29:57
uh the light versus dark thing is a
30:00
vicious reality dark versus light it's a
30:03
vicious reality
30:04
um you know i talk about this in my book
30:07
tears we cannot stop my daddy was blue
30:09
black
30:09
i'm a yellow negro red bone negro
30:13
my daddy i saw mistreated
30:16
from black people who thought that he
30:19
was
30:19
less than not as desirable as thought to
30:22
his
30:22
little cute son with the curly hair in
30:24
the glass or smarter
30:26
or my brothers who were browner and
30:29
mistreated i think
30:30
and certainly uh treated in a way
30:33
different than i was so i have to own up
30:35
to light privilege the way we ask white
30:37
people to own up to white privilege
30:39
we have to talk about the way in which
30:41
light-skinned privilege has existed
30:43
from the times of slavery in america
30:45
where because of inter-marriage
30:47
and forced miscegenation lighter
30:50
children were produced
30:51
and as a result of that thought to be
30:53
smarter or closer to the dominant white
30:55
supremacist ideal and
30:56
norm now that's no fault of people born
30:59
light i'm not demonizing like in people
31:01
and you've been a victim of some of the
31:03
uncritical
31:04
nasty vituperation directed toward
31:07
people simply because of
31:09
a choice they didn't make to be born
31:11
with so we didn't we didn't choose to be
31:13
born light skinned but we have to assume
31:14
the responsibility
31:16
that is often given to us as a result of
31:19
the privileges
31:20
that are unearned that are extended to
31:23
light-skinned people
31:24
by virtue of being light-skinned at the
31:26
same time
31:27
we've got to fight the feeling that
31:29
being lighter
31:30
is less black and being darker is
31:32
blacker who's blacker louis farrakhan a
31:35
light skinned black man or clarence
31:37
thomas the dark being black man
31:39
so the point is we can't color
31:41
coordinate through shade
31:43
what authentic blackness is about we
31:45
have got to
31:46
overcome this white supremacist
31:48
occupation of our mindset
31:50
that tells us that any shade is
31:52
representative
31:53
of an authentic blackness what's
31:55
authentically black is loving blackness
31:57
embracing blackness understanding how we
32:00
uh
32:00
uh you know get along with each other uh
32:04
give each other support give each other
32:06
affirmation
32:07
regardless of those shades so at the end
32:09
of the day we deconstruct
32:11
white skin privilege light-skinned
32:13
privilege we talk about the demonization
32:15
of darkness and let's be real
32:16
dark-skinned black men had it over
32:18
dark-skinned black women so they would
32:19
love a wesley snipes
32:21
or a denzel washington but wouldn't see
32:24
viola davis
32:25
as a woman who embodied the beauty
32:27
light-skinned black women
32:29
certainly seen as the embodiment of the
32:33
ideal norm of beauty within black
32:35
circles
32:36
in the same way so we've got to talk
32:38
about demythologizing all of these
32:41
hurtful painful racist ideas that we
32:44
internalize
32:45
and then stand tall regardless cause we
32:47
got everything in our race
32:48
we got caramel cuteness we got vanilla
32:51
vitality we got chocolate charm
32:53
we got brown beauty we got it all doc we
32:56
like ben
32:56
and jerry we got the whole range of the
32:58
rainbow
32:59
[Laughter]
33:00
get that up get out of right there
33:02
professor dyson come on
33:04
hey hey hey make me hungry yes hey
33:07
epidemic i love your voice i love you
33:10
uh asking that question and you being
33:12
you you're all right with me brother
33:14
you're a citizen okay
33:15
in the morning all right thank y'all
33:17
have a blessed one
33:18
you too professor dyson it's always a
33:22
joy to have you on our platform
33:24
clearly appreciate you and when you were
33:27
naming
33:28
man i love you too and when you were
33:29
naming all these gifts that black folks
33:31
have given to the world
33:33
you forgot to mention one person he goes
33:35
by the name of michael eric dyson
33:38
oh man bless you hear that jack i
33:40
appreciate y'all
33:41
hanging out with y'all you and tracy g
33:43
and having all the people there
33:45
brother rich you i i just love y'all i
33:47
appreciate what you do for our people
33:49
every day
33:50
and and i also wanted to add my
33:51
congratulations you've been a hall of
33:53
famer they just recognized you've been
33:54
in the home
33:57
places but they don't even know hey man
33:59
they just physically articulating what
34:01
we knew was seriously true from the
34:03
get-go
34:03
you were born a hall of fame but they
34:05
just caught up with you doc
34:06
and keep doing your thing thank you man
34:09
michael eric dyson ladies and gentlemen
34:11
have a beautiful end of the year okay
34:13
yes you too my friends thank you all so
34:15
much look forward to coming back soon
34:17
absolutely get the book it's a great
34:19
read michael eric dyson long time coming
34:21
reckoning with race in america
34:23
we gonna come back and just talk
34:38
you
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