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Ryan Gilbert, Joe DeMarini, & Jacob Russell discuss the rumors that the Philadelphia Flyers might be interested in Anaheim Ducks' forward Mason McTavish.
This clip is from BSH Podcast Episode 105: https://youtube.com/live/9MMzqFy0rmc
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0:00
Meanwhile, McTavish, I just beyond the
0:02
fact that the player, I don't
0:03
necessarily know if he's got that next
0:05
level of potential the way Berniers
0:06
does. I don't know how I feel about
0:09
going back to the well and getting
0:10
another duck, you know, like just just
0:12
picking off all the old ducks. Like the
0:15
GoTJ thing, we we talked about it
0:16
before. We understand why that, you
0:18
know, he kind of he didn't pick where he
0:20
wanted to go per se, but he did ask out
0:22
and you got the best sort of package
0:24
with the Drysdale thing and that worked
0:25
out and Drysdale looks like he's a guy
0:27
who's maybe a top four um uh defenseman
0:30
for the future as long as you want him
0:32
uh after this playoff run especially and
0:35
you get Zegras
0:37
uh on the cheap for Palat and a pick or
0:39
whatever it was. Um and and you know,
0:42
he's
0:43
potentially going to be your two C for
0:45
quite a while uh if if they choose to go
0:48
that route, right? So, it's worked. It's
0:50
been good, but I just don't think
0:51
especially when you already did the
0:52
Zegras move uh that that getting a guy
0:55
like McTavish, you can't really project
0:58
I can't really project maybe even to to
1:00
have uh a top-line role in the future. I
1:03
don't know if that really makes sense.
1:04
They're both signed for basically the
1:07
same amount at the same term. Um kind of
1:10
makes sense. They were drafted right
1:11
after one another. They've kind of had
1:13
similar outcomes in their careers thus
1:15
far, but I I do like Berniers more as a
1:17
potential trade target. I think he has a
1:19
bit more of a ceiling uh especially
1:22
offensively.
1:23
>> You're bang on with the like the Seattle
1:25
problem, which is his best linemates
1:26
have been Eberle and McCann. Not only
1:28
are those his best linemates, that is
1:30
their top line. There's a reason the
1:31
Kraken have not done too much uh outside
1:34
of that one weird playoff win over the
1:37
Avs, but uh
1:39
I
1:40
I think I just think there's more there
1:42
and bringing up the 2021 draft, it is
1:45
crazy to look at all of the centers that
1:47
were drafted in that first round. The
1:48
only one that has approached star level
1:50
is Wyatt Johnston. So, for anyone who's
1:52
saying, "Oh, you can only get your top
1:53
end centers, your top tier, like your
1:55
your franchise centers at the top of the
1:57
draft. Shut up. Like sometimes I know
1:59
it's a COVID draft, but
2:01
it it just goes to show that not even
2:03
the ones in the top five or top three
2:06
uh are guaranteed to be a 1C.
2:09
>> Yeah, the only one that's a star
2:10
fittingly got drafted to Dallas. So he's
2:12
a star in in in more ways than one
2:14
there.
2:14
>> Hey.
2:16
>> But I think the potential of like I
2:18
don't think either of these guys are
2:20
going to be your 1C. They're not the 1C
2:23
answer you're looking for. McTavish can
2:25
maybe get there, be a 1C.
2:27
>> squint I could squint see Beniers doing
2:30
it. I don't know why.
2:31
>> Yeah, Beniers could get there. Like if
2:33
Beniers is doing this with with McCann
2:35
and Eberle, if you give him
2:37
>> Hey, listen.
2:37
>> Martone and and someone else, like that
2:41
that's a
2:41
>> to tip it.
2:42
>> That's That's a Kraken Kraken leading
2:44
scorer, Jordan Eberle. And Jared McCann
2:47
had 20 and 20 in 52 games.
2:50
>> We're talking We're talking on
2:51
these guys and they would be top top
2:53
five scorers on the Flyers. We would
2:54
take them.
2:56
>> Okay, your top scorer having 55 points
2:57
is still bad, though. That is still not
3:00
good. It's just, you know,
3:02
that is the top line. Those are the
3:03
guys, you know, there's not anybody else
3:05
to key on on the roster. What are you
3:07
going to look at Chandler Stephenson,
3:09
you know? Are you going to really keep
3:10
an eye on Kaapo Kakko at this point?
3:13
Like in the big 2026, Kaapo Kakko's like
3:15
on the whiteboard, you know? So I just
3:18
feel like Beniers there's something
3:19
there. McTavish, he's in this like
3:22
offensive whirlwind with the Ducks,
3:25
right? Like they just score. They don't
3:27
play defense. You saw it even in the
3:28
playoffs. They They're very weird team
3:31
to watch. Sometimes they look I I
3:32
thought when the Flyers played them,
3:33
they kicked their ass like every time.
3:35
Like it It also is like that emotional
3:37
game for the Flyers, but it is for the
3:39
Ducks, too, right? Like it is for the
3:41
Ducks, too. And the [clears throat]
3:42
Flyers just seem like that style of play
3:44
really nullified what the Ducks try and
3:47
do.
3:48
Um but they have so much offense they
3:49
create so much offense. The fact that
3:51
McTavish isn't in that group with Seneca
3:55
and and Gauthier and you know, Troy
3:57
Terry, those types of guys. He's not
3:59
really part of that nucleus. I think
4:02
that gives me pause. If you're going to
4:04
pull him out of the fire and try and
4:06
give him a fresh start.
4:07
>> I mean, that's that's the Pat Verbeek
4:09
problem. That's like he doesn't like the
4:11
guys he didn't draft.
4:13
>> Yeah. Yeah, and the counterpoint to that
4:15
is the guys you mentioned, Cutter
4:16
Gauthier, Beck and Seneca. Those were
4:18
McTavish's two most common linemates.
4:20
>> And 328 minutes together, 59.6% of the
4:24
expected goal share at five on five
4:26
according to MoneyPuck here. But then
4:28
you see
4:29
that's the whole season, probably more
4:31
in the first half of the season cuz you
4:33
know the narrative of McTavish
4:35
being moved to wing, not being sound
4:37
defensively. Cuz you look at the
4:38
playoffs, he played with
4:40
Ryan Poehling and Chris Kreider. So Ryan
4:42
Poehling was clearly the center on that
4:44
line, played a bit with with Gauthier on
4:47
the wing
4:48
instead of Kreider as well, but like
4:50
McTavish feels like another project
4:53
where it would be Zegras-like. Like if
4:55
you didn't get Zegras, maybe you can get
4:56
McTavish. And the thing about getting
4:59
another duck just makes it makes it
5:01
weird. Like so far, I feel like both
5:03
sides are happy with it. So there is a
5:06
double-edged sword of like, okay, both
5:07
sides are happy. Let's go back to the
5:09
well again. Let's trade need for need
5:11
and see what we can do. But also you're
5:13
you're just adding more chips in that
5:16
that that could go wrong. Like
5:18
what if McTavish is justice. What if
5:20
McTavish is just like a Morgan Frost and
5:22
you trade a first-round pick and Noah
5:25
Cates or you you maybe if you can if you
5:29
can deal Risto there cuz cuz they're
5:32
Karlsson's off the books. I don't know
5:33
if Gudas is gone back there. Like if
5:35
that's something where the Ducks would
5:37
would want Risto. Truba's gone as well.
5:39
Yes.
5:40
So like if they want Risto, you take
5:41
McTavish back. Maybe, but
5:45
like even with him even with Beniers.
5:47
Beniers have have more potential. I
5:49
would prefer Bedard to McTavish, but
5:52
adding a center like this who on a
5:55
Stanley Cup winning team is a 2C
5:59
doesn't really do much right now,
6:00
especially now you have Dvorak, you have
6:03
Zegras, you have Katchouk, you have
6:04
Cotoure, you have your guys. And this
6:07
was one of my main points against the
6:08
Dvorak extension. Like sure, you're not
6:11
going to you need someone there in case
6:13
you don't trade for a McTavish or a
6:15
Bedard, but if you do trade for them,
6:18
you're suddenly kind of hamstrung with,
6:20
you know, too many centers can't be a
6:22
problem, but too many middle-six centers
6:24
that kind of all do the same thing.
6:26
>> Well, I mean, with Dvorak, you just go
6:28
back to a hybrid kind of thing, right?
6:30
You move him or Zegras to the wing and
6:32
then you play them that way. One of them
6:33
is a face-off guy if you need him to be.
6:35
Like they're not locked into Zegras and
6:39
Dvorak as 100% no doubt centers. You
6:41
could
6:42
>> you already have too many wingers. You
6:43
already have too many wingers.
6:45
>> Yeah.
6:45
>> You can't just be like, all right, we
6:46
have too many centers, let's move a
6:47
center to wing. That's where you have a
6:49
bigger
6:50
>> When Rubins back, when you look at, you
6:52
know, Martone is going to have the full
6:54
season.
6:56
All the guys coming up through the
6:57
system, there are a few who you think in
7:00
a in a year or even a year or two
7:03
will have a chance to make team.
7:06
I I don't I I would switch Zegras back
7:08
to the wing. That's fine. I really don't
7:10
have a problem with that. I think he's
7:12
then a top line winger, basically. But
7:14
you you you are faced with this problem
7:17
of
7:18
is Mason McTavish better than Christian
7:20
Dvorak? No, he's not. Especially last
7:22
year he wasn't.
7:24
I think he's close, but Dvorak he has he
7:26
definitely has a higher ceiling, but
7:27
he's not better than Christian Dvorak.
7:30
Um Noah Katchouk, you'd rather have Noah
7:32
Katchouk or Mason McTavish. That's the
7:33
sort of question you're asking. I think
7:35
I'd rather have Noah Katchouk, to be
7:37
honest with you.
7:37
>> Yeah.
7:38
He is He is a great defensive player. He
7:41
makes a lot of sense. And then Couturier
7:43
is going to be there and Couturier as
7:44
you you know, he showed he he he's back
7:47
in the conversation. He played a lot
7:48
better. He looked a lot more like
7:50
himself in the playoffs. I don't know if
7:51
he keep that up. I don't know if he even
7:53
needs to keep that up like throughout an
7:55
entire regular season really, right?
7:56
Like I think you're moving into an area
7:58
with him where it's going to be day by
8:01
day, week by week how he's playing.
8:04
So, you know, it
8:06
I I don't really know where a guy like
8:07
McTavish fits unless you you know, you
8:10
are trading somebody who is a winger or
8:13
who is a forward on the roster. Um but
8:16
like Gil said, it kind of makes more
8:17
sense that they would want a guy like
8:19
Risto, right? They would want another
8:21
big defenseman to replace the guys that
8:23
are leaving. So, I mean I mean if that's
8:25
the case, you you are getting caught in
8:26
the numbers game kind of at that
8:28
>> It would it would be predicated on them
8:29
moving a winger out like in a separate
8:32
deal for a separate position or
8:33
something like that. But the the
8:35
McTavish thing to me kind of screams a
8:38
David Jiricek situation all over again.
8:41
Like high pedigree player, kind of on
8:43
the outs with this organization, never
8:44
really caught on. Um
8:47
but the potential nets you a massive
8:50
return, right? The Wild gave up a first
8:52
round pick, a couple other picks, and
8:54
like a guy to play third pair defense to
8:57
get Jiricek. What happens about a year
8:58
and a half later? They trade him for
9:00
Bobby Brink and nothing else. McTavish
9:02
seems like the kind of player who could
9:04
get moved
9:05
and doesn't catch on on his new team
9:06
either and then is sold at a way, way
9:09
lower price two or three years from now.
9:11
And then at that point, do you take the
9:13
swing? Cuz Kates would probably be gone,
9:15
Dvorak would be gone. Do you just
9:17
you know, see how it plays out cuz I
9:20
don't want to give up a big package for
9:21
McTavish or maybe even Beniers. Like
9:24
it's not it's not worth it to the
9:25
Flyers. They don't need that position
9:28
and they shouldn't be taking that risk.
9:30
Like they're they're a playoff team.
9:31
They don't need to
9:34
gamble on a guy that they
9:36
already have like someone's already
9:38
playing that spot.
9:40
>> Yeah, I mean
9:41
I do think
9:42
well Bynum especially but also McTavish
9:44
do does have a higher ceiling than
9:46
Devorak and Kates and Thomas wrote
9:48
broadstreetHockey.com that he speculated
9:50
like a Kates and a first round pick for
9:52
McTavish can maybe be something the
9:54
Ducks would want to do but like I'd
9:56
rather get some save Kates to use in a
9:58
package for a better center like a
10:00
Robert Thomas or someone better than
10:02
that. But if if it is like a Risto for
10:05
for McTavish and you can somehow find a
10:08
place
10:08
>> Risto and a third or something like
10:10
that, you know.
10:11
>> Yeah, Risto and
10:12
>> I was thinking the same thing when I was
10:14
like we were starting the pod, I was
10:16
walking home from work today and I was
10:18
like
10:19
I'm going to say Risto and a third but I
10:21
mean it genuinely not actually like the
10:23
Hagel and a third kickback but uh
10:26
yeah.
10:26
>> It makes sense. That's like around what
10:28
I give up for a guy that I don't think
10:30
like it's the same sort of situation
10:33
with the Ducks. I think the Ducks right
10:35
now have too many potential top six
10:37
forwards. Like you're not going to play
10:38
Mason McTavish as a third line left
10:40
wing, fourth line left wing. Like that
10:42
just doesn't make sense.
10:43
Um so I
10:46
you know, I'm not necessarily too
10:48
bullish on either of them really. I I
10:50
think you can really just save the
10:53
assets like you said and whenever
10:55
something pops up throughout the year,
10:56
you never know when something will pop
10:58
up throughout the year. I think you can
11:00
take the big swing
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