Microsoft Surface Duo Unboxing - https://youtu.be/-Ys4zp-cQOU
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0:01
Very excited here today. We've got Panos Panay from Microsoft on the show
0:08
Big things happening here talking, of course, about the latest device, the new Surface Duo
0:14
which I've been playing with for a while. And honestly, I get excited anytime I'm kind of interacting with a new form factor
0:23
Anytime I get an opportunity to play with something that is not a slab of glass
0:29
just the same thing done over again. I've seen that, obviously, almost a thousand times on the channel
0:34
for the amount of time that I've been doing this. And I understand that this device is sort of your baby
0:41
Is that fair to say? I think it's probably a good characterization
0:47
I kind of get in trouble at home sometimes when I say these are like my children
0:51
because especially when the kids watch, if that makes sense. Like it's, uh, but yeah, I think it's a representation, uh, yeah
1:02
Of the whole team's kind of investment at the end of the day
1:06
Like there's an amazing team that works on this, these products, but yeah, it is near and dear to my heart. It's, it's been, yeah. Yeah
1:14
It's emotional for sure. It's my baby for, yeah, I think I can say that. Well, I mean, I think it kind of
1:19
it's so different and new that it's going to, it would, it would require somebody to sort of push it through or a team
1:27
as you mentioned, because it is so different from what's out there. And I'm sure most people's approach would be to sort of look at what's
1:36
happening in the marketplace and sort of approaching a new device with that in mind
1:42
But this is so different from what's out there that for me
1:48
I sort of imagined it as being, it would have to be somebody's passion project to put this through
1:54
Fair enough. I think you're right. It is different enough that it takes a little bit of conviction
1:59
a little bit of, you know, the team had a vision. They're amazing
2:05
And I believe in where we wanted to take the industry on this topic
2:11
Like it's a big deal. Lou, you got to look. You got to look at what do people want to do
2:16
What are they trying to do? How can we make things easier for them? we always talk about it that way. Like, what is it, what are, what are the needs of, what are the
2:24
needs of, you know, people, consumers, uh, any picture customer segment, but that's a pretty
2:31
important element where once you sort of see where you want to take things, it does take conviction
2:36
and investing in technology, you know, investing in a new form factor and standing behind where we
2:43
think it's different, uh, and, and how important it is to enable different things to happen. I
2:48
I think we're seeing it. We're seeing that. Don't get me wrong. There's plenty of people who will throw doubt at it
2:53
There's plenty of people who will have opinions that are like, I don't get it. It's fine
2:57
But ultimately, yeah, it takes a little bit of vision. It takes some vision and conviction
3:04
And then ultimately, if it's anchored in customers, if it's anchored in the people you believe are going to go after it and use it
3:13
and it'll make a difference in their lives, we get pretty jacked up. it's something where uh we get excited i i personally get to this point of like wow we're
3:22
gonna make a difference um we can we can drive change yeah that's inspiring and then you watch
3:29
this team kind of roll into it it and and believe in what they're building and making and by the way
3:34
five six years in the making this isn't like we had an idea right last october i got on stage and
3:39
then said hey check it out here it is uh that's not how it really works and you iterate iterate
3:45
iterate and uh here we are talking to you and so i'm i'm curious do you look at this device
3:51
as a phone do you call it a phone is it a phone i get in trouble i get in trouble man with this
3:58
question i gotta be honest i've answered it plenty of different ways so like somebody should
4:04
go get the excerpt it's like what what has he said right it just depends you know i look at it
4:09
is a surface and that's my mind it's not that's not even like a trick that's not a like a marketing
4:15
tool it's none of that it's like this is how we talked about this is surface it's a product that's
4:20
going to adapt to what you need to do period and that hinge allows it the thinness allows it the
4:25
fitting in your pocket enables it the idea that i can move around with it stay connected at all
4:30
times and all of a sudden you're like well what what's my phone for if i have a surface duo
4:35
So then ask the question, do you think it's a phone? Sure. At that point, if you feel like the mental model, if you think I'm going to replace my phone with Duo, you should
4:44
Like, it's transformative, I believe. Right. So to be clear, though, for you, it is your phone
4:52
It is. I mean, I carry two phones, or I had carried two phones for the longest time
4:58
Now I carry two of these. And quite frankly, I only need one now
5:02
It's super fascinating. like uh calendar and mail side by side is a big deal for me instagram and twitter uh youtube and
5:09
instagram at the same time like these are things that i could only at one point um you know mail
5:15
and calendar on my on my pc to get things done and just know where i'm at because i'm moving you know
5:21
so fast and connecting with others but now it's kind of it's it's transformed how i'm operating
5:27
like this is it this is my phone now i don't have a problem saying that's where i kind of get in
5:31
trouble. Like you just said it wasn't a phone. Like I promise, I promise you for many, it will
5:35
be their phone. For others, it'll be a replacement for their tablet, you know, and, and for many
5:41
it'll be the second phone. Like I totally get it. Um, I do think though that once you, here's a
5:48
here's the thing with this product. Um, when you first use it, it depends how you intend to use it
5:54
Uh, it will either take you longer to, to learn or shorter. And depending on how you use it
5:59
If you take your primary SIM out, you put it in this, you put it in the Duo, it will become your phone
6:06
And within a week, it will be the only thing you can use and it will transform how you're doing things
6:13
If you choose to, you know, use it as a tablet, it'll take a little longer on the learning curve
6:18
The engagement model is where you engage it. And I think eventually it migrates to be in your phone
6:22
So I think it'll be different for most people. For me, you know, it's my phone
6:29
Yeah. So then I get to this part for me where I'm thinking about the foldable market. Like we've got all these new devices emerging that are sort of taking their own approach towards what this next device is going to be
6:48
So I also have a problem calling all these things phones because I envision kind of where they might go and sort of see them as futuristic computing devices
7:01
Myself, I'm speaking on the phone less and less in the traditional sense
7:07
And so I've obviously played with Samsung's latest device. I've played with another foldable device, which I've got a video coming out soon, which I can't really mention
7:17
There so many different approaches to these kind of pocketable convertible things Now what makes yours different is you done this dual screen approach instead of attempting to bend an OLED display like others have what is the mindset there why dual display instead of
7:38
a folding yeah I get stuck on foldable when you say that I kind of go foldable right uh
7:45
we looked at foldable okay this we didn't go that direction we didn't we didn't actually want
7:51
land in foldable here let me give you some context and don't get me wrong it's going to get categorized
7:55
all over the place phone foldable tablet two screen it's okay like that's going to happen we
8:00
don't nobody really controls that but i would say um our intent was dual screen like we have this
8:07
rich history of understanding multi-mom this rich history of multitasking two apps at the same time
8:13
on windows we understand like how people engage better uh especially when it's structured in
8:20
frame for them and what we found was there were a couple elements in a folding screen i mean that's
8:26
just a closed product and an open product and then there's management of windows and how do you get
8:31
things where you want to really love love the concept and then we actually studied you know
8:38
we studied brain waves we studied patterns where we like we understand that when people put two
8:45
screens side by side, their brain lights up differently. It just does. And it, it, you
8:50
you can engage, uh, get more done tasks. Uh, you can get more done faster, but it's also
8:56
you know, this is the weird, weird part. It's less stressed to do it that way
9:03
And so the concept of windowing is not new, especially for, for Microsoft, but the idea
9:10
that you can put two windows, if you will, or screens side by side and get them in your pocket
9:16
Wow, that was powerful. And then when we started the studying and the belief and moving from one
9:20
screen to the other and connecting those two things, that even started to validate where we
9:24
were going. And then ultimately the thing that we talked, and I think you saw it, but the hinge
9:29
being able to go back 360 degrees and take the call if you needed to, and then close it when you
9:35
were done. Both those concepts were vital to what this product was going to be. All right
9:44
then pause. We have this belief in dual screen. The architecture had to be invented to get it
9:50
right. The hinge had to be invented over multiple generations. You saw the launch videos, I'm sure
9:57
but a little bit of you saw Pavan and Jasmine talk about the depth of engineering that came
10:01
the years to get to this thinness, all that great. What we realize as we study and work
10:09
through the scene down the middle of this product tends to be the thing that I celebrate more than
10:14
anything, because it is the structure that's needed for the two screens side by side for us
10:21
So you can launch two things. They place where you would expect them to place
10:25
and then you engage. It's a very powerful kind of concept for somebody who's using it and gets
10:30
into it. It's almost, uh, it's got this, it's got this quality where once you learn it, you're in
10:38
And now you want to browse and text. Now you want to have a call you and me having this call
10:44
And on the other side, I want to just stay informed and connected with somebody else. I want to watch a video, maybe talk about what I'm watching. I want to edit a video. All these
10:53
things started to come to life and that out of your pocket loop. And now it's mind blowing. Now
10:58
go back to foldable. So your original question like so, but then there's foldable, like, yeah
11:03
I think that's an opening and closing screen and it's limited to what we wanted. Then
11:06
then the architecture around it was you didn't actually get that structure of two screens. You have to create that. It doesn't mean it can't be created. It's an extra step. Maybe it's
11:15
complex. It's not, I have not used the products you're using. So I don't, you know, I'm not
11:20
I can't comment, but I will tell you that fundamentally, uh, we looked at both what we
11:26
can accomplish and what we think is better for the user is what we ran after and we you know dug
11:31
into well i can speak a little bit about well having experimented with all these different
11:37
new devices and one thing that stands out to me about your product is how polished it feels
11:46
the hardware where the folding oled has a kind of a wow factor to see it bend at the same time
11:56
there's almost a little bit of apprehension for the user about how solid it is or long-term durable
12:04
or whether it's even the final form of that tech. As opposed to holding the Surface Duo, which it feels robust, solid
12:15
It feels further along in the generation than a first-generation product. Well, I mean, it probably speaks to the fact that you guys have been working on it for so long
12:25
It's not necessarily your first-gen product, especially from a hardware standpoint. I mean, it's a good point
12:31
I think what you're – we have this – it was important to us that this product was emotional when you picked it up
12:39
It felt emotion. Like, not the product itself, but the human that grabbed it
12:43
And that meant we had to push kind of the boundaries of thinness, the hinge, the radii
12:51
Like, what you're solving for here – I mean, here's my camera
12:55
right there, and then when you fold it back, like that perfectly flat piece, because when it's in
13:00
your pocket, we didn't want this bulge, we didn't want this bulk. We also wanted a large enough
13:04
screen, so when you did open it, you had this, whoa, I got so much content. Did I really just
13:09
take this out of my pocket? Look at how much I have. That's all emotional in many ways, but then
13:14
when you pick it up, you feel the thinness, and honestly, the build quality, it's the best
13:19
we've accomplished in surface. And, uh, there's a team, like it takes so much pride in this year
13:27
the mechanical engineers, the double ease, the industrial designers, uh, there, they are in
13:33
uh, together, uh, and refusing to compromise, you know, and, and it took years to get to that
13:42
point. And it's taken generations of other products and that history to show up in this
13:47
product so you can feel that but what you also understand is and you saw this lube like the
13:53
thinness comes from the fact that there is no radius here on the hinge there is no bulge or
13:58
bulk it is you put it together put it next to a regular phone or a slab as you said you're going
14:04
to kind of see they're about the same thickness when this is closed with two screens that was the
14:08
that was the goal and then when you open it there was this emotional connection you can either hold
14:13
it like a book you can fold it backwards it'll adapt to you all that's true and the hinges
14:17
it gives you that you know that kind of car door feeling like it just robust that high-end car door
14:24
like you open it close it you're like wow i know i can trust it those are elements yeah actually
14:29
actually i think it's even better than a lot of car doors because it stops at any point as opposed
14:35
to finding those those stop points i do have i have a slightly nicer car that does stop at any
14:42
point like this hinge but that costs a lot more money than it's super delightful right like that
14:46
yes absolutely yeah so we have a couple incredible and these mechanical engineers that work on this
14:54
product incredible and the friction hinge and what it is uh you know like if you sat through some of these reviews and the design points and the care and love that goes into every element every part of the angle Now the trick is
15:11
is the device understanding what angle it's sitting at. Now that's the software hardware
15:16
integration. We got to know. We got to know what the user's intention is. We almost have
15:20
to predict it many times. And, uh, that also is a process. So you've got to perfect the hardware
15:25
and then you got to bring the software along and that's what makes a product of course. But, uh
15:30
bringing those two things together has been, has been delightful and, and, uh
15:35
almost feel like, uh, I maybe, you know, I don't want to be, um, overstated, but really it's this
15:44
this team is pretty incredible what they're, what they're able to accomplish. so i have a functional question for you i've been using a device for a while myself but probably
15:53
nowhere near well definitely nowhere near the amount of time that you've been using it
15:57
do you ever take it in the sort of folded this way i don't know if you can see that
16:03
open the open fold do you ever put it in your pocket like that but locked yeah um
16:10
yes it just depends what i'm doing like if i'm there are time the answer is yes more times than
16:20
not i leave it in phone mode is what this is called that's how i leave it right and um i gotta
16:27
be careful because i've got messages here and i don't want you know it's amazing what people
16:31
pause and zoom it out. Oh, trust me. I've experienced it. Many times
16:38
It blows my mind when I get a phone call. What were you thinking? I'm like, shit, I was just using my product
16:43
I don't know what. I've had to change my phone number a few times
16:46
I can imagine. I can imagine. Yeah, I'm sorry. I'm so sorry. I use it this way more times than not
16:56
There are times, though. So like if I'm at Costco, which seems to be my super, you know, that's like my date night with Mary these days, my wife
17:05
And we need to go where we go. Right. I will close it, put it in my pocket and just chill
17:13
And that kind of actually shuts things down for me. It's quite nice
17:20
It's different. And I get a vibration or I know if I'm getting a call
17:25
If I'm wearing my earbuds, I can take it. but really when I want to close it, I close it
17:30
But outside of that, like, no, even by my nightstand, I put it down like this just so I can get my glanceables
17:37
And it's just like my phone. Now, you can start questioning, like, how well does it fit in your hand
17:46
and if you're going to use it all the time that way. My primary typing posture when I'm in phone mode is just two thumbs on the device
17:54
and going full speed so i can respond quickly and just stay engaged but like you said i'm not
17:59
taking a lot of calls anymore yeah well actually the the reason for the question was sort of around
18:05
that digital detox concept you know the phone the typical smartphone is always in open mode
18:13
it's sort of always there when you place it on place it on a table pull it out of your pocket
18:17
it's constantly inviting you to interact with it and this kind of shares something with laptops
18:26
in the sense that when you close the lid you're done with it for a bit at least spot on spot on
18:34
like good for you uh thank you there's something when we designed the product was closure um my
18:41
team doesn't like when i say this publicly but closure matters like sometimes you just want to
18:45
done um four kids blue when i believe me like there's plenty to do at all times but
18:53
i love this idea like when we sit down to play fortnite i shut my duo and put it down and we
18:59
sit next to each other my daughter and i she's 10 and she's better than i am in every sense but we
19:04
jump in it actually you can't disturb me as opposed to watching my screen light up and then oh wait
19:11
wait, I'm missing something. And that digital detox you talked about, have you experienced this? I I'm sure you have
19:17
Have you been in a conversation with somebody who's wearing a watch and
19:22
the next, you know, they're talking, they're actually talking and they look down at their watch and you can see
19:28
they come out of flow, their brain twists. They read what they said and they come back up
19:32
You feel that emotional disconnect and then you kind of have to catch back up
19:37
You got to like, yeah, there's like pause. I'm like, where was I? some are better than others at re-engaging you know I to your point of that detox like
19:46
I don't think it's getting better right now like in many ways you know we're getting informed at
19:51
all times and you know it's disruptive and it helps takes us out of our flow sometimes as humans
19:56
that are connected even in video calls now you know during as we work through COVID and we spend
20:03
so much time on our PCs you'll see people glance at their phones or their watch while they're
20:08
talking to you, you can feel that. That's not like a missed emotion or a missed connection between
20:12
people. We don't dismiss that. We see eyes move. We then take those micro tells on the other side
20:18
We use them. Are they listening to me? Are they just not interested? Uh-oh, did they get over
20:22
interrupted? Should I pause and ask them if they need a minute? Like all those things kind of pull
20:27
us out. So one of the things that Duo does is you want to connect. You want to be connected
20:33
closing it matters and i'm not over indexing on it but it's real for sure now to that point this
20:41
is the learning curve of the product if you're used to a phone in your pocket and you're addicted
20:46
to that glanceable nature of it addicted might not be the right word i'll probably get in trouble for
20:50
that i think it's the right word i think it's an absolutely fair word like well let's just say
20:55
that's it like what you do is you always you know you're like just check am i missing something i'm missing missing there is a learning curve to not have that available to you and the longer you use
21:05
this product the more you actually respect that and appreciate it but at first you're like i just
21:11
want to get to the information i want to know when it's coming in i remember getting that feedback
21:16
when we first started or i i just need to know when information is passing through i'm like you
21:22
probably do and if use duo and when it's closed it's closed if it doesn't work for you then don't
21:27
It's okay. Like, but, uh, and then the answer is you can use it folded back and, and that's, that's
21:34
okay too. Like it's a phone at that point, but I do love the concept of digital detox
21:39
I do love the concept of it. Sometimes we need to be with each other, Lou. Um, and some, yeah, I feel that
21:46
I mean, the, the, uh, example that you used of the smartwatch, it's the reason I'm using
21:51
a semi-smart watch right now with all notifications turned off because it would be that thing
21:58
when you sort of turned off your phone then that one would pick up where your phone left off
22:03
and it was sort of having the unintended effect that you were mentioning where it could
22:08
just hijack a moment and that's it's becoming harder and harder to protect those protect those
22:15
moments and so I was aware of it and actually put those devices away for that purpose now obviously
22:20
there are some people who manage it better and are able to have only the key notifications come through or they get that you get better at ignoring it But there is kind of a strange training process with those devices that by default out of the box they want to hit you
22:36
with everything and there's a there's a biological feedback to that buzz that pulls you back into the
22:43
sort of digital realm and outside out of the the real one it's fascinating look and you're right
22:48
people there's many people that manage it well there's many people that love it um and fall in
22:53
love with it which is cool like like for me that like as a as a team uh as a product maker as a
23:00
team of product makers like when somebody falls in love with your product and they need it that's awesome um and when they want it come on like you celebrate that for sure you made a difference but
23:09
but yeah you know this is it's just a concept and and it's uh it resonates when you tell me
23:15
it resonates when you talk about it it's cool that you picked up on it now another key difference
23:20
that I noticed with this product compared to some of the I guess you could maybe comparables that
23:26
are out there is that this device doesn't make a big deal of the camera in the same way that other
23:33
devices do I mean even if I'm looking at the Samsung folding product it's still got a huge
23:39
kind of massive camera hump on the back now for good reason in their case they're trying to have a
23:45
flagship level there's a zoom camera in there and it's just a huge focus for those devices
23:52
for most smartphones this one on the other hand kind of hides the camera well like a lot of the
23:58
other things when it's closed there's no nothing really staring back at you uh but obviously
24:04
there's a compromise there if you're going to have a tiny little camera module and only a single
24:10
camera unit, then some users, some potential buyers, that's going to be a consideration
24:15
for them. So what was the thinking behind that decision? Why not have some giant camera hump on the device
24:23
I think for the things you've already said, it's a good leading question and you've kind
24:30
of resolved it for yourself. The focus wasn't the camera, the focus was two screens side by side
24:34
And then once you start designing a product for that, you start realizing what's most important, which include the thinness, the elegance, the ability to fold it back, not getting caught in a wedge because there's a huge bump on the back of the product
24:47
And I can't put it in my pocket the way we just talked about. And really, is it about the camera
24:52
No. I mean, if you really wanted a premium camera, premium is not the right word. this is a premium camera and you can take some great pictures with it
24:58
but if you wanted to go speed feed, compare, you know, a master zoom class and kind of, you know
25:05
push the boundaries of cameras, uh, that's wasn't where we were going to put our energy. It was, it
25:11
it results in too many trade-offs on the product, um, from thinness to weight to what it's really being used for
25:18
which is the most important thing. And, uh, ultimately that 360 degree hinge then get compromised and then the principle
25:27
the product kind of goes starts to fall down and you realize you're chasing a
25:32
spec and don't get me wrong that spec you know or that camera more than a spec
25:38
that amazing cameras by the way on some of these devices like crazy cool tech
25:44
look it if it's important in the most critical thing for you if you're buying
25:50
a camera and there's a phone with it the awesome like there's plenty of products but it's also hard
25:56
when you say panels is it a phone i'm like once i say yes you're like well the camera sucks man
26:01
i'm like well that's a camera it was a phone but isn't it funny how phones and cameras are
26:06
synonymous with one another makes perfect sense uh and it's a need for many but really at the end
26:12
of the day the product takes great photos and it's amazing for front-facing camera which is
26:16
where we put our energy. Like you're going to be on a Teams call, a Zoom call. You're going to get
26:21
into any one of the apps you want that are two-way and WhatsApp. You're going to use Snap
26:27
Then we have a great front-facing camera. We're working on eye gaze. We're bringing it to Duo
26:31
So you're going to connect with the people even closer from Duo to Duo. We've got these amazing
26:36
focus areas that are about this experience. I should probably pick up my device, but it's about
26:42
this and you're uh when you as a team and as a as a group of product makers and and for myself it's
26:51
it is fundamentally like what is the one thing this product's going to deliver like you've got
26:56
to stay there you want to make a beautiful product you want that emotional moment you don't know how
27:00
delightful it was to watch you pull that thing out of the box and go whoa what is this that matters
27:05
man look that matters like it totally matters and and then the robustness you're talking about in the
27:11
feel like all that comes together seamlessly. And you know, there's some, there's moments where you
27:17
make decisions on what the product will be and what the product won't be. And to your point
27:21
when you kind of made that call, and I know, don't get me wrong, I've gotten plenty of feedback
27:27
It's, it's first thing I get asked. And what about my camera? I'm like, let's flip it backwards and
27:32
take a photo, then call me. And like, tell me how great of a photographer you are, like, and how
27:38
how much you really need. And if you need a high end high, you know, if you needed to go get like
27:44
um, true photography lessons or whatever it is, or go get the perfect photo, like
27:49
I think there's plenty of products that can do that for you. And I, I never, I would never talk bad about those products. I purposely don't use many of them because I don't
27:59
want to have an opinion, but I also, because I get asked a lot and it's better for me from a
28:04
genuine sense to not, you know, have to sugarcoat. But I think it's going to be for people when they
28:11
go to buy Duo or invest in it or be part of the Duo family or the Surface family. Yeah
28:16
and that'll be a decision point. Do I want the two screens? And do I want the productivity that
28:20
it brings? Do I want this adaptability? Do I want tent mode? Do I want to be able to sit on an
28:24
airplane and just fold this thing and watch it on this massive screen and beautiful? Do I want to
28:28
be able to keep it in my pocket and sit on this massive screen? All the things that you get
28:32
you'll have to ask yourself do i also but but i need the camera bump so what do i do now or do i
28:37
want the camera bump i'm just going to say that not to be rude just in simple form and that'll be
28:42
a trade-off that people have to make when they're when they're coming after this product but i think
28:46
you nailed it you know it's about about the thinness about the elegance about folding it's
28:51
about what the product was designed for to be used by people well it's all part of the relationship
28:57
it's all part of i mean in some ways the way you go on to use the device think about the device
29:03
talk about the device it it all depends on that initial interaction it's so true so true that's
29:11
why when you when you pull duo out of the box the first time uh i'm just i was anxious you know
29:17
well actually to be honest with you i think this device sort of requires real reactions
29:27
maybe more so than it requires the typical let's say review process and the reason being is because
29:35
the review process as we've seen it kind of emerge on the web and through video it sometimes
29:42
struggles with emotion and emotion is such a big part of uh sort of what we extract from these
29:49
devices and the work that goes into them and reviews on the other hand tend to look more
29:56
at a spec sheet, you know, being comprehensive. of getting all the details in but sometimes the details or a list of details doesn't properly
30:06
encompass a product and what it means or how it behaves and so pulling this out of the box and
30:13
capturing the initial moment of interaction is closer for me to how a potential customer should
30:22
think about it because holding it is different than seeing it yeah and that's a difficult thing
30:31
by the way to express or to put into a video there's no other way than capturing it live
30:37
and then it's up to the viewer to determine okay that's his reaction that's how he's feeling about
30:44
it that's his initial feedback and then they're closer to how the same experience might feel for
30:50
them. Yeah. I love, that's what I love about it. I think it's, it's genuine. Like more and more
30:57
people are emotionally connecting to the products that they're using for sure. I wouldn't say that
31:01
was the case, you know, seven years ago, but I would tell you now, like it's part of, it's part
31:07
of who we are. It's on us all the time. It's meaningful. And whether it's a PC or a phone
31:11
it matters. And we're starting to see it more. You're right. That emotional connection
31:16
I also believe in this a little bit, you know, I get here, I end up here every time, but
31:20
These products reflect the people that are making them. The team's going to put all its energy in
31:25
I want people to take all the energy out of it that use them. That's where you get a relentless team
31:32
That's where you get relentless people looking at every detail, and it matters. I don't want a rep to say sorry to you
31:37
Oh, I know. That part wasn't perfect. Sorry. But the rest is cool, right
31:42
That's like, man, it misses a point. But there's a hole in your shirt
31:46
Yeah, I know. But look at the rest of my shirt. And so there's just an element of truth to keeping people engaged, connected and kind of encompassed
31:55
But you're right. It's been hard to express, like, pick it up and feel it
32:02
Turn on the screens and look at them, you know, before you take the shot
32:06
And I don't get it. You know, it's it's missing this spec, this feed, this point that I needed
32:13
How could you possibly do that? Like just first pick it up and then read a book on it
32:17
Yeah, there's a thing about it. There's a kind of a balance
32:22
There's a balanced feeling when you hold it, which is very difficult to showcase in video
32:28
There's a lightness to it. Obviously, the insane thinness of it, which without a reference point to some other phone
32:35
just seeing the product images, it's hard to know how different that is
32:40
But that's sort of the aim, obviously, for me in my video
32:44
and having the reaction in there is to try to portray some of those intangible pieces
32:50
that are just tougher to write down. I think it's why you're having such a great impact
32:55
It matters. Right now, my kids, 20, 17, 14, they're watching creators like yourself
33:08
and they're leaning into the opinion because it's just genuine, it's real
33:13
So, you know, we don't read as much as we used to, maybe
33:18
Definitely. Like I know my kids they read their book at night and I love that But when they it but when they want info if they want to learn they moving to YouTube you know they moving to Insta
33:30
They're using, for me, you know, our team and my family, Edge, and getting all the web and just
33:37
getting the videos off there. Like, so this is just reality and it's fun to see. Actually
33:43
can I just say this? Like, it's really kind of a, it's an honor to be just talking to you today
33:49
Like it's humbling. It's super humbling and a little bit frightening. And also like I get to represent my team, the team, our team, like that team has killed themselves like in so many different ways. I guess that's a bad sense, but they put so much in and to be able to represent it is nice. So I appreciate you having me on
34:09
Cool. Yeah, of course. No, the feeling is likewise there. Appreciate having you here too. I think it's going to be insightful for a lot of audience members to sort of get your perspective and hear it from the other side because people who have been watching my videos, they always, well, they get to see the reaction
34:27
They get to see the ysis, but I'm always trying my best to come from a place of appreciation, come from a place of respect for the work that goes into something
34:38
Especially recently, the longer I've been doing this, the more I've been able to recognize how difficult it is to make things and especially to make things that are different or new
34:48
or to I mean this is a risk these these are these are risky moves and so I try to I try to put some
34:57
of that in there but ultimately having you on is is going to be the best way for people to get a
35:02
better sense of the behind the scenes the effort the energy the commitment and so forth anyway I
35:08
wanted to ask you one more thing just about the the decision to go with Android to create a to
35:16
have a relationship with google here i mean as a famous maybe the most famous software company
35:23
out there there was a windows phone uh there i remember first hearing about the courier project
35:33
i don't was that 2010 or something long long time ago i mean i've been kind of following the thing
35:40
along as many tech enthusiasts have and then you get to a point where i guess there's a
35:46
recognition and i mean i'm i don't want to put words in your mouth but that android is the thing
35:53
that's in people's pockets and that okay here we are as microsoft but we're going to have to
36:00
collaborate on this device i just want to hear a little bit more about the background on that i got a bunch of party lines for you if you want them but let me just spare you those and jump into
36:08
like background at the end of the day like even talking with sati we sat down we want to meet our
36:13
customers where they are. That sounds like a line, but it's not. It's true. It's just, it's real
36:19
Like that's where they are. And you don't want to reinvent that. There's no point at this point
36:26
They're there because the apps are there. And they're there because it's a great platform
36:33
It turns out, you know, Microsoft's one of the largest ISVs on Android, as it were. We have so
36:39
that are built for Android. And you put all that together and you're like
36:42
wow, let's make a great product. Well it just product So maybe it an Android OS It got our Microsoft energy into it And then fundamentally we optimizing the apps that people use from Microsoft on the product
36:59
We call it the best of Microsoft. And that was the design point for the product
37:03
It was the best of Microsoft and the Android you know. Let's put those together. And the dream there was, hey, would Google be interested in that
37:13
That's an interesting just a load. I didn't make that many friends when we started this process
37:18
It's not like everybody's like, this makes perfect sense. You should do this
37:25
It takes, I believe, a leader like Satya to push that envelope and say, we adopt all platforms for sure
37:32
Let's now practice what we're preaching. It's true. And making a product with another platform, that was a little bit, especially from the leader who runs Windows
37:41
I was like, that's, you know, I don't know that everybody was excited, but the truth is it's the product you need right now
37:48
And that's what I believe. It has the apps that you need. And Android is so flexible to help us with that adaptability for users
37:58
Like, it's super cool. Now, on top of that, it gives an extra focus on making the Microsoft properties on Android great
38:07
So, you know, think about Office. Think about Teams. think about it edge you know you can just go all the way down the list news to do one note all these
38:16
apps that come to life on android um even management apps for commercial customers like
38:22
there's just opportunity to get closer to the customer which by the way what surface did
38:26
a lot for windows was just get us closer to the lives that we want to change you know to hear what
38:33
people are saying like straight up and now we're going to get that same filter from duo and um
38:40
it's it's i don't know it's hard to say but it's the right platform for this product yeah point
38:45
people have android in their pocket it matters yeah and and what i think is funny enough
38:50
we've kind of we've been living in a space where and i've experienced this firsthand being on the
38:56
web talking about tech we've been living in a space where tech companies have to be enemies
39:01
and have to have their fans exclusively and their fans have to be at war with everybody
39:09
all the other fans and the it gets exhausting at a certain point and what might to some at first
39:17
glance be like okay they've made the concession here that you know this is some sort of point of
39:24
weakness or someone could perceive it that way but in reality it's it might be a strength
39:30
to be able to look at it and say and be honest and to start with the customer instead of maybe
39:37
pride, let's say. Yeah, I think it's fair. Let me give you two sides to that. Just because I need
39:42
to acknowledge what you said about fans, but I also want to just share that acknowledgement
39:50
Think about Microsoft's mission statement for a minute. It's we thrive on this. We believe in it
39:55
We want to empower every human and organization on the planet to achieve more. I mean, that's a
40:00
huge statement, but we're pretty, it's meaningful. It matters. Like, you know, having a mission in
40:06
that vision for who you are, what you want to be. And then but you can that matters and then translate to what you doing at work especially And to be able to say we have a mission that to help every human achieve more
40:21
Then take that. Then me talking about putting Duo on Android is not crazy
40:26
It's where people are. It's what we need. It's what will help that mission
40:31
So take a leader like me that gets very convicted in vision and where we're headed and patience on that journey
40:39
and you can kind of see Duo represent that. Pause. Go to fans for a minute
40:45
Dude, let's be clear. It is hard for me to read when one of my fans or a Microsoft fan
40:53
or a Windows fan sends me a note, you know, telling me what they think
40:58
You know, like the, what have you done? And then I only hope
41:05
like I hope they get the product and they use it and they go, oh my gosh, this is an awesome
41:09
a Microsoft product. It's a Microsoft product using an Android platform, but it's a Microsoft
41:15
product. You will feel surface. When you pick it up, you will know it's surface. And I think
41:23
our fans will be delighted once they start to understand. Connect that mission of empowering
41:28
everyone to achieve what they want to achieve and then connect it to this product and you can see it
41:33
like you can literally see it tie that to a fan sometimes there's a there's a few it believe me i
41:41
don't know if you do this but i try not to i read as much as i can to be respectful of the people
41:47
who put energy back into what i do i won't watch i won't watch this video i can't i won't read
41:53
articles that maybe i'm quoted and that's hard but i read my comments i read what fans are saying
41:59
because I have to stay connected to people using the products and it matters to me
42:03
But boy, I got to tell you, sometimes it's hard. You know, sometimes you get those moments
42:07
You're like, I think I want to just call this human. Which, by the way, early on, I tried a few times
42:13
Very bad idea. Very bad. Like, it doesn't scale. Yeah, well, you know what
42:22
I think you're going to make a lot of fans happy with this one. You have something special
42:27
You have something different. and believe it or not, that's in my job where I'm sort of always looking for that next thing
42:35
I'm looking to be inspired in what I do, in the videos that I shoot, in the devices that I
42:39
have the opportunity to interact with. This one sort of captured my imagination. It got me back
42:46
into the realm of thinking about futuristic computing devices, not necessarily being stuck
42:52
on the form factors that currently exist. Devices like this are the reason I got into this in the
42:58
first place. I mean, the kid version of me is alive and well when I get the opportunity to
43:03
interact with things like this. I want to thank you for joining us here and being a part of this
43:09
video. I think it's going to be really insightful to a lot of viewers out there, to Unbox Therapy
43:15
fans, to Microsoft fans. So thank you so much. And hopefully we can do this again sometime
43:20
Hey, I'm appreciative. I'm grateful. Like I said, it's humbling to be on here representing Microsoft. It's a big deal
43:25
You're doing a hell of a job, by the way. Thank you for spending the time with us. I'll be sure to pass a lot
43:32
of this through to the team so they can get the feeling and the filters that you've given us. I appreciate that
43:36
Awesome. You take care. You too
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