HAUNTED ELLICOTT CITY, MD: 250 Years of Ghosts & Legends | Rissa Miller

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>> Woo!
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>> Hey folks, welcome to Phantoms and
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Monsters Radio.
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Tonight we've got a special guest with
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us, Ress a Miller, who's an
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award-winning author, folklorist,
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historian, and storyteller.
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Whose work explores the strange places
2:22
where history, folklore, and the
2:24
unexplained meet.
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Former award-winning journalist and
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literary coordinator at the Edgar Allan
2:30
Poe House and Museum, she has spent
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nearly a decade leading ghost tours
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and researching the legends, hauntings,
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and unusual histories of Pennsylvania
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and Maryland.
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Now, Ress is especially fascinated by
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the stories communities tell about the
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places they inhabit
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and what these stories reveal about both
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the past and the people who keep them
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alive.
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Now, her research takes her on deep
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dives into historic archives, old
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newspapers, cemeteries, museums, and of
3:00
course, more than a few haunted
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buildings.
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So,
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Ress, thanks for joining me this
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evening.
3:09
>> Thank you so much for having me back. It
3:11
is a pleasure to be here with you again
3:13
on Phantoms and Monsters.
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>> Well, we were
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I had a couple people say they wanted
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you to come back. I haven't been doing
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many interviews of any and I figured,
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well, we're going to ask Ress to come
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back. It's been over a year.
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So, um
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I guess a good subject to talk about is
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of course Ellicott City. You and I are
3:34
both very aware of this place. I I lived
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down there almost 20 years.
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Uh
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I used to work near there. I've seen,
3:43
heard, and
3:45
experienced a few things in in the past.
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So, uh I'll just let you take the floor.
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Give us your presentation, tell us what
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you think about Ellicott City, and uh
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whatever you want to talk about.
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>> Thank you so much, Lon. Okay, so I love
4:02
Ellicott City. Uh I've never actually
4:05
lived there. I've lived all around it,
4:08
but never in it. I have worked in
4:11
Ellicott City, though, for quite a
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while.
4:14
Um I worked with a Well, I still work
4:16
with Maryland History Tours. It's owned
4:19
by a fantastic gentleman named Ed, and
4:22
Ed trained me first to be a ghost tour
4:25
guide in Ellicott City many many many
4:28
moons ago.
4:29
And um I How do I describe?
4:33
So, well, we're going to jump right in.
4:35
We're going to jump right into the first
4:37
ghost story. This is the B&O Railroad,
4:40
and this is now a museum, and it's free
4:43
to enter. You can absolutely go to the
4:45
B&O, experience it, walk through, and
4:48
maybe you'll meet Charlie. Charlie is
4:51
the main haunting of the B&O Railroad.
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Now, this building was put up in 1831,
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and it was actively a train station
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until 1950,
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which is phenomenal. It connected
5:04
Ellicott City to Baltimore. That was 13
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mi of track, lucky 13. And um Charlie
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has had a lot of uh
5:14
How do I want to say?
5:15
legends um in Ellicott City. There are
5:18
people who swear they have pictures of
5:20
him looking out the window, and the
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really interesting thing about Charlie
5:23
is he was a real person from history. He
5:26
actually lived there, and he was the
5:28
train conductor there during the time of
5:30
the Civil War.
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So, the kind of um
5:36
interactions people have with Charlie.
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I'll share my own personal story first.
5:40
I was giving a presentation in the upper
5:42
room that was not about Charlie. It was
5:44
actually about Edgar Allan Poe. And um
5:48
as I was talking, suddenly two women in
5:51
two different rows stood up and both
5:53
screamed at the same time.
5:55
Um they both swore that somebody had
5:57
walked up and put a hand on their
5:59
shoulder and it was freezing cold and uh
6:02
there was nobody standing there. I was
6:03
in the middle of giving a presentation.
6:05
There was you would have certainly
6:06
noticed somebody walk up and touch two
6:08
different people in two different rows.
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And uh I was like, "Oh gosh, you know,
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that must have been Charlie. I uh I
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apologize I did not properly introduce
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him before I started talking about Poe."
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And so as like, "This is Charlie's
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place. He is the haunting here and he
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was the station master."
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So um I told a little bit about
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Charlie's story. Unfortunately, those
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two ladies did not stick around to hear
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it. Uh they both took their things and
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left the presentation.
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So um
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um there's a dog behind me tonight for
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those at home. I apologize. She's
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decided it is time to play squeaky ball.
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Can you give us some quiet, baby? Okay.
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We'll see how that goes.
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But um
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But yeah, so Charlie does other things.
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He is still there basically caretaking
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the B&O. Uh there are people who say
7:02
that um they hear him dragging cases
7:05
around upstairs and they go upstairs and
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nothing's been moved. But it's almost
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like he's still bringing in people's
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luggage and he's also done kind of
7:12
helpful things like toss the trash bag
7:14
downstairs at the close of the night.
7:16
So um like many of Ellicott City's ghost
7:19
stories, he is not a particularly scary
7:22
ghost. He's kind of a benevolent
7:24
character. And I do think he is an
7:27
interactive spirit. I don't think he's
7:29
residual because he does all kinds of
7:31
different things. They do have these
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doors on the front of the building on
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what would have been what is still the
7:37
second floor and there used to be stairs
7:39
that came out and came down to ground
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level.
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>> Mhm.
7:43
>> They had to um electronically keep them
7:46
closed and also sort of bar them shut
7:49
because Charlie continuously opened
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them. And it was a straight drop
7:54
out those doors and down to the ground.
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So, yeah, Charlie has been quite a
8:00
character at the B&O. A lot of folks
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have encountered him. Um they they still
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hear him walking up and down the steps
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long after the museum's closed and
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there's nobody there except one or two
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people downstairs.
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And um I think it's um
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I think it's safe to say that I I don't
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think any flood or any other catastrophe
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is going to scare Charlie away cuz he's
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been there through all of it, through
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Agnes and through all of the recent
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flooding. He continues to be a presence
8:29
at the B&O. I think it's his place and
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he's there to take care of it.
8:35
>> Yeah, he's not going anywhere.
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>> [laughter]
8:37
>> Yeah, I don't think so.
8:38
>> that.
8:39
>> Yeah.
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>> So, um
8:42
>> [sighs and gasps]
8:42
>> tell me some stories that you don't
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think I've heard before from Ellicott
8:45
City.
8:46
>> Stories that I don't think you've heard?
8:47
>> Yeah.
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>> Gosh, um let's see. I'm trying to think
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what pictures you have of tonight. So,
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the things I think you might not have
8:56
heard. Um
8:59
I know you know that one and I know you
9:01
know that one.
9:04
So, there used to be a spot there called
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Tea on the Tiber.
9:08
And um it has been empty since the first
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big flood.
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And it was a it was a tea room that, you
9:15
know, ladies would go and have tea, I
9:16
guess gentlemen, too. We'd go and have
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tea and they would serve, you know,
9:20
scones and uh fancy high tea and things
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like that. Finger sandwiches with
9:25
cucumbers. And when they were restoring
9:28
it, I don't know that you've heard this
9:30
story, they
9:32
were trying to finish painting to get
9:34
the tea room open and they came in one
9:36
day and paint had been splashed all over
9:39
the walls and as they washed it down it
9:41
started to look like dried blood.
9:43
>> Mhm.
9:44
>> So, as it turns out in that room there
9:47
had been a death of a woman named
9:49
Catherine. [snorts]
9:50
And uh there were very few details in
9:53
any of the historical accounts about how
9:55
or why Catherine died or what what was
9:57
going on there, but one of the other
9:59
details that we do know is that that was
10:01
uh the town butcher for many years when
10:03
it was Ellicott Mills.
10:05
So, we don't know if she was the wife or
10:08
a daughter or an employee there,
10:10
but um we do know that Catherine died in
10:13
that room and it is strongly believed
10:15
that when the tea room was reopening or
10:18
opening they um
10:20
very much witnessed her sort of saying,
10:23
"Yes, that's the spot." Um
10:25
they witnessed her sort of saying, "I'm
10:27
still here and I'm a presence." And then
10:30
in the years to follow while Tea on the
10:32
Tiber was there a lot of folks would
10:34
hear her walking around. They'd hear
10:36
like the swish of long skirts through
10:38
the tea room. And honestly in a in a tea
10:41
room that that seems to kind of make
10:43
sense. It it almost feels like a
10:45
a a good kind of haunting to have there
10:48
is an old-fashioned lady.
10:50
>> Mhm.
10:51
Mhm.
10:52
>> Is that a story you knew?
10:53
>> Well, I didn't know that story. Um
10:56
I I knew there'd been a lot of stories
10:58
up on Tongue Row and down around, you
11:01
know, on Tiber.
11:02
>> Absolutely. Yeah.
11:03
>> And people who don't know Ellicott City,
11:07
that is probably the most fascinating
11:09
part of the town for me is when you go
11:11
up
11:12
uh
11:12
from Main Street and you go up the hill
11:14
and go in through, you know, the alley
11:16
and everything and it's like it's it's
11:18
it's so weird. I mean, that was a a
11:20
thoroughfare a main thoroughfare for the
11:22
town at one point. And it's just so
11:24
narrow. I don't know if you can even get
11:26
a wagon through there.
11:26
>> narrow, yeah.
11:27
>> Yeah, I don't know if you can even get a
11:28
wagon through there.
11:30
>> You could get your horse through.
11:31
>> Could you? That's about it.
11:33
>> That's about it. [laughter] Yeah.
11:35
So, I would love to talk a little bit
11:36
about Ellicott City. So, Ellicott City
11:39
for those who don't know is in Maryland.
11:40
It is 13 mi south of Baltimore, and it
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was founded by Quakers, and that pretty
11:45
much gave it a different personality
11:47
than any other major part of Maryland
11:50
that still exists today. It was founded
11:52
by three brothers from Bucks County,
11:53
Pennsylvania, the Ellicott brothers,
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Joseph, Andrew, and John.
11:57
And they came there to establish a
12:00
farming colony. So, in that area, it was
12:03
mostly tobacco plantations before them.
12:06
They were grain farmers. They started
12:09
Ellicott Mills. They were growing wheat
12:11
and other grain crops. And
12:15
um
12:16
that is kind of how Ellicott City got
12:19
its personality. There were mills there
12:20
until 2020.
12:22
Um making Indian Head Corn Meal and uh
12:25
Washington Flower Mix. That was there
12:27
until 2020 when they moved to the
12:29
Carolinas.
12:30
So, it's only been 6 years out of over
12:33
250 that Ellicott did not have a grain
12:37
mill, which is kind of wild. I don't
12:39
even think there's uh there aren't
12:41
really any functional bakeries there
12:43
right now, either, which is kind of sad.
12:45
But, you never know.
12:46
>> Yeah.
12:46
>> Yeah. You never know. You never know
12:48
who's going to pop into one of those
12:49
little shops next. But, um Ellicott City
12:53
be- because it was founded by Quakers
12:55
had a very different history.
12:57
Many of the original shopkeepers, like
13:00
the woman who owned Tongue Row, were
13:01
women.
13:03
Um that's We're looking at right now is
13:04
the Clay Grounds. And um I'll come to
13:07
that in the second. But, uh Tongue Row
13:10
that you started talking about a moment
13:12
ago was indeed
13:14
um a business owned by a woman named Ann
13:17
Tongue. She was Quaker, and she came
13:20
from England after her husband's very
13:23
early death with her children.
13:25
And she built housing for mill workers
13:28
and she rented them out. And at the
13:31
time, you know, they they went for the
13:33
salty price of almost $500 a year. But
13:37
it's because they had fireplaces and
13:39
they were pretty nice accommodations. So
13:43
that said, Anne was one of many female
13:47
business owners in Ellicott City. Now I
13:49
want you to remember that we're talking
13:50
about the 1700s.
13:53
So female business owners weren't really
13:56
very common except in Ellicott City.
13:59
Quakers allowed women to own businesses,
14:01
to have their own money, to choose who
14:03
they wanted to marry, to have an
14:05
education, and to inherit property.
14:09
This is not true most other places in
14:12
America or the world even at that time
14:14
in history. So Ellicott City started
14:16
with this very unique perspective that
14:19
continues to this day.
14:21
Even today I We haven't counted in a
14:24
minute, but one time Ed from Maryland
14:26
History Tours and I went through and we
14:28
counted how many of those businesses
14:29
today are still owned by women. And as
14:32
of just a few years ago, the majority of
14:34
them were still owned by women even
14:36
today.
14:37
So for that reason, Ellicott City has a
14:40
little different perspective. But you
14:42
know, since you're talking about Tong
14:44
Row, let's talk about the main haunting
14:46
there. Her name is Cecilia.
14:49
So
14:50
Cecilia was definitely from the
14:53
Victorian era, which means that she came
14:55
in maybe halfway through that 250-year
14:59
history, right?
15:01
>> [snorts]
15:01
>> And
15:02
she probably lived there. She was
15:04
probably somebody's wife.
15:05
And Cecilia was a very active spirit for
15:08
a very long time. There used to be a
15:11
bookstore in the spot where the little
15:12
market cafe is now.
15:14
And the children's books were on the
15:16
second floor. Cecilia was well known for
15:20
for children's books down and giving
15:21
them to kids.
15:22
>> Mhm.
15:23
>> That um if a child went in and wanted a
15:25
toy or a book that was up too high to
15:28
reach, she would graciously get it down
15:30
for them. And because uh she is not she
15:33
was never considered a dark or a
15:35
sinister spirit, children weren't scared
15:37
of her.
15:38
They just graciously took the things and
15:41
it was all good.
15:43
Uh Cecilia was seen walking around. Uh
15:46
there are some of the tour guides who
15:48
said that guests have got pictures of
15:50
her.
15:51
But one time she met someone she didn't
15:53
like. And uh this is one of my favorite
15:56
ghost stories to share from Tongue Row.
15:59
Cecilia uh could flit in and out of all
16:03
of those little houses on Tongue Row. So
16:06
it's actually a whole series of small
16:09
stone houses. And I'll talk about the
16:11
Ellicott City stone in a minute cuz I
16:12
know you know it's special, right?
16:14
>> Mhm.
16:14
>> And so um there was a salon there for
16:18
quite a while. And there was a woman
16:20
getting highlights. So for those who
16:22
don't know, when you get highlights,
16:23
your hair is put into aluminum foil
16:26
literally. They're these pieces of
16:28
aluminum foil sticking out while they're
16:30
highlighting your hair. And they're like
16:32
your hair is folded into them. It looks
16:34
very much like you're worried about
16:35
aliens reading your mind, okay? Cuz
16:37
there's aluminum foil all over your
16:39
head.
16:40
And so this woman was getting her hair
16:42
highlighted. She's in her foils and you
16:44
have to sit with them for a certain
16:45
amount of time, 20-30 minutes, something
16:47
like that so that the the color takes.
16:50
So during that time, this salon patron
16:53
went to the ladies room and on her way
16:55
back down the stairs to get her foils
16:57
taken out and her hair rinsed, Cecilia
17:00
appeared in full form, said,
17:04
"I don't like you. Get out of my house."
17:07
And the lady literally left in her foils
17:11
uh just straight up went home,
17:13
absolutely dashed out of the salon.
17:16
Um I always had the question like, did
17:17
she pay?
17:18
But, um, maybe not.
17:20
>> [laughter]
17:21
>> Apparently, she was terrified. And this
17:24
is not
17:25
characteristic of any other story we've
17:27
ever heard about Cecilia, ever.
17:30
Ever. So, this lady must not have been a
17:32
very nice person. Um,
17:34
>> Yeah.
17:35
>> So, yeah, because Cecilia was kind and
17:38
gracious, or even just neutral to
17:39
everybody else, except this one lady.
17:43
>> Mhm.
17:46
Well, you know, I have heard
17:49
so many legends associated with Ellicott
17:52
City and the environs.
17:54
Um,
17:56
and of course, I don't buy into every
17:58
one of them, you know.
18:00
I mean, it's an old town, and there's a
18:02
lot of old stories, and
18:04
old story old stories get expounded
18:06
upon, so, uh,
18:08
yeah. Um,
18:11
you have Can you tell us any other
18:14
real ghastly stories from Ellicott City?
18:17
>> There aren't a lot of ghastly stories.
18:20
Uh,
18:20
>> Mhm.
18:21
>> there are lots of sad stories. That I I
18:23
can do sad stories. Ghastly, not as
18:26
much. Um, we could go up onto Mount
18:28
Misery and talk about the jail, that's
18:31
kind of ghastly. Or we could go to the
18:33
Ilchester Bridge and talk about the
18:34
flicker geist. Um, now, I think the
18:38
flicker geist I think we talked about
18:40
that when I was on here talking about
18:41
Hell House.
18:41
>> Yeah.
18:42
>> But, the Ilchester Tunnel and Bridge is
18:45
a fascinating story, because they made a
18:47
movie about it, right?
18:49
So, um, we were talking earlier about
18:51
the B&O Railroad. And the B&O Railroad
18:53
used to come out and go around that
18:56
mountain right there. And that was not
19:00
the best plan. Uh, every time there was
19:01
a flood, the structure would get washed
19:03
away. And so, they decided in 1902 to
19:06
blast through the mountain and put in
19:09
the tunnel.
19:10
Um, it worked out great, and suddenly
19:13
the B&O the railroad could easily come
19:16
and go, and no longer was um plagued by
19:19
the bridges getting washed out by
19:20
floods.
19:22
>> Mhm.
19:22
>> So, yes, there we go. That's the
19:24
Ilchester Bridge.
19:25
So,
19:26
over time, the story of a flickergeist
19:29
popped up.
19:31
Now, flickergeists aren't unique to this
19:32
area. Flickergeists actually are
19:35
phenomena we can trace back to Europe. A
19:37
flickergeist is a
19:40
entity, I want to say. I don't know if I
19:42
would use the word ghost. I'm going to
19:43
say an entity
19:44
that um is going to lure you to your
19:48
death. It is not the same as a
19:50
benevolent spirit like in the rest of
19:52
Ellicott City.
19:54
But, especially when you get back in
19:55
that Seven Hills area, there's a lot of
19:58
dark stuff back there.
20:00
So, the flickergeist allegedly will lure
20:03
you down the tracks into the Ilchester
20:06
tunnel. And there's a great shot. Those
20:08
are the tracks. That's the tunnel.
20:10
I want to emphasize to everybody
20:12
listening that these tracks are still
20:13
live today.
20:15
I have never ever ever personally walked
20:18
them cuz I don't want to get hit by a
20:19
train.
20:21
>> Yeah.
20:22
>> um I People are always like, "Did you
20:24
walk down there?" I'm like, "Absolutely
20:26
not. A, it's illegal. B, those are live
20:29
tracks. Like, if a train should come
20:31
along and I'm like, you know, busy
20:33
taking pictures or distracted, that
20:35
there's nowhere to go."
20:36
So, um and I can't personally
20:39
>> not coming in long either. So, they come
20:41
through there pretty quick.
20:43
>> And I'm not personally fast enough or
20:45
fit enough to outrun a train. So,
20:48
>> [laughter]
20:48
>> um I know I've never walked the tracks
20:50
into the tunnel, nor do I plan to.
20:53
Uh, this would be a great spot if, you
20:54
know, somebody has a drone. That's how
20:56
you get those pictures, right?
20:58
>> Yeah.
20:59
>> Um all of that said, the flickergeist is
21:02
an entity that, as you get closer to it,
21:04
it you feel like you're being stared at.
21:07
And the whole idea is you don't blink.
21:09
That's what They also call this entity
21:10
the Blink Man.
21:12
You don't blink. The minute you blink,
21:15
he can take you.
21:17
But the thing is, you're also going to
21:18
be distracted and you're going to have
21:20
to blink cuz humans have to blink. Our
21:22
eyes will be damaged if we go longer
21:25
than however many so seconds without
21:27
blinking.
21:28
>> [snorts]
21:28
>> And every time you blink, he's closer.
21:30
He's closer. He's closer.
21:32
And finally, he's so close that you
21:34
haven't noticed that he's about to push
21:36
you in front of the oncoming train. And
21:38
that is how that story goes.
21:40
>> [snorts]
21:40
>> Yeah.
21:40
>> In 2008,
21:43
a movie I'm sorry, 2018, a movie was
21:45
released called Butterfly Kisses. And
21:47
the whole idea is that you've gotten
21:49
close enough to the Blink Man that your
21:52
eyelashes can touch, which is quite
21:54
terrifying to be totally honest.
21:57
So, yeah, that that's that's
22:00
that's terrifying to have your eyelashes
22:01
touch a ghost.
22:03
>> [laughter]
22:04
>> But,
22:05
I think that's one of the more ghastly
22:07
stories from Ellicott City for me
22:08
personally.
22:10
A negative, dark, malevolent creature
22:13
that wants to throw you in front of an
22:15
oncoming train.
22:16
>> Well, wouldn't surprise me. I mean,
22:18
there've been a lot of death associated
22:20
with that with that bridge.
22:21
>> Absolutely.
22:22
>> And there've been people been hit inside
22:24
that tunnel, too. So, yeah, that's not a
22:26
new What I don't know if you remember
22:29
people used to um
22:31
get on the trestle and climb up the
22:33
hill.
22:34
>> Yes.
22:35
>> Above the the tunnel?
22:36
>> know about that.
22:37
>> And hang out up there. He's like, "Oh my
22:39
god, one of those people just slipped
22:40
one I mean, cuz it was so steep."
22:42
>> it's still very steep. It has They
22:43
haven't changed it.
22:44
>> Yeah.
22:45
>> It's still very steep.
22:46
>> Yeah.
22:46
>> And cuz it's literally right next to the
22:48
Hell House Hill.
22:50
So.
22:50
>> Right.
22:51
>> It's all right there together.
22:55
>> Yeah. Ever since Well, you you know,
22:57
when I used to work there,
22:59
right there where Simpkins was across
23:01
the river,
23:02
you know, we had the power plant right
23:04
there and then of course we had the
23:05
bridge to the left and you know, all the
23:08
railroad and stuff and up into the hills
23:10
up into the college.
23:12
And
23:13
man, you'd be out there in the
23:14
summertime.
23:17
Middle of night just standing there at
23:19
the door you'd hear all kinds of crazy
23:21
stuff come from up that hill.
23:22
>> I'm sure.
23:23
>> It was really amazing sometimes.
23:26
We saw a lot of UFO activity up and down
23:29
that valley.
23:29
>> that from multiple places. Yeah.
23:32
>> Yeah.
23:32
>> I've I've even heard that from people
23:34
associated with the museum and their
23:36
spouses that they have indeed witnessed
23:38
that as well.
23:41
>> Yeah, there was another there was
23:42
another phenomena used to happen all the
23:44
time and it was
23:47
we used to have a lot of meteorites come
23:49
down through that valley. You know, they
23:51
would flash green
23:53
and they
23:54
I saw at least five of them.
23:56
>> Huh.
23:57
>> The time I've been there.
23:58
>> Okay.
23:59
>> And uh you'd be weird because you'd be
24:01
up on the hill you'd be up on River Road
24:04
and it'd be dark and you're there
24:06
talking to somebody and all of a sudden
24:08
a big
24:09
uh green flash
24:11
lights up the whole area.
24:13
>> Interesting.
24:14
>> And I I have see I have seen five of
24:16
those.
24:17
>> Wow.
24:18
>> Yeah, so that I you know,
24:21
I don't know if anybody's ever going to
24:22
come up with a legend about that but
24:25
we we used to talk about it down at the
24:27
mill all the time.
24:28
Uh that these meteorites would keep
24:30
hitting into the valley.
24:32
>> Interesting. Yeah. Down into the hollow.
24:35
Yep.
24:35
>> Yeah.
24:35
>> So
24:36
um
24:37
the pictures that you just saw were of
24:39
the museum. They're on the opposite
24:40
hill. It's called Mount Misery. So
24:42
there's seven hills on one side and
24:43
Mount Misery on the other.
24:45
And um I think one of the best things
24:47
about those pictures of the museum is
24:48
you can see the Ellicott City stone.
24:51
So um let's talk about that for a
24:53
second.
24:54
The Ellicott City stone is a composite
24:56
granite and it is the bedrock of of the
25:00
town and it is believed by many experts
25:04
that that is one of the reasons that
25:06
this little town is so very haunted. It
25:09
is this bowl basically of this composite
25:13
granite that has um
25:15
crystal in it.
25:16
And it is believed that energy bonds
25:19
down to it.
25:21
And this is also this town is also the
25:23
intersection of two rivers, the Tiber
25:25
and the Patapsco.
25:27
And we know that of course nowadays
25:29
because we think of it with the floods,
25:31
but in the paranormal community a
25:32
crisscrossing of two rivers is a very
25:34
liminal space and it is a another hotbed
25:38
for paranormal activity. So these these
25:41
two things going on at the same time are
25:43
fascinating and then we brought in the
25:46
modern world and we put in the electric
25:48
grid on top of this bowl.
25:50
So here we have the the bowl of granite
25:53
with the two rivers on one side
25:55
and the the small um estuaries coming in
25:58
on the either other side and then we put
26:00
in electric grid on top. It's almost
26:01
like we closed a a Tupperware. Boop.
26:04
And it created a fascinating spot for
26:08
the paranormal. So much activity, all
26:11
kinds of activity happens in this town.
26:16
>> Yeah, it's it's a weird town. I mean
26:18
it's just got that energy.
26:22
>> And there's something about it you can't
26:23
help but go back to it over and over.
26:26
It's it's fascinating. The way the town
26:28
itself seems to lure you in.
26:32
>> Yeah. Well, I used to love you know when
26:34
I was living in Sykesville I had to come
26:36
down old Frederick Road and go through
26:39
Ellicott City to go to work and I used
26:41
to love coming through there at night
26:42
time because it just seems it just
26:44
seemed like
26:46
you're just stepping back in history
26:47
because it basically I mean the
26:49
buildings are all historical buildings.
26:51
>> Pretty much
26:51
>> all of them are. Yes.
26:53
>> You know.
26:53
>> Yes.
26:55
So you're right now you're looking at
26:56
the judge's bench and the judge's bench
26:58
is a place with a fantastic ghost story.
27:01
Let me linger here for a moment. So the
27:03
building you're looking at was
27:04
originally constructed in the 1860s and
27:07
for a very long time it was all
27:09
different kinds of stores.
27:11
And then we come into the 1960s and it's
27:15
like a mom-and-pop grocery store. Like
27:17
before we had giant Safeway and Kroger
27:19
and places like that.
27:21
Grocery stores were independently owned
27:23
like everything else used to be.
27:25
And so they this family had an
27:28
independent grocery store there.
27:30
>> [snorts]
27:30
>> Now Ellicott City is adorable today and
27:33
a wonderful spot for tourists, but it
27:35
wasn't always that way. It used to be
27:37
kind of a rough part of town. It was
27:39
known for like wine, women, and song.
27:42
So rough in fact the soldiers from Fort
27:44
Meade were allegedly not allowed to go
27:46
there which of course means that's where
27:48
they where they went.
27:49
>> Um.
27:49
>> Yeah.
27:50
>> That said, this family that owned the
27:54
grocery store there
27:56
I believe it was the Berger family
27:58
had a daughter named Mary.
28:00
Mary is one of the most famous and most
28:02
active ghost in Ellicott City.
28:05
She is still there. So she fell in love
28:08
with a boy from Ellicott City and her
28:10
parents were like, "Oh, absolutely not.
28:13
You cannot marry a local boy. You have
28:14
to marry someone not from Ellicott
28:16
City." and they forbid her from ever
28:17
seeing him again.
28:19
Now she was only 19, but remember in the
28:21
1960s that wasn't a shocking age to get
28:24
married. It's not like today where
28:25
somebody got married at 19 we'd be
28:26
surprised.
28:28
But back then that was a normal age. So
28:31
that said, um
28:33
Mary found no way forward except ending
28:35
her own life without her her guy.
28:38
And on that third floor of that building
28:40
she ended her life and to this day it is
28:44
said that she's still there.
28:46
There are so many reports of Mary. There
28:48
are
28:49
even within the probably the past year
28:51
there are dozens of new ones.
28:52
Uh the normal things that Mary does are
28:55
to move things around, uh to slide beers
28:57
back and forth, that you hear her voice,
28:59
uh that you're in the bathroom and
29:02
suddenly uh your stuff's moving around,
29:05
um or the toilet paper rolls out like
29:06
almost like a cat is taking it down, but
29:08
they always say it's Mary. There could
29:10
be a cat ghost there. There are a couple
29:11
of others in Ellicott City.
29:12
>> [snorts]
29:13
>> But um my favorite story about Mary was
29:16
there was a bartender there through the
29:17
late '90s that could see and hear her.
29:21
He was a graduate student um from
29:23
University of Maryland and he worked
29:25
there as a bartender through his um
29:28
master's degree.
29:29
And because he could interact with
29:31
[clears throat] her, they became
29:32
friends. And even after he finished
29:35
school, he stayed for a very long time
29:37
because he knew once he left he couldn't
29:39
she couldn't come with him.
29:41
She was going to be there and um
29:43
apparently people who witnessed this
29:45
said they had this great friendship.
29:48
That's it as if they say that almost as
29:50
if fate had finally sent her a good guy
29:53
who was her Ellicott City boy for a
29:55
little while.
29:56
He did eventually have to move on and
29:59
start his career.
30:00
But um I I love the story of the
30:03
bartender who was gifted in that he
30:05
could see and hear her and interact with
30:07
her and I imagine in a life
30:10
an afterlife, I guess, this kind of
30:12
probably lonely for her. She had at
30:14
least one person who made her feel seen
30:16
and heard.
30:21
>> When you do um when you do tours in
30:24
Ellicott City, uh
30:26
let's say that you're giving an overall
30:28
tour of the whole area. Uh
30:31
what places do you hit and
30:33
what are some of the
30:35
more interesting stories as you go
30:36
along?
30:37
>> on what you like, I guess, but um
30:39
>> I know, that's true. Yeah.
30:40
>> Oh, there's me giving a tour. So, that's
30:43
my girls' night out tour. Um I On that
30:45
tour, I give only women's history of the
30:48
town and I only talk about the female
30:50
hauntings. So,
30:52
that's a really fun tour because there's
30:54
so much women's history there because of
30:56
the Quakers.
30:57
So, some of the different places that um
31:00
many of the guides hit. We always talk
31:02
about the B&O.
31:03
Um we often will talk about um
31:09
Tong Row. We will talk about the old
31:12
jail up on top of Mount Misery.
31:15
We talk about the Clayground sometimes.
31:18
Yep, there's the B&O again. Um we will
31:20
talk about the
31:22
the the old bookshop that was owned by
31:25
Deborah Disney.
31:27
Um the museum of course, the Phoenix.
31:31
And the Judges Bench, the Wine Bin is a
31:33
classic. So, there almost every built
31:37
There's the jail. So, almost every
31:40
building there has ghost stories. And
31:42
the longer you're hanging around that
31:44
town as a ghost tour guide, the more of
31:46
them you know. Um honestly, like if I'm
31:48
on Main Street, the tour could take 3
31:50
hours. Nobody wants to hear me talk for
31:52
3 hours long to be to be clear. But
31:55
because we have to get it to 90 minutes
31:57
when we're doing a tour. But all of that
31:59
said, there are multiple ghost story
32:02
tours rather because there's so many
32:03
stories here.
32:05
And each one of us guides, and there are
32:07
eight of us, could do it differently.
32:08
Like you could go any Friday night or
32:11
Saturday night, get a different guide
32:12
and have a completely different
32:13
experience because there are so many
32:15
ghost stories and so many legends in
32:17
this little town. There's a great view
32:19
right there down the hill of
32:22
downtown Ellicott City.
32:24
And you can see even today it's not a a
32:26
wide modern street. It is a fantastic
32:29
old town that does indeed Sorry about
32:32
the dog again.
32:34
She's at it. She's playing.
32:36
No.
32:37
No. Can we stop? No.
32:40
So, um it is a great old town and it is
32:43
like stepping into another time when you
32:45
go there cuz it has been so beautifully
32:47
preserved.
32:50
>> Yeah, that you know, as soon as I moved
32:52
down there and started working down at
32:54
Simpkins, I mean it was like
32:56
the whole history. And course I was into
32:59
paranormal anyway.
33:00
>> Right.
33:01
>> history that that river valley is just
33:04
unbelievable. I mean there's just so
33:06
many different things that have happened
33:07
there.
33:08
>> Oh, yes. So many
33:09
>> 250 years, just that history itself.
33:13
Uh yeah, it's uh just a lot.
33:16
>> It is a lot and you know, when I started
33:19
there as a tour guide, I started with
33:20
just one tour and of course I added on
33:22
more and more and more because, you
33:24
know, I'm me. But um
33:27
that said, um
33:30
you know,
33:31
the the way that you you start to see
33:34
how these stories weave together and
33:36
sort of create the fabric of this town
33:39
and this community is absolutely
33:41
fascinating. So, um I'm trying to think
33:44
which one to like sort of get into next.
33:46
Um let's talk about the Wine Bin.
33:49
So, at the top of the hill right across
33:50
the street from the judge's bench,
33:52
there's a store called the Wine Bin and
33:53
it's been the Wine Bin since 2008. It's
33:55
been owned by a guy named Dave.
33:57
And um it's been sort of a pillar of the
33:59
community cuz that's almost 20 years
34:02
that it's been the Wine Bin, right?
34:03
>> Mhm.
34:04
>> But before that, there was an antique
34:06
store in there and then before that, it
34:08
was the fire department.
34:11
>> Mhm.
34:12
>> It was the fire department and it was
34:14
operated by Captain Shipley. And Shipley
34:17
uh
34:18
was a a man about the community, not
34:20
unlike Dave at the Wine Bin, actually.
34:22
And he had a dog named Yogi and um they
34:27
say that both of them are still there
34:28
today.
34:29
So, when it was a
34:32
um
34:33
fire department in 1938
34:37
um part of the New Deal from FDR
34:39
financed the this building. And um it
34:43
became the town's fire department until
34:44
1995.
34:47
Um which is wild because imagine
34:50
imagine the fire trucks on these
34:51
streets, right? Um you know these
34:53
streets in Ellicott City.
34:55
It makes so much sense that they finally
34:57
had to move it out out of the historic
34:59
district.
35:00
>> Yeah.
35:01
Yeah, I guess it was real tight.
35:02
>> Yep. But those big
35:04
those doors you see were [clears throat]
35:06
the front where the fire trucks would
35:07
come and go, the front of the Wine Bin
35:09
right now.
35:10
>> Right.
35:11
>> So
35:11
>> [clears throat]
35:12
>> Captain Shipley is still there and um
35:15
they see him both upstairs and
35:16
downstairs. Upstairs right now is one of
35:18
those um ax guard ax throwing places
35:21
where you can go and like
35:23
you know, throw knives and axes at
35:24
targets and things.
35:26
But um
35:28
that said, um oh that's uh a full moon
35:30
shot over the town which I I think is
35:32
kind of cool.
35:34
Um
35:35
so the Wine Bin Ellicott City's uh
35:39
Captain Shipley the ghost. So he has
35:41
this open door policy and when Dave
35:43
first opened the Wine Bin, he had a lot
35:46
of trouble with Shipley. He had the
35:48
problem that Shipley would unlock the
35:49
doors at night.
35:51
>> Mhm.
35:51
>> So it got to the point where Dave had it
35:53
had installed cameras. He was trying He
35:55
was like, "Which of my employees isn't
35:57
locking the door?" The employees were
35:58
locking the doors. The doors would then
36:00
unlock themselves after dark because
36:02
Shipley had an open door policy for the
36:04
fire department and he didn't understand
36:06
why a liquor store
36:08
needed to be locked up.
36:10
>> Mhm.
36:10
>> And so um they finally started just
36:13
talking to him and saying like, "Look,
36:15
we
36:15
we also welcome the community, but this
36:18
is a retail store now. And we need to
36:20
keep it locked up.
36:22
So um my personal um experience with
36:25
Shipley was I was uh starting a pub
36:28
crawl there and it was not a ghost tour.
36:30
I was actually talking about history of
36:32
Maryland witches, which is a different
36:34
program I do.
36:36
And so I had it given my introduction
36:39
and all of the sudden behind me all of
36:41
these beers fell on the floor and they
36:44
just started going boop boop boop like
36:46
as if somebody was knocking them down.
36:48
And luckily nothing was broken, but I
36:51
was like, "Oh, once again I have
36:53
neglected to pay proper respect to the
36:56
ghost of this building." I was like, "So
36:58
we will be pausing the witch tour and I
37:00
will be telling the story of Captain
37:02
Shipley and his Dalmatian Yogi."
37:05
So I did and I do that every time I
37:07
start there now
37:08
>> [laughter]
37:09
>> because you know, you have to be
37:11
respectful of the ghosts who live in a
37:13
building.
37:13
>> All right. All right.
37:16
Has there has there been any death
37:18
associated with any of the haunting is
37:19
there even cryptids or anything that or
37:23
has been seen in that area?
37:25
>> Um as in like there were murders or like
37:28
I'm not sure what you mean.
37:29
>> Well, you that or attacks or some type
37:32
of some type of assault that associate
37:35
that people associate with the
37:38
phenomenon that's there.
37:40
>> There is
37:42
there's a tragic story of a girl who was
37:45
raped and murdered and is still a
37:48
haunting in Ellicott City. And
37:52
her name is her name was Gertrude in
37:53
life and
37:55
she was in the building that was
37:58
originally in the fire department before
38:00
Shipley's where they kept the horses for
38:02
the bucket brigade.
38:05
And Gertrude decided that there was a
38:08
young man she didn't want to marry.
38:10
And instead of accepting her no
38:13
graciously he decided that no one else
38:16
would have her.
38:17
And um
38:19
she
38:20
she died for that no.
38:22
And she is still there today in the
38:26
Manor Hill Tavern. That building has
38:28
undergone many many many changes but she
38:32
is still there and the stories that
38:34
about her are
38:37
numerous.
38:38
Even today people who work there
38:40
experience her. One of my favorite
38:43
stories was a gentleman walked in and
38:45
the bar wasn't very busy and he walked
38:47
up to the bartender and said I hear you
38:48
have a ghost here. I want to meet this
38:50
ghost. Out of nowhere female voice said
38:53
well rack them up meaning like put out
38:55
the drinks.
38:56
So
38:57
the bartender said drinks. I don't think
38:59
Trudy actually drank hers but they've
39:01
even named cocktails and appetizer
39:03
specials after her. She has done very
39:06
mischievous things like one time they
39:08
were set up for a party in the party
39:10
room and they came in in the morning and
39:12
all the tables were upside down balanced
39:14
on the upside down wine glasses.
39:16
Inverted.
39:18
So
39:19
that is one of the stories that is
39:21
associated with a murder or a death.
39:24
Like I said it's sad. It's a sad story
39:26
but it seems like she's having lots of
39:27
fun now and that she's kind of at home
39:31
at the Manor Hill Tavern.
39:32
>> Yeah. Yeah.
39:36
Yeah, there's been a lot of tragedy up
39:38
and down that river. I I I mean you know
39:40
just from
39:41
>> Absolutely.
39:41
>> stories I've heard and
39:44
things that I've seen and read and
39:46
gotten involved with but um
39:48
>> Oh, there's a good story involved with
39:51
this site.
39:52
So this is the Patapsco Female
39:54
Institute. It's a park now. It took $10
39:56
million to restore this building after
39:58
the satanic panic but Howard County did
40:02
it. I think if they hadn't this would be
40:04
another hell house.
40:06
So
40:07
right? So that said PFI is now a
40:11
historic park and those are the ruins
40:13
that are there. This was Ellicott City's
40:16
girls school. It was um
40:19
Hang on, I have my have my dates here.
40:21
It was built in 1837. It is made of
40:24
Ellicott City stone and it was most
40:27
famous from 1841 to 1856 because a woman
40:31
named Almira Lincoln Phelps was the
40:34
headmistress and she was internationally
40:36
famous as an educator of girls and a
40:39
millionaire in that time from her books.
40:43
So to be a millionaire in 1856
40:46
is mind-bending. It is mind-bending. But
40:49
she made $3 million in her life from her
40:52
books.
40:52
>> Wow.
40:54
>> Right? So
40:56
>> for that time, I mean.
40:57
>> Right? It is It is. Yeah, she's she's
40:59
quite something. If you If you're
41:00
interested in women's history, Almira
41:02
Lincoln Phelps is definitely a name to
41:03
look at.
41:05
So the story of the ghost is Annie
41:07
Vanderlot. So Annie
41:10
was allegedly student there. Now Almira
41:13
Lincoln Phelps was so famous she
41:15
attracted students from everywhere
41:16
including Europe, Cherokee Nation, all
41:19
over, literally everywhere.
41:21
Annie Vanderlot came from the Antebellum
41:23
South. So coming to Maryland meant that
41:27
she was going to be experiencing winters
41:29
for the first time.
41:30
Heavy, cold,
41:33
freezing cold winters with snow and ice.
41:35
Uh and that hill, Mount Misery, is no
41:38
joke.
41:39
So um Annie kept writing home saying, "I
41:42
hate it here. I don't want to be here.
41:45
Please come get me. I'm going to die
41:46
here."
41:47
Her parents were like, "She's just
41:49
whining.
41:50
She'll be fine."
41:52
And um finally she wrote to her
41:53
grandmother and Annie sent to her
41:56
grandmother, "You Everybody's getting
41:58
sick. You have to come get me." Now it
42:00
is true that many girls died at PFI from
42:04
influenza or even common colds because
42:06
this was, you know, pre-germ theory,
42:08
right?
42:09
>> Mhm.
42:10
>> So
42:11
unfortunately the story goes that Annie
42:14
did get sick and even though her
42:16
grandmother got in her carriage and rode
42:19
up to Maryland to come and get her, she
42:21
was too late.
42:22
Annie had died until her grandmother got
42:25
there to retrieve her and take her back.
42:28
Now, Annie is one of the most commonly
42:29
seen ghosts on Mount Misery. They say
42:32
that she has long blonde hair and that
42:34
you can see her in what you would call a
42:35
day dress anywhere on the property.
42:38
Apparently, dog walkers see her the most
42:40
because people are walking their dogs
42:42
there in the early morning and in the
42:44
evening, which are like sunrise sunset
42:46
times and that's when Annie seems to
42:48
appear the most.
42:50
She's not the only ghost at PFI. There
42:52
are others. There's the shadow, which is
42:54
just a disembodied shadow that seems to
42:55
walk around and stand next to people.
42:58
Uh there's no person, but there'll be a
42:59
shadow cast next to you as though
43:01
somebody is standing there.
43:03
And uh then there is a residual, uh
43:05
which is a man from the 1950s who
43:08
appears in like his
43:10
vest and attire, smoking a cigar. And
43:12
you see him walking on a floor that's
43:14
not there because that part of the
43:17
building does not exist anymore.
43:19
>> Mhm.
43:20
>> So, um I have not personally witnessed
43:23
Annie or the cigar-smoking man or the
43:25
shadow, but I know a lot of people who
43:26
have, including Ed, the man who owns
43:28
Maryland History Tours. He was um there
43:31
for a historic event and sure enough, he
43:34
looked down and saw a shadow next to his
43:35
and he looked next to him and there was
43:37
nobody there. He said he went and got in
43:38
the car and I was like, "Ed, I don't
43:40
think a car door would stop a ghost."
43:43
And he's like, "Yeah, I know that." He's
43:44
like, "But I felt better about it."
43:46
>> Mhm.
43:47
Mhm.
43:48
>> So, there that is. But Annie's story is
43:51
tragic and um
43:53
it is uh an unfortunate death, but in
43:56
both of the schools, both PFI and at um
44:00
the school that was Hell House,
44:02
it was very real that people would die
44:03
of influenza
44:05
>> Mhm.
44:05
>> or pneumonia. Those things definitely
44:08
really happened.
44:11
There's Tung Row.
44:13
>> Tung Row.
44:13
Yeah, Tung Row.
44:16
Folks, if if you're in the chat tonight
44:17
and you've got a question for Alyssa, go
44:19
ahead and put it all caps and put it in
44:21
the chat and we'll try to get to it.
44:23
Okay, go ahead, Alyssa.
44:25
>> So, um, in this picture, you can kind of
44:27
you can see some of the buildings of
44:29
Tung Row. You can see that beautiful
44:30
Ellicott City stone right there behind
44:32
the flowers. And then the blue building,
44:35
which is on um, I guess like screen
44:38
right, that has the awning, that is
44:39
Little Market Cafe, where Cecilia was
44:42
most often seen.
44:44
So, um, yeah, there you get a better
44:46
shot now. Um,
44:48
that's more like what it looks like now
44:50
and it's it's a bustling restaurant, but
44:53
you can't go inside the building anymore
44:56
uh, because they use it as a kitchen.
44:58
>> Oh, really?
44:59
>> Yep.
44:59
>> It It looks a lot like it used to look.
45:02
>> Yeah. Yeah.
45:04
Um, they actually have a sign out there
45:06
right now that says Boo Boulevard.
45:08
>> [laughter]
45:08
>> Do they?
45:09
>> Yeah, it's super cute. Um, I when I saw
45:12
it the first time I I laughed out loud.
45:14
It's somewhere in this mix of photos. I
45:16
I don't know actually what I called it,
45:18
but um, I don't know if we'll see it
45:20
tonight or not, but it it is cute and
45:22
it's almost like they're sort of
45:23
claiming their their haunted history
45:25
there on Tung Row.
45:26
>> Yeah.
45:27
>> Cuz it it's not just a Halloween thing.
45:29
It's out all the time.
45:31
So.
45:32
>> Um,
45:33
>> I really love too, this particular
45:34
restaurant puts out like a 10-ft
45:37
werewolf every Halloween, which I think
45:39
is great. You know, we have the Patapsco
45:41
Howler just right down Just Yeah, oh,
45:44
there it is. Boo Boulevard Boulevard.
45:47
Um, we have the Patapsco Howler and they
45:49
get this giant werewolf out and sit him
45:51
right there in the courtyard.
45:54
Um, and I was like, I wonder if the
45:55
Patapsco Howler likes this.
45:57
And maybe maybe it makes makes him or
45:59
her feel more at home, I don't know. But
46:01
yeah, the Patapsco Female Hollar story
46:03
is literally right down the road.
46:06
>> Yeah.
46:07
Yeah, and we had a few things happen
46:09
this past couple years as well. So, um
46:11
especially in Columbia and down there
46:13
where in um
46:15
>> Actually in Ellicott City, too.
46:17
>> Yeah. Yeah.
46:18
>> Yeah. So, what we're looking at now is
46:20
the visitor center and you can see more
46:21
of that beautiful Ellicott City stone.
46:24
And um I have had personal encounters
46:26
with the ghost at the visitor center.
46:27
Her name is Loretta. Um her name was
46:30
actually Loretti, but um we call her
46:32
Loretta now and um
46:36
a lot of people have seen her because
46:37
she does appear in spectral form. That
46:39
was not my experience, but um she lived
46:43
there a long time ago, many many
46:46
generations of that property back when
46:48
it was a funeral home.
46:50
Um she was uh one of the children of the
46:53
funeral, I guess, director, or the
46:55
undertaker who was there. At one time
46:58
there were seven uh funeral homes in
47:00
Ellicott City. The death business has
47:02
always been
47:03
>> right?
47:03
>> Yes, the death business has always been
47:05
part of Ellicott City's history.
47:07
>> Yeah, I didn't realize that.
47:09
>> We had Annie Easton and and uh one of
47:12
the first female undertakers in America
47:13
in Ellicott City.
47:14
>> Mhm.
47:15
>> Um her building is gone. It has been
47:17
ripped down. But anyway, Loretta at the
47:19
visitor center. So, um I was a very new
47:22
tour guide and I used to actually carry
47:24
an oil lantern that would be lit with
47:26
real fire.
47:27
>> Mhm.
47:28
>> Cuz you know, it looks very cool, right?
47:29
It's very cool. So, I had this oil
47:31
lantern lit with real fire, with real
47:34
fuel in it, and I went into the ladies'
47:36
room at the visitor center and I
47:39
was using the ladies' room facilities
47:41
and I watched my lantern tip over.
47:44
It was lit.
47:46
Uh the whole building could have gone
47:47
up. I was terrified, but for whatever
47:49
reason the flame went out. It just went
47:51
out. And then I was like I was I was
47:55
rushing trying to get to it. I I'm like,
47:57
"Oh my god, like what is happening? I'm
47:58
like, Loretta, if that's you, please
48:00
stop." And then I watched my cell phone,
48:02
the phone I had right before this one,
48:04
start to slide along and reach the end
48:07
of a shelf and tip off. And it I had And
48:10
that phone had a crack all the way down
48:12
the screen for most of the years I had
48:14
it from that fall.
48:15
>> [snorts]
48:16
>> I had a few strong words for Loretta
48:17
that day.
48:19
Um
48:20
I did.
48:21
I did. And uh I always talk to her when
48:24
I'm on the property there. Uh
48:26
she rarely talks back, but she does I'm
48:27
not the only person who moves uh she's
48:30
experienced her moving things around in
48:31
the bathroom. For whatever reason, she
48:33
seems to be active in the bathroom. Um
48:36
my boss Ed said when he used to have his
48:39
office there at the visitor's center, he
48:41
looked into his screen, like I'm looking
48:42
at you right now, and he saw a
48:44
reflection of her standing right behind
48:46
him looking over his shoulder.
48:48
Um people have seen her reflection a lot
48:51
uh in the bathroom.
48:52
>> [laughter]
48:53
>> And uh in computer screens, in the
48:55
windows upstairs. So, um she's
48:58
definitely around. And I wouldn't say
49:01
she's malevolent, but she's definitely
49:02
curious and she's playful.
49:06
>> Got a question here from Lana Bright.
49:08
Have you ever wondered whether telling a
49:10
ghost story over and over could somehow
49:13
give that story a life of its own?
49:15
>> Oh, it absolutely gives that story a
49:17
life of its own.
49:19
>> [laughter]
49:19
>> A 100%.
49:21
So, um
49:25
It keeps these stories alive, first of
49:26
all. And it keeps a face on the history
49:29
of this town, or whatever town the
49:30
stories are about. And I think this is
49:33
one of my favorite pieces of the ghost
49:35
story phenomenon
49:37
is that
49:39
Okay, most people look at history as a
49:41
really dry, dead thing that no longer
49:43
relates to them. But when you give it a
49:45
ghost story, you are giving it a
49:48
personality, perhaps a tragedy, but a
49:51
life. You're giving it a life. And
49:54
suddenly history is a lot more
49:56
interesting. So, you can be like, "When
49:59
did Loretta live? What was it like to be
50:01
the daughter of an undertaker in, you
50:03
know, the 1800s?" What did that life
50:05
look like? And um
50:08
maybe because we're still talking about
50:10
Loretta today, she sticks around.
50:14
I mean, who knows how it works to be a
50:15
ghost. I I surely do not. I cannot
50:18
explain the phenomenon. I know there's
50:20
some um
50:22
feeling that residuals have a
50:23
scientific-ish explanation, being like a
50:26
scar on time-space, but there is no
50:29
explanation for the interactive
50:31
intelligent ghosts.
50:33
Uh we don't We just don't know. And a
50:35
lot of non-believers just haven't
50:37
experienced it. And I think once you do,
50:39
it's very hard to get it out of your
50:41
brain.
50:42
>> Yeah, the the best witnesses are
50:44
non-believers. That's how
50:46
>> yeah. I love the skeptics on my tours,
50:49
Lon. They are my favorite guests because
50:51
it is always them that prove the point.
50:54
>> Yeah,
50:54
>> [laughter]
50:55
>> absolutely.
50:56
>> Cheers, Lon.
51:00
>> Uh Sir Wolf, how realistic is there
51:02
granite underneath the whole town? Did
51:04
they incorporate granite in their
51:05
houses, walls, etc.?
51:07
>> Yes and yes.
51:08
>> Yes, yes.
51:09
>> Yes and yes. [clears throat]
51:10
Mhm.
51:11
>> Yeah, I think it's very similar to what
51:13
they have in Gettysburg. I think the
51:14
granite is very similar to what they got
51:16
up in Gettysburg, that high high
51:19
bedrock.
51:21
And um
51:23
but the interesting thing about here in
51:25
south-central Pennsylvania
51:28
and the connection
51:30
with the harbor and, you know,
51:32
is that
51:33
we had these under underground aquifers
51:36
that run 50, 60 mi north from the bay.
51:40
>> Mhm.
51:41
>> So, uh
51:43
with all that water very close to the
51:45
surface, I mean, you would think the
51:47
hauntings and and some of the other
51:49
activity would be
51:51
you know,
51:52
crazy, which it is. I mean, we get so
51:54
much goes on
51:56
uh in Gettysburg in particular, of
51:58
course here in Ellicott City and other
52:00
areas.
52:01
It's that that and I blame it on that
52:03
very high bedrock.
52:06
Uh cuz you go to Gettysburg, you can see
52:08
the bedrock in certain areas. That's
52:10
just sticking out.
52:12
>> Ellicott too.
52:12
>> Yeah. Yeah.
52:14
>> Yeah.
52:15
>> So, I don't know. I I just figured it
52:17
had to be a had to be a very high quartz
52:21
uh type of granite that is in both
52:24
locations.
52:25
>> You know, I ages ago, I was super
52:28
curious. So, I interviewed a geologist
52:30
and his big takeaway was he said that we
52:33
know that certain kinds of stones,
52:35
certain kinds of rock do radiate energy.
52:38
They can scientifically prove that
52:39
certain rock radiates energy of its own.
52:42
Has an electromagnetic frequency that is
52:44
measurable. And he said there are other
52:46
stones that, you know, very sensitive
52:48
people get headaches around or they feel
52:50
auras around or like and I mean like um
52:52
migraine auras.
52:54
And he's like, I can't say that it's
52:57
wrong. He's like, I can't say that this
52:58
theory is not true.
53:00
He's like, it could be true. He's like,
53:02
we just maybe don't have the science to
53:04
understand it yet. Which I thought was
53:06
an interesting thing to come from a
53:07
scientist. Um because he he said that in
53:11
in his long career with geology that
53:13
there were too many things he couldn't
53:15
explain and a lot of coincidences and he
53:18
said that he feels in science
53:19
coincidences are leading somewhere, but
53:22
he couldn't he couldn't say what it was.
53:24
>> All right.
53:27
Huh, well, he's got more of an open mind
53:29
than a lot of these people.
53:30
>> [laughter]
53:31
>> It's true. It's true.
53:32
>> Yeah.
53:34
So, Alyssa,
53:35
what do you have plans
53:37
to to you know, what's going on for the
53:40
rest of the with you and any other
53:42
projects. Uh, I I know you're thinking
53:45
about doing another book. Anything else
53:47
going on?
53:48
>> Well, um, in Ellicott City, if you want
53:50
to come see me there, I have a ton of
53:52
stuff booked in October, November, and
53:54
December.
53:55
Um, so I have um, ghost tours and pub
54:01
crawls and I'll be doing my girls night
54:03
out again. And um, again, that is only
54:06
for female-identifying guests, but it is
54:08
lots of fun because there's so much
54:11
women's history there.
54:13
And um, I will be presenting a new
54:15
program in Ellicott City, which is Urban
54:17
Legends of Maryland. And that will be at
54:21
the museum.
54:22
I I love being at the museum because
54:24
it's haunted and sometimes the ghosts
54:25
actually show up.
54:26
>> Yeah.
54:27
>> They actually show up in the middle of
54:29
me talking
54:30
>> It's a nice location, too.
54:31
>> It's great. Yeah, the museum is
54:33
beautiful. It's the old Presbyterian
54:34
Church. For those who don't know, we did
54:36
show pictures of it a bit ago.
54:37
And um, I have had the ghosts literally
54:40
show up and the whole room be so cold
54:42
you could see your breath.
54:44
>> [laughter]
54:46
>> So, um, it's it's a wild location to
54:48
give talks and to to perform in that
54:51
way. But, um, but yes, and then um, on
54:54
November Friday the 13th, I will be
54:56
doing History of Superstitions at the
54:58
museum.
54:59
And later in December, Krampus will be
55:01
joining me for my Holiday Cryptids
55:04
program.
55:05
So, I'm it's always fun. Uh, Krampus is
55:08
a
55:09
fantastic addition to the show.
55:11
>> [laughter]
55:11
>> Right.
55:12
>> So, but yes, and you know, if you love
55:14
Ellicott City, um, Maryland History
55:17
Tours does ghost tours there every
55:18
Friday and Saturday night, um, on Mount
55:21
Misery and Main Street. And um, then in
55:24
October, there is even more. So, it's
55:27
it's a great place to go, uh, walk
55:29
around all afternoon, grab some food,
55:32
lots of great small businesses to
55:33
support, and then and a ghost tour at
55:35
night.
55:37
>> Well, you and I are going to be giving a
55:39
presentation in September at the
55:42
>> We are.
55:42
>> at the Alba Twich Festival, the one in
55:45
Columbia, not the one in
55:47
>> Columbia, correct. Yes. Got to keep it
55:49
straight. There's there's so many things
55:50
happening these days, so many events.
55:52
>> And I think we have something going on
55:54
in November in Gettysburg as well.
55:56
>> We do.
55:57
Yep.
55:57
>> So, these will be our Mothman
55:59
presentation. I don't know you know, I
56:01
had to go back and look cuz there've
56:03
been a few things have happened since
56:04
the last time we did the presentation,
56:06
so
56:07
we might have to do an update soon on
56:09
that.
56:10
>> Uh yeah, we should probably meet up
56:11
offline and
56:13
talk about it.
56:14
>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
56:17
Okay, well, I want to thank you for
56:18
coming on tonight. Uh
56:21
we did have requests to have you come
56:22
on, so I decided for sure I'll bring
56:25
Rissa in.
56:26
And uh
56:28
you know, tell us a little more about
56:29
our history around this area and uh it's
56:32
very much appreciated, so uh
56:35
you take care, have a good weekend, and
56:37
uh
56:38
we'll get you back on here again at some
56:40
point.
56:41
>> That sounds fantastic. It's always a
56:42
pleasure, Lon, and um whoever requested
56:44
me, thank you so much. It's good to know
56:46
I have a few fans out there.
56:49
>> Okay, folks, well, thanks for uh joining
56:51
on this evening, and uh look,
56:56
if you do want more interviews, I'll see
56:58
what I can do. Uh it's not my favorite
57:00
thing to do that much more, but uh
57:03
it does give us a break once in a while.
57:05
So, again, if you're in the chat
57:07
tonight, you if you did donate, it's
57:10
very much appreciated.
57:12
So, uh yeah, we'll see you next Friday
57:14
night. You take care.
57:19
>> [music]
57:31
[music]
57:49
[music]
57:55
[music]
58:05
[music]

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