Up next in 10
Are violent video games responsible for - or linked to - real-life lawlessness?
00:17 James Hanson makes the argument against this moral panic.
05:28 Caller Christine fiercely disagrees, wondering what sort of enjoyment anyone could get out of a game like Grand Theft Auto.
11:11 Caller Simon has been playing video games for nearly 40 years and can proudly say he has not yet killed anyone.
13:58 Caller Dexter draws attention to a murder that was linked to the violent video game 'Manhunt'.
17:37 Caller Colin believes games like GTA definitely have 'an influence' - but that doesn't mean they should be banned.
20:20 Caller Billy wonders if violent video games will indirectly lead to a more prepared conscription-base.
23:59 Caller Shrivan draws a link between the lawlessness in Middlesbrough and violence in video games.
26:46 Caller Tosin argues that games like GTA have an 18 rating 'for a reason'.
28:09 Caller Kyle used to play video games under age - but it has never given him 'any desire' to act out violence in real life.
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Show More Show Less View Video Transcript
0:00
Is it doing you any good
0:01
Well, if it's helping me relax, if I'm taking enjoyment from it, why should you stop me
0:06
Well, I'm not trying to stop you. It sounds like you are, with respect, Christine
0:10
No. It does sound like you want a lot of these video games either banned or regulated in some way
0:16
Yes, I would. I would. I'm going to admit to something. In fact, I'm going to admit to a series of quite heinous crimes now
0:23
I have deliberately run over pedestrians. I have brutally murdered police officers
0:31
I have ransacked corner shops. I have taken part in criminal endeavours
0:37
I have grown illegal drugs. On Grand Theft Auto 5. I have removed the steps from swimming pools to watch innocent people drown
0:48
I have started house fires to watch them burn. On The Sims
0:53
I have taken a sniper rifle to my enemies, I have used a razor-laced bowler hat to decapitate people
1:01
and I've used all manner of techniques to assassinate opponents. On James Bond night fire
1:08
None of that makes me a real-life threat to people. Because none of it is real life
1:16
If we are incapable of drawing a distinction between entertainment and reality, then where does it stop
1:25
Are we going to have to ban The Sopranos or Goodfellas or any movie or TV show that depicts violence
1:33
Wouldn't we need to consign most rap music and certainly most drill music to the dustbin of history
1:39
And wouldn't we need to issue an arrest warrant for Eric Clapton because he admitted to shooting a sheriff, but he didn't shoot the deputy
1:45
where does this madness end i think it is a load of baloney to claim that violent video games are
1:53
in any way responsible for real life lawlessness because ultimately people have to take personal
2:00
responsibility the people who commit these crimes are responsible for their own wrongdoing
2:05
not the developers of video games which provide entertainment and fun and a sense of community
2:12
increasingly because you can play them online with your friends to millions of people in the
2:16
uk and around the world i think it is a tired cliched old argument i think it is something that
2:22
mary whitehouse would be saying if she was still around today and i think we need to move beyond
2:28
it i mean the research on this is a is a bit mixed you can kind of find academic studies that will say
2:33
whatever you want to hear so in 2015 the american psychological association released findings
2:39
suggesting a link between violent video games and aggression. It set up a task force that reviewed hundreds of studies
2:45
published between 2005 and 2013 and they concluded that while there was no single risk factor
2:52
to blame for aggression, that violent video games did contribute. So their report stated the following and I quote
2:58
the research demonstrates a consistent relation between violent video game use and increases in aggressive behaviour
3:05
aggressive cognitions and aggressive effect and decreases in pro-social behaviour, empathy and sensitivity to aggression
3:12
It is the accumulation of risk factors, they say, that tends to lead to aggressive or violent behaviour
3:18
The research reviewed here demonstrates that violent video game use is one such risk factor
3:25
And yet, before you go, aha, James, you just quoted a study that completely disproves what you've been saying
3:32
a very large group of academics, 200 in total, wrote a letter saying they felt the methodology
3:37
of that research was deeply flawed as a significant part of material included in the study
3:43
had not been subjected to peer review here is dr mark coulson associate professor of psychology
3:48
at middlesex university talking about that study saying and i quote i fully acknowledge that
3:53
exposure to repeated violence may have short-term effects you'd be a fool to deny that but the
3:58
long-term consequences of crime and actual violent behavior there is just no evidence linking violent
4:04
video games with that. If you play three hours of Call of Duty, you might feel a little bit pumped
4:10
but you're not going to go out and mug someone. And he's right, isn't he? And even if you do think
4:16
there might be some link, for which there is very scant evidence, I would suggest, even if you think
4:21
there is some link, or your instinct tells you there is some link, how do we regulate it? I mean
4:27
do you say, OK, you can have a James Bond video game because you're playing as a goodie and you're
4:31
shooting fictional bad guys, but you can't have GTA because you play as a criminal
4:35
and you can kill innocent people and police officers. Is that the line you draw
4:39
And then what about policing lyrics in music? Are we going to have to ban most rap and drill music
4:45
What about violence on TV and in movies? Shoot-em-ups banned completely? Is any Quentin Tarantino movie completely unacceptable
4:54
Where does this madness end? It's just censorship. This is a liberal Western democracy
4:59
Why are we entertaining discussions of censorship just because some people don't like violent video games
5:04
If you don't like GTA, no one is forcing you to buy and play it
5:09
Why should I be stopped from buying GTA 6 when it comes out in November and playing it to my heart's content
5:17
And you might even make the argument, if someone does have slightly aggressive urges
5:23
that playing a shoot-em-up might be a way of actually then releasing some of that tension
5:28
Christine is in Crouch End. Afternoon, Christine. What would you like to say? Yes, good afternoon, James
5:33
Yes, I think the answer is yes. Now, why would anybody want to watch violence
5:39
If it was in real life and a person you cared about, would you want to watch that
5:44
And violence in the media makes people less sympathetic to real life
5:49
Now, have we progressed as a society? We had the Romans killing the Christians with the lions in the Roman arena
5:57
We had the French Revolution with people knitting while people were being guillotined
6:02
We had the Jews in Nazi Germany being killed. So all these people were innocent
6:07
So you asked the question and I said yes. And I'm going to back up with one instance
6:18
This was a program, I think, an article in The Times. And it was about some Pacific islands which had been given financial reparations after the Second World War
6:31
There were about three of them. One was called Yap. And maybe one of them spent the money wisely
6:39
Another one spent the money on introducing TV videos. And now these were previously peaceful islands
6:46
and they found that the one that had introduced the videos and the violent films and that, the crime came
6:53
whereas before it wasn't there. So that is one example of violent stuff producing crime
7:00
So do you think, Christine, because, I mean, I have played violent video games and I've watched violent movies
7:05
and I've listened to songs with violent lyrics, do you think, therefore, I am more likely to be violent
7:11
I don't know because, I mean, maybe, but I mean is it doing you any good Well if it helping me relax if I taking enjoyment from it why should you stop me Well I not trying to stop you It sounds like you are with respect Christine
7:26
It does sound like you want a lot of these video games either banned or regulated in some way
7:31
Yes, I would. I would. And you dismissed Mary Whitehouse. If people had listened to her
7:37
then maybe we wouldn't have people going around killing policemen and stealing mobile phones
7:43
and breaking into people's houses so much. OK, there's always been violence before TV
7:48
but I think it's escalated because the prisons are full. So I think if people had listened to her
7:54
and cut out the violent videos and all the sex that's on TV..
7:59
Have you played one of these games, Christy? Have you played GTA? No. Why do I need to
8:04
You might like it. What about Red Dead Redemption? That's another one. Or Call of Duty
8:09
Why would I enjoy that? They're very, very advanced, cleverly made games
8:15
games that give people the chance to perform missions, and it's fun
8:20
Well, I'm afraid I get my fun in other ways. I don't, you know, I don't like violence
8:27
Okay, if somebody's been attacked and somebody has to fight back, that's one thing
8:32
But, you know, I mean, the crime, the crime is rising. And so what reason do you give for it then
8:42
Well, hang on, hang on. Correlation is not causation. You might, well, first of all, a lot of people would dispute the fact that crime is rising
8:49
but some crimes may be rising, okay. Correlation is not causation. Just because crime has continued to be an issue since video games have come on the scene
8:57
does not mean that video games are responsible. Sadly, there will always be some violent crime
9:01
That is just a reality of life. And we shouldn't stop policing it. We shouldn't stop trying to mitigate it or reduce the likelihood of it
9:08
But it's always going to be around because some humans are scumbags. That's just a reality
9:13
but I don't think that ordinary people who are perfectly law-abiding and peaceful
9:18
who enjoy playing, for example, Grand Theft Auto in their free time should be denied that opportunity
9:22
just because there are some evil people out there. Did you say that we shouldn't be reducing crime
9:28
Is that what you said? No, no, no. I said we should never stop trying to reduce it but we have to accept that it's a reality
9:35
that there will always be some crime. Yes, but there's more crime because of this violence
9:41
What evidence do you have of that? Because I just quoted this article
9:45
One article. One article. Okay, from Nottingham University. First of all, they pooh-poohed the idea
9:52
but then they came to realise that what people watch affects you
9:58
Okay, how come advertising on TV? But where do we stop, Christine
10:02
I had a cap gun as a kid. Would you ban my cap gun? Not necessarily
10:07
Would you ban people going to Laser Quest? What's that? It's where you shoot people with lasers
10:14
What? In real life? I mean, they're kind of fake lasers. It doesn't do you any damage
10:18
Or paintballing, where you shoot someone with a paintball. It can hurt. Would you ban that
10:23
Well, if it hurts people, that's not very nice, is it? Well, I just worry we're going down a slightly puritanical road here, Christine
10:31
Really? It's getting worse. It's getting worse. It's getting worse because during the 1940s
10:38
when they made the films. There wasn't the terrible violence. There wasn't the sex
10:45
And they had a good story. Come on. There was violence and sex in the 1940s
10:51
Not in the films. No, they didn't. And what happened in the 1940s
10:57
We had probably the worst conflict and the worst genocide in human history
11:02
So there isn't necessarily a correlation between what is happening in society
11:05
and what's happening in the culture and what then happens on the streets or with governments or whatever
11:11
Simon is a first-time caller in Northampton. Afternoon, Simon. What's your take on this
11:16
Yeah, so, I mean, I'm 48 years old now, and I've been playing video games since I was maybe 10 years old
11:22
And have you ever hurt or killed someone? No. So I've never wanted to do that
11:30
I play the Call of Duty games. I've played GTA. I've played all sorts of games on there
11:35
Never have I wanted to. Because there's a difference between reality and what you do on a video game
11:41
So what would you say? I mean, we heard from Christine in Crouch End a moment ago, who basically asked the question
11:47
why would you even want to play one of these games? Why would you want to play a video game
11:52
that allows you to shoot innocent people within the game? What would be your response
11:58
Well, we're not allowed to do it in real life. But would you want to do it in real life
12:03
No, exactly. So why do you want to do it in fiction? It's fun to play
12:09
I mean, you've always played. I remember Cowboys and Indians. Whatever you've always done as a kid
12:14
As a boy, what did we want to do? We wanted to hurt each other. Not badly, but you would shoot each other with a BB gun
12:21
You'd play with swords as sticks, wouldn't you? We had fun. We're not hurting anyone
12:27
You're playing a game. Personally, I've got a firearms and a shotgun certificate
12:32
I've been play shooting this morning. At no point did I want to turn around and shoot anyone
12:37
But do you think you may be, not the exception, because I'm with you, Simon
12:41
and the vast majority of people, myself included, who play violent video games are not themselves violent
12:45
but is there a risk that for some people who are maybe psychologically damaged
12:53
or who are of a violent disposition naturally, that these kind of games may be a bad influence
13:01
Then we would have to stop all kind of rap music, all of that kind of music out there
13:06
that is out there for what people are listening to, they seem to pick it up far more than these video games do
13:12
They make it something that you should be out there doing on the street. We also don't have the punishment
13:19
It seems the punishment, I think the lady before was talking about in the 1940s
13:23
You look back, you used to get the cane at school. I never grew up with that
13:29
but I did grow up with a mum that would hit you with a slipper
13:34
you knew what would be there. There was that bit of pain that you would get for being naughty
13:41
We don't get that anymore. It's please sit on the quiet step. You know you've been naughty
13:45
No, give them a slap on the bum. We need that throughout our life
13:51
We've been very much soft as a country. Simon, appreciate the call. Simon, first time caller in Northampton
13:55
Let's go to Dexter in Craigavon in Northern Ireland. Afternoon to you, Dexter
14:00
Afternoon, James. How are you doing this? Good to talk to you. I'm good, thank you. What's your take on this? Well, I don't play the Grand Theft Auto series as such
14:07
I do dip out of it occasionally if I want some nostalgia or kind of retro vibes
14:12
What a horrible term to use. But I don't see... I can see elements of where it can go wrong
14:19
There is an even more extreme game series back in the 2000s called Manhunt
14:23
I don't know if you've heard of them, James. No, tell me about Manhunt. No, you've never heard of Manhunt
14:27
I've never heard of Manhunt, no. They were also produced by Rockstar
14:31
Oh, OK. I mean, I was largely playing... I'm 33. So I was largely playing
14:36
Okay so maybe you had slightly more I don think I was I don think I said that my parents wouldn have allowed me to play GTA then I played GTA when I kind of got into my late teens early 20s
14:46
But I was largely playing FIFA at that age. Same. In my opinion, FIFA 05 is the best FIFA.com
14:55
But anyway, back to sort of those sort of games. Yeah, but tell me about Manhunt, though. So Manhunt was also a stealth sort of video game, like GTA
15:03
but a bit more in-depth and a bit more violent. And that actually is linked to several deaths where the prosecutors used Manhunt and Manhunt 2 as part of the investigation
15:15
Oh, that's interesting. There was actually a chap called Stephen who was murdered in Leicestershire in 2004, 2005, I think it was, as a result of Manhunt, the video game, his friend killed him
15:26
So you can link elements of it together. But as your previous callers, you know, it's not reality
15:34
I know these days, you know, I did watch the half an hour prequel on Netflix
15:39
and I was amazed at the graphics and how good the content and the actual videography was of GTA 6 launch
15:46
It's going to be a phenomenal game, I think, and definitely a bit of a head-turner
15:51
Yeah, I suppose, and this is a provocative question, but there are certain types of crime that you are allowed to commit or you are able to commit
16:00
in, for example, GTA, you can murder someone. You cannot, for instance, sexually assault someone in GTA
16:06
Now, I don't think anyone in their right mind would want that to be allowed. I will just put in a bit of an Easter egg reference there
16:12
which is hot coffee. That's all I'm going to say. Some of you may know what that means in terms of GTA listeners
16:20
But, yeah, I totally agree. It will show elements of... I mean, it will show complete elements of killing people
16:28
and gangland sort of style and living and brutality, whereas it won't show other elements of it
16:34
But is that part of the problem with GTA in particular? Does it glamorise the gangs
16:40
Does it glamorise organised crime? It could do. It could do. It could show, I mean, for example
16:46
obviously GTA Vice City was set in the 80s where crime was, obviously still people use knives and guns
16:51
but it was a different kind of crime compared to nowadays where gangster stuff may be a little bit more sort of moved on
16:58
But, I mean, I've recently started watching back-to-back all the Crime Watch episodes from the 1980s onwards in the UK
17:06
And some of the crimes, they think, gosh, this action is out of GTA. Where on earth do you find those, Dexter, out of interest
17:11
All on YouTube, okay. Every single episode. But you sort of think, gosh, these crimes could have literally been scripted in GTA, some of them
17:19
So it happens everywhere, unfortunately. And I'm not for or against it
17:23
It doesn't bother me one iota. But I just find it fascinating that some people can take it to heart to kill their friends
17:28
because they've seen something in a video game. Yeah, no, really interesting
17:32
Dexter, thank you. Dexter in Craigavond then. Let's go to Colin in Alton in Hampshire
17:36
Afternoon, Colin. What would you like to say? Hi, good afternoon. If you go back to your question, does it have an influence
17:43
And the answer is yes, it absolutely must have an influence because in exactly the same way as the entire advertising world
17:53
influences what people do by showing them things that other people are doing and whether it's
18:00
advertising to go to spec savers or or one of the stores or whatever it is there's no question
18:06
whatever that what we see on the screen whoever we are is put there to influence you but but colin
18:14
have you played these video games uh i'm not i have seen them and played them and of course my
18:20
kids and grandchildren do as well but that doesn't mean to say that i think anyone should ban them
18:25
i think that it's a different question yeah okay no i see the distinction you're making that it
18:31
will have an influence but that doesn't mean we should ban them correct i don't see how you can
18:35
ban it you can't ban the fact that there were wars you can't ban the fact the holocaust happened you
18:40
can't ban any of those things well and you can't ban violent movies i i agree we do and i think that
18:47
I think that the trouble is it hits the young people. And I think when people are trained to do anything on screen
18:57
which they are every day by every entity, when they are trained to do something at a very young age
19:04
it must have an impact. Only on a few will it make them do stuff they might not have done
19:11
But it's a different question about how you cure it as to whether or not it does have an influence
19:18
And my point is it definitively does have an influence. Whether that actually transforms into action
19:26
I don't think you can judge. I suppose some might say, OK, you don't have to ban them
19:33
but you could regulate them. I'd like to see an age of..
19:38
I don't think young people are 14, young men in particular, 14, 15, 16
19:43
when they suddenly find they're all full of this stuff that drives us to do fighting and war and boxing
19:49
and everything else that we do competitively, some of it seriously contact sports like rugby
19:56
You add all of that up together and they're brutal. But I think that knocking it into young people
20:03
is not probably the best way. Here's Kiri on the subject of violent video games
20:10
James, I'm a 40-year-old woman. I've been playing video games since I was five. I play every type of game except sports
20:17
None of it causes anything. If violent video games cause violence, do cooking games cause chefs
20:22
Does Forza, which is a racing game, cause racing drivers? If I play bridge construction simulator
20:28
am I now an architect? It's ridiculous. These games, GTA, etc., have an age rating of 18
20:33
so if younger people are playing it, that is their parents' fault. I just completed a game where I detect doppelgangers
20:40
while running a petrol station. It's just a game. I've got a game on my phone
20:44
I get mocked about this by my mates where I run a supermarket
20:48
and I basically run around stacking the shelves of my fictional supermarket
20:54
and my mates say to me, is this not really boring? Why on earth do you get some weird pleasure
20:59
as you're sitting on the tube stacking the shelves of your fictional supermarket
21:02
with fake oranges? I don't know why. Something about it entertains me
21:08
in the same way that playing FIFA or football manager back in the day used to entertain me
21:13
in the same way that I have played GTA in the past and enjoyed it. Billy is a first-time caller in Prestwich
21:19
Afternoon, Billy. Good afternoon, James. Thanks for taking my call. You're more than welcome. What would you like to say
21:25
I was just listening to the debate, and I'm not a gamer. I'm of a generation that remembers Atari and Commodore and Max Payne, maybe
21:34
But I have two sons who are into gaming, who are growing up now, and they've had PC consoles
21:39
and I've watched them playing COD, Medal of Honor, Sniper games and it's really talented the way they do it
21:46
And I'm listening to what happened after the news with your interview about
21:50
what's going on in the world at the moment with the possibilities
21:55
And then I'm thinking, have we got a younger generation that have been on consoles COD Medal of Honor have sold millions and millions Have we got a generation now that ready to go into combat because the First and Second World War heroes
22:07
never had that facility, like airline pilots have to go into consoles and simulators
22:12
So apart from the violent games, which are evil, but have we got a generation of young people
22:17
who are ready for combat? Well, it's not the daftest question because I think they use F1 simulators
22:25
for training a lot of F1 drivers now. Exactly. So more so than the previous generations who fought
22:31
But, you know, and they do it on the Internet and worldwide
22:35
and they're playing against other people, and my two boys were pretty good at it
22:40
so, you know, more so than the previous generation. So is it a good thing
22:45
So, yeah, I mean... It's realistic. It's so realistic now, you know, you could be there
22:50
But where do you stand on this debate as to whether these violent video games games may encourage
22:55
some people to be violent in real life? I don't know. I've seen the boys play
23:03
in GTA where they steal cards and they do bad things and stuff
23:07
like that. They certainly wouldn't be doing that in real life, but I don't
23:12
know. I think it's down to the person in general. But where
23:15
the big things with combat things are ready, I don't think the subscriptions, which
23:22
I've heard in the news being talked about, subscriptions. I don't think they would
23:25
subscribe to go into war, but I think we've got a mortality generation of
23:29
back already, young generation more than ever. So that's all I was saying, and I thought
23:35
after the news, your conversation with people was how the world is changing now with
23:41
Russia and everything like that. I think, well, maybe we've got a generation who may
23:45
without going put on the ground more ready than ever. Really interesting point you raised, Billy. Thank you
23:51
Billy, first time caller in Presswitch. here's shrivan in hemel hemstead afternoon shrivan what would you like to say good afternoon james
23:57
good afternoon james you know i'm against this violent games because each time they have been
24:03
released they are more violent than ever i'm not gamer i just read a little bit of news about what
24:08
the gta is if we look at middlesbrough recently that is gta playing out in reality and i think
24:15
do we know that though shrivan no no i will tell you why we i think this is my opinion you know we
24:22
as human species, as human beings, we emulate others. It's part of our
24:26
DNA emulation. I'm sure there is some studies. I've not done any in-depth study. I'm sure
24:31
there are studies you may know of that have found that games have an influence
24:35
to enact it out in reality. But me personally, I think these games should be banned
24:42
These fantasists and delusionists who play them in their bedrooms, they should
24:45
be taken out of their bedroom and be more productive in the society. And my other
24:49
point was, which I said to your researcher, which ties in with your previous caller just now
24:54
about the military application. If these gamers want to play so much
24:58
they are very skilled at these high-level games, military games, shooting games
25:02
put them in conscription. But Srivan, where does this stop? If you are banning violent video games
25:09
would you ban movies that depict violence? Movies? I don't know. I've never thought on this point
25:17
Does that mean we can't have a new James Bond film? I'm not saying
25:20
I'm not talking about James Bond, but the games, let's stick to the topic of games
25:25
games and conscription, I'm saying. If they want to play games in their bedroom, violent games
25:30
they should be put into case. Look at the needs argument. So many arguments we had
25:35
But yes, I take your point. But there are also lots of jobs in the video game industry
25:41
It's a real British success story. Look at Rockstar, the company behind GTA, was founded in Dundee
25:47
And it's become a huge global brand. and there are loads of jobs in the video game sector
25:54
Why aren't we celebrating that? I mean, not the violent games. They should not be celebrated, I think, in my view
26:00
Yeah, but does a 17-year-old want to sit in his bedroom playing Frogger
26:06
Frogger? I don't know what the Frogger is. But I disagree with it, James
26:11
I think we need to get the youngsters' needs outside to be more productive
26:17
You know, this is delusional fantasy. Well, I certainly agree with that. I think, you know, the days of young people kicking a ball around
26:23
or just roaming free and playing in the park and inventing games as they're roaming out and about
26:29
sadly, I think are behind us, but I think we should probably bring them back because it's better to be out and about, I would suggest
26:36
with your friends than just stuck indoors playing on the video games 24-7
26:40
but video games are going to be part of the mix, probably. Srivan, thank you. Let's go to Tosin in Norwich
26:45
Afternoon, Tosin. What would you like to say? Hi, I thought I'd give a call from a female gaming perspective
26:52
A few things. First of all, GTA, which I've played, and I have never gone out to mug somebody
26:59
steal a car, blow up a building. Glad to hear it. I've never done any of these things
27:05
GTA has an age rating. It should only be being played by adults who can identify very clearly
27:11
the difference between reality and fiction. so that argument about a 17 year old in his room
27:18
a 17 year old shouldn't be playing it anyway it should only be being played by adults
27:23
with all of their mental facilities in fact I've taught children where they've said
27:30
oh I've gone and played GTA they shouldn't be playing it they shouldn't be playing it
27:36
but the game isn't designed for them it's designed for adults who want to take
27:41
a little bit of time to escape from reality and to do something different
27:46
We're not going around committing violent acts because we played the game
27:51
I think that is a very, very balanced, fair assessment of who should be playing these games
27:58
Absolutely, they've got an age rating. It shouldn't be played by anyone under the age of 18
28:02
But if you are over the age of 18, what is the harm of it? Why are we banning fun
28:06
A squeeze in, Kyle, first-time caller in Stourbridge. You haven't got long, Kyle, but what would you like to say
28:11
Yeah, hello, James. ironically I'm going to follow up from what your last caller was saying
28:15
because full disclosure I have been playing very violent video games from a much younger age than I technically should have
28:22
given their age ratings but I just do not I flat out do not agree
28:27
much like your last caller I've played games like Mortal Kombat Resident Evil and GTA
28:31
my whole life it has never given me any compulsion or desire
28:35
to go out and commit any of those kind of activities that I've been partaking in on the game
28:39
and actually just the caller before that was talking about studies the internet institute at
28:46
the university of oxford did a study just before the pandemic which found there was no correlation
28:51
they they did a study on a group of teenagers who played violent video games and there was no
28:55
correlation between the two yeah and and look i know there are some people who say there have
29:01
been some studies that have proved the opposite the truth is there is no conclusive um proof really
29:07
one way or another. But look, I broadly speaking agree with you, Carl. And as someone who has played games
29:11
for a lot of my life as well, I honestly think we need to stop just banning things
29:16
because we don't like... If you don't like GTA, don't play GTA. It's quite simple
29:20
No one's forcing you to play it
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