Todd McShay expands on Cam Ward - Patrick Mahomes comparison

Welcome to A to Z Sports Primetime on this Wednesday, April the 9th

Lovely to have you guys here for another episode of the Primetime program

Thanks for stopping by. We got draft comps tonight and we had a really good interview with Todd McShay

now the ringer, of course, longtime ESPNer, doing college football and draft talk for them

He's since transitioned over to the digital side of things, and he's doing an excellent job there, just as he was doing an excellent job for the mothership

But he came on the radio show today, and we talked about Cam Ward. We also talked about the toughest position group to evaluate, and I think his answer there is going to be a pretty interesting one

There's been a lot of comparisons, though, about Cam Ward and Player X

Cam Ward as Diet Coke Steve McNair. Cam Ward as taller, slower Kyler Murray

Cam Ward as Sam Darnold, question mark, which is a draft comp that Trevor Sikama had for him of Pro Football Focus

who is somebody whose evaluations and tape study that I trust, a more surprising one

But the way that Trevor articulated the similarities that he saw in those two players made it make more sense than it initially did

when I read Sam Darnold. There's a lot of different ways that people are going to compare

and contrast these players. Players and draft comps are always a part of the equation, but

what is a fair one to have for Cam Ward, and is the Patrick Mahomes comparison actually

apt for what this player is stylistically, which is something that we are going to talk about

together. So we'll get to that. We'll do the toughest evals. We'll do a little rising and

falling. A lot of good stuff from McShea on the show today, on the radio show today, and you're

going to get a taste of it here on primetime. You can check out the interview, of course

the full interview on 104.5 The Zone's YouTube channel. So if you're filing in here via YouTube

you can do the same for The Zone's YouTube page and subscribe to that while you're there

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wager terms and conditions do apply. So there's a lot of different things to dive into here

And a lot of the things that come up at this time of year, as we previously mentioned, are

draft comps. And there's a lot of draft comps for Cam Ward, who is the player who we most expect the Titans

to select with the number one overall pick at this point in time. We will wait until Thursday, April the 24th before that is officially set in stone

But it is fair to assume that we are on the correct trajectory

Ocho says Ward is the LeBron of football. He is. Let's not get crazy

I even kind of recoil a little bit at the Steve McNair comparisons

But it is a fair question to ask you. Like, if you've watched Cam Ward, whether you watch him in Incarnate Word

or you saw him at Wazoo or you watched him last year at Miami, is there a player that he reminds you of

You don't have to be a draft expert or a draft yst to watch a player

and think, hmm, that reminds me of Baker Mayfield or that reminds me of Sam Darnold as a comparison that he's gotten

Kyler Murray is a comparison that he's gotten for different reasons. Steve McNair and Patrick Mahomes, again, for different reasons

are the comparisons that Cam Ward has brought. It doesn't mean that he's going to be any of those players specifically

It means that he could have a couple of traits that all of those players have and bring to the table

So it's something that I think is worth asking you guys. Your Two Rivers Ford take, who is your draft comp for Cam Ward

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Who's your draft comp for Cam Ward? Because, you know, I think it depends on who you ask and what their football database looks like and what frame of reference, what time period of football they're pulling said comp from

And it's not something like you guys know that I watch football, obviously. I watch it for work. I watch college football for work. I watch professional football for work

I cover the Tennessee Titans as part of my professional job. But I'm not a draft yst

I am a reporter by nature and now a loudmouth talk show host as a result of my strong opinions

in a lot of different situations. But I've never been a tape yst

I will watch games. I will watch replays. I will watch all 22 to try and see what it is that people like Greg Cosell or Todd McShay

or anybody else who does this at a high level, Mina Kimes, what they are seeing and try to marry what they're saying about it with what I'm seeing to help

educate myself, just the same way that any of us would do it. I'm not trained in the art of

studying tape. And as most of us are not, some of us have played sports at a high enough level where

you might be comfortable saying that you are comfortable watching tape and projecting or

yzing what you seeing on that film into an opinion a formulated opinion I rely on people smarter than me in that department Delegation is the route that I prefer to choose So when I ask you this question

of who your draft comp for Patrick Mahomes is, all I'm going to tell you is who he reminds me of

stylistically when I watch him, based on the fact that I watch NFL games every week

basically all year long because Greg and I are talking about not just the Titans

but other NFL teams. So I'll watch NFL games during the off season. You can go back and see things that I missed or players that I might not know

much about or players who maybe made an impact later in the season than you

might've expected or what weren't initially in the starting lineup, but earned their

earned their way into the starting lineup. Of course, coaching tendencies is also something that we're studying on the install podcast

with Cosell, which we enjoy very much. But DraftComp, who do you see when you watch Cam Ward

Vols times eight on YouTube says, DraftComp for Cam Ward is a more athletic Jake Locker

That's interesting. I would wonder, my follow-up for you would be what specifically, what trait

or what is it about Jake Locker or about Cam Ward that you see that makes him a more athletic

Jake Locker to you. The Athens Titan Nine says, and this may be biased, but he says I can see, he or she

I'm not sure, says I can see traits of McNair, I guess, but that's a dangerous comparison

It is. And I love that you look at these things and you come away with saying, all right, Steve

McNair, you see some of it, right? You definitely see some of it

But as Todd McShay pointed out on the radio show today, Steve McNair wasn't even Steve McNair until he became Steve McNair

So it's a dangerous. Actually, that's not something McShay said. That's something James Roday Rodriguez said, who's the star of Sight, who was also on the radio show today, a diehard Titans fan, former Houston Oilers fan, now Tennessee Titans fan

But this is what he had to say specifically about Cam Ward. And we'll let you hear this Todd McShay snippet from the larger interview that we did with him today on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, and Twitch

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All right, here's Todd McShay talking about Cam Ward and, as he dubbed him, the assassin

So what sets Cam Ward apart to you then? What makes him an individual? I think the thing that goes unnoticed is he has an unworldly sense of when pressure is coming

and the poise combined with that to wait for it. He knows it a tick before he's going to react to it

He knows it's coming from the front side, the back side, interior

You can tell he knows when it's coming because he likes to wait

to the last second to elude it because then you're vulnerable as a defender. Other quarterbacks, if you really study it, a lot of quarterbacks

when they know it's coming or they sense it, at that same point where he decides to wait a tick

so that he can get that defender kind of off balance. And I heard you guys talking about Mahomes

It is kind of a similar trait. Neither is a beautiful athlete. Neither is going to run a great 40 time if you clock him right now

But there's this instinctive aspect to their game where, like, okay, go ahead, take one or two more steps towards me

because if you do, then I got you off balance. And then I'm going to pull the trigger on the move

that I already know I'm going to make. And I think that goes kind of, I don't want to say unnoticed

but I don't hear a lot of people talking about that aspect of his game. And so much of his game is that ability to kind of elude a defender

and make a great throw on the move. The second part that I think is, and he's not unique to it

but he's in a small group of people that can throw as accurately as he does

from different arm angles. And then the thing I think that because we get so enamored with the highlights

with Cam Ward, when you get him to the top of his drop and he plants that right foot

and he's in rhythm with the receiver, he's an absolute freaking assassin

If the receiver's where he's supposed to be and he knows where he wants to go with the ball

in terms of throwing a receiver open, hitting a spot, when it's all in rhythm, and I think that's

as Tennessee dug into this, and Brian Callahan's watching, you're watching through whatever lens is important for you, right

And so Callahan and the offensive staff for Tennessee is watching through the lens of

okay, here's what we do. Here's what we're going to need him to do within the structure of our offense

When he does that at Miami, like I said, he's an assassin

That's Todd McShay on the radio show earlier today. Check out the interview via YouTube

Check out the interview via the podcast. The podcast is called The Buck Rising Show, wherever you get your podcasts

Speaking of podcasts, Bert, I don't know if we have any movement on 615 sessions for Friday, because I know we were going to try and do something different this week

But perhaps we will have more information on that. I just had to remind myself now, because if I didn't say something to Bert now, I'd forget

And then he would be scrambling on Friday. Benjamin asks, is Lucas's foot broke or what

Probably. I didn't ask him for an update after his x-ray today

But hopefully it's okay, because he's been going through it. but the draft comp there and McShay kind of expanded earlier in the interview

And like I said, you can check out the full one for yourself, but he said that quarterback is such a unique position that he almost

doesn't like draft comps for that position specifically. But the, the comparison that I am comfortable making

and somebody mentioned that I had a Freudian slip earlier. I didn't realize that I did

but I'm sure that I did is, is Patrick Mahomes. And it's not when I say that

people are going to, because what Cap says is Mahomes was a way better prospect than Ward

That's a wild comp. It's not. Because it doesn't have anything to do with comparing them

Well, let me rephrase, because that's not correct. It is not comparing them from a traits standpoint

Right? And you can make any kind of comparison that you want

but the comparison for cam ward and patrick mahomes is not based on traits

it's not based on well cam ward will be the next you know unstoppable quarterback the best

quarterback we've ever seen the most talented quarterback no nobody's saying that which is

what patrick mahomes is but when you watch them and the way that they are creative in the arm

angles that you throw or that they throw with and the movement that they bring to the pocket

and in the pocket and their escapability, there are some things that remind you of Pat. It does

not mean that he is going to be Pat, nor does it mean that he is going to, that he has the talent

ceiling of Patrick Mahomes, but there are things about his game, how he plays, how he goes through

the rhythms of an offense, how he makes plays outside of structure that remind you of McNair

and Patrick Mahomes and other players like that It has no bearing You have to distinguish that fact because what he follows up with again I assume he caps says that fair When I hear pro comp I think traits

and that's fine. It's incumbent upon whomever is giving said comp to distinguish, why specifically

are you comparing them to that player? Why specifically are you comparing them to that

player. Okay, Josh Allen and Will Levis, not comparable, except when you talk about their

arm strength. Josh Allen, indisputably, no matter how inaccurate he was coming out of Wyoming

could make throws to every part of the football field. Will Levis can also do that, but he just

never improved in a way that was significant enough or consistent enough for the mental part

of the game. It doesn't mean that Will Levis is going to turn into Josh Allen, and certainly Levis

doesn't have the mobility of Josh Allen, and it's why I like the Josh Allen Cam Newton comparisons

more than I liked Levis to Josh Allen. There's a bunch of different ways that you can make a player

comp without saying, well, yeah, this player is the next Patrick Mahomes. No, no, no, don't say

that. Or the next Steve McNair. No, please, God, don't put that pressure on that player before he's

even taken a snap. There are so many different ways that you can compare a player to another

It's just important for you to distinguish. All right, why are you making that comparison? And for

me, I think that McNair and Mahomes are good comparisons for how Cam Ward plays stylistically

stylistically, not traits, not arm strength, not size, not football acumen, all these different

things and maybe he ends up having some of that stuff that we haven't been able to distinguish

because he hasn't taken he hasn't taken an NFL snap yet but that's that's the important thing

to me with draft comps because I you know we've all gotten caught up in this at some point

or another where you've compared a player to another player and then that doesn't happen and

people say what are you talking about asshole you don't know what you mean you don't know what you mean at all okay well then uh I think that you have to make sure that you distinguish those things

So the McNair, Mahomes, Cam Ward comparisons are based off how he plays, not the traits that he brings to his play, if that makes sense

All right. So with everything that you've got going on with Cam Ward, it's also worth asking, do you have a position that you're particularly undecided about, that you're struggling with, that you're trying to get a read on as you get ready for the Titans draft

and maybe you're not even studying the draft that closely. That's okay. You don't have to. That's not your job

It's part of our job to do that kind of stuff for you or to bring on smarter people who will do that stuff for you

like Todd McShay, who we will go back to here in just a second. But on that front, is there a particular position group

in this year's draft class that has you kind of confused or undecided, uncertain about what you

about the strength or weakness of that position group? Is there just a position group that you're not sure about

in this year's draft class. We'll talk about it together. Position group on the whole, not an individual player

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So, what position group have you struggled with in this year's draft class

Forgive me if I mispronounce this, but Latreel. Latreel Cole says wide receiver

For Corey D. Jackson, it's the safety group. For Lewis, he says tight ends

Offball linebacker for Vols times eight. You got offensive linemen, so you guys are all over the board with this

Be French. Craig Baxter says wide receivers and linebackers. Caleb Meadows says how deep is the tight end on day three

Another need to address. So there's a couple of different position groups that are tough to yze

What nobody is disputing is that the defensive line and edge group is as deep as we've seen

arguably in any draft but it doesn't mean that the evaluation is easy which is something that

we asked again Todd McShay about earlier today but who has been the most difficult prospect

in this class for you to evaluate whom have you really struggled with

the the hard part like let's go through the edge rushers real real quickly

it is like we're gonna have more defensive linemen drafted in the first three rounds by like five six

or seven than we've ever had before. I went back 30 years

It was just 26 was the most in a given year. Interior and edge guys

This group is loaded. It's loaded at edge in the first round. There's a bunch more guys later in the second and third

It's loaded along the interior. But with the edge guys, it's like there's a bunch of yeah, buts

And you hate as a scout and an evaluator, like you said

when it's not clean, right? And so like Abdul Carter, arguably the best player in this draft

But yeah, but I don't love the fact. And you're nitpicking here, and he's going to be just fine

But there's the shoulder and the foot injury and his undersized and only one year at edge

Jalen Walker, is he a tweener or is he in the next Hassan Redick or Nolan Smith

Then you get down like Mike Green, some off the field stuff that he addressed at the Combine

Played at Marshall. Didn't play at Alabama or Georgia. James Pierce, as you guys know in your backyard

I would argue he's the second best edge in this class. Second best pass rusher in this class

But he's got some stuff and some football character stuff. And so there's a lot of guys that you struggle with

You see the talent and you want it to just be about the talent. And even like the cleanest guys, right

People were almost in tears talking about the interviews with Tyler Booker

the guard from Alabama. I talked to a GM the day before they worked out

and it was like, I don't care where you got him rated. He's going higher than that. I don't care that he's a guard

I want to sleep really well after the first night of the draft, and I'll do that knowing I just got a 10-year starter

with maybe the best character of any player we've ever seen. Then he goes out and has the worst combine workout of any player

along the offensive line. So every guy's got something. Nobody's perfect. But I think those edge rushers became – and Shamar Stewart, right

Shamar Stewart is like Trayvon Walker-type workout numbers. Is he the next Daniil Hunter, or is he a guy who's never going to be productive

Just one and a half sacks last year, but 33 quarterback hurries. And so there's just – there's a lot of that that goes on

And then this time of year, there's all sorts of noise. that's again Todd McShay on the radio show today talking about the most difficult position group I

asked him about a prospect and he gave me an entire position group there on the radio show

uh exposing the truth on YouTube says Abdul Carter best player in the draft is laughable

no it's not what what about it is laughable did you watch him at all did you see him in the college

football playoff did you see him beat people's asses with basically one arm tied behind his back

because his shoulder was busted listen travis hunter is crazy all right travis hunter we may

never see another travis hunter again and that makes him different and it makes him one of the

best players in the draft class but to argue that abdul to to say something so stupid as abdul carter best player in the draft is laughable and and dismiss it uh just to me means that you have no idea about what you watching

how anybody could come away and again you would also have to watch other players in the draft to

come away with that i suppose and i'm just assuming for for the purposes of of this conversation that

most of you also watch college football if you're watching the nfl it doesn't mean that you have to

There's plenty of people in the NFL that don't watch college football until you're studying tape

But there is no – it seems that you have exposed yourself whilst trying to expose the truth about whatever it is that your truth is

And your truth appears to be nonsense because you can't watch Abdul Carter and not think, holy shit, that guy's a problem at any level

at any level of the sport, despite him being undersized or, and he is slightly undersized

He's not quite Micah Parsons, and he's only played one year on the edge. He's an absolute hellion on the edge

So maybe he's only going to get better, which would make you look even dumber if you're somebody who has that opinion

So maybe he doesn't end up being the best player in the draft class. You don't know that

Or the most successful. It depends on how you define those things. But, yeah, man, I don't know

I don't know how anybody could possibly say that with that kind of smugness and arrogance

unless you just don't know shit. And I guess that's the takeaway that we all have after that comment

So, rising and falling. Whose stock rose? Whose stock fell this week in sports

Let's talk about it together on Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, and on Twitch. I have one more McShay clip for you

Again, it's a great interview. You can catch the whole thing on 104.5thezone.com

but it speaks to the kind of stock up, stock down time that we are in with the draft process

or largely we've gone through that with the draft process. There's still some visits that are being made, some pre-draft Zooms and things of the like

but who stock rose, who stock fell this week in sports? Facebook, YouTube, Twitter, and Twitch, you guys can tell me

And while you do that, and I'll read some of your comments here in just a second, I'll let Todd McShay again tell you about a stock up candidate in Jalen Milrow

the Alabama quarterback. And then there's Jalen Milrow, right? Who's just this sort of polarizing figure

Can you guys believe he's going to the draft? No. Well, that's the thought we were talking about yesterday

We had a whole hour on it yesterday, Todd. I'm trying to figure out who the hell is talking to his agent

I went back last year because I remember there were 13 guys drafted. I bet 13 guys that accepted invites to the draft

A couple other guys got invitations, turned it down, wanted to be with their family. 13 players were accepted invites and were in Detroit for the draft last year

And the league really doesn't want. It's great TV, yes, but it's a bad look for the league to have the Brady Quinn situation

Aaron Rodgers, and most recently, as I say, Will Levis, right? And it's not good for anyone

This isn't a reality TV show where we're trying to shame people. And so they trimmed it down 13 players last year

And I remember Darius Robinson coming out of Missouri. I liked him in the first round, but I wasn't getting a consensus from the league

He was a fringe guy. And I heard the reports coming out of the New York offices

that they really wanted to make sure that we didn't have a guy who had to... And I've been in the TV truck after the first night of the draft

and I've had the production meetings the next morning before day two of the draft where the production group and the reporters are talking to the moms

or dads of the family. Well, they went home or, yeah, they're going to come back

It's just nothing that they want. So Darius Robinson was the 13th of the 13 players

He wound up going 27. And I remember when he was drafted, I was like, the league knew, right

All 13 players drafted in the top 27 picks last year. And so when Jalen Milrow gets selected

and the information coming out of New York this year was, we're going to trim the fat even more

We're talking eight, 10 players this year. and Milrose on that list

I'm not saying it's a lock. The vast majority of people I talk to in the league

have day two grades on him. And some have grades that just, you know

I wouldn't be proud to kind of mention. But what he has in terms of his elite skill set

that 4-3-9, that Georgia game with the running ability, is probably better than anyone else's elite skill set

that they have in this quarterback class. And so as a quarterback coach and an offensive coordinator

and you look at like Joe Milton and the value, you're not drafting the guy in late first or second round to

to just go trade them for a late round pick again. But my point is

I think there are plenty of people in the league that coach these guys that

say there's more there than maybe with some other guys. Let's take a flyer

maybe move back into the first round. So, Todd McShay, again, on the radio show today

You can check out that full interview on 104.5 The Zone's YouTube channel

and subscribe to it while you are there. So, Milrow, stock up at this point in time

Going to be pretty interesting to see where he ends up going

McShay talked today about the idea of potentially four quarterbacks in the first round with Dart and with Milrow

Milrow is attending the draft for some reason. So it seems there is a decent percentage chance that he ends up going as a first round pick

which is crazy. Stock down, Nico Harrison, the Mavericks GM. I mean, stock down for all time for Nico Harrison, the Mavericks GM

But Luka currently has 31 in the first half. I think he just made a three there to make that 34

So good for Luka. He's leading all Lakers by a mile. He's leading all scores by a mile right now

And after draining that three with just a few seconds left, a little over 30 seconds left in the first half, the, the Mavs

the Mavs are keeping it close, but Luca is giving them absolutely their money worth

So was that a three that he hit or a two point shot

I'm not sure. Anyway, I think it was three, but Luca revenge game

not going well for Nico Harris and stock down for him. that's going to do it for us tonight

Fun show. Appreciate you hanging out. Radio show will be a good time tomorrow. Come hang out with us from 10 to one on one Oh four

five, the zone. We're really cooking on the radio show. I'm not going to lie to you. We're really having a, we're really having a big

a big year so far, a big off season so far, and we're going to have an even bigger year come football season

And we're all very excited about it. We're all very excited about the idea of a new quarterback

And we're all very excited about the install on Friday, May the 2nd

You can get your tickets now. One Oh four, five, the zone.com. You can be in the house when Greg Cosell breaks down the tape of your new quarterback and your new offensive line and potentially your new wide receivers and pass rushers

We will add alongside Cam Ward in this NFL draft. Bert, I believe, put the link in the chat earlier

So you can check that out. And if you didn't see the link in the chat earlier, go to 104.5thezone.com

Tickets are selling fast. See you guys tomorrow morning at 10 a.m. on 104.5 The Zone

particular Chetta bangs says, pretty sure Levis is more important to the city than some balls fan

I'm inclined to agree. Billy Jones says as a ball fan, I saved my hate for Obama in Florida

I don't know why that's so funny. It's, uh, well, it is

It's funny because the idea that like, I think anybody, and I maybe except for Billy Jones

I think every, Oh, he means Bama