John Mara - What Are You Going To Do To Fix This? #nfl #nygiants #football #sports

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to prosper to rise
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[Applause]
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to the BL [Applause]
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all right well welcome back to another edition of In BBI with John Eric I'm John mcdevit and with me as always
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senior editor of Big Blue Interactive Mr Eric Kennedy and Eric we are on an epic Pace I think we've now lost what was it
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10 straight games this is this these are records that well we weren't expecting to the setting records when we started
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this show again we certainly were not expecting this kind of record yeah um
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100th anniversary of the team I think John Mara wanted a special season uh I don't think he's getting the special
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season he wanted he's getting a historic season season 10 in a row is a record um
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I had to double check that it is a franchise record to lose 10 games in a row which is something given some of the
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seasons this franchise has had over the 100 Year history so um I just wanted to
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say just off top I know you and I have been trying to keep these podcasts a
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little bit upbeat and positive in the sense that we're at least trying to be you and I are trying to make have some
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fun and has some humor but this is it's getting to the point where this is just nauseating I mean it's just I the for
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for Giants fans out there who again the the world doesn't revolve around the Giants the world doesn't revolve around
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sports but those of you who this team matters this is just disgusting and it's
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sickening and it's just it's embarrassing and I and I feel for you and the the low light for me personally
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this week was my two kids who I love dearly and love me dearly um hopefully
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um saying to me separately that they would like to watch the Eagles commanders game um which was on at the
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same time as the Giants were were on because and I don't blame them and they saw a hell of a game um watching you
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know I missed it I had to watch the highlights later but they saw a hell of a game watching that game and um it's
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sad because we and I have talked about this you know a whole generation of Giants fans aren aren't going to watch
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this because it's just it's terrible it's why would you subject yourself to this right and I I know you didn't mean
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it to be humorous and I'm we're trying to be serious but the humor part about it when you said special the first
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thought I thought for the Giants 2024 season is they're the Tim version of South Park special and if and if this
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was an astronomy class the Giants are flat earthers so there you go that's
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where we're at right now it's bad it's yeah it's so bad um and we the opening
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that we used hopefully it it gets it shows up in the beginning of this video yes is
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symbolic oh my gosh it's symbolic of the disaster of the season it's like the so
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equate the the Giants with the Porto John reigning their whatever you want to
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call it down on us fans that's what we're being exposed to right now so I thought it was a perfect clip symbolic
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clip the only other thing that we should have added to it and I I thought about I'm thinking about it now and maybe when
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you watch this I might have already done it is we needed also the part we need like Randy Quaid going the [ __ ] full
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yes because at this point I mean that's what this has become it's funny the Giants took the
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lead in the game on Sunday and at no point in time truthfully did I worry
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about draft pick or anything else I'm like they're not going to win this game I don't care what happens there's no way they're going to win this game and I
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just didn't expect it to fall off they took the lead and then it just fell right off the cliff if you're a person
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who believes let's talk about this a little bit because there's a lot of people keep saying it Sai said it on our previous episode that the Giants might
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literally be soft tanking I.E they're not just going out there and going here's the
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ball but they're not trying to win if you're a person who believes that was
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Sunday validation for that belief you know I find myself agreeing
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with Sai 95% of the time and I don't want to
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believe him in this case and I don't think he's correct in this case he could be we're going to find out very soon
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we're going to find out in a month what what is today December 23rd we'll find out actually find out what three three
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four weeks three weeks so yeah yeah
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um I I don't think I don't think it's in the DNA of this franchise the soft tank
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I I think that means I think that if you're going to if they're soft tanking it means you were
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correct early early early on in the season where you thought there might be an agreement that no matter what they're
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coming back um my statement back then
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was it's easy to say that they're going to come back when the record what was the record
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at the time two and five or whatever something like that yeah so every week that goes by every loss
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that piles up and now the games are getting out of hand 354 3514 last week
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347 this week they're getting out of hand people are really upset that the
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ones are still tuning in are really upset it's not just the people flying the airplanes I mean people are really
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angry and um you and I have talked over
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the weeks and months about if a team gets the stink of losing on them
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it's hard to get off I think coaching staffs and front offices can fall prey
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to that too so how do you bring back this coaching staff at this point and if
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you do are the players even I mean are they are they already lame ducks are you
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already setting yourself up for again keeps talking about this a lame duck season Dan Reed came back I just I just
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I don't think they're tanking but if they are tanking I don't know if that's a good thing either I just I know I'd
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like to hear your thoughts on this I just sure the problem I have with the tanking
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idea is if that was the case why did you wait so long to pull Daniel Jones who literally was now that we've seen your
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best chance of winning with him at quarterback we've seen since then they weren't winning with these other guys so
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why would you leave them in as long as you did I got I have always felt like they
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were put on notice that said you wanted something else because it seemed obvious Shane wanted a different quarterback day
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ball seemed very excited about Daniel seemed very excited about May and that was shown to the world you didn't get
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him whatever happened behind the scenes that we didn't see about that whether they knew you weren't going to be
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allowed you're not giving the farm away to move up but we know you don't want him but you need to prove to me that
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he's not the guy so they go get neighbors if that was the agreement was we're gonna go as long you got to go as
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long as possible until it seems like we can't really be in it anymore before we
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give up on Jones you're coming back if he fails that's on me if he fails that would be a
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John Mar thing that's the only thing that makes any sense if that's true about the soft tanking but the tanking
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didn't happen until halfway through the season I don't buy it I do think there was some weird kind of agreement uh for
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whatever reason but I also think you're right it sounded good when maybe they might be
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four and 13 five and 12 but two and 15 on what would
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be what a 12 game losing streak I can't imag imagine how do you bring that guy
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back I don't know and I I should correct myself from last week I kept saying 13 13 games my there are my math skills 12
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games they will end up losing 12 games in a row um I don't know and it's not it's not just the 12 games which is and
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itself is enough I mean it's enough right say they don't say they even win the last two games they still want lost
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10 games in a row no no Giants coach in history has ever done that and we're
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talking about some doozies of again no one likes to hear his name Ray Hanley didn't lose 10 games in a row um Joe
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judge didn't lose 10 games in a row I mean so we're talking we're talking historically bad they're not now they're
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not competitive people who are saying injuries injuries injuries the injuries didn't pop up until the last few weeks
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right don't give me that crap and my preview article talked about it people
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who didn't see it all the reasons why I think um D's on thin ice and all the reasons why I think Shane is on thin ice
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and and uh you know the tanking argument doesn't work for me from this this
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perspective you it's what I talked about earlier Drew lock is going to be a free
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agent who is not coming back to this team it does not make any sense in any stretch of the imagination for him to to
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throw two pick sixes because it doesn't help him you know he wasn't deliberately
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doing that because it doesn't help him in free agency in the off season he's not Drew Lock's not tanking Drew Lock's
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playing for for his next contract there are other guys on this team that are playing for the next contract so it's harder to me to have a football team in
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the AA free a pro team in an AA free agency to tank
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um with if the players are involved now maybe you can say they're tanking because they're setting up the the the
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players for failure by putting so many guys on ir and by playing Drew lock in the first place I don't know I I just I
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don't think they're tanking long story short is this they thanks to the Raiders winning they're they' right they've got the first pick
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in the draft right now so some people are very excited about that
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unfortunately it's doesn't look like there's a clearcut you know oh my God we have to get this quarterback quarterback
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in this draft um there are two guys that everyone's talking about and we'll talk about them in this yeah um and hopefully
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one of them ends up being the next guy because I'll tell you what I'm looking at Drake May right now and I'm looking
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at Jaden Daniels right now and I'm like son of a [ __ ] I'm like
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oh we were so close to getting one of these two and um so if they're tanking
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or they're not tanking the good news is we're in position of that the question is is do you want and this is a question
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for you and others out there who if they want to comment in the comment section do you want Shane and D to pick the next
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quarterback do you trust them to pick pick the next quarterback there are pros and cons to this we saw I mean they
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obviously thought highly of Daniels and they obviously thought high of May we've
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got that on tapate we know that and we know they tried to trade up for one of
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them they knew they couldn't trade up for the other um Daniels but they we know that that they they were they
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thought he was it was worth an effort to try to trade up if he did fall so we they did that but on the flip side
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they're the ones who gave Daniel Jones this huge contract that got us into this mess in the first place so do you trust
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them do you trust able to run an offense do you trust a coach that's lost 10 games and is going to lose 12 games in a
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row to come back and get turn this team around do you have is there anything out
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there for you John that you say if if DAV comes back there's
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something that I there's a there's a reason why I think he should he should come back I don't see it I so
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no and the reason is and I and I want to touch this in a minute you shared the
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the post by R Stapleton yeah um I've commented back to him on it a couple of times I think it's ridiculous to his
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stance but we'll get to that in a second we started six and two in 20122 I've said this numerous times we went three
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five and one after that we had a point differential overall in the first eight games of which we were six and two of
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plus six so we we were winning but we were winning very close games there were
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turnover was involved it wasn't a murderous row of opponents we did have the Ravens the Packers were decent uh
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but we beat a Tennessee team that was very flawed we beat a Carolina team two turnovers right in the first two
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possessions in the first quarter and we won the game by three so we didn't have the offense wasn't great it was a bad
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roster we went three5 and one we had a point differential of Nega -2 so from the first eight games of 2022
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6-2 since that time if you go the rest of 22 35 And1 20 three we were six and
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11 de Ball's won nine games out of 26 well now here you are fast forward now we've won 11 games out of what we are
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now two and we're two and what two and 13 so we've so now you've won out of 39
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11 out of out of the last like uh 39 games 37 games whatever it
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is we're just going down down down down and the problem is you know you always have that statement it can always get
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worse so as far as like the way the the things are going under day I keep thinking man they've really
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bottomed out this team's bottomed out and then something else happens you're like oh I guess I was wrong they they can actually play even worse and I know
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the players have changed but who picked them right who picked these players it's
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not just who drafted them but who picked them to make the team we've had weird weird very weird roster decisions with
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we've talked about multiple times special teams has been kind of played around with it's the opposite of Joe
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judge who Joe judge went and got a whole bunch of just special teams on only guys guys to cover we had multiple guys that
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their job was to cover special teams they couldn't play any other position but we thought we would carry them now we got guys who can't return we seem to
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get rid of returners or we get and the guy gets injured then he's gone we don't have a returner so we play people that aren't returners we have the weird
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kicker stuff then there's just kind of what happened as you've brought up don't
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forget Drew lock as we we talked about we talked about saying if you pull Jones
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just throw DeVito in there's no point in playing lock because you know what are you trying to do but that's not their
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mindset their mindset was we still want to win games right but you jump the backup quarterback and went to the third
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string guy so why was he the backup then why was he even on the sense doesn't
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make any sense so so your question is is basically like is there anything that D Ball's done that you can go that's the
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one thing that I think we're missing here that he's a good coach no I can't think of one thing I don't like what he
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does during the game he's so inconsistent in his decision- making of what he's going to do he's inconsistent
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with the roster putting it together he's had issues with his his coaches the people he picks he's had issues with
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he's changed his whole demeanor and it seems to be after all the stuff leaked about him and wink and all the BS so
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this year he's kind of a little bit different but every now and then you see it come out with the players but it to
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me it's it's like one of those um it's like a dog who barks at stuff after stuff has already happened and then you
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know now they're walking away and the dog barks he's yelling at he's getting mad at Drew lock for what Drew look at
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what's happening on the field Malik neighbors can't line up properly when it goes before the snap Jaylen hay can't
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get lined up right and caus is another one that I guess you could say was neighbors it probably was on ha you've
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got guys constantly doing things that you're just like what the hell did you have you practiced any of this stuff
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right and that's where I'm like okay so if you come into another season and now
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we have the first pick in the draft or even the second it doesn't matter and you bring in a rookie quarterback it's
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an the rookie quarterback has a Long Leash because they're they're they're a rookie quarterback but your head coach
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has one that's tied basically right at the stake he has no leeway for failure
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he can't live off the leash that the quarterback has that's not going to happen if we fail horribly you've got a
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receiver who's already kind of showing Diva like attitude pieces not necessarily like on but he's clearly not
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happy with the way he gets used he's not happy with the way the team is going and he clearly isn't happy with who that's
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quarterback he doesn't always blatantly say it but you can read into a lot of the way he says things that he's just
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not happy he dogs almost every Friday practice by the way and I know he has lingering injuries but why do they only
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bother him on Friday don't know yeah so if you bring that quarterback in and you
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struggle now you got a receiver who's unhappy that quarterback is not going to be listening to this head coach that he knows is probably not going to be there
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so now you're going to have to have another head coach come in so that's where I'm like well if we're going this route he's got to go he's got to go and
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then if you go one step further then the guy who picked them the guy who gave
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Daniel Jones as far as we know unless somebody comes right out and goes John Mara made me do it he gave him that
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contract I don't have a problem if that's the decision-making you made to get to a certain point what I do have a
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problem with you had a two-year out that's what we talked about constantly even before we did the show again it was
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post it all the time they they clearly built a two-year out here right that was a thing that we all knew right you
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didn't even make it the two years right you you dropped him a year and a half if
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it's so bad that that's the case then why the hell did you give him that contract at all that that to me says
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there there is definitely something we're missing in that string of events that led to this contract because
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clearly if you're going to do it you ride it out I know the injury piece but we we didn't worry about the injury
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piece until the 10th game we were already pretty much out of it at that point and he was taking shots you were
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running quarterback sweeps if you were worried about the injury you stop calling the quarterback to run power plays you go no no more of that if you
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have to run run and get out of bounds but we're not going to call Design runs but they did so the injury thing really
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didn't come into play until they decided to yank to pull him off and move him all the way to the back right I just feel
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like if you're going going to reset which this is and I'll turn it back to you who who
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on this team are you really confident you're going to build around is there enough of them that you can say Joe
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Shane is the reason we have that group so I kind of want him to continue to add to it or do we just not have enough
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players really to say we can build around and you clear the deck of the head coach and the general manager and
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let them restock the roster well that's the million-dollar question so I been
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very uh wary since 2006 of
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making um making statements um too early making
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very strong statements that I I would I would regret because back in 2006 I thought Tom Coughlin was on the
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was basically on the way out I thought the way even though they made the playoffs that year the Way That season
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went um I I just felt he wasn't the right fit and that was the the most
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wrong I've ever been with the Giants because Tom Coughlin went on to win two Super Bowls I was really down on Tom cin
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so I've been very guarded about making very strong opinionated statements that
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that would come back and bite me in the ass and some of these things that I I wish I'm I I I don't do that because
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some of my gut instincts end up being correct and for I'll give you minor
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example and then major example minor example was I didn't like when they signed Nate
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Solder I thought that was I thought they had disaster written all over it and I bit my tongue and I didn't say so at the
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time and I wish I had said this is stupid this is wrong and I by the way I did say the Evan Neil pick was Dumb and
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I took a lot of grief fit because I didn't not I thought he was going to be a bad player I just think you didn't dra
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draft a right tackle top 10 so
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um I just think that the situation is so bad right
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now so toxic right now that I just don't I don't see how you roll this back
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with the fan base and try to convince them that this is going to be okay next
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year because the fan base I I'm can you find anybody who's actively defending
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these guys other than the reporters I mean it's I want to get into that too because the whole the reporters
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defending the defending this right now to me is very odd it it's kind of flipped and the back in the day when
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they smelled blood in the water the reporters used to go after and TR and and jump on the coach like like Tom
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Coughlin back in 2006 they all tried they all turned on Tom Coughlin right now it seems like at least half the
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reporters covering this team are almost like employees of the Giants saying why
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why they should get another chance um which which is which is very very bizarre to me but I I just have a hard
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hard time seeing the fan base getting excited about rolling this group back
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for all the reasons Sai talked about and you and I have talked about what's the identity of this team what are they
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trying to build like what you just talked about who are we building around um and that ties in with the identity
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and what are we trying to do we talk to a sign you and I talk separately with
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ourselves about what's this passing offense trying to do where you know what's the running game trying to do the
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defense all about I just when you're still asking those kinds of questions three years into this regime I just
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don't know where the I mean don't if they if
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they come back say say in three weeks you and I are doing a podcast and it's announced that they're staying with
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everyone's mea comes out and says we're we're going to make some changes but but dav's coming back and Shane's coming
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back and we're going to get the first round draft pick the first pick and the draft we're going to change this around I mean are you going to feel good about
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that will you feel good about that no God no no I'm I'm really worried the biggest change in the Giants
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organization like physically changed where they were at in many ways was based
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on uh I don't say luck per se but in many ways it was luck the Giants finished in the Draft order second in
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1981 if the New Orleans Saints take Lauren Taylor yeah there is a good
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possibility the Giants take George Rogers M you know Heisman Trophy winner gon to put him in a
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backfield the Giants would not be the Giants today if that had happened no so
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sometimes it is more circumstance that leads you to
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where you where you need to go versus your own so I feel like getting first almost puts the it puts the the one
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piece that we seem to be not so great at is when we can just decide what we want to do versus things kind of fell our way
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it's so funny that you brought bring that up because I thought the exact same thought today I really thought maybe
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it's not such a good idea that we have the first pick that we maybe it would be the second pick because maybe if we have
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the first pick we'll take the wrong guy I mean I thought that I I mean think about this right how hard would it be if
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the Giants let let's say right now we have the first pick which we do let's say the draft is today let's say
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everything is the way it is right now which is shadur Sanders is talked about all over the place he's well known his
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dad is famous um he just won the Heisman or uh he was part of winning the Heisman
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to um Hunter won the Heisman but he was there he's throwing passes to Malik in the street Giants have scouted the hell
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out of him team you know yeah are the Giants
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going to go cam Ward is the better Prospect though and take him over Sanders after
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all that there's no way you're going to have to you're literally I mean I person here so here's the thing quite quite
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frankly I would not I prefer cam Ward I said this back in the summer I thought cam Ward you did say that I thought he
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was I thought he was a guy to keep an eye on he's he's got flaws though I'm really worried about just taking a
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quarterback with the one number one pick just because but at the same time we
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don't have a choice right and that's what the the other part of my um statement was I lost my train of thought
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when I was I said there was a minor thing with an eight solder the other thing that I wish I had said at the time
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but I bit my tongue was and I kind of alluded to it since then that and I'll
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say it right now the contract that they gave um J Daniel Jones I think really
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was the death nail for both these guys I think it's just when they get fired now
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because of it is it going to be at the end of this year or is it going to be the end of next year but I don't think
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they're going to be able to overcome the the and and people some people are going to say out there are going to say one
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decision can't sync a regime and and I'll say yes it can because if the if
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the decision was so catastrophic and the Daniel Jones contract was catastrophic
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and some people are going to say well it was only a two-year deal it's not catastrophic it set everything else up
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it led exactly to where we're at right now where this team is in year three and
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they were on the right path in in year one and they got off that right path they stopped the rebuild they started
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thinking that they could compete if they just made tweaks to the roster which is the exact goddamn thing they did with
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Eli Manning instead of saying we've got major structural problems we've got to redo this whole thing they kept saying
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and Gman did this the to Reese did this Gelman did this and now the current regime's doing this
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where it's all reactive it's all fix this fix this it's again the whack-a-mole that John C talked fix this
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and there's no plan here and when they did that contract at the time I thought
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this is going to sync them and I wish I had come out and said that but again I'm trying to not be the guy that hits the
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panic button and look like you know look like but I I think they're never going to be able to overcome this and whether
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they get fired this year or next year um I hope they don't if they keep them I hope they don't get fired next year
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because I don't want to go through this again but I just feel like um I just
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feel like the whole thing it's it's so bad we're historically bad we're horrible on
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offense look at the I I put it on the um the front page of the website I did the
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um the write up after the game a little bit differently I wanted people to see what all 11 drives of the giants look
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like in this game so there there were 11 possessions that the Giants had and they had one touchdown drive and the other
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possessions are all three and out or pick sixes or a fumble or a turnover and
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downs but most of them are they didn't even get a first down on the drive and they only got eight yards or or minus 10
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yards or or whatever and and and this was against a Falcons team that's
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playing a rookie quarterback who we passed on it and and you turn on the TV
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and watch the NFL and there a lot there's a lot of bad football throughout the NFL right now sure but most
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teams are at least in games you can watch a game and and and see another bad
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three- win team and at least they're in the game and the game's close and we're not we're losing by four three four
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scores now now and I just don't see how you I just I I know Sai says there there
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there's a soft tank going on and they're bringing them back but I that's going to be a hard sell to this fan base that's
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going to be a really really hard sell to this fan base so two things and the first thing I'm gonna say is going to
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sound like I'm completely going against you and I'm not but I do disagree just slightly on the the one decision
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shouldn't sink a thing I I kind of agree with that theory it shouldn't the problem is you're talking about one
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Monumental mistake but we're leaving out all the other things that have that you've done wrong oh sure a lot you
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didn't trade Barkley when you should have and could have and that would have made sense if you were planning to keep Jones and you weren't planning to give
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Barkley the contract you should have traded them you didn't davier McKinny same thing you go and then you you go
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out of your way into a draft and you say oh we know we got by with a very
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mediocre roster and we've given our cour back a big contract so what is your
30:30
first thought to do you go and get a quarterback no matter what you were locked in and number in the first round
30:36
you were going to get a cornerback you made it pretty obvious that's what you were going to do right that guy is not
30:42
really played out the way he wanted and he was designed for the defensive coordinator we no longer have by the way
30:48
so you really took what was there so again it's kind of the whack Ando thing we need a cornerback so we'll just do
30:53
that but your roster was so still kind of that we really should have just been
30:58
really good players at any position to fill that up I would argue the center falls into that category to the next
31:05
round yeah but then we did it again even though the draft seems okay we did it again in 24 you went and said we're not
31:12
getting a quarterback there were still three available when we picked you didn't want any of those guys you went
31:19
and got neighbors because we need to get a weapon for Jones we got to justify that contract okay you got your dog
31:25
which I hated that when they said it over and over again got a dog he's a dog well he's dogging a lot of it right now
31:30
so I don't know don't give me all the the receptions cuz I watch Brian Thomas with a really bad Jaguars team and that
31:37
dude is making some really long touchdowns and everything else neighbors drops a lot of passes and I'm not liking
31:43
a lot of some of his demeanor on the field again you're losing it sucks I get it but for now second round we wanted a
31:51
corner we were going to get a corner no matter what but then the two guys that we had labeled were gone so you just go
31:57
and get the third Corner well who else was on the board by the way at that time at other positions if I I would love to
32:04
see the board who did we have because if you took somebody who was here and there was somebody up here at a different
32:09
position then you ignored your previous principles as we take the best player if we got somebody rated fairly high on the
32:15
board that supersedes need right but it didn't we made need and we did the
32:20
center we did it again with quter Andre Phillips is a good player but again it seemed like you did that or was it n did
32:27
we get Phil first and then nuben or nuben nuben first doesn't matter you went defensive back because we lost
32:32
mcken then you went corner so you forced those positions no matter what so I
32:39
don't like it's not just the one decision it's just the one that stands out so bad because every other decision
32:46
that you made this is a thing I talk about all the time my wife will be like ah if only this that I'm like you know if that had happen every other decision
32:53
that we made after that would be different so you don't know how it plays out you made the decision to get Jones every
33:00
choice that you made afterwards is based on the fact that you did that but you're not sold on that so you
33:08
built in a two-year out but you didn't do what the Falcons did which I think was stupid at the time for giving the
33:14
huge contract and immediately drafting the successor but now it's kind of smart
33:19
on their part but at the same time we didn't do that we gave the guy a lot of money and then we go hope it works out
33:26
if not we got two years well what's weird about the Giants thing is this I we haven't talked about enough about
33:32
this we won't spend a lot of time on this because we have so much to talk about but we didn't talk about enough about this because I think everybody
33:39
just breathed the S relief when Daniel Jones was gone but it was pretty Monumental to cut Daniel Jones in the
33:45
middle of this season I mean it really was for this this franchise to do that
33:51
so I do give them credit for doing that I actually give them credit for finally
33:56
saying and and recognizing and they don't want to admit this the only reason they um really pulled the plug on him in
34:04
my opinion was a $23 million risk of continuing to play him at the at this point because I think that's why they
34:11
cut him I I think they they they benched him they benched him and then he wanted to be released and it would have been a distraction anyways to keep him around
34:17
so just just get rid of him I give them credit for that but it so that but you
34:23
would think if they were that game planning this out that possibility must
34:29
have been in their minds going back before this I hope it was I hope
34:34
somewhere Shane and dble were saying you know if this doesn't work out with with
34:41
Daniel and there's this 23 million dollar risk here we're going to we're
34:47
we're going to cut him at during the season so if they thought if they were thinking that way at the time that's why
34:54
you would think maybe that's where they would have quarterback would have been become a more uh U pressing need in the
35:04
draft where the where Nicks penck and and um McCarthy went right after the
35:11
Giants you would thought they would maybe would have reached there or traded down a little bit and picked one of
35:17
those guys cuz in the back of their head and again we kind of saw it in Hard Knocks again too they weren't they
35:22
weren't sold on Daniel so I mean it's obvious that's stating the obvious they're not sold on Daniel they're
35:27
talking about trading up for for Jaden Daniels they're talking about tring up for and they scouted all the
35:33
quarterbacks we know they scouted all the quarterbacks so we know in the back of their head that D Daniel could flame
35:41
out which he did which a lot of us expected him to do a lot of us were afraid he was going to get hurt again
35:48
and and then and thankfully that didn't happen again so if that if if that's in their head then why were they acting
35:55
coming into the season again kind of like let's surround Daniel with weapons and maybe he'll that kind of thing so it
36:01
seems sort of like a desperate move it almost seems like um Jesus we didn't we
36:07
didn't get to one of our top three guys let's just surround Daniel with an offensive line give him some wide
36:14
receivers tight end and maybe maybe he'll surprise us again um the
36:20
alternative is I don't know what their alternative was because signing Drew lock obviously doesn't seem to have been
36:27
wealth thought through so I don't this is the problem Shane has we talked about why D's got these problems Shane's has
36:34
these problems because I don't see what the plan was here it seems like they've been flip-flopping again the Barkley
36:39
thing seems flip-flop the Daniel Jones thing seems flip-flop um we've talked
36:44
about Barkley about how they should have traded him in 2022 2023 we haven't spent
36:50
enough time on xaver mckin Xavier wanted a new contract last year with the Giants
36:55
the Giants going into the season said no we're not going to talk to you once the season starts they knew he was going to
37:01
hit free agency and then they had a horrible first half last year up until the trade deadline they should have
37:08
traded him at the trade deadline last year and then then he walked and I that's so it's not just saqu we we we
37:15
talking about saquin but Xavier's in the same category and to a minor minor extent they they apparently had you know
37:22
and not even crappy offers but they had offers for Z oari who as we predicted
37:28
ended up an injured reserve again trade him now for trade him for a seventh
37:34
rounder I don't care just get rid of him and now they're gonna get nothing for him and der Slayton the same thing and
37:41
and I think Mara's words about this was I think this was last year we don't want
37:46
to just trade guys at the deadline and make it look like we're just giving up on the season but they did though but they have and that's and the funny thing
37:53
is is like that's exactly what you're doing right now yes if you believe the soft tank and I do think at this point
38:01
they're not trying super hard to like they're I don't think they're game planning specific anymore to the
38:07
opponent I think they're just game planning like we'll run this on third Downs we're going to we'll do this and I
38:12
think they're keeping it very lot more vanilla quite frankly I don't think it matters even when we weren't doing that
38:18
what difference does it make that the quarterback doesn't matter I just don't really see I hate to
38:25
say this because I used to think it's the boogeyman a boogeyman a boogeyman but I do think there's a Mera issue in
38:31
part of this and it is the thought process that he didn't interfere in the Barkley
38:37
thing but we knew how he felt about it I do think he interfered on the Jones side of things back in I've said this over
38:44
and over again I don't want to be the dead horse I think he interfered on the Jones side of things to make sure that they could franchise Barkley because
38:50
Barkley was not going to take the contract that they were offering the only way you get Barkley is to give him
38:55
the money that he wants but then you don't don't give that to your quarterback now you brought up you shared the thing that art Stapleton
39:01
shared and if anybody didn't see it go back and look at the post in the thing but basically what what the hell was
39:07
that tweet basically what he shared and I'm paraphrasing but correct me the if I'm wrong here is he was he was
39:13
basically talking about you can't really get rid of these guys at they you you forget that they was coach of the year
39:19
in 22 that he had a bad roster um you know you got to give them a chance to have their own quarterback and and make
39:26
that and make it their own before because if you do this if you get rid of them you might not be able to get
39:33
another coach because you tell them they've got two years and then they're probably out his argument was what you
39:39
just said but was basically you can't fire a historically
39:44
bad GM and Coach because you would send a bad message to the rest of the league
39:51
on on coaches that you might be you be be interested in so in other words stick
39:58
with the crap that you have already because you heaven forbid you send out a bad message I mean to me that's like I
40:04
mean say you had a failing stock I mean say you had it's almost like hold on to something because you don't want to send
40:10
out a message that you you you you made a bad investment in the first place well you don't hold on to something that's
40:16
you don't hold on to something that's not working because guess what if they're horrible at their job they're
40:22
going to get fired at some point and then you've lost another year we have lost more than a decade
40:28
of of football here this is really bad we had a good season in 2016 and we had
40:34
a decent season in 2022 but besides those two years the rest of the decade we've been in third
40:41
and fourth place in like six and six and 10 you know F five and 11 be a good year
40:48
that be a good year I mean it just terrible four win Seasons I mean just terrible and this is the this is I mean
40:55
I couldn't believe he tweeted that out I that that that to me that was that was an absurd his rationale was you can't
41:02
send a bad message you better keep the crappy guys you got you have of course art and the other thing he said the
41:09
other element of what he said was um you got to give them a chance to pick their
41:14
quarterback well they did pick their quarterback they picked Daniel Jones they were going to get rid of him they
41:20
decided not to they decided to give him $160 million they both signed off on
41:25
that that art that was their quarterback they picked that they've caused this mess for you to act like they haven't
41:33
picked a quarterback is absurd he made it he made it even worse because he did post later in response to someone else
41:40
that the Giants had no choice these guys had no he goes they had no choice but after coming off a playoff season you
41:47
can't get rid of your quarterback there's a difference between not getting rid of the guy and franchising him for
41:53
the one year while you still try to figure out my roster what I'm doing then giving him what at the time was a fairly
42:00
significant quarterback contract the numbers inflated when you
42:06
do the the whole the whole thing the adjusted value part but the one that was
42:12
mocked across the landscape of the NFL former players other commentators mocked
42:18
this particular thing and I think some of those things are kind of generated more for just creating stuff but to be
42:24
honest you know they were all looking at it going you paid him and you didn't pay Barkley doesn't matter what we think
42:31
about whether Barkley should have got money it matters to other players though that the the more important of the two
42:36
players that they felt for the team you gave one a ton you gave the other guy basic that's that's not us opining they
42:43
said it publicly Kon Timol came out and publicly said that and the other thing and I sorry to interrupt but there are
42:50
other teams out there that part ways with players that that got that are reason for their success but they said
42:56
it's it's time to move on like look look Tyreek Hill with the Chiefs but you can pick quarterbacks too where teams have
43:03
said no he's not going to the thing is and you and I have talked about this over and over again yes the Giants got
43:09
into the playoffs in 2022 but it wasn't really a great season they kind of they
43:14
kind of it was sort of a Band-Aid approach um sure um to get in get in
43:19
smoking mirrors and a lot of it yeah and they and they basically had to dumb down the offense for Daniel Jones they had
43:25
their hands on they knew what he could couldn't do the Philadelphia Eagles knew what he everyone wantes to talk about
43:31
the Vikings game and you and I talked about this over and over again how bad the but look what Daniel did against the
43:36
against the Philadelphia Eagles in that playoff game after that he got crushed because the Eagles knew how to defend
43:42
defend Daniel Jones sure he's not a good quarterback and other people Giants fans
43:47
have said this that they couldn't P they could not walk away from saquan Barkley
43:54
and Daniel Jones I don't get that mindset at all that that's that's a New York Giant fan mindset that somehow
44:01
they've they we've a lot of our fans have Incorporated that from our ownership for some reason I and that's a
44:07
loser mentality oh yeah you can get rid of players and again the Eagles are a
44:13
great example of this they know when to get rid of player the Eagles know when to get rid of players before they're they become an
44:21
issue and and we don't we hang on to players and we hang on to coaches and
44:27
hang on the GMS too long that that's the history of and that's where this loyalty criticism comes from with Giants fans
44:34
with with the the meos are too loyal because we all have seen it over the and this goes back to Wellington too they
44:41
the loyalty is a tremendous asset but it can also be a a detriment if if you you're too loyal to somebody and there
44:48
was no reason to hold on to Daniel Jones if you don't think he could he's not $160 million quarterback he just isn't
44:56
no and and that and and the people that mocked the Giants at the time were right they were right for mocking him I mean
45:03
it was a terrible contract and it set them up for this whole thing I'm sorry I had to get get that no no you're fine
45:09
well that's where we're at though right like so if you you can Bandy about anything you want about should they
45:16
shouldn't they should they shouldn't they the fact of the matter is this there is a series of decisions that have been made that continually seem to be
45:23
either very shortsighted or just really wrong one of the two they they thought they
45:30
were one minute they're do we we don't do the fifth year option okay that means you have huge question marks about this
45:36
guy and you're just GNA you know make it through year number four we'll see what he
45:42
does 15 touchdowns through the air seven on the ground and you go he's worth $40
45:49
million a year those are midling range quarterback numbers by the way the the the rushing
45:55
touchdown is a little bit higher but the passing touchdowns are low that was one of his best years since
46:01
his rookie year was 15 so you you then make a decision that's the exact
46:06
opposite of the way you first came in the way you thought you were going so then you stop the rebuild if that's what
46:13
you want to call it and now we go into we're going to sort of we're going to we're going to retool we're going to add
46:18
some more we're going to add some weapons and we're going to move forward but by doing what you
46:25
did in a where where you were starting to get ahead on the cap we then went backwards on the cap by the way we're
46:32
still not good no we're no we're not and people who keep saying that you're wrong stop saying the Giants are in great cap
46:39
shape if you look at their cap picture Visa the rest of the league we're all right but it's not like great it's it's
46:46
it's not and and as John keeps pointing out we've got a huge quarterback void
46:51
right now and the roster is going to have to be filled up because the a lot of the guys we have are drags so that cap space is going to disappear really
46:58
really rapidly people are giving too much like oh well we got all this space next year we have space because you just
47:04
cut a guy but a lot it's dead money and again I don't care about dead money I never have do I know you don't you don't
47:10
but I do I care I mean the only reason I don't care about it is because it doesn't affect how much money I have to
47:16
spend whatever I have to spend is what I have to spend it doesn't matter that 50 million of it is dead money it just
47:22
means that here's my space that's all I care about what do we have for space why are we always kind of eh on Space we
47:29
don't have great players where are great players because they don't know how to evaluate talent and John C has talked
47:36
about this for over and over again and they're not good at they're not good at evaluating talent you said something
47:42
interesting they've made a lot of the wrong decisions what decisions have they made that have been right and if they
47:48
don't they haven't they they don't then why are you bringing them back they're not making the right decisions I just
47:55
have this feel feeling strong strong feeling so here I'm going I'm gonna I'm going to get rid of this old reticent
48:02
Eric that won't speak his mind all the time I'm going to tell you right now if we roll these guys back they're we're
48:08
going to fire them in the following year and then we're going to be like damn it
48:13
here we go we wasted another we wasted another year again I wanted these guys to work out they were given a chance to
48:20
be to be a breath of fresh air their first year was great they but they've botched the the they botched everything
48:26
since they hav gotten nothing right the last and and the other thing too is you talked one thing that you said that that
48:33
that reminded me of something again that we you and I have talked about over and over again so if you weren't completely
48:39
sure on Jones when his contract was up again remember they they they passed on
48:45
the fifth year option so they decided they had one look at him when they came in and said no we're not Daniel Jones
48:51
isn't the future we're not going to give him the fifth year off then they then they barely make the playoff
48:57
and they get an upset in the first round and they get crushed in the next round and all of a sudden they
49:03
say well maybe Jones is the going to be the guy
49:09
and instead of just franchising him and letting Barkley walk they gave him a huge contract and
49:16
franchise Barkley but then what do they do the very following year they let Barkley walk anyways and based on the
49:23
comments that we saw in Hard Knocks did I got to strong impression that that Joe
49:29
Joe Shane was never really really all that high on Barkley because I don't the comments he made in that were just
49:36
a um spur of the- moment one year overview of of of Barkley I think I
49:43
think in the back of of Shane's mind he bought into this running back don't have
49:49
shouldn't be getting Premier money whether you agree with that or not that was his position so if he felt that way
49:56
again and he felt and he felt there was even even an inkling in his head that they
50:02
were going to let Barkley walk the following off season why would you why would you give Jones the contract why
50:08
would you just do it a year early and let Barkley go a year early and then instead of taking a huge gamble on Jones
50:15
which they did just franchise Jones one more year and then you would because if they had franchise Jon once more year
50:20
they wouldn't have resigned him and we wouldn't be in this mess right we wouldn't have and I bet you we would have drafted a quarterback
50:27
it's it's interesting all the things that that come back from that point in
50:33
time so Circle back you made the the comment one big decision can I said a
50:39
bunch of other decisions have to to make the one really stand out the problem is the one is the Domino piece to all the
50:45
other decisions everything you did after that point has been almost the opposite
50:50
and it's the wack-a-mole approach that John C brings up but we do it too late
50:56
you you signed Jones you franchise Barkley then we should have gone out right away and tried to get a playmaker
51:02
a big- Time playmaker to put a wide receiver so you would have had your Trio
51:07
we would have had the the the the the Three Amigos essentially the Cowboys had it when they got Aman Smith and they had
51:14
Irvin but then they also had Alvin Harper they also had Jay novich the Giants basically wheeled out
51:19
their receiving core and what did we get we had dominative wand Del Robinson you know from from the previous draft then
51:26
you went and traded up and got Jaylen High highight these are not guys that you were going to be say they're taking
51:32
over you still had Slayton we were hoping Hodgins would G I mean you didn't go get that BigTime player so instead
51:39
you went we got Jones signed and we got Barkley franchise we'll go get Deontay Banks now our defense is going to be
51:44
better you played this like we just weren't a wild card team that kind of got lucky to get in which we were you
51:53
played this like we're a wild card team we were like the 80 like 84 Giants going into 85 with a dominant D line and we're
52:00
going to add a few pieces and now we're going to go and then 85 and 86 this team was not ready to go
52:06
anywhere you but you played it like it was and it burned you and then you
52:12
doubled down on it though again in this year you didn't get the quarterback even
52:17
though you knew you you didn't like the guy you got you that's your fault you
52:23
signed him but you didn't like him you made it very obvious that you wanted one of those other
52:28
guys notice that they never showed Brian deall talking about players on his team
52:34
they never asked him about like hey what do you do you think we can roll into the season with there was none of that in
52:40
Aro there it was only Joe Shane talking about allowing him to be the bad guy I
52:45
guess but I also wonder there's been all the rumors that D ball might have been far more Pro Barkley and L Pro Jones and
52:53
that's why you don't know a lot of that stuff but regard Shane talked about Jones Shane talked
53:00
about how we kind of need to know we need a quarterback and and that's why they were looking at may they were
53:05
looking at Daniels you hear D ball talking about the rookies not about anybody on his
53:12
team they made every decision at that point though to support the decision they made to sign him except for the
53:18
fact that they did it later 23 gets blown up Jones gets hurt so what do we do we roll it back out now we go get the
53:25
playmaker what evidence did you have from from the the 23 season that said to you Daniel
53:32
Jones not only is going to be the guy that you go he's gonna be better than the 22 version well not only that but
53:39
you have the humongous injury risk now yes yes huge injury risk two neck
53:44
injuries and an ACL and we thought he would be better than 22 if you gave him
53:50
a wide receiver and he's a running quarterback too it's always too late
53:55
it's always after after the fact that we do things people who say again you can't do these things do you think if the
54:02
Giants had had Carson went and he they had the kind of playoff success the Eagles had with Carson Wentz they would
54:09
have parted ways with Carson Wentz no I don't think the Giants would have done it I think Eagles said he's not good and
54:16
they got rid of him that's I think I'm sorry I I just think it's hysterical that you said that because when you were
54:21
talking before about holding on too long and other teams my first thought was the
54:27
Philadelphia Eagles had it had Carson Wentz had more success his rookie year than Daniel Jones than Daniel Jones had
54:33
he had he took a knee injury and that's the only reason that folos got on the field so and they said we don't want
54:40
that anymore yeah one year later they were like nah this is not Mar and whoever the GM would Gman or whoever
54:46
would have said no we got to hold on to this guy you know give him another year and you've seen what's happening with
54:52
wentz's career it's they were right the Eagles were right so we held on to
54:57
Daniel Jones too long and and all right so we we can keep going because I want to talk about a couple other things too
55:03
because there there so there's so much to talk about but I just I just think there have been so many bad
55:10
decisions made and you have to ask what have they done right right and what you said earlier again um one other thing
55:18
that you said about Mara has said well or the Giants have felt you can't you can't trade away
55:25
assets or you're sending the wrong message that you're you've given up on the season well they did that with Leonard
55:30
Williams it didn't bother us same year you did Leonard Williams why didn't you do other players that we all thought it
55:37
wasn't going to be just Leonard Williams if people remember on the website we thought Leonard Williams was going to be the first one and there were going to be
55:42
others because why would you only just because you are sending a message to the lot you are sending a message but but
55:47
the season was over like so many other seasons are are that was over by Halloween and they he was going to be a
55:53
free agent and they got a good return for for somebody who was going to be a they got a second round pick for him and
55:59
I think they got a lower round pick in addition to that but everybody was thrilled at the time with because we
56:04
thought we're not going to resign him and we better get something and we thought well they're going to do this with other player and I thought they'd
56:11
do it with Barkley I thought that's that's when they were going to ship Barkley and I thought we'd get if we
56:16
could go back in time and say sell the assets that you had get a bunch of draft picks and rebuild this thing get the
56:23
salary cap in order and rebuild this I guarantee you Shane would redo that I if Shane could go back in time and redo
56:30
this oh sure he would have done that I you know and some of the stuff it's hard some of the stuff just hasn't
56:36
worked out you made a valid point you had a valid point back then that you're
56:41
drafting Neil which is really high to be a right tackle but to clarify because we
56:46
have talked about this it wasn't that Neil was a was the was the risk per se
56:52
it's the position Neil was at the top of the of the order of tackles that you were going but you were getting them to
56:58
play the right side of the offensive line which is a high pick most to do that and most teams who would have
57:04
drafted him would have played him at left tackle right they would have played him at left tackle we had a left tackle
57:10
so that my argument at the time was if we didn't have Andrew Thomas drafting Neil would have made sense because he's
57:17
a left tackle I my problem was you don't draft a right T you can get a dra right tack a good right tackle in the second
57:23
round why would you draft one in the first round and and not lo and behold we this guy can't even play right tackle so
57:29
it would have been can you imagine Evan Neil at left tackle holy crap so yeah yeah well and the thing that's cost us
57:36
the most though we're giving we're giving Joe Shane a lot of credit for the 24 draft and we're not really saying it
57:42
now but over over the series of of podcasts we've we've done that and other people are constantly like look at his
57:47
draft choices that's another and and a lot of other people are saying oh that's why to bring them back but but one of
57:54
the reasons you have a salary cap problem that you do have is that you keep drafting guys that hopefully will
57:59
be middle of the pack players on your roster that eat up space at a very cheap
58:05
cost and can contribute two three four years hopefully before we have to you know they might never be starters but
58:12
they're they're contributors but if they are starters they're like the mcfaddens the problem is you get like a third
58:18
round Jos audu and you decide you're going to play him a tackle and he can't be a tackle I've really hardly ever seen
58:23
him play guard so this guy is basically on there but he's not you're having to constantly sign free agents at the
58:29
position he was drafted at you then you got mckian he gets hurt he's not even on team so you've missed a lot or your guys
58:37
just haven't been good enough that they they're backend roster pieces that you have to go get free agents keep bringing
58:43
them in Van roton we get we go get runan we go get you've had to bring in a lumor
58:48
so basically almost our entire offensive line is made up of guys that you've had to pull in from elsewhere because the
58:54
draft guys just can't seem to they they they all four offensive
58:59
linemen they've drafted have not panned out so they had to go in the free agency and try to fix something because they
59:04
couldn't draft offensive linemen so the the argument for keeping Shane right now
59:11
is something that I mentioned in my game preview is where Mar I know maror is thinking this and I would too
59:18
is when Shane came in to his credit now it hasn't worked out to his credit he
59:26
got rid of a lot of people in the front office he got a lot of and he and he
59:31
hired people and he brought in an outside vo voices and a lot of us cheered at the time again 22 we were
59:38
coming off 2022 and they um the first the first
59:43
when he first got there they couldn't because they were already the old Scouts and stuff were still were still scouting
59:49
during the college football season before Shane was even a giant so when when that when they that draft's over
59:55
that's when a bunch of people got fired and he started bringing people in and that continued this past offseason too
1:00:01
so Mara's sitting back going Shane is restructured this entire front office
1:00:07
and if I get rid of him everything he's built up for the last three years goes out the window now you and I as F and
1:00:15
other fans are out there are going so what they suck get rid of them but as an
1:00:20
owner someone who controls the organization you're thinking think of it like if you own a company you hired
1:00:26
somebody and they redid everything and they put on in this whole new structure and you spent all this money on it you
1:00:33
would be really really wary of blowing it all up again because the next guy who comes in might say I don't like any of
1:00:39
this and I don't like these people I'm going to get rid of all of them so right again the fan US fans will say that
1:00:45
that's fine do it but when you own the team that's a hard decision and I guarantee you that's kind of where where
1:00:52
mea is thinking right now too is do I want to fire all these people again and
1:00:57
and start from scratch um and I think that influen and again I just throw that
1:01:02
out there because there's more to it than just saying fire this guy fire that guy you know that type of thing there
1:01:08
are there's a whole structure and organization in place that's been built up and when you do that chaos is a
1:01:15
result you and I will argue that's a good thing right now because what we have isn't working but Mar's got a
1:01:21
bigger picture than that than you and I you could argue that George Young was in
1:01:26
a similar position he hires Ray Perkins they struggle early on they had
1:01:34
drafted Phil Sims he gets injured a lot they struggle they get LT they make the
1:01:39
playoffs 81 playoffs with the Giants is not drastically different than the 2022
1:01:45
Giants the difference was it's a it's a different league in a different era at that time you had players where there
1:01:53
was wasn't going to be a lot of movement even if your players contracts were up they weren't signing with anybody else they were stuck with you unless you
1:01:59
literally unless you cut them yeah unless unless you cut them they were you had the rights to them so but that team
1:02:06
fell off in 82 and Perkins leaves so the difference being we didn't we it they
1:02:14
made the playoffs with Perkins two years later D ball makes it right
1:02:20
off they fall off the cliff immediately the next year the Giants of 81 fell down in 82 there was a strike we fell off the
1:02:27
cliff in 83 with the new coach and Parcels but young got two coaches before
1:02:34
they had real success he had Perkins then he had Parcels if mea and if you
1:02:39
look across when's the last time we had a GM that we fired after with the coach that they hired we didn't they always St
1:02:45
they get a second coach right I have a feeling that's where this is going to go
1:02:50
the problem is I think they're trying everything possible to figure out how to keep day ball too and I just don't see
1:02:56
why I don't really want to keep Shane but I also get the fact of blowing it up with him it it's
1:03:02
complicated because then you you do have to find and there are going to be other teams looking for GMS right now you
1:03:07
gotta find a GM that's going to want to come in they're G to want their coach that coach has got to want to come here
1:03:14
which I don't know right now if this is the most attractive spot but the first pick in the draft does appeal to some
1:03:21
people I think D Ball's going to get fired I think Shane's coming back but John if I if I were you
1:03:28
one you need to you you need to keep your family part of this a little bit out of the decision- making from now on
1:03:34
you muddy the waters you embarrass yourself Chris Mara being involved in stuff looks like he's going in there to go what's going on so he can go back and
1:03:42
go tell you know Big Brother Big Uncle whatever the hell the relationship is between those two all the information it
1:03:47
looks stupid Chris Mara has no business being involved in that stuff other than the fact that his last name is Mara no
1:03:53
different than when you say s said Sanders is only considered the number one pick in the draft because his name is Sanders if he wasn't he probably
1:03:58
wouldn't be looked at as easily that's the only reason Chris May is where he's at and then McDonald's the same thing
1:04:04
he's been around Forever by the way we've had no success with these guys being involved why are they not under
1:04:09
scrutiny too so if you want to make changes if you're going to let Shane run Shane's going to cook the things he's got to do it then the leash or the uh
1:04:16
the sit on your shoulder the Jiminy Cricket I'm right here telling you what's going to happen or not happen
1:04:21
needs to go away and you got to let him he either has to sink or swim on his own I I want to turn to um I want one
1:04:29
comment what you said but we should turn to because I don't want this to go on way way long but I'd like to talk about the quarterbacks and I'd like to talk
1:04:35
about the next head coach um but um the what you just said about McDonald
1:04:43
and mea um being still involved in the Personnel
1:04:49
is very disconcerting and I'm starting to really wonder if you've talked about the organizational arrogance before I'm
1:04:56
starting to wonder and again I'm going to highly regret saying this because um and we can talk about this
1:05:04
too whether whether the Giants really are putting pressure on other podcasters and stuff out there or not they haven't
1:05:09
done with us they have not reached out to John and I and say you better get total of course we don't have the we don't have the viewers yet so maybe
1:05:16
they're not worried about us um I'm starting to worry if they're just not that SM smart that that the people that
1:05:23
that that the people at the top of this organization are I you know I I think that I know
1:05:28
this they're they they have good intentions they actually want to win they when they see fans on our site um
1:05:37
suffering in terms of like a family tragedy or death in the family something like that they will reach out and and
1:05:45
and they don't advertise it they don't look for credit they don't look for for PR on it they they really care about
1:05:52
their fans but I wonder sometimes if they're just not very bright and I worry
1:05:58
about that at the top of the organization because some of the stuff like again what does John maror has got
1:06:04
to look around and go what what are we doing wrong something's what are the
1:06:09
things that are staying the same and what's changing and at some point you you'd think he would look at his family
1:06:15
and go and himself and go where the problem we're the problem something
1:06:21
we're doing isn't working here but they don't seem to be doing that again if if if I if I'm at home and I
1:06:30
and I try to fix something and I keep botching it over and over again I'm going to hire a professional to come in here and fix it for me I'm not going to
1:06:37
keep you know I've made the analogy before if if I got if I have a leaky pipe and I'm flooding my house I'm going
1:06:44
to hire a plumber to come in here and fix it because I can't because I can't fix it but but John John John the
1:06:51
plumber keeps trying to and his house is flooding and it keeps getting worse and worse and now it's it's the waters past
1:06:57
the basement and coming to the first floor and he still won't hire the plumber so that that that to me is just
1:07:03
disconcerting in itself because five Co John five coaches in the last less than
1:07:10
a decade now were talking about five coaches and that's what we I why I want to talk about I want to talk about
1:07:16
quarterbacks quick and I want to talk about coaches nothing we do is quick but I want to talk about coaches and quarterbacks because I think we well
1:07:23
before before you do that before you do I want to ask you one thing yeah have you ever dealt with anybody who you would consider an insecure
1:07:32
narcissist not personally but I'm you know I I recognize them when I see them
1:07:39
in public so I I don't have anyone in my life that's like like I will be very
1:07:44
careful how I say these next things because it it could cost me it could cost me a significant amount of money
1:07:51
um I have had a lot of experience over the last X number of years dealing with what I would consider an insecure
1:07:57
narcissist okay and the reason I say that is it's a it's a person that takes
1:08:02
a lot of pride in their particular thing whether I I'll be too specific if I say
1:08:09
what it is so let's just say it's their their widget right they take a lot of pride in their widget I'm getting more
1:08:15
enjoyment trying to watch you but but the problem with the widget
1:08:21
is they know there's problems with the widget but they're okay with the widget the way that it is because it's theirs
1:08:26
they will actually bring other people in to work on the widget but then they'll make them do the work the way they want
1:08:33
it done yeah versus versus hiring these people to come in and make the widget
1:08:39
better it's I'm gonna teach you how it you're you're GNA learn my way yeah and
1:08:45
then when things happen if things are said or whatever like you get like if suggestions are well the widget would be
1:08:51
better if you did this you actually insulted the them you hurt their feelings and they get very defensive
1:08:57
about it they believe that it's their way is the right way and it's the only way they seek out advice sometimes not
1:09:03
because I'm looking for your advice but then I want to explain to you why your advice is wrong well I understand yeah I
1:09:09
that's what I see here yeah and one thing that you said and and and I we'll
1:09:14
drop it because I don't I don't want to make this longer but I want to go back to what you said a number of shows ago
1:09:20
what were you most concerned about you were concerned that Hard Knocks
1:09:25
will be a confirmation bias for for John Mera that his opinion his worry about
1:09:31
saquan was right and even though technically it is from the eagle side of
1:09:37
the equation keeping him on the Giants actually would not have been the right thing to do and Sai said the same thing
1:09:44
in terms of that you know mea and um um both maros ended up being right about
1:09:51
what's our identity's idti and that's the thing and but Sai was not saying
1:09:56
from my point of view that it's going to reinforce bad behavior he was saying they ended up being right so so yes how
1:10:03
would they not take that lesson and if that's the case then you're gonna see them meddle
1:10:10
yes and we need a guy who thinks like we think versus going that was right from
1:10:17
one perspective not from the perspective of giants because you're not you're not really evaluating yourself you just
1:10:23
confirmed that you were correct in your thoughts well what concerned me about the picture behind you right now when I saw on The
1:10:31
Telecast was him turning around and who's standing right behind him well
1:10:36
Chris Mar's off to the side that's McDonald walking across right but who's
1:10:41
there in the booth right next to him like who's he so so when you're in a dark place and you're looking to [ __ ]
1:10:48
and you're looking to um right right who do you turn to and look at who he's got
1:10:54
next to him and um we you know the narrative is whether
1:10:59
this is true or not the narrative was when Coughlin was in thin ice that mea made him get rid of his coordinators the
1:11:07
original coordinators and replace them with gilbride and was it first spags
1:11:12
that came or was there a guy before spags whatever they spags came SEC spags came second we had remember did he come
1:11:20
third or second so so he I think he was second I think he was coughlin's first offensive coordinator and defensive
1:11:25
coordinator were fired and and the narrative was that mea forced them out so I'm so so is Mea saying now Shane I'm
1:11:34
going to keep you but you're going to be on a shorter leash right now and and
1:11:40
Chris and Tim are gonna have more say in this so um right right well and then the
1:11:47
coach thing right we hear behind the scenes that there were some people in the organization McDonald's supposedly
1:11:53
one of them that was very Pro Brian Flores not dball and that Shane wanted
1:12:02
dball being his guy I don't know if that's true or not I don't right I know that's the rumor though yeah and clearly
1:12:09
you know and the way that blew up too afterwards by the way that was McDonald's fault you your damn Tech
1:12:15
should not have been able to get out like a that's my only exposure to his his his um ability is like idiot what
1:12:23
that didn't that was not a good look for him anyway sorry no no it's fine so you're absolutely right well here's the
1:12:28
other thing about this picture behind me the Giants say that they didn't have the
1:12:34
suite available like they did in other places and that's why some of the front office staff was down on the sidelines
1:12:41
where we never see them usually well there's Mara there's McDonald Chris
1:12:46
Mara's in there yeah there's Roman there I see a lot of space over there there's a lot of there's a lot of space no one's
1:12:52
sitting down I think you can walk around I'm pretty sure I have a feeling there
1:12:57
were people down on the sidelines they were there not to because you didn't have room in the suite they were there
1:13:04
to hear the interaction with the players to gather data to gather information
1:13:09
about how things are going with day ball on the sidelines what's the feeling of the players what's the Thought on the
1:13:14
look look at Brown going up to Tommy DeVito who's flipping open the the play chart as a play is obviously being
1:13:21
called in brown is standing right there between him and Bole listening to what's going and are we extrapolating am I
1:13:27
extrapolating I saw that and it means this yes am I right I don't know but it sure is the weirdest Optics I've ever
1:13:34
seen for the Giants oh and that answer was [ __ ] now that you say look at all the room behind so unless you we're
1:13:39
getting to the thing like you were talking before they don't want to draft a draft a black quarterback and maybe
1:13:44
they don't want to have a black assistant GM in the suite with them I don't know well where's Shane where where's
1:13:50
Shane yeah he wasn't seen in those pictures and I don't remember seeing him on the sidelines I think well I think he
1:13:56
might have been but I see did you see the the the Atlanta Falcon cheerleaders he might have had the binoculars looking
1:14:02
at the at the cheer yeah they were really dressed I don't know they were like full pants and everything I don't know the whole thing's a mess the the
1:14:09
whole thing's a and and before we move on the the again the big picture to me is this
1:14:16
is when they were two and five two and four 2 and six it was easy to say they're coming back when they're 2 and
1:14:23
13 and see looks like you behind you and they're like that's why I don't think they're tanky no that look like that
1:14:31
doesn't look like a man to me who's who's just sort of like the expected outome yeah yeah if anything he would be
1:14:37
kind of celebrating a little bit Yeah God yeah it was funny getting on BBI when when the first pick six was thrown
1:14:44
because we were winning the game at that point I went on BBI when the pick six was thrown it was like people were going
1:14:50
oh thank God there's to L we lo I mean this is the bizar world we live now you would have thought David Tyree just did
1:14:56
the helmet catch all over I mean this is just so sad so so so what the nice
1:15:01
discussion that this turns into is this is is kind of what Sai talked about too is this to if you bring back Shane and
1:15:08
D's gone let's assume that that's at least going to happen if that doesn't happen if they bring back
1:15:15
dble I'm gonna be like Michael Scott in the office no when Toby's back no no no
1:15:22
dear God no no yeah um I mean how do you sell that to
1:15:28
your players if Shane's coming back they've got to hire a coach who has a
1:15:35
vision for what this team is going to be and that's why as as Sai talked about
1:15:41
and others have talked about and I don't think they're going to get them because this it's to Too Perfect a fit is Vel if
1:15:47
you're bring in Vel you know you're going to get a tough I don't want to use
1:15:53
the STD smart tough def um you know you're going to get ah
1:15:58
you're burning and itching to do it you know yes you're but you know he's got a history of you know you know what you're
1:16:04
going to get with him he's he's again he hasn't taking his team to a Super Bowl but you know you're there's an identity
1:16:11
to those Titan teams so you've got to get somebody who and if it's not him it's got to be somebody you bring in and
1:16:18
you interview and say you're we're not just trying to
1:16:23
bring in players and willy-nilly and just go from there what do you want to
1:16:29
do on defense what do you what's your vision for defense what's your vision for offense this is crazy we've we' fired
1:16:37
five coaches this is we don't want to do this anymore we need a long-term plan in
1:16:42
place what are you how are you going to build this and that's what they need they they cannot get some weak need um
1:16:51
indecisive guy in here they've got to have somebody who's going to come in here with a really really really strong
1:16:56
personality and says a little bit of a narcissist in a way but we want we want a good narcissist in here that says
1:17:03
godamn it we're going to do it my way and my way or the highway and this is what I'm going to be about and no Joe
1:17:09
Shane I'm not I don't want this guy I don't want to draft this guy um he's not
1:17:15
he's not my kind of player he doesn't fit my scheme and I can't use him I don't want this guy so that's the kind
1:17:22
of guy that we need in need in here so um I'm curious what you think so when
1:17:29
we what are you looking at with the coaches on the market right now I know you like Vel I know you like but if it's
1:17:34
not Vel let's say it's let's say Vel says Christ I I I don't want to deal
1:17:40
with this mess and he may he may well do that um I'm hoping he doesn't I'm hoping
1:17:45
they they they get him and again I'm not all I'm not saying vel's the next Parcels or Coughlin here I'm just trying
1:17:52
to steady the steady the ship at this point but then again keep in mind Parcels wasn't Parcels until he became
1:17:57
the coach of the Giants we didn't know that and Coughlin was a good coach elsewhere that got his team to a point
1:18:03
and couldn't get him beyond that that's Rabel in a nutshell right I don't want to relive the past per se but there are
1:18:09
there are pieces of the past that you learn from and say this is and after you've done so many things a different
1:18:15
way you kind of need that piece so answer your question obviously Vel I'm not sure he's the guy I kind of have a
1:18:21
weird feeling he's going to end up in New England um because I think Mayo's gonna get fired didn't Ben Johnson say
1:18:28
he's interested in Chicago this week I don't know I don't know he'd be allowed to say that okay because I mean you
1:18:35
can't really you're you're coaching another team you can't okay I thought I saw something on it may it maybe I don't
1:18:41
know it seems weird that usually you don't mention other teams by name this is this is I i' I've gone back
1:18:48
and forth on this one and recently come around to it um I if I'm going from a tree of they've had experience
1:18:55
then after Vel my next choice is Arthur Smith right I think before yeah I think
1:19:00
he got kind of a bad R in Atlanta they were kind of hamstrung at quarterback
1:19:05
and and quite frankly look at the Falcons now right like you you replace them you bring in uh a new head coach a
1:19:12
new general manager all that good stuff you spend a [ __ ] ton of money on a guy coming off an Achilles injury and then
1:19:19
you draft the quarterback who's now already had to replace the dude so you are GNA have to cut him in the off
1:19:24
season but for all the talent that they have the Falcons can't seem to win and they're in a shitty Division and they're
1:19:30
still fighting to to win it um you've got Kyle pittz who's I mean he they
1:19:37
should have beat us by more Kyle Pitts has a ball that he juggles and just tosses it up for Cordell flat to
1:19:43
intercept you've got bejon Robinson sure but you you haven't you haven't done much on the defensive side of the ball
1:19:49
that's where you've been gouged lots of times so I'm not buying it I think Arthur Smith got a raw deal look what
1:19:55
he's done with Pittsburgh you've got you you basically got Reclamation projects with both Wilson and Fields that team is
1:20:03
playing better than they should because I don't think either one of those guys is anywhere near as good Fields has never really developed and Wilson's on
1:20:11
the backside I mean you're a shorter smaller quarterback and your skills are starting to diminish those are two
1:20:16
things that are hard to overcome physical stature is one thing but when your skills start to diminish it becomes glaringly more obvious I think he's okay
1:20:24
I think he can by for another year or two but Smith is making salad out of [ __ ] basically where we're at and and
1:20:30
then s was talking about going in the other coaching tree Direction instead of going with the Patriots coaching tree
1:20:37
which hasn't worked out around the league historically speaking going with the 49er coaching tree right Shanahan
1:20:43
coaching tree and Li Liam Cohen with the with the Buccaneers the problem I have with that though is I actually think
1:20:50
that he he's totally right that tree has has spawned a lot of good coaches yeah
1:20:57
but you nailed it a few minutes ago if you go that route yeah your drafting has
1:21:03
to match exactly what they want and if you're not GNA do that which I don't think Shane and dball have been on the
1:21:10
same page about who they've decided to go and get I think neighbors but they look like they are in Hard Knocks again
1:21:16
I know that's edited but they look like they're on the same page came out of Buffalo and um I mean I I never got this
1:21:23
sense that Shane wasn't I mean we they we know daa wanted Malik neighbors so
1:21:29
you've got you've got Jones who's not a deep ball passer right you go get a Speedster to be a deep yeah where's the
1:21:36
get he never get the same thing with hayatt on haatt I know a lot of people have given up on hayatt but that's why I
1:21:42
haven't given up on hayatt still I I think I think you're in the minority of
1:21:48
those cuz I'm in the other side oh I know I am I'm a tiny minority with they
1:21:53
should they should now looks terrible with with banks who again he's he's M
1:21:58
he's misc defense now but then you've got hayatt and then you've got um who am
1:22:03
I forgetting the second round pick um schmidtz schmidtz that draft looks terrible right now well hayatt to me my
1:22:09
problem with hayatt it's all Optics now and it goes back to that video of him talking to the Dallas Cowboy receiver
1:22:16
coach I know yeah I know and he's like well what kind of receiver am I no what kind what kind very arrogantly well
1:22:21
guess what that coach is right you are a onetick Pony unless you learn other
1:22:26
stuff and you can't even do that for us you don't beat people off the line you're not physical and you don't get
1:22:33
set when you're supposed to yeah and I don't think he's ever going to be a physical receiver but I think there is a it's like Colin was talking about there
1:22:39
is a there is a way to use him and they're not using him in that way and again they don't have the quarterbacks
1:22:45
to get him the ball so again he's one of those guys I know I'm way out in Lim he's one of those guys that if we let go
1:22:52
of him I would not be shocked if he does well someplace else so so with what you were saying right so let's say you go
1:22:59
Liam Cohen you need to get him a quarterback that can improvise that is
1:23:05
quick on his feet Baker Mayfield's not a great quarterback but he does make quick decisions overall he has a pretty good
1:23:11
arm he's got a lot of of I hate to use the word because and now you're gonna be like get off my yard kind of thing he's
1:23:17
got a lot of Moxy you know what I mean he's a guy and you can make plays with
1:23:22
him you for the if you look at the way the Lions did stuff right you so you bring in Dan Campbell he's a gambler
1:23:28
he's aggressive whatever they go and get Jared gof number one draft pick from the Rams but a guy who didn't live up to the
1:23:35
what they felt they should have that's why the Rams wanted to move on that's why they switched quarterbacks but you
1:23:41
put him in a spot where you go we're going to be a multifaceted big play team
1:23:47
we will be fast he's got a gun I want to attack people down the field I'm okay if
1:23:53
he throws a few interceptions I'm okay if he's not a runner we're going to make up for that with a lot of other stuff
1:24:00
great but look at the Giants we had a guy who was not a great passer he could run but that run is not he's not a Lamar
1:24:08
Jackson run he wasn't creative he's not a Lamar Jackson Runner he's just fast for his size when he gets going so you
1:24:17
have to design everything around him and D ball did for about nine games he was able to do it in 22 and
1:24:24
two games specifically the Colts game the Vikings playoff game that is pretty
1:24:30
much where Jones topped out do you see the risk though do you see the risk here is that if you keep dble and you draft
1:24:38
Sanders or Ward and then dble gets fired in the following year and you hire and
1:24:43
then you hire a new coach he gets stuck with the quarterback he didn't draft or ownership forced to only bring
1:24:53
in somebody who will accept that guy as their quarterback this is the same goddamn mess we've been in for a while
1:25:01
now that we've hired people like even Joe judge fell into this and
1:25:07
um Shermer right was it Shermer who who was the coach when shmer was with we we
1:25:13
got Barkley and then they went and got Jones it's dble I'm sorry so it was dble and judge both had to accept they both
1:25:20
had to accept um Daniel Jones as the quarterback when they came in here I don't want to do that again that's kind
1:25:25
of why I want a new well even madoo he was stuck with Eli even though he wanted to he wanted momes he he wanted him to
1:25:31
go get momes and they were like EV Ingram talk about you know one
1:25:37
of those pivots in franchise history right there you know um imagine if the
1:25:43
Giants had drafted Mahomes so well I mean think about it for not only pivot in Giants history but what about other
1:25:49
let's take the Giants organization out of it and I don't want to drag too too long but let's take the individual right
1:25:55
where would where would Ben McAdoo be right now he started off that first year they were what they were we were 12 and
1:26:01
four 13-3 I think we were 13 and three we we am I right about that 12 and four
1:26:06
11 doesn't matter we made the playoffs we won the division this last decade to me is a blur we won the division we made
1:26:12
the playoffs and we won the division we played the Packers we lost a shitty game because OD Beckham couldn't catch the
1:26:18
ball and none of the receivers after the little boat trip could do anything he comes into the off season and he's like
1:26:25
I want momes that guy is going to be the guy where would he be had they had they
1:26:31
gone that route instead they forced me Eli through and then they kind of wanted
1:26:37
to get away from him and what with their backup was Gino Smith but the Optics were so bad it was handled so poorly
1:26:43
that it fell apart and mea basically you know Reese got fired for that decision and and madoo got fired the team was
1:26:49
going down anyway but it was racked with injuries too by the way let's not forget that so d doesn't get a pass on injuries
1:26:56
nobody else did you then get Shermer and you you you still have
1:27:01
Eli and then you go we're GNA get the running back who's been touched by the hand of God even though you could have
1:27:06
done other stuff forcing that quarterback on the coach one more year
1:27:11
then you forced yourself into a quarterback pick which is where we are right now right right my problem with
1:27:18
what you said is this if you if you draft Sanders if we're gonna look at this from an individual standpoint you
1:27:24
draft Sanders the coach gets fired he obviously didn't do well during
1:27:29
the season if he gets fired right right so if D gets fired the Giants obviously didn't do well and let's be honest a lot
1:27:35
of rookie quarterbacks like Drake May are on losing teams right and they struggle right they struggle and may didn't even start by the way jacobe
1:27:42
brette did that's a normal thing even for an elite guy I mean it's not the
1:27:48
Jaden Daniels types don't normally that doesn't Norm how many how many games did Mahomes start his rookie year he didn't
1:27:53
start right he didn't one game the final game of the season when they decided to go ahead and let him play
1:28:01
yeah if he struggles and you and he gets fired how much damage did you do to your
1:28:07
rookie quarterback already like if did you throw him in the fry pan because we're we're playing you know I don't know what happened did we do a veteran
1:28:13
and he just sat there if you did a veteran and he sat that's a little different but that new coach coming in
1:28:19
has no idea what he has in this guy who's now in his second year if he played and did poorly
1:28:24
because the the rest of the team is poor and your coach is shitty and everybody as soon as bad stuff happened they're
1:28:30
like he's getting fired because that's what you're gonna have everybody you know it that's what happened with Dan ree everybody knew he was out of there
1:28:36
if D ball rolls in we saw it first game of the season second down bad play Third
1:28:44
Down boom we're punting against the Vikings booze were raining down on the
1:28:49
first six and and it's going to be the exact same thing but with the coach this year it's exactly same thing ex with the
1:28:55
coach and if you cause lack of a better way of saying this I know it's a word
1:29:00
you're not supposed to use anymore but if you if you [ __ ] the growth of your rookie quarterback because you have a coach that you probably are going to
1:29:07
fire then there's no point in him being there if you're gonna go rookie and it's Sanders by the way he's gonna bring a
1:29:14
whole lot to this organization and I don't mean just on the field he has his own podcast he's got a huge following
1:29:21
his dad's freaking famous ESPN Fox everybody's going to follow this dude
1:29:27
everywhere it the spotlight will be on the Giants like there's no tomorrow you
1:29:32
roll out D ball the second it's gonna be D Ball's fault if Sanders struggles it's D Ball's fault the one thing that
1:29:38
concerns me about people like when Tibido came out in in Sanders this year
1:29:44
is Bill parcel used to ask draft prospective draft prospects what are the
1:29:50
three most important things in your life and he said if they didn't if football wasn't in in the top two he didn't want
1:29:57
to have anything to do with that guy so I I the thing that scares me a
1:30:03
little bit about Sanders is what kind of what Sai says it's the how how much how
1:30:09
much how is it more important for him as brand is his brand more important to him than football that's the thing that
1:30:15
scares me and I I've got to and I'm going to be brutally honest here I have not gone back and looked at these
1:30:20
quarterbacks yet so I'm I'm not going to be I'm not g to be on here and say I know plus I wouldn't know anyways
1:30:27
because no one can rate judge these quarterbacks even the experts but I but I I want to go back and I want to look
1:30:33
at look at these quarterbacks before I make a strong statement but I do get a little bit concerned about you know when
1:30:39
these when you got a guy that's very concerned about his brand he's got a big posy around him and Dad's involved and
1:30:46
that kind of thing that doesn't mean I'm discounting him I'm not saying but but it is something that you've got to take
1:30:51
into account especially if dad is going to be involved D in his professional career too so it's just something to
1:30:57
think about and it's again if the next coach comes in does he want to deal with that or not and is he going to want to
1:31:03
get rid of it for instance I can see the next coach that comes in here that having a problem with a lot of the
1:31:08
personalities on this team somebody might come in here and say um some of
1:31:13
the names that we've talked about before you know the tibal the Hyatts the banks is um they may say Banks tremendous
1:31:20
player but I don't want a player on on my team that quits on a play I don't want a guy like hayatt who's not a
1:31:26
physical wide receiver you know so we were talking about we were talking about the San Fran coaching tree what do their
1:31:32
wide receivers are known for they're all really good blockers and they're all involved in the running game right
1:31:37
that's not Hyatt you know so if you get somebody like that he might not be a good fit even if he's a even if he ended
1:31:44
up being a good player he may not be a good fit for this thing so that anyways
1:31:49
no no you just said something that made me think of one other thing of why when you hire somebody that it has to be the
1:31:57
right person and you that the organization has to be together like it does like the players the players you're
1:32:03
going to bring in and you just brought up something that I keep wanting to mention how many effing times are we
1:32:09
gonna call a running play whether it's the quarterback whether it's a sweep around whether it's just a handoff
1:32:15
running wide where you put W Del Robinson in motion to be one of the lead
1:32:21
blockers he can't block tiny and you're I mean he gets called for holding he's
1:32:27
doing the best he look how small he is yeah but if that's the team you're trying to run like you talked about you
1:32:33
need a Debo Samuel you need to have a Jawan Jennings who's your third or fourth receiver but that guy still puts
1:32:39
up some pretty good numbers when he's forced into play bigger guys physical guys they can run they can block you
1:32:45
don't have a wandell leading the way on the outside right and that's where you worry about the McDonald's and the mea
1:32:52
Chris mea influence is again if you have to have somebody come in who's going to
1:32:57
run their system you don't want somebody else at in the room banging the table for somebody that doesn't fit the system
1:33:03
I'm not saying that's what they're doing but again some things have not there have been some constants in this
1:33:08
organization that haven't changeed and they two of the constants so right everyone's got to be on the same page
1:33:14
and it's I would get a strong personality coach out there I don't know enough Sai said something very
1:33:21
interesting he said he likes to watch the interviews of the assistant coaches
1:33:27
on other teams to get a feel for their personality uh I don't do that but that would be a good way to start getting you
1:33:33
know I would I I would like this like this this Cohen guy I would like to see what he sounds like that kind of thing
1:33:38
so and that's not the end all be all because Joe judge sounded great in front of a microphone I remember his first press conference all the Giants fans
1:33:45
were like yeah this guy's great what he's awesome yeah and you know what we we're allil we were all guilty of um
1:33:53
assumed assumed success by osmosis because he was around Bill bich we thought hey
1:34:00
we've got the next young Bill bellich guy we couldn't get Bill yeah yeah you know what I hate
1:34:07
about that I don't want somebody who talks a good game that I can't actually prove and if you say things that just
1:34:14
kind of like you were never in that position to really prove it like he was not the reason the Patriots were
1:34:19
successful bill belich was you might have learned stuff from him and that's great but he talked very arrogantly and
1:34:25
I think the Giants like that he came in we're going to do this same with you know McAdoo talking about taking care of
1:34:30
the the Duke and you know all this stuff the only guy who didn't fit that mole was Shermer because we brought the adult
1:34:36
in who was milk toast that's what we came up with he's basically milk toast I think right now the the biggest thing is
1:34:42
with the Sanders part that scares the crap out of me is just I don't know how good he is I know
1:34:51
he's pretty good but I also know when things don't go his way he has no problem talking about who was at fault
1:34:58
he threw his offensive line under the bus repeatedly last year and did so even early on this year after they got beat
1:35:03
by that's not good for a quarterback if that's that that that does in the locker room that doesn't go down well in the
1:35:10
locker room seen football over the decades to know not just the Giants I'm
1:35:15
talking about other teams that that doesn't go down well his name his name earns him stuff in college and his dad
1:35:21
is the coach there in the NFL it's gonna a gain you Media stuff but with the
1:35:28
players that's not going to gain a whole lot you're gonna walk in they're gonna expect yeah we expect you to be you know
1:35:35
shadur Sanders the number one pick in the draft that's what worries me CAM
1:35:40
Ward I think he has a little bit he has some flaws and he doesn't have the name
1:35:45
but I think he's he's he's at least Michael penick's like in terms of his overall passing ability he does take
1:35:52
chances um he's a little bit more I think he's more athletic than than a penex he he doesn't have the previous
1:35:58
knee injuries and stuff I think he can move around a little bit more but he'll take chances but you better have a coach
1:36:04
that's ready to do that now Sanders I'm gonna throw one thing out there and I'm just curious of your thoughts I joked before about would the
1:36:12
Giants actually consider trying to to bring the Sanders group as one Deon I
1:36:18
can't see that I either I can't see that I I don't think they'll do that the giant but would they be willing would
1:36:25
they think if the advice was given to them to bring Pat Shermer on as the offensive coordinator even though he
1:36:31
used to be the coach he's the coordinator for Sanders if you want to keep show no issues in the past of
1:36:38
giants of bringing back guys so like they even they even um they even brought
1:36:44
back um they've they've brought back guys before I don't I don't see a problem with with that I don't see see
1:36:50
an issue with that and I also I do want to give Sanders credit for one thing I have not looked at a lot of film of him
1:36:56
or anything like that but there is an element to the his game that's appealing not it's not just the he takes he's able
1:37:03
to like Sai said he take he can take a lot of punishment and Sai was kind of mocking
1:37:09
that saying well we have that with Daniel Jones but that's not thing but there is something to be said about toughness and being able to not you know
1:37:16
still beat your opponent after you like look at Joe Burl Joe Burl can get sacked nine times in a game and still beat
1:37:24
and I do have a thing I one thing I've noticed with quarterbacks today in this
1:37:30
today's game is this is they have to have a certain degree of improvisation
1:37:36
to their game that that when play breaks down they can make something special happen and Daniel never had that Jo
1:37:43
Daniel Jones you and I have said over and over again he's robotic he's mechanical whatever but I don't want a
1:37:48
mechanical robotic and and as much as he didn't win anything the one thing that I admired
1:37:54
about Tony Romo's game was God damn it you thought you had him at times and he
1:37:59
would spin around and do something and still still still make a play down the field when you thought you had him dead
1:38:05
the rights and Mahomes is like that too so I I want somebody who who has a little who when a play breaks down
1:38:12
because plays break down all the time in the NFL now you can't get a great offensive
1:38:17
line um or it's very rare you know the Eagles have it but it's very rare to be able to get Five Guys across the board
1:38:24
where you got a wall your plays are going to break down you want to have a guy that can make a play when a play and
1:38:30
not just every now and then that's part of his DNA he does it on the game to B
1:38:35
so I would I would you want guys who can process you got guys who know where to throw the football but I want somebody
1:38:41
who can do who's a little bit magical with the ball in his hands when everything breaks down and the Giants haven't had that in a long time Eli
1:38:47
didn't really have that either that's why that that play in the Super Bowl is so so great with the recatch is because
1:38:54
Eli looked like he was dead and in most cases Eli would have been dead there Eli wasn't known for that kind of thing
1:39:00
where he breaks out and throws that play So I I kind of want want that well and
1:39:06
you know the funny thing too with this people keep talking about the quarterback class is not as good as last year and right now last year's looks
1:39:13
very good or this this year's looks very good you don't know about McCarthy he hasn't played right but penx is now
1:39:18
playing and he was fine he wasn't wasn't great I mean I think if the Giants even had a halfway decent team we win that
1:39:24
game but he was fine um but the other quarterbacks have played pretty darn well this class is getting thinner by
1:39:32
the day all's going back yeah there are rumors that that uh ERS is going to go back there's rumors that Beck might go
1:39:40
back so you start going all of a sudden you've got Sanders Ward milroe who Sai
1:39:46
loves and I I I see it it's really hard to say I could see the Giants training
1:39:53
back up other people are saying oh no he's going to go top 10 I don't know he doesn't show enough passing yet to say
1:39:58
he's going to go top 10 but teams are desperate there's again one of those teams the Giants almost have to draft a
1:40:04
quarterback they almost oh without a doubt yeah I mean unless you sign unless unless we get a starting quarterback
1:40:10
from another team you don't have a choice you don't have anybody the Giants are so screwed right now that they're
1:40:17
almost forced to do something that that is a roll of the dice that's a terrible
1:40:23
position to be in but that's what this G GM has has done to them and the previous
1:40:28
GM they've put themselves in this position where they're they're almost forced to take somebody and just pray
1:40:34
that that the guy pans out that's a terrible position to be in it's it's weird to think that we met with Russell
1:40:40
Wilson but the rumor is that we told him you would be a backup only you're not coming to you're not coming to stupid
1:40:47
that looks now look at you're not you're not coming to compete why would you if you really wanted him right why would
1:40:54
you tell them that why wouldn't you just say listen we'll give you I I know we can get you dirt treat because you're
1:40:59
getting a whole bunch of money from from the Broncos but I'm gonna tell you what we'll give you five instead of one million because I think the Steelers
1:41:05
offered one we'll give you five million we want you to come and be the backup I you know I don't know how things are
1:41:10
going to work with Daniel but I want if if we need to we were ready to Pivot to you let's see what happens instead you
1:41:16
go you're only coming to be the backup you're not competing that's the only other thing
1:41:21
that then starts to hint that they they were this was all either going to work with Daniel Jones or it was not going to
1:41:28
work yeah or somebody was after the fact the meeting it took place somebody was narrative spinning at that point the AG
1:41:35
wanted to do that or the Giants or whatever I don't know who who knows but again there was no backup plan for
1:41:41
Daniel viable that backup plan for Daniel and like you said earlier Devito's on the roster you keep
1:41:48
a third quarterback on the roster on the 53 man roster but now they going back
1:41:53
and forth and flip-flopping and some of that was due to the injury that DeVito had originally and but but he could have
1:41:59
played now and now it looks like lock has a shoulder so now the veto may come in it just just the whole thing just
1:42:04
seems Seems like a seems like a mess right now well when you when you jump the backup you basically said I don't
1:42:11
think he's the guy or you're you want to lose or but I don't know that that I quite
1:42:19
frankly I can't tell you have we played better with lock I think lock is a better arm I think he makes some idiotic
1:42:25
decisions you watch him play and you're like why the hell are you bailing so fast or you start running and then all
1:42:31
of a sudden he start he's going instead of perpendicular he's going parallel I'm like where the hell are you going yeah
1:42:36
like the first down is right there lock was a was a prayer and some of us
1:42:41
including myself thought maybe he'll surprise us based on he had a couple of moments last year like against the
1:42:48
Eagles and maybe he'll surprise us but he looked bad in the preseason before he
1:42:53
got hurt and then he's looked bad since he's been in a and it's obvious that he's not the answer and he'll probably be out of the league in a couple of
1:43:00
years yeah one more backup job in him someplace um but he may be out of the league after this have you noticed you
1:43:06
were mentioning all these coaches have you noticed that if you come to the Giants now now Shermer
1:43:13
landed in the college ranks but Mo if you're an offensive defensive or
1:43:18
coordinator offensive coordinator defensive coordinator or head coach if you come to the Giants it's it's a Coach K position it's not it's not that's
1:43:25
another reason why that that they may have trouble attracting people because people that come here to have their
1:43:31
careers die I mean even Jason Garrett I mean if you come he in for broadcasting
1:43:36
I know I mean if you come here your your career basically dies with the exception of spags who was only his last position
1:43:44
who here was an interim coach um in hindsight maybe he would have worked out better if they if they who knows um I
1:43:50
know people are down on him because what happened with the Rams but um I have a hard time believing he'd be worse than
1:43:57
some of the clowns that we've had here so now spags left to take a head coaching job then
1:44:03
got fired and came back came back but so I don't think that's why I think Shermer
1:44:08
could come back but yeah but we but we fired Shermer we didn't fire spags he I
1:44:13
know but I don't do you really think that it would matter I mean so much time is me again I don't know I I don't know
1:44:19
that's why I was asking the question for me I would be like if you think if you think Sanders is your guy and you think
1:44:25
that Shermer has a unbelievably good connection with him and if that's what Dion's telling you that hey I really
1:44:32
think Shermer and and shadur can really they work well together then I bring
1:44:37
them on because you had him as a head coach he certainly knows offense that I want to keep that continuity but I again
1:44:43
who's the head coach I'm gonna try try to stay consistent here the to me the head coach has got to be a borderline
1:44:51
narcissist strong willed guy who and he makes that decision and then he has nothing to want
1:44:58
to do with shmer and that's his call and I don't care what mea if you have a problem with that then don't hire me I
1:45:05
I'm not gonna work do you have a do you have a preference offense or defensive coach like for a head coach do you care
1:45:11
um you and I have talked about this before I'm because we've gone some of this is PT
1:45:16
PTSD with all the offensive Minds that we've fired with the exception of the The Whiz Joe judge special team I never
1:45:23
was um I'm almost leaning towards a defensive coordinator just out of a sheer reaction but that's a bad reason
1:45:29
why to pick somebody but but part of this is because I grew up under parcels and he was a defensive guy and I I kind
1:45:36
of missed that I I I I just want a strong personality I want Tom Coughlin
1:45:42
Bill Parcels were strong personalities and it was their way or the highway and I think we and then and
1:45:49
we need to change it and the other thing one last thing I wanted to say cuz we've wrap we got to wrap it up yeah
1:45:55
um tied into all of this if I'm going to bring this full circle is John Mara has
1:46:03
to start to recognize that the league is different it's not the same league
1:46:09
anymore and the time table is not the same anymore it's and some of this he's
1:46:14
done like he's gotten rid of coaches every two to three years now and he's gotten rid of GMS every four years now
1:46:21
so I'm not going to say he won't do this type of thing but for some reason they
1:46:26
they'll hold on to players though they they'll hold on to they'll hold on to Daniel Jones for six years which none of
1:46:32
us can understand but he's got to understand that um you know like when
1:46:39
people said it's no big deal to resign Daniel Jones to a four-year deal that's really a two-year deal a two years in
1:46:45
the NFL is an eternity now it wasn't in 1986 but it isn't in 2024 two years is
1:46:52
an internity and that's why I was saying a couple
1:46:57
months ago don't tell me somebody's safe if depends on what the record's going to be and I didn't think it would be this
1:47:03
bad I didn't think we wouldn't win another game we didn't win another game when I made that statement I thought we
1:47:09
we might have four wins we didn't win we're not going to win another game when I made that statement we better
1:47:16
not yeah so so I I don't see us winning another game even if the Eagles play
1:47:21
their backup so I don't anyway I don't I don't want to jinx it but I don't see it so it would take a lot the the good
1:47:28
thing is is that and then we will wrap it up the good thing is that right now in the league there are still things up
1:47:33
in the air I know Ray and Arlington on on BBI bigblu interactive.com for those who don't know Ray is R's awesome with
1:47:39
those things I every time I see it so so breaking down the potential of where the Giants could be drafting uh you know the
1:47:46
way things are falling but one of the things he pointed out is like where the Eagles are right now what what they have to play for and quite frankly they're
1:47:52
there are a number of scenarios that would require them to continue to play to win even even if it's not the number
1:47:57
one seed they haven't locked up the division yet Dallas by beating Tampa Bay keeps kind of the pressure on that they
1:48:04
are they're going to be a tough foe to play if Dallas beats Philadelphia who right now maybe without Jaylen Herz then
1:48:11
Philadelphia has to win in the final week of the season I think it they play
1:48:17
Washington last is am I am I am I right about that no they play us last what am I talking about they have to be us last
1:48:22
Dallas they have Dallas before so they have stuff to play for but they also have the number one seed is still up in
1:48:28
the air Minnesota is right on the heels of Detroit Minnesota has a game with Green Bay if they were to lose to Green
1:48:35
Bay but Detroit loses to San Francisco it everything is still kind of on for that following week so there are
1:48:41
different scenarios but at the same time you could put all the backups on the Eagles on the field and you put all of
1:48:46
our backups which most of them are which most of backups are playing now which most of them are currently starters you
1:48:52
know like yeah you know when you have to go I don't know who the hell Lane is you know I'm like he I know he's a defensive
1:48:58
back we brought him up I don't know who he is dur dur in that defensive tackle who the hell is that I don't know Garcia
1:49:03
I don't know you know when you get all these guys you're just like we're not beating anybody unless that team
1:49:09
literally shows up and goes you know what we're just gonna pull half the team off the field we'll go our our six
1:49:16
against your 11 let's see what happens that's the only way I see us winning because I think I I don't think we're
1:49:21
tanking I think think we're at the bottom of the tank yeah we're we're bad I mean the Giants wouldn't beat the
1:49:27
Raiders I was saying last night after the game we went out the dinner um and I
1:49:32
said the sad thing is we're right now as the game was still going on I said we
1:49:38
don't even have the first pick and the team that might have the first pick would beat the crap out of us if we played them right now that's how bad the
1:49:44
season was so think almost my daughter was there and she had her phone out I said what's the score
1:49:49
what's the score what's what's going and everyone went at the table was like Dad why do you care about what the Jaguars are doing I'm like we need the first
1:49:56
pick and I'm not sure even we need the first pick well that's yeah that's the thing
1:50:01
it's know it's like it's like you were all excited you're just all excited and you open your present and you got socks
1:50:07
what if the best quarterback in this draft is MIL roll what if it what if he is the best quarter and before people
1:50:13
out there say [ __ ] look at this pass draft right now there are there all all
1:50:18
the quarterbacks other than McCarthy are playing now and none of again it's way too early in penic but none of them are
1:50:25
looking like crap and the guy's having the most trouble right now because of the team he's playing on is Caleb Williams but um I have one goal my last
1:50:32
comment because whoa we almost went two hour holy crap it's for those complaining about we we we're going too
1:50:38
late we're only doing one show because it's Christmas week so that we're only doing one show I only one go on this
1:50:44
rest of the season um in terms of the actual games being played or two goals I should say one is the Giants hopefully
1:50:51
staying keeping the first pick even but the more important goal to me right now is somebody knocked the Eagles out of
1:50:57
the playoffs I I if someone knocks the Eagles out of the playoffs I'll be happy with this year that that's my number one
1:51:02
goal because I would do not want to see Barkley in the Super Bowl for God's sakes and that would be a disaster that
1:51:11
that's my number one goal so I so two so I'll do two for me I don't want the Giants to win another game I don't know
1:51:17
if I care about the number one pick but the one number one pick allow you to
1:51:22
do something if we want to trade it to get other stuff that you know it gives it gives us something but if not then we
1:51:29
pick the guy that we want and hopefully you do the right thing right the second one I like where you're at I'll just
1:51:35
stick more specific to the Giants I really want to see Evan Neil pulled off tackle and placed at guard and see if he
1:51:41
can be anything because he's not a tackle he will not be a tackle in the NFL he is a liability um and you got to
1:51:48
see if if he can be a William Roberts there's only two games left though I don't think there's even enough time I mean they can play M guard but it's
1:51:55
that's not even enough sample size probably it'll be next year is going to be it for him he'll he'll either have to
1:52:01
play guard next year with under the new coach or he's he's toast um I don't think they'll do the fifth year option
1:52:08
um Jesus they better not um and then we'll go we'll have to go from there so
1:52:14
um I I I do think I have to go back and watch the tape it was kind of an up and down game for him he he wasn't doing
1:52:21
badly in the beginning and on the second interception I I thought Ren did a um
1:52:27
had a bigger mess up than well sure but I mean what the hell was he doing though oh yeah but some coaches teach on his
1:52:33
quick pass some coaches teach that I don't know if that was he was supposed to do that with the dive at the at the
1:52:39
feet but but even if you are that wasn't a good look it wasn't it
1:52:45
wasn't a good look but to me that didn't cause the break it was the van r no I I I agree with you but he's he's 3 cmet
1:52:51
away from break his own neck by diving into the ground I mean it didn't look good it's not a good look and and for
1:52:57
somebody who the knock on him is on the ground too much it it that doesn't that doesn't look but I thought the announcer
1:53:03
was being a little bit unfair there I thought ran Ron was really the guy that bad things happen to bad teams and
1:53:10
that's what the Giants are right now and and um the the dlls press conference at
1:53:17
the end of the game to me was just really ey opening it was it was
1:53:23
almost if he is not being fired he's he deserves an Oscar because that that was
1:53:30
a press conference a coach gives that knows he he's fired yeah I agree if people haven't seen it watch the press
1:53:36
conference after the Atlanta game to me that was that was a coach that knows he's gone so and if he isn't he and he
1:53:44
knows he's coming back he deserves an Oscar for that performance don't be
1:53:51
surprised if we hear that he's gone before the last game of the season and
1:53:56
don't be surprised if he ends up at the University of North Carolina oh wow that would be a hell
1:54:02
prediction Freddy Freddy kinchin is now at the University of North Carolina Steve bellich is leaving Washington
1:54:09
after their bowl game to go to Carolina to be with Bill bich he's bringing the old gang back he's got Lombardi who
1:54:16
apparently is now the general manager in college which they didn't have that position before but now they do so they
1:54:21
bring Lombardi down there I guess he can [ __ ] on the Giants at the college level now who cares uh but belich bringing his
1:54:26
old crew back together would not surprise me if D ball or he ends up at Alabama the thought that has entered my
1:54:33
mind which is probably wrong is I've gotten the strong vibe that D doesn't even want to be here anymore I agree
1:54:40
when I watch him it's like he doesn't even want to be here so again if he's
1:54:46
that's again I'm probably reading too much into it and no I I I think you're on to something I you can kind of you
1:54:53
can kind of tell what guy keeps saying it's on him now before he didn't say stuff like that it was always we're
1:54:59
playing the best players we got we're gonna wash the tape they're trying really hard blah he goes that's on me that's coaching you know we do the
1:55:05
that's that's impression he's going to the motions and he's just waiting till this ends so he can get out of here
1:55:11
that's what I'm that's the vibe I'm getting from him and that is my last comment on merry Christmas happy
1:55:17
Hanukkah to everybody out there and for those who don't know please let um
1:55:22
prayer keep prayers in mind for John's father who's battling cancer right now
1:55:27
um so and that's always tough around the holidays and we've been keeping them in our prayers um and a lot of people out
1:55:35
there know what that's like so um so keep keep johnning your thoughts too right now within his family but happy
1:55:41
Hanukkah and Merry Christmas to everyone out there uh to to you as well and I appreciate that and I'll leave it there
1:55:47
because yeah I'll leave it there yeah so like subscribe comment and uh we'll try to make it shorter next time I promise
1:55:55
so uh thanks for watching and uh we'll catch you again [Music]

John Mara - What Are You Going To Do To Fix This? #nfl #nygiants #football #sports

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John Mara - What Are You Going To Do To Fix This? #nfl #nygiants #football #sports

BigBlueInteractive.com