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Immunologist, ANP and Psychotherapist Dr. Margo Livingston talks Coronavirus on BayRadio
Jan 13, 2025
Dougie Mack speaks with Dr Margo Livingston on Covid-19 Coronavirus, including the different levels of symptoms, those most at risk, and how best to prevent infection. Find out more about her work at www.mindsanctuaryuk.com
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0:00
this is Bay radio here today I'm gonna
0:04
be chatting with dr. Margo Livingston
0:07
I'm good I'm good how are you coping
0:10
with current situations well I find it
0:13
fascinating I just was working in London
0:16
in the last couple of weeks and I
0:18
managed to just get back to Spain last
0:19
Thursday I think I you know was very
0:21
lucky to get back into in because now
0:24
the flights are adjusting stop so I'm
0:27
feeling very privileged to be living in
0:31
the countryside in peace and quiet but I
0:33
realize there's a lot of confusion and
0:35
worry out there about this virus you're
0:38
you're a doctor of immune ology right
0:40
yes yes so your your finger is right on
0:44
the poster so to speak yeah well
0:46
basically my background I I studied
0:48
immunology at University in Glasgow many
0:50
years ago and I then did a PhD in
0:53
hematology in cancer research and
0:57
yesterday the government were talking
1:00
after the Cobra meeting in the UK and
1:01
they were about people that we would be
1:04
at high risk for getting this infection
1:07
of coronavirus call with 19 is the
1:08
actual disease that you get from the
1:11
virus and they were talking about people
1:13
with multiple myeloma which was what I
1:15
did my PhD in so it's just anybody
1:17
that's that is immune or compromised so
1:20
they have a per or a weakened immune
1:22
system is at high risk of catching the
1:25
virus and and anybody above the age of
1:28
65 they're saying but it's more people
1:32
who are in their 74 and morbidity so
1:37
basically anybody who has a chronic
1:40
illness that doesn't really matter what
1:42
age they are so if you're between if
1:45
you're between zero and 20 years old you
1:48
actually have a very very small chance
1:51
of catching the virus because it it does
1:54
not tend to affect in fact young people
1:58
or babies although there has been some
2:00
reported cases and there was a baby born
2:03
with corona virus in West London and a
2:06
few days ago or a week ago and but the
2:10
baby had an infected mother
2:12
and so it was obviously pretty expected
2:16
that it would actually catch the virus
2:18
but it's to do with the way the virus
2:20
attaches to the DNA in order to infect
2:24
the cells cost and we are hosts for the
2:27
virus so if you're under 20 you're very
2:30
unlikely to get this infection which is
2:32
good because flu and other major
2:35
infections tend to be indiscriminate in
2:38
terms of who they in fact so if you're
2:40
between 20 and 50 and most likely if
2:44
you're healthy you would you will have
2:46
very very mild symptoms from the disease
2:48
but if you have any other chronic
2:52
illnesses for instance anything to do
2:55
with lung disease like seal eat so if
2:59
you've got chronic obstructive Airways
3:00
diseases or if you've got five doses of
3:03
the lung or any weakness in your lungs
3:05
and then then you're more at risk of
3:08
catching covered 19 and second most
3:14
worrying second disease to have would be
3:17
if you were immunocompromised so if you
3:20
have any form of illness which makes you
3:24
have a weakened immune system so that
3:27
would include people with cancer and
3:31
people on cytotoxic therapy for cancer
3:34
or rheumatoid arthritis they sometimes
3:36
get given cytotoxic drugs so they weaken
3:39
your immune system and also people with
3:42
autoimmune disease so that's people who
3:44
whose immune system has kind of turned
3:47
turned on itself and this would be very
3:50
high-risk to catch this disease and so
3:53
anything so also people who are
3:56
malnourished or don't eat good diet you
3:59
tend to having a strong immune system if
4:01
you live a healthy lifestyle
4:03
if you eat fruit and vegetables and you
4:06
have adequate vitamins and minerals and
4:10
if you have enough sleep enough rest and
4:12
you're not too stressed out stress can
4:14
cause a dampened immune system as well
4:16
hmm
4:17
so people with with any issues in their
4:19
immune system or their lungs would be
4:21
very very high-risk no matter what age
4:23
they are of patching coronavirus
4:25
and so if you're under 50 and you're
4:28
pretty healthy then you should be
4:29
absolutely fine and just experience mild
4:32
symptoms and that you would recover
4:34
completely from the disease it figures
4:37
are roughly that 80% of people will just
4:39
have mild symptoms and 20% of people
4:42
would require hospitalization 5% of
4:45
those we'd end up in intensive care
4:46
requiring ventilation and intensive
4:49
medical assistance and those are the
4:52
ones that we really would need to worry
4:53
about hmm what would you suggest people
4:56
do if they feel these symptoms and they
4:58
feel they are going down with it what's
5:01
the best thing they can do so let's just
5:02
say that you suddenly find yourself with
5:05
a temperature now the temperature is
5:07
quite interesting because if you have a
5:09
bacterial infection and you have a-you
5:12
tent up quite a high temperature maybe
5:13
over 38 degrees up to 39 or more and
5:16
viral infections don't tend to give you
5:19
such a high temperature although that
5:21
they can be very very dangerous
5:23
infections to have as we've seen so 37.8
5:27
degrees centigrade is is the average
5:30
temperature that people with coronavirus
5:32
infection would would have that would be
5:35
the first thing second thing would be
5:37
the onset of a dry cough now if I would
5:39
describe what a dry cough is it's just
5:41
some like a cough which is
5:44
non-productive it's something tickling
5:45
that's bothering you but not just the
5:47
odd cough you would need to have this
5:49
cough for several hours and more than
5:51
half a day is what the experts are
5:53
basically saying so you'd be
5:54
persistently coughing all morning and
5:56
your temperature's going up to their
5:58
27.8 and the third symptom would be
6:01
tiredness so Xfinity is related to this
6:05
infection and you might just feel a wee
6:08
bit tired or you know just feel like
6:11
staying in your bed just a bit out of
6:12
sorts and and those would be the
6:15
symptoms of a mild infection of
6:17
coronavirus and and if you had extreme
6:22
fatigue where you literally couldn't get
6:25
out of bed you couldn't get the toilet
6:27
without help and and you just literally
6:29
couldn't be bothered getting dressed or
6:31
eating then you would really need to
6:33
seek some medical help maybe go to the
6:34
hospital and definitely call the help
6:37
numbers that are being circulated on the
6:39
face
6:39
groups around this area and some other
6:42
uncommon symptoms that people might get
6:45
and our headache now I've heard of a
6:48
gentleman in the UK who had a headache
6:50
and a temperature he didn't have a cough
6:53
so if you've got that I would say yes
6:55
you make well hunt the virus it's not
6:57
you know it's not set in stone people
6:59
are different and they do all the
7:01
symptoms they might have a combination
7:03
but the common symptoms are at a
7:06
temperature of 37.8 a dry cough lasting
7:09
more than half a day and tiredness and
7:12
other common symptoms would be a
7:14
headache a really sore head
7:16
nasal congestion with coughing a sore
7:19
throat and you may or may not cough up
7:22
sputum but it's not usual to cough up
7:24
sputum because it's it's usually back to
7:26
you and in fact that cause spittle and
7:28
this is a viral respiratory infection
7:30
that we're talking about and you could
7:33
get shortness of breath so shortness of
7:35
breath is not a common symptom and if
7:37
you are short short of breath then
7:39
you've probably got a more serious
7:41
reaction to the virus and I definitely
7:43
definitely would seek medical assistance
7:44
if you've got shortlist wrath and also
7:47
if you've got chills and sore muscles so
7:50
a bit like flu where you feel shivery
7:51
and you get sore muscles that's that
7:53
were more of a symptom so I would be
7:55
checking that out in terms of getting a
7:57
bit medical advice whether you should be
8:00
getting tested or maybe going to the
8:02
doctors or the hospital and sometimes
8:05
really you can get nausea and vomiting
8:07
but that's not a common symptom and
8:09
really rarely is diarrhea and this is
8:12
what I find amusing because it's a
8:14
respiratory viral infection so I don't
8:16
understand my people are bulk buying
8:17
toilet paper and I I just think it's
8:20
changed stains human nature and follow
8:24
each other and copy each other but you
8:25
don't need extra toilet rolls and if you
8:29
have a severe hospitalization case then
8:33
you would have a really high fever
8:34
you would have coughing and you would be
8:37
coughing up blood and you could once
8:41
your blood was tested you would have
8:43
decreased white blood cell kite so you'd
8:45
have an obvious immune response on the
8:47
go and you would have you could possibly
8:50
end up with kidney failure so basically
8:52
they're very very serious cases the 5%
8:55
that end up in intensive care they would
8:57
end up needing multi-organ support so
9:00
they would need fluids intravenously
9:02
they would need help with their
9:04
breathing and what has actually happened
9:06
to these people is that the immune
9:07
response has become so switched on that
9:11
these sometimes get an an acute
9:13
inflammatory response which can actually
9:16
be the cause of death as opposed to the
9:18
virus itself so the immune system is
9:21
struggling to try and help save you but
9:24
if you're compromised by being a bit
9:26
older and your immune system is
9:28
obviously a bit weaker when you're older
9:29
or and or that you've got some other
9:32
underlying conditions then your immune
9:34
system just can't really cope and these
9:36
are the severe cases that we have to
9:37
watch out for to get back to the
9:39
original point if you have mild symptoms
9:42
you can just self isolate and self
9:45
isolate the members of your family that
9:47
live with you in your home that's what
9:49
the UK government have been advocating
9:51
of it since yesterday so basically if
9:54
you've got symptoms you shouldn't be
9:56
going outside and you shouldn't be
9:58
mixing although we've already been put
9:59
in lockdown here in Spain anyway but the
10:02
thing is you don't want to be mixing
10:04
them at people so even the people that
10:05
you live with should be taking
10:07
protective measures they shouldn't be
10:09
kissing and hugging you they should
10:11
maybe be sleeping or living in different
10:14
parts of the house you should have your
10:16
own cutlery and do your own cooking and
10:19
dishes if you possibly can and have your
10:21
own toilet facilities and obviously you
10:23
need to have these cleaned and very very
10:26
thoroughly with gloves and possibly
10:29
masks although I don't really believe
10:31
that master they're not the ordinary
10:33
paper masks are not a major deterrent
10:35
against viral infections you know what
10:38
you would do you would do whatever you
10:39
would do for a normal viral or flu type
10:42
unless you would have rest and you would
10:46
drink plenty of water you would have
10:48
warm drinks you would have analgesia and
10:51
there are some reports that not
10:53
non-sterile
10:54
anti-inflammatory took like Griffin and
10:56
Naprosyn may actually be
11:00
counterproductive and I would suggest
11:02
that on that basis just take something
11:05
like
11:06
it's more as some simple and easier and
11:09
maybe some warm soup if somebody's kind
11:11
enough to make it for you or bring it
11:12
into the house and just keep yourself
11:15
warm and you should get better if you've
11:18
got a mild case of the disease you tend
11:20
to only be sick for two to three to four
11:22
days and then you should feel much much
11:24
better and and the the hope is that you
11:27
will have lasting immunity to this
11:29
infection from there I think it's
11:31
important for people to understand how
11:33
they catch the infection so basically
11:35
the the virus itself the actual virus
11:38
which causes coronavirus disease is
11:41
respiratory virus it's called severe
11:44
acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus
11:46
know the word corona is basically a
11:50
description of the shape of the virus
11:52
it's got some spikes showing the outside
11:54
and if you look at that in a kind of
11:56
distant picture it looks like a healer
11:58
and it's it Karuna means Crone and
12:01
therefore that's why it's called corona
12:03
virus and it's it's it's new so this
12:07
virus this specific corona virus of the
12:11
Saros type has never been seen before
12:14
and that's why people have been quite
12:16
frightened because there's no cure for
12:18
it there's no antibodies there's no
12:19
vaccination yet and so what I would like
12:23
to just cover quickly as how how do
12:25
people catch it so as I said it's our
12:27
spiritual infection and it spread from
12:31
one person to another via respiratory
12:33
droplets so when we talk or when we call
12:36
or when we sneeze we actually produce
12:39
water vapor from our lungs in our breath
12:43
which could easily contain the virus
12:46
okay so the virus would be it's
12:49
absolutely minut
12:50
it's about point 1 microns in diameter
12:54
it's absolutely my new viruses are tiny
12:57
they tend to they would be in mucus or
13:01
water droplets coming out of your lungs
13:03
from coughing from sneezing and even
13:07
from talking and that's why distancing
13:09
yourself and from for at least one to
13:11
two meters from other people is going to
13:13
help you to 100% not to get catch any
13:16
droplets and the droplets need to
13:18
and somewhere that you can then ingest
13:23
them okay so somebody could cough
13:25
directly into your face and you could
13:27
just breathe that in and then you would
13:29
end up with that virus particle in your
13:32
lungs when you breathe in that's going
13:33
into your truck here
13:34
and down into your lungs and the virus
13:37
will then take hold because that's where
13:39
it wants to go that's where it thrives
13:41
that's where it can multiply some
13:43
viruses can't live on their own they
13:45
need a host like a human being for them
13:48
to multiply and replicate and the other
13:51
way that you could pick up the in fact
13:54
is that these droplets it's to somebody
13:56
next to you maybe sneeze or coughs and
13:59
or the and they if we hand up we've got
14:02
the virus on their hand okay and they
14:05
then put their hands on door knob or a
14:10
handrail of a staircase that you're
14:13
walking up now these are called for
14:16
mites these are inanimate objects that
14:18
that can hold on to the organisms and us
14:23
on the infection now it's been studied
14:26
how long this corona virus can actually
14:29
live I would say that human host and
14:31
believe it or believe it not it can live
14:34
between four and seven days on a
14:37
doorknob mmm without being destroyed
14:40
it's still viable and so therefore you
14:44
could just put your hand on that
14:45
doorknob and then at that point you
14:48
don't have the infection until you put
14:50
your hand to your mouth okay so you've
14:52
got a virus into your mouth or your nose
14:54
or your eyes so this is why your whole
14:57
face is the vulnerable area any mucosal
15:01
surface which is a route of entry into
15:05
your lungs is going to be vulnerable so
15:08
your school States your breathing goes
15:10
straight into your lungs you'd breathe
15:12
through your mouth so that was straight
15:13
to your lungs and believe it or not you
15:14
can get the virus through robbing your
15:17
eyes if you had the virus on your hands
15:19
and so you need to be very very careful
15:21
about touching things and that's why I
15:23
know supermarkets here in Spain they're
15:25
offering you gloves when you walk into
15:27
the supermarket because if you use the
15:29
cat you know the pin machine
15:31
lots and lots of people are using the
15:32
same thing and that's where you could
15:34
pick it up as well and so that's the
15:37
main route of infection does that make
15:39
sense
15:39
absolutely there's just one more thing I
15:42
need to need to ask you now there's been
15:45
all sorts of different ideas as to
15:47
whether or not this virus can be passed
15:49
from pets to people and vice versa yeah
15:52
now I'm to speak on behalf of dog lovers
15:55
and well pet lovers everywhere surely if
15:58
if you're if you're with your pet you
16:00
happen to have it the temptation to give
16:02
your pet a cuddle is it do you have to
16:04
treat them like another member of the
16:06
family and give them a bit of distance
16:08
can we interesting yeah it's interesting
16:11
because basically they did find this
16:15
family and we're positive for the virus
16:17
I think it was in home call max yeah
16:22
it's very much very mom's science wasn't
16:26
it I think yes so the dog had no
16:28
symptoms but the point of this is who
16:30
gave who the virus right so the point
16:33
the point is that the virus and the
16:36
preferred host is obviously humans
16:39
because it wouldn't be spreading like
16:40
wildfire in amongst humans if it was
16:43
more interested in dogs okay it would be
16:45
it would be attack you know attaching to
16:48
dogs and getting spread through the dog
16:49
world so dogs could pick up the virus
16:53
but it could well be that the virus
16:55
doesn't replicate in dogs and cats and
16:58
it's supposed to have originated from a
17:00
bat it's a bat virus that the SARS virus
17:04
tends to originate from bats and and
17:08
then that would be an intermediary host
17:11
so we're the owner and the final host
17:13
and the virus would go via an
17:15
intermediary home so there being a bat
17:16
and then some kind of animal was in the
17:19
middle which was passing on the
17:22
infection to humans okay so I I was
17:25
reading about what you should do and
17:27
it's basically the same thing if you've
17:31
positive fork over 19 everybody in the
17:34
house
17:35
she'd kind of self isolate so I would
17:37
say you can't state you're going in
17:40
garden and just leave him there for two
17:41
weeks or a week or something
17:43
see and it's absolutely human nature to
17:46
want to cuddle and stalk her dogs and my
17:49
take on it having to reduce and merge
17:51
back to myself I I could clear Dora them
17:53
and I cuddle a long time and you know I
17:56
obviously don't let them let me I don't
17:59
let them lie on my bed you know just
18:00
general normal precautions but I don't
18:03
think dogs are going to be a major
18:05
threat to you I think you just need to
18:07
avoid contacting other humans all right
18:11
well thanks ever so much for coming on
18:13
and chatting with us answering a few
18:15
questions for us
18:16
did you notice though I didn't open with
18:18
dr. Livingstone I presume I bet you get
18:21
that all the time there's no e in
18:24
Livingstone and David Livingstone the
18:27
Explorer he actually was a ton and not a
18:30
stone was a living stone and but
18:33
everybody misspelled his name all the
18:35
time and so in the end he just allowed
18:37
himself to be a stone so Livingstone
18:40
with Annie I don't actually come from
18:42
Glasgow and he came from Blantyre which
18:44
is really close and I was born in Africa
18:47
so my mother my mother did mention once
18:50
that and she thought we might be related
18:52
but my dad died really young and when he
18:54
was 36 so I don't know i don't have
18:56
never but maybe one day I'll find out if
18:59
I'm related to doc can I just say and
19:03
that my website is called mind sanctuary
19:08
UK calm yeah so it's M IND
19:11
Si and si tu ary UK calm and my email
19:16
address is in for at main sanctuary UK
19:19
calm and and if people would like to
19:22
have a free copy of my fact sheet which
19:24
I've put together explaining all about
19:26
what we've been talking about and a lot
19:28
more and please could you email me and
19:30
I'd be more than happy to connect with
19:33
you and also I am an online consultant
19:37
so apart from being a doctor of
19:38
immunology I'm actually an advanced
19:40
nurse practitioner which is called an
19:42
A&P I don't know if the listeners have
19:45
heard of that but it's a it's a new
19:47
fairly new qualification in the UK and
19:49
it's we are advanced nurses so we are
19:52
licensed to prescribe medication
19:55
we're licensed to assess illnesses and
19:58
diagnose problems that people may have
20:01
in their mental health so I am a
20:04
psychotherapist so mental and physical
20:06
health and I'm an online consultant here
20:10
based here and in Spain but also I deal
20:13
with clients in the UK so family wants a
20:15
private consultation about any kind of
20:17
illness or a health problem please get
20:20
in touch and I'd be more than happy to
20:21
have a chat with you absolutely
20:23
marvellous things there as much again
20:24
for chatting with us Margate stay well
20:37
you
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